Re: FreeBSD Stable Image
On 29 March 2012 19:22, Matthew Seaman matt...@freebsd.org wrote: On 29/03/2012 17:18, Matthew Seaman wrote: On 29/03/2012 17:10, Mike Barnard wrote: Hi, Any one know where I can get a FreeBSD-9.0-STABLE ISO/IMG image? ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-stable/ That path does not seem to have it. ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/9.0/ Errr... except of course that is -RELEASE and you asked for -STABLE. I don't believe there's a 9.0-STABLE snapshot available at freebsd.org right now. Instead, try one from here: ftp://ftp.allbsd.org/pub/FreeBSD-snapshots/amd64-amd64/9.0-RELENG_9-20120329-JPSNAP/ There's a new snapshot available there pretty much daily. Thanks Matthew. I do recall downloading a STABLE ISO a while back, make that a few years back. It was a 7.0-STABLE image. I guess they are not there any more :-( -- Mike Of course, you might discount this possibility, but remember that one in a million chances happen 99% of the time. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: FreeBSD Stable Image
Hi, Reference: From: Mike Barnard mike.barna...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 09:32:39 +0300 Message-id: cadhh34ofe5v3nrg3lzwvejomzes0fykbfr4patv2hj+j5c6...@mail.gmail.com Mike Barnard wrote: On 29 March 2012 19:22, Matthew Seaman matt...@freebsd.org wrote: On 29/03/2012 17:18, Matthew Seaman wrote: On 29/03/2012 17:10, Mike Barnard wrote: Hi, Any one know where I can get a FreeBSD-9.0-STABLE ISO/IMG image? ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-stable/ That path does not seem to have it. ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/amd64/amd64/ISO-IMAGES/9.0/ Errr... except of course that is -RELEASE and you asked for -STABLE. I don't believe there's a 9.0-STABLE snapshot available at freebsd.org right now. Instead, try one from here: ftp://ftp.allbsd.org/pub/FreeBSD-snapshots/amd64-amd64/9.0-RELENG_9-20120329-JPSNAP/ There's a new snapshot available there pretty much daily. Thanks Matthew. I do recall downloading a STABLE ISO a while back, make that a few years back. It was a 7.0-STABLE image. I guess they are not there any more :-( With advent of 9 release, various paths that had a single i386 or amd64 etc in, now have a double set in the path name. But all the old 8,7,6 etc paths retain use of single $ARCH. Other than that I dont think there's been other path name changes. Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Reply below not above, cumulative like a play script, indent with . Format: Plain text. Not HTML, multipart/alternative, base64, quoted-printable. Mail from @yahoo dumped @berklix. http://berklix.org/yahoo/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
question regarding geom labels
hi there, i have a question regarding a label for a swap partition. when should i do the labeling? after or before creating the partition scheme? when i label before creating the partition scheme, likes this: glabel label -v swap /dev/da0 gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 i get the following warning: GEOM: da1: the secondary GPT header is not in the last LBA. which is obvious, because the label is being written into the last LBA and thus the backup GPT header gets written into the last-1 LBA. if i create the partitioning scheme before labeling the device, like this: gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 glabel label -v swap /dev/da0 or gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 gpart add -t freebsd-swap /dev/da0 glabel label -v swap /dev/da0p1 the label gets written into da0 or da0p1 and is at constant risk of being overwritten by userdata. cheers. alex ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Surge 2012 CFP is Open!
