On Tue, 2024-01-30 at 09:57 -0500, Steven A. Falco wrote: > On 1/30/24 08:55 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 08:38:51AM -0500, Stephen Gallagher wrote: > > > 3) Fedora has a long-standing and well-communicated stance that > > > we are > > > a Wayland distribution first and foremost and that X11 support is > > > intended as a migration-support tool rather than a first-class > > > citizen. > > > > Does it? This is very much news to me, so I don't think you can > > call > > it "well-communicated". We also have an XFCE desktop spin and > > probably others that require X11. > > https://fedoraproject.org/uk/spins/xfce/ > > > > In addition Wayland doesn't actually replace all the basic > > functionality of X11 even after all these years, which is why I > > need > > to use it. > > I'm in the same boat. Back in September when this topic came up, > folks were invited to write bugs so the missing functionality could > presumably be worked on. > > I wrote two bugs: > > Bug 2239016 - Plasma(Wayland) does not honor window positioning when > setting window geometry > Bug 2239029 - Plasma(Wayland) does not save windows between sessions > > For 2239016 the response was "That's just how wayland works" and for > 2239029 someone added a reference to an upstream KDE bug (from 2021). > > I realize that this is a volunteer-driven project, and that I cannot > expect someone to address the above wayland limitations, especially > since the wayland design philosophy appears to exclude such features. > > But that doesn't change the fact that I need the missing > functionality, and based on how this discussion is going, I > personally doubt wayland will ever meet my needs. > > I'm delighted that there are like-minded folks who want to maintain > X11. Please allow them to do so. > > Steve
Steven, thank you for the serene explanations and for highlighting an important point about waynland, wayland seems to miss some important features. > > > 4) There was a comment on the FESCo ticket to the effect of '"you > > > must > > > move to Wayland because no one maintains X11!". Here are some > > > people > > > who are maintaining X11 packages, so let them do their thing.' > > > This is > > > misleading, as the move to Wayland is specifically because the > > > upstream of X11 *itself* is largely unmaintained. These packages > > > are > > > not maintaining X11, they are adding new dependencies on it. > > > > They're maintaining parts of the X11 stack. > > > > > My proposal for consideration is this: > > > "FESCo will allow these packages in the main Fedora repositories, > > > however they may not be included by default on any release- > > > blocking > > > deliverable (ISO, image, etc.)" > > > > It seems quite strong. I'm unclear why having X11 packages and > > spins > > for those that want to use them is a problem. It seems like the > > missing functionality of Wayland is the bigger issue that needs to > > be > > addressed. > > > > Rich. > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > Do not reply to spam, report it: > https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue -- Sérgio M. B. -- _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to devel-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org Do not reply to spam, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
