Re: [digitalradio] Digital Voice update #2 - programmers wanted - codec2 and the G3PLX modem
Hi Trevor, Op 29-08-10 11:08, Trevor . schreef: I do not understand why -say- the IARU does not does this. I'm not say they should endorce any standard of any technology. Unfortunately it would require a volunteer willing to put in a lot of hard work to do. Volunteers are always in short supply. Well, I don't know. In the internet-world, RFCs are usually written by the people who design the protocol or the technology explained in the RFC. The IETF doesn't do that neither. All the IARU should do is: - encourage people who create new protocols and technologies to document it in a written document. - Do quality control (e.g. concerning the exact wording of the RFCs) - Publish them. (which just means put them on their website). Now I must say. Thinking about it. Perhaps one of the differences in (say) an internet-protocol and ham digital modes is that the first group is usually created by teams of people, while I have the impression that a lot of the digital modes are created by just one or a very limited number of people. In a team, there usually already is written documentation anyway (as part of the process of coming up with the specification and the discussions inside the team), it's probably much easier to translate the final version into a RFC-document and there usually already is somebody of the team assigned to documentation anyway. If you do create something by yourself, most people have something on paper, but most of it in my head. The task of asking now write this all into a nice technical spec is then much more work. Perhaps what Dave (Rowe, creator of codec2) should do is to make a technical presentation on some ham conference (preferable filmed and available on youtube afterwards) so that somebody else can start write a technical specs based on that. And, to be honest. Having to give a technical presentation is not necessairy a bad thing. I noticed myself that, having to make some slides and having to think on how to explain something, quite often leads to some insides into problems you are having. :-) One existing source of info is http://www.arrl.org/technical-characteristics But this doesn't provide always provide detailed description of a mode, for instance you couldn't recreate Pactor-III from the information supplied there. Also I suspect it's not kept up to date with mode enhancements. Thanks for the link. Very interesting. IIRC, pactor 2 and pactor 3 use patented technology so I doubt it will be freely documented somewhere. :-( 73 Trevor M5AKA Cheerio! Kristoff ON5ARF (ex ON1ARF)
Re: [digitalradio] Digital Voice update #2 - programmers wanted - codec2 and the G3PLX modem
Hi all, Talking of documentation and specs. I am still pretty new to radio-amateurism (just started again after more then 17 years) one of the first things I noticed when I started exploring all these digital modes, is that it is pretty difficult to get specifications and exact documentation of them all. If I look at the culture of the internet and opensource (which is my profesional background), I'm still surprised that there is not central repository of all these digital modes. In the internet-world, there is the IETF (internet Engineering Task Force) and there are RFCs. Almost all protocols are published as a RFC, for everybody to read; usually at the same time when applications and tools using it appear; and the IETF make sure there is a consistent wording and quality in these documents. This means that everbody who is interested in a protocol or some technology can just download the specs and read them. Either I have looked good enout, but AFAIK, in the ham-world; that does not exist at all. I've been searching all over the web to find information on how all these digital modes really work and you really need to scrap information together for all over the web (without any certainty what is now the correct way). I do not understand why -say- the IARU does not does this. I'm not say they should endorce any standard of any technology. But, the way I see it, it should really help if they would provide a platform so that everybody who comes up with a new technology or a protocol can document it (in a way consistent to other RFCs and place it in a central repostitory so that everybody can read it. That would help a lot, clear up inconsistencies between programs and help developers to write code. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. Op 28-08-10 11:17, Patrick Lindecker schreef: Hello Andy, I think it would be an interesting subject. However, if such mode was created I think it might be rather be conceived in some public way, so that the _detailed _specifications be public and written by specialists of this specific matter (I don't belong to these specialists). Then, it would be (relatively) easy to carry these detailed specifications to multimode programs, which would be compatible on this particular mode. Now, I think the Cesco program (FDMDV) exists and it worked well (at least with the first Codec), so... 73 Patrick - Original Message - *From:* Andy obrien mailto:k3uka...@gmail.com *To:* digitalradio@yahoogroups.com mailto:digitalradio@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Saturday, August 28, 2010 9:34 AM *Subject:* Re: [digitalradio] Digital Voice update #2 - programmers wanted - codec2 and the G3PLX modem I wonder if Patrick would be interested ??? Andy K3UK On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 3:26 AM, Tony d...@optonline.net mailto:d...@optonline.net wrote: All, I received an email from Peter Martinez today regarding the new codec developed by Dave Rowe. I had asked him if it was possible to use it in one of the digital voice applications and he explained that the modem, which was originally designed by Peter for a different voice codec, would have to be modified for it to work with Dave's codec. He said that he would not be able to take this on at the moment because of other obligations, but he did mention that he would pass along the know-how to anyone who would like to try writing a modem for Dave's codec based on Peter's own FDM design. This is how Cesco, HB9TLK re-engineered Peter's modem to work with a slower 1400 bps codec for the digital voice program FDMDV and how Erik, VK4RS developed EasyPal Unfortunately, we haven't been able to get in touch with Cesco for some time now so it may be necessary to have someone come up with a new digital voice application - something along the lines of WinDRM / FDMDV. If anyone is interested in taking on these projects, please contact me direct and I will put you in touch with Peter. Thanks, Tony -K2MO