Surge 2012, the scalability conference, September 27-28, Baltimore, MD has opened its CFP. Please visit http://omniti.com/surge/2012/cfp for details. -- Katherine Jeschke Director of Marketing and Creative Services OmniTI Computer Consulting, Inc. 7070 Samuel Morse Drive, Ste.150 Columbia, MD 21046 O: 443-325-1357, 222 F: 410/872-4911 C: 443/643-6140 omniti.com Surge2012: http://omniti.com/surge/2012 PG Corridor Days - DC: http://pgday.bwpug.org/ The information contained in this electronic message and any attached documents is privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient, note that any review, disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this electronic message or any attached documents is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please destroy it and notify us immediately by telephone (1-443-325-1360) or by electronic mail (i...@omniti.com). Thank you. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Please help me diagnose this crazy VMWare/FreeBSD 8.x crash
On 3/29/2012 7:01 AM, Joe Greco wrote: On 3/28/2012 1:59 PM, Mark Felder wrote: FreeBSD 8-STABLE, 8.3, and 9.0 are untested As much as I'm sensitive to your production requirements, realistically it's not likely that you'll get a helpful result without testing a newer version. 8.2 came out over a year ago, many many things have changed since then. Doug So you're saying that he should have been using 8.3-RELEASE, then. That isn't what I said at all, sorry if I wasn't clear. The OP mentioned 9.0-RELEASE, and in the context of his message (which I snipped) he mentioned 8-stable. That's what I was referring to. And since both the poster and I made it clear that this doesn't seem to be a case of it fails reliably on a machine of your choosing, just installing random other versions and hoping that it's going to cause a fail ... well, let's just say that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Or at least it's a recipe for a hell of a lot of busywork, busywork not guaranteed to return any sort of useful result. What you suggest is a fine solution for My ASUS Sempron box fails when I do X! -- in such a case, Try a different version of FreeBSD makes lots of sense. The problem is, in a virtualization environment, theoretically the virtual hosts are all the same sort of hardware (modulo any specific configuration changes of course), so when someone presents a problem that afflicts only a percentage of their VM's, it is important to keep in mind that you are not interacting with physical hardware, and that reinstalling an OS on a problem VM...? Well, let's just say I like real hardware better for many reasons. In the meantime, it's unrealistic to tell people to use supported releases, to wait fifteen months between releases, and then to criticize people complaining about problems with a supported release for using old code. ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again. - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: question regarding geom labels
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, Alexander Best wrote: i have a question regarding a label for a swap partition. when should i do the labeling? after or before creating the partition scheme? when i label before creating the partition scheme, likes this: glabel label -v swap /dev/da0 gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 i get the following warning: GEOM: da1: the secondary GPT header is not in the last LBA. which is obvious, because the label is being written into the last LBA and thus the backup GPT header gets written into the last-1 LBA. Right. Don't do that, the GPT backup header needs to be at the end of the physical device. If you're using that whole disk for swap, there's no need for a partition anyway. if i create the partitioning scheme before labeling the device, like this: gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 glabel label -v swap /dev/da0 or gpart create -s GPT /dev/da0 gpart add -t freebsd-swap /dev/da0 glabel label -v swap /dev/da0p1 the label gets written into da0 or da0p1 and is at constant risk of being overwritten by userdata. No. The swap device entered in /etc/fstab would be /dev/label/swap, which is one block smaller than da0p1. That's the last-block metadata, it's safe. But if the whole disk is for swap, skip the partitioning entirely. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Please help me diagnose this crazy VMWare/FreeBSD 8.x crash
On Thu, 29 Mar 2012 19:27:31 -0500, Joe Greco jgr...@ns.sol.net wrote: It also doesn't explain the experience here, where one VM basically crapped out but only after a migration - and then stayed crapped out. It would be interesting to hear about your datastore, how busy it is, what technology, whether you're using thin, etc. I just have this real strong feeling that it's some sort of corruption with the vmfs3 and thin provisioned disk format, but it'd be interesting to know if that's totally off-track. We've ruled out SAN, but we haven't ruled out VMFS. Even FreeBSD Guests on standalone ESXi servers with no SAN exhibit this crash. For the record, we only use thick provisioning and if it was corruption I'm not sure what layer the corruption could be at. The crashy servers show no abnormalities when I run either `freebsd-update IPS` or `pkg_libchk` to confirm checksums of all installed programs. Now the other data on there... it's not exactly verified, but our backups via rsnapshot seem to prove there is no issue there or we'd have lots of new files each run. Crud, there goes part of my theory :-) Have you migrated these hosts, or were they installed in-place and never moved? fwiw the apparent integrity of things on the VM is consistent with our experience too. ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again. - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
Karel Miklav wrote:
Could you please recommend me a home printer that works nicely with FreeBSD?
HP inkjets aren't that bad, FreeBSD drivers are allright, but I'd like
to shift towards some kind of PostScript laser. Xerox Phaser 6500 looks
nice, but I can not economically justify my appetite. Is there a cheaper
alternative or maybe PostScript printers aren't that good idea anyway, heh?
Postscript printers make [more] sense If:
- Corporate use .. maybe ?
- Trying to offload connected PC CPU (rarely need to for home
use, now PCs are fast).
