Re: Honestly, fork systemd
previously on this list Svante Signell contributed: To answer the original poster's own question, what can he do? He can stop writing these emails and start writing code (a fork of systemd supporting kFreeBSD, to be specific) I don't think forking systemd is a good choice, that software id doomed, better to fork gnome components to make them usable with another init system. There are a number of usable components of gnome, e.g. evolution, I would like to still use it, without systemed, but that is currently not possible :( 3.10.4 runs on OpenBSD likely after patching though I don't see any patches to evolution itself in their ports tree. I think Antonio patched OpenBSD's sndio in for pulseaudio for gnome 3. You could look into that. I do see a configure arg --with-sub-version=OpenBSD Ports so maybe the patches were accepted upstream. -- ___ 'Write programs that do one thing and do it well. Write programs to work together. Write programs to handle text streams, because that is a universal interface' (Doug McIlroy) In Other Words - Don't design like polkit or systemd ___ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/527874.41062...@smtp141.mail.ir2.yahoo.com
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
[ pruning the recipient list a lot ] On Sun, Feb 16, 2014 at 03:21:15PM +0200, Aigars Mahinovs wrote: I personally dislike systemd on a few technical and few social grounds, but I respect the decision of Debian TC and will do what I can to make systemd in Debian be the bast it can be and make Debian with systemd the strongest system it can be. I hope others will do the same. Very well put, and a good thing to say. I also personally *really* dislike systemd for a range of reasons, but let's move on and make things work in Debian as best we can. -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK.st...@einval.com I've only once written 'SQL is my bitch' in a comment. But that code is in use on a military site... -- Simon Booth signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
On 16/02/14 09:54, ChaosEsque Team wrote: Isn't it great that we have to have this discussion about forking debian because within an oligarchic 8 man planning committee, which was split 50/50 for and against systemd, the chairman happened to be a systemd fan and abused his position to gain a double vote for forcing systemd down out knecks? Whatever it is you are trying to say, what difference will it make if you keep sending these emails without doing any actual work to code an alternative? Do you think an alternative is going to just fall out of the sky? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5300908c.10...@pocock.com.au
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
The alternative is allready here. It's called SysV. Nothing needs to be done. It is a rock on which to build. Not a shifting sands. I must say, I agree with the man of the New Testament on this particular sort of issue. Build your house on rock, not on sand. The alternative is allready in all of our laps, you're just trying to take away what we allready posess. It is theft of a sort. On 16/02/14 09:54, ChaosEsque Team wrote: Isn't it great that we have to have this discussion about forking debian because within an oligarchic 8 man planning committee, which was split 50/50 for and against systemd, the chairman happened to be a systemd fan and abused his position to gain a double vote for forcing systemd down out knecks? Whatever it is you are trying to say, what difference will it make if you keep sending these emails without doing any actual work to code an alternative? Do you think an alternative is going to just fall out of the sky?
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
On 16 February 2014 14:34, redl...@hush.com wrote: The alternative is allready here. It's called SysV. Nothing needs to be done. It is a rock on which to build. Not a shifting sands. If you insist on alegories, then the choice now stands between building on a solitary rock in the middle of a stormy sea or building on the sandy beaches of a popular costal town. Often it is easier to put in the work to drive down piles trought the sand down to bedrock and injecting some concrete where needed to form your own rock foundation rather than transport everything to that rocky island. And the end result for the users is a much more useful home. The choice in Debian has been made - we like the beachfront property. Help us make the best of it - investigate where the sand is weakest and inject concrete there, find the bedrock and drive some piles to it, add liquifaction protection where that is needed, be constructive. The house will be build here. If you can help its construction and help it be stronger - please help. If you are going to continue advocating not building here - please don't. That one is settled. I personally dislike systemd on a few technical and few social grounds, but I respect the decision of Debian TC and will do what I can to make systemd in Debian be the bast it can be and make Debian with systemd the strongest system it can be. I hope others will do the same. -- Best regards, Aigars Mahinovsmailto:aigar...@debian.org #--# | .''`.Debian GNU/Linux (http://www.debian.org)| | : :' : Latvian Open Source Assoc. (http://www.laka.lv) | | `. `'Linux Administration and Free Software Consulting | | `- (http://www.aiteki.com) | #--# -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CABpYwDW+hHKY0Si1WRVw_JfVffNkO8bKTmbWrqvoe=eh19c...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
On 14/02/14 14:58, Aigars Mahinovs wrote: On 14 February 2014 13:42, ChaosEsque Team chaosesquet...@yahoo.com wrote: The systemd fans ban anyone who say fork-that to systemd. Not respecting the communication culture of the project is a perfectly reasonable reason for a ban, regardless of the opinion expressed by the banned or held by the banners. What can we do? Can we fork debian? (Why do we have to...) During this whole debate what I came away feeling is that the strongest point of criticism against systemd was not technical or structural, but rather social - there is a significant and vocal discontent with the decision making process in systemd and with some specific decisions made with that process. Which leads to a fear of possible future problematic decisions. If that is not a reason enough to reject systemd from consideration (and apparently it is not), then there is another solution with a long history of success in open source community - *fork systemd*. Debian appears to have some important requirements and wishes that current upstream does not consider valid. If the current upstream continues to hold on to that position, then it might be beneficial to both Debian and the wider community if Debian leads a fork of systemd, implementing these requirements and wishes, seeking out other requirements and wishes that have been rejected or ignored and gathering a new development community around this fork in systemd. To answer the original poster's own question, what can he do? He can stop writing these emails and start writing code (a fork of systemd supporting kFreeBSD, to be specific) As a second choice, if he believes in this cause so valiantly but doesn't know how to code, he can sell his home and give the money to the free software developer of his choosing and pay them to make an alternative. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/52ffac54.6000...@pocock.com.au
Re: Honestly, fork systemd
On Sat, 2014-02-15 at 19:05 +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote: On 14/02/14 14:58, Aigars Mahinovs wrote: On 14 February 2014 13:42, ChaosEsque Team chaosesquet...@yahoo.com wrote: The systemd fans ban anyone who say fork-that to systemd. Not respecting the communication culture of the project is a perfectly reasonable reason for a ban, regardless of the opinion expressed by the banned or held by the banners. What can we do? Can we fork debian? (Why do we have to...) Maybe that is interesting too, any takers? To answer the original poster's own question, what can he do? He can stop writing these emails and start writing code (a fork of systemd supporting kFreeBSD, to be specific) I don't think forking systemd is a good choice, that software id doomed, better to fork gnome components to make them usable with another init system. There are a number of usable components of gnome, e.g. evolution, I would like to still use it, without systemed, but that is currently not possible :( -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1392491888.3779.84.camel@PackardBell-PC