Re: AW: AW: AW: [digitalradio] ROS v 4.8.X not spamming cluster
Laurie, Then why don't they filter it at the cluster? Makes more sence, if you ask me. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. Op 25-07-10 04:01, Laurie, VK3AMA schreef: Because, outside the US, there is a large EU user-base of ROS users contributing a significant of unwanted spam to the Cluster. de Laurie, VK3AMA On 25/07/2010 11:28 AM, F.R. Ashley wrote: After reading endless posts about this software, I sincerely wonder why in heck anyone is even using it. What are the chances of giving it a rest? 73 Buddy WB4M http://www.obriensweb.com/digispotter.html Chat, Skeds, and Spots all in one (resize to suit) Facebook= http://www.facebook.com/pages/digitalradio/123270301037522 Yahoo! Groups Links http://www.obriensweb.com/digispotter.html Chat, Skeds, and Spots all in one (resize to suit) Facebook= http://www.facebook.com/pages/digitalradio/123270301037522 Yahoo! Groups Links attachment: kristoff_bonne.vcf
Re: [digitalradio] Question about mail servers on HF
Hi All, Russell Blair schreef: We'er going out in the RV for about two weeks, and would like to check my mail on yahoo.com: Question is there nay mail servers on the HF that I can check into and get my mail, and what program would I need for this to happen, any help ? You know. I once saw a TV-documentory on this, and more particular on communication and life for people living on the small poor islands-nations of the pacific ocean. They used some kind of HF-radio based system to sent messages from post-offices located on certain islands to other Islands. I never found what system they where actually using. All information I found on the net is either aimed at hams or emergency communications, or for (rich) owners of yachts. Does anybody know if these systems are used by PTTs in the world? BTW. According the documantory, the main problem for these island-nations was not really the technology and equipement, but find a good secure electricity-system which -by preference- is not dependent on (to be imported, so very expensive) petroleum. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. -- jabber/gtalk: krist...@krbonne.net begin:vcard fn:Kristoff Bonne n:Bonne;Kristoff email;internet:kristoff.bo...@skypro.be note;quoted-printable:jabber: krist...@krbonne.net=0d=0a= x-mozilla-html:TRUE version:2.1 end:vcard signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
[digitalradio] new yahoo-group: gmfsk-devel
Gegroet, To continuo on the discussion here before, I set up a new yahoo-group called gmfsk-devel. Anybody interested in the further developement of gmfsk or spin-of projects, feel free to join. The URL is http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gmfsk-devel People who want to join via email, sent a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] The mailinglist is not moderated. Joining does is subject to moderation, but only to block spammer from joining the list. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: [digitalradio] MFSK/Olivia - sources released under GPL
Gegroet, Me too, I would be interested in hacking gmfsk (more out of interest of learning to write digital-mode programs). gmfsk is IMHO a great start to code new modes instead of writing a complete program by yourself, as it already has a great GUI and a number of low-level DSP algoritms in it. Wouldn't it be a good idea to set up a seperate list on gmfsk-development for everybody who is interested in this. There seams to be some people/groups going there own way, so getting them all on one mailing-list would (IMHO) be the best way to get everybody at least in touch with eachother. I do think this would be the priviledge of Tommi to do this, but as it looks like he has to much other things on his hands (hey, I understand, I have a life outside the internet too, you know :-)), perhaps somebody else could do it. If it is on yahoogroups, I would be willing to do this and take up the role of modurator for the time being. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. Leigh L Klotz, Jr. schreef: I sent the original sources I got from Pawel to Tomi and did the first on-the-air Olivia test with gMFSK. There is another OM who has recently forked gMFSK and announced it on this list. Getting those too back together would be a wiorthy goal as well. Leigh/WA5ZNU On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 5:56 am, Darren Long wrote: Hi, Can we just compile this into the latest release of gMFSK, or isn't gMFSK built like that? Darren, G0HWW On 22 Apr 2006, at 22:04, Pawel Jalocha wrote: It is my pleasure to annonce that the MFSK/Olivia source code is released under GPL and can be dowwnloaded from: http://homepage.sunrise.ch/mysunrise/jalocha/mfsk_olivia-Apr2006.tgz Pawel Need a Digital mode QSO? Connect to Telnet://cluster.dynalias.org Other areas of interest: The MixW Reflector : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup/ DigiPol: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipol (band plan policy discussion) YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "digitalradio" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: [digitalradio] MFSK/Olivia - sources released under GPL