- Coms link to printer is slow
Worst case: I once had a serial cable to a serial
to parallel converter, then you notice how big PCL data is.
especially if doing own font rendering, not using printer
built in font sets, ( I made my own Russian font sets once).
So now CPU load no longer an issue, as
these days an ethernet to centronics type converter is cheap, connect
any old PCL laser with centronics (eg my Old HP 4L cost me ~ 3 beers)
Ghostscript converts { PS PDF etc } to PCL,
called automatically as a filter from /etc/printcap
I wrote my own filter,
http://berklix.com/~jhs/src/bsd/jhs/bin/local/lpf_vsl/lpf_vsl
before becoming aware there's a standard one:
/usr/ports/print/apsfilter
There's a section in the Handbook about CUPS you should read
For some new HP USB you want certain options in out of kernel.
Cheers,
Julian
--
Julian Stacey, BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com
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how often to update ports?
Aleksandr Miroslav writes: How often do you folks update your ports/packages. I was manging two servers for years for my personal web/email, and I've rarely gone for more than 3 months with any single package being not up to date, usually about once a month I would update all my ports. Security updates go in as soon as they can be tested locally. Everything else ... within a couple of days, unless a) others report problems, or b) it requires a lot of re-building dependant ports (e.g. perl, X, autotools). Caveats: no machine is mission-critical; most are lightly loaded; spares are available. Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:14:20 -0400 Mike Jeays articulated: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. I have used an HP 1020 for three years now, and it works fine after three cartridges. I had an inkjet fail at the first cartridge change, after I bought new cartridges. (EPSON - never again). I know several students that purchase inexpensive ink-jet printers that work perfectly. When the ink runs out, they just replace the unit. The cost is about the same. I could replace probably four cheap ink-jet units for what it is gong to cost me just to replace the cartridges in my Brother Laser Color unit. Then when you factor in the other parts that eventually will need replacement, it really gets expensive. -- Jerry ♔ Disclaimer: off-list followups get on-list replies or get ignored. Please do not ignore the Reply-To header. __ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 17:38:36 +0200, Karel Miklav wrote: Could you please recommend me a home printer that works nicely with FreeBSD? HP inkjets aren't that bad, FreeBSD drivers are allright, but I'd like to shift towards some kind of PostScript laser. Xerox Phaser 6500 looks nice, but I can not economically justify my appetite. Is there a cheaper alternative or maybe PostScript printers aren't that good idea anyway, heh? Allow me to mention some things that are worth investing in. 1. Network connection. Don't bother with USB stuff. Buy a printer that offers Ethernet and maybe also WLAN, this will save you many trouble, and you are free to put the printer wherever you want. 2. Standard language. Postscript and PCL. Make sure the printer understands at least one of them. PCL is very common among HP printers. Regarding drivers - you don't need them. PS is the default output format for printing from every application. Printer filter collections such as apsfilter or CUPS tend to support non-PS printers very well, and it's quite easy to write your own printer filter (may even be a one-liner) using ghostscript. There's nothing wrong with PS because (as I said) you don't need any drivers, but the data transfer may need some time, and the processing speed depends on how fast and how good (!) the PS interpreter in the printer is. In my experience (with the printers I'm going to mention at the end of this message) PCL is faster. 3. Laser printer. Don't believe that inkpee printers are genereally cheaper. They are not. The only excuse for using them is that you need photo quality color prints (requiring the proper paper, too). 4. Additional functionalities. Before buying something, ask yourself what you need. Does it need to have a scanner? Does the scanner part support FreeBSD? Is there a way to scan to local storage (e. g. USB stick) in the printer? Does it need a sheet feeder for scan input? Does it need to scan photo positive/negative films? Does it need to fax? I have had good luck with my army of laser printers here. HP Laserjet II, 4, 4000 duplex, as well as a Samsung color laserprinter CLX-2160. All this stuff works out of the box. I don't have any need for inkpee. Photos can be printed at much better quality at my local drugstore, if I need that. The printer filters are gs one-liners I wrote myself, because I speak PCL to the laser printer, and some splix gibberish using foo2qpdl to the (sadly USB connected) color printer. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: freebsd 9.0-release + zfs + mysqld(percona) = kernel: swap zone exhausted, increase kern.maxswzone
