On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:22:43 EST, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In a message dated 1/23/2005 12:11:24 PM Central Standard Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Gilberto: > But then the larger question is whether the present-day conscience" is > actually a perfectly reliable guide? Can we even reliably determine > what "the conscience" is saying to us? I mean, if everyone could just > listen to their conscience, and the conscience was reliable then we > wouldn't have any real need for religion.
> No, the conscience is not a perfect guide. But the society is a perfect > society within its paradigm Gilberto: I don't understand what you mean by that. There are certainly people whose consicence moves them to protest and criticize institutions of the society they live in. Scott: > The one thing we can accurately determine for > ourselves with no assistance is that our conscience judges our actions with > absolute accuracy. Gilberto: I'm not sure what you mean here either. If this were true wouldn't religion be unnecessary? Gilberto: > Part of the problem is that people's conscience aren't always the most > reliable. Even from a Bahai perspective, aren't there some very > commonly-held moral opinions, even in the West which are just wrong? > > So why should popular conscience be the ultimate arbiter? Scott: > Popular conscience and social conscience and inner conscience are three > different things, are they not? > Gilberto: What is the distinction between popular conscience and social conscience? Scott: > > As I said, it is only when some try to make one time and > places SOCIAL > laws BE another time and place's social > > laws that problems arise. Gilberto: > What are the specific problems? Scott: > Trying to enforce the cutting off of a man's hand for theft becomes a > problem when the rest of the world society perceives it to be brutal - for > one instance. Gilberto: But on what grounds is it brutal? MAybe I'm not being clear enough. It just seems that religions create groups and institutions which promote certain values in society. And there are at least two important tasks which religions carry out in society. One, when the society drifts away from its core values, the religion should remind people of certain principles. And secondly, at the same time, religious leaders need to apply these principles to new situations and correctly understand what is going on in society and be sensitive and flexible to current situations in order to remain relevant. ESpecially when popular opinion drifts too far from the basic values, then popular notions of what is good become much less reliable in terms of determining right and wrong. Peace Gilberto "My people are hydroponic" __________________________________________________ You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:archive@mail-archive.com To unsubscribe, send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To subscribe, use subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Baha'i Studies is available through the following: Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.edu Web - http://list.jccc.edu/read/?forum=bahai-st News - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st Public - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaist Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.net New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