Gegroet, Leigh L Klotz, Jr. schreef: Please count me in on such a list, but I wouldn't want to do anything to discourage Tomi. Are you going to contact him? I did email him; but -from what I understand from other people- he is a very busy man. My main goal would be to separate the modem back end from the GUI front and and have them communicate something like the way X Windows does, so we could have clients (GUIs like gpsk, or services like PSKMail). Also the modem server would more easily run on Windows, Mac, etc. that way, and be able to have a great UI for the platform. Well, I agree. gmfsk would be a great toolbox for all kind of protocols; so a system which is open so that other protocols and applications can be added inside into it, on top of it and below it). The way I see it, there are about 4 different parts: 1/ The lower-layer IO, i.e. everything that has to do with the audio- and PTT-devices. What would be nice is a way to make gmfsk read from files instead of from the audio-interfaces. (would be nice to do debugging or analise audio-samples that where recorded before-hand). 2/ The GUI: Is very good. The only thing I see that is but something that might be added is -on one side- a full 4 Khz spectrum/waterfall, but also a zoom into a very small part of the spectrum. 3/ The DSP-related stuff (FSK/MF/BPSK/QPSK/...) and the protocols that run on top of it. (let's call it layer 3a and 3b). The reason I would seperate the two is that certain protocols use the same modulation-sceme and could then use the same code. So, as gmfsk now already has RTTY, if you seperate the FSK-decoding from the upper-layer stuff; you could then use the same FSK-decoding modules for other protocols. So if you would then like to write (say) a navtex-decoder; you can do it by just adding code for the navtex/sitor-B/amtor-FEC stuff, and place it on-top of the FSK-decoding module. Another nice thing would be that a upper-layer protocol-code could use receive a dump of the FFT-process without any decoding. This would allow you to write (say) a wefax decoder. 4/ The upper-layer IO, So provide a standardised way to attach higher-level applications on top of the core communication protocols. This would allow applications like PSKmail to connect to a gmfsk using standard ports (unix-sockets, tcp-sockets) without the need to hack the code of gmfsk; or a decoder for digital sstv. (to name just two of them). Infact, as you also said, it would actually be possible to run this remotely from another machine over a network. No a more general note. I have the impression that most ham-software is writen by a single person or by just a very limited group. That's a bit strange as if you look at the open-source world; most applications overthere are writen by tens or even hunders of people. (how many people are working on -say- firefox, open office, GNOME or KDE, the linux-kernel, ...)? Perhaps, if we redesign fmfsk into a generic toolkit for digital radio; this would attract more people into this; as there wouldn't be a need to write everything from scratch again for your little program for your little new digital mode. Just write a module and plug it into the toolkit. A bit like lego. :-) Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: [digitalradio] navtex on linux (was: Do we really need to know?)
Gegroet, Dave Cole (NK7Z/NNN0RDO) schreef: Can someone tell me what freq NAVTEX transmissions are on please? The main frequencies are 518 Khz for the international (i.e. english-language) broadcasts and 490 Khz for local information. You can find the schedule here: http://home.cogeco.ca/~dxinfo/navtex.htm It carries safely-related maritime information. It's dual-frequency FSK at 100 baud with a shift of 170 Hz. In tropical areas, is also on 4209.5 Khz, but I don't know if there are already a lot of stations on that frequency. Thanks, Dave NK7Z/NNN0RDO http://www.nk7z.net Cheerio! Kristoff ON1ARF smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: [digitalradio] Linux for Windows addicts
Gegroet, Andrew O'Brien schreef: Please excuse the Linux rookie questions. I wonder if there is an easy to manage CD bootable Linux program that one could download for a CD burn? Sometime ago a member here (Harv, I think) was kind enough to mail out a CD that did this, it had a few sound card glitches so I stopped using it. It seems that some of us that are Windows addicts, but want to try some Linux only software, could be tempted if we had a simple to install Linux system that easily reverts to Windows. Maybe there are updates to what Harv was distributing? In addition to the hints given by some other people, you can also take a look at qemu, which is a free PC emulator. The main focus is to run it on a linux host but you can also run it on a windows box. This allows you to play around with different unix operating-systems inside a virtual PC on your windows; and will give you a way to try it out before you start installing it on a PC or without the need of live-CDs. Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: [digitalradio] Linux for Windows addicts
Gegroet, Kristoff Bonne schreef: In addition to the hints given by some other people, you can also take a look at qemu, which is a free PC emulator. The main focus is to run it on a linux host but you can also run it on a windows box. Oeps. Forgot the URLs: Main project page: http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/index.html Qemu for win32: http://free.oszoo.org/download.html Cheerio! Kr. Bonne. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