On 03/28/12 03:09, Philip M. Gollucci wrote: It works out to roughly 7.7GB from 32MB okay fine. If I double it, that should give me 15.4GB from 64MB (still not enough). If I 16x it that should give me 246GB from 512MB. Thats more my physical ram + swap. Oh well. After reading several sparse articles/post, I've come to the conclusion that FreeBSD doesn't do well with SWAP 32GB; however it does allow it. As such I decided to drop the swap to 8GB*2=16GB. Sadly that didn't help either after dropping kern.maxswzone back 2*thedefault which is apparently very near or the max you can up it and get more actual SWAPMETA space b/c of the limiting based on the number of total system pages. I'm still quite perplexed here. Please also the recent thread on -stable where someone has the same problem with ZFS/NFS. subject: 9-STABLE, ZFS, NFS, ggatec - suspected memory leak -- 1024D/DB9B8C1C B90B FBC3 A3A1 C71A 8E70 3F8C 75B8 8FFB DB9B 8C1C Philip M. Gollucci (pgollu...@p6m7g8.com) c: 703.336.9354 Member, Apache Software Foundation Committer,FreeBSD Foundation Consultant, P6M7G8 Inc. Director Operations, Ridecharge Inc. Work like you don't need the money, love like you'll never get hurt, and dance like nobody's watching. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Printer recommendation please
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:14:20 -0400 Mike Jeays wrote: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. How do they compare for light and occasional use? I'm thinking in terms of a few pages, a few times a year, so presumably the consumables become perishables. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, RW wrote: On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:14:20 -0400 Mike Jeays wrote: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. How do they compare for light and occasional use? I'm thinking in terms of a few pages, a few times a year, so presumably the consumables become perishables. In exactly that scenario, ink nozzles can dry out, rendering your inkjet printer inoperable. I only print every few weeks, and if I had to replace ink for every print just because it dried out, I think I might become angry. My laser printer works even after months of inactivity. For the record, I completely agree with Mike. I also would not buy a printer that did not speak Postscript. My PS-speaking LaserJet was working as fast as I could edit /etc/printcap - no CUPS, no drivers, no ghostscript, no filters. -- Chris Hill ch...@monochrome.org ** [ Busy Expunging / ] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
RE: Printer recommendation please
-Original Message- From: owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Karel Miklav Sent: 30 March 2012 16:39 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Printer recommendation please Could you please recommend me a home printer that works nicely with FreeBSD? HP inkjets aren't that bad, FreeBSD drivers are allright, but I'd like to shift towards some kind of PostScript laser. Xerox Phaser 6500 looks nice, but I can not economically justify my appetite. Is there a cheaper alternative or maybe PostScript printers aren't that good idea anyway, heh? -- Thanks, Karel ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org Not exactly conclusive, I have a Dell 1320C with the Ethernet module, and while I have never needed to connect it to one of my FreeBSD machines, it would work with OS X and CUPS, since then Dell has released an official driver for OS X. However I am not sure as to how much use an OS X driver would be for FreeBSD, for £90 I am satisfied with its performance. Regards Graeme ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
FreeBSD Security in Multiuser Environments
Hello,
I would like to raise a discussion about the security features
of FreeBSD as a whole and how they might be employed to actually
derive some meaningful guarantees.
I have found myself administering a system with many potentially
untrusted users. Furthermore, some users do not trust some of the
programs they run and are thus allowed to ask for some slave
accounts. A slave account is a user account accessible only to
root and the master user. This can lead to a hierachy of authority.
Also, each account has potentially confidential data that may be
accessed only by the account itself and its ancestor accounts. This
includes when a user is logged on and what the user is running.
Finally, the system must always be up so no user untrusted by root
may trash it.
This is a pretty harsh set of restrictions and is almost unmanageable.
However, I have taken three steps to ensure security: base system
hardening, using sudo for privilege granting and using rctl(8) for
resource accounting and control. Gathering enough information in these
three areas has been an ongoing task for almost half a year, and I
would like to discuss some problems of my approach.
In terms of system hardening, I have:
* Encrypted the whole (except /boot) system with geli(8)
(HMAC/SHA256 and AES-XTS). It is not as nice and much slower
than proper filesystem-level checksumming but it is what
FreeBSD provides (ZFS is too unstable).
* Disabled useless and potentially dangerous services: cron, devd
and sendmail.
* Removed every setuid bit. The system works even then.
* Hardened /dev: every non necessary device has had the 0007 bits
stripped. Optional groups were created (e.g. audio, mixer and mic
for devices /dev/{mixer,dsp,audio}*).
* Hardened the sysctls:
- security.bsd.see_other_uids=0: Users can only see own processes.
- security.bsd.unprivileged_proc_debug=0
- security.bsd.unprivileged_read_msgbuf=0: The log is considered
sensitive information.
- security.bsd.hardlink_check_uid=1: Avoid hardlinks to old SUID
binaries.
- kern.log_console_output=0
- kern.coredump=0
- vm.overcommit=1: This avoids retarded Linux-like behaviour on
OOM conditions.
* Changed permissions on /root to 0700: root deserves privacy.
* A boot script changes some permissions:
- /var/log to 0750: the logs are considered sensitive information.
- /var/run/dmesg.boot to 0640: this is also sensitive information.
* Added a group sudoers and made sudo setuid only to users in
sudoers: would have avoided trouble with recent sudo exploit if
only trusted users have slaves.
As for using sudo to grant privilege, for each master-slave
relationship between users u and v, I have added a line like
u ALL = (v) NOPASSWD: ALL to /etc/sudoers. Then the user u is
supposed to become v by issuing sudo -i -u v and to execute a
command as v by issuing sudo -i -u v
It is worth noticing that sudo closes all file descriptors greater than
or equal to 3. It is important not to let your pseudo-terminal leak
through file descriptors 0, 1 and 2 if you have a shell connected to
it. Also, the -i is mandatory because otherwise a file descriptor
open at directory . is leaked via the cwd file descriptor. I
believe this is enough, but since this is not properly documented, I
am not sure.
As for resource limiting via rctl(8), for each user u root does not
trust, I have added three rules:
* user:u:vmemoryuse:deny=MEM
* user:u:maxproc:deny=PROCS
* user:u:pseudoterminals:deny=0
Here MEM and PROCS are limits on total virtual memory usage and
total occupied entries in the process table for process u,
respectively. Furthermore, I never give access to pseudo-terminals to
untrusted users because all sessions are started from ssh or ptys of
trusted users. Also, ptys must be available otherwise trusted users can
not work on the machine. Finally, I have noticed rctl -u user:u
reports a single pty open for user u no matter how many open ptys u has
(except of course if u has no open pty, in which case 0 is reported).
One naively would expect these restrictions to be enough to prevent
abuse (trashing or DoS) as long as the sum of the MEM values (rounded
up to page size) is less than or equal to the total physical memory
plus swap space less the system (and trusted users') memory usage and
the sum of the PROC values is less than the process table size minus
the number of trusted processes. I sincerely do not know if this is the
case.
However, using vmemoryuse as a limit is overkill: it counts the total
mapped pages, not the total anonymous pages, which are the ones that
actually take resources. Of course, this assumes the memory management
data structures (including the page table) are accounted as anonymous
memory of the corresponding process, since it is easy (especially on
amd64), to map pages sparsely to greatly increase the size of the
page table. However, I do not know if this assumption holds on
RE: Printer recommendation please
On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:14:20 -0400 Mike Jeays wrote: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. How do they compare for light and occasional use? I'm thinking in terms of a few pages, a few times a year, so presumably the consumables become perishables. Toner really doesn't go bad, and good laser printers are built to last. My first laser printer was an HP LaserJet 5P that my local bank branch was throwing away in 2003. It ran on its existing toner cartridge for 5 or 6 years under light use - maybe 500 pages per year. Matt ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 00:12:07 -0400, Matt Emmerton wrote: Toner really doesn't go bad, and good laser printers are built to last. My first laser printer was an HP LaserJet 5P that my local bank branch was throwing away in 2003. It ran on its existing toner cartridge for 5 or 6 years under light use - maybe 500 pages per year. Ha, that's nothing! I _still_ have a fully functional HP Laserjet 4. I got it in a heavily used state in 1996, and I've never treated it in a polite way: always quite heavy use. The printer is still working today, after more than 15 years. It has been on pause for some years, and right after plugging it in again, it produced regular quality results. Just try _that_ with typical home consumer inkpee stuff. :-) I can't tell you how many pages the printer has done in its life. The page counter must have encountered an overrun and now says some 4 digit number which doesn't increase anymore. So now I can sell it as only few pages printed, like new... :-) If durability is interesting, buying a laser printer will be the right choice. Today's inkpee printers seem to be the same price as a full ink cartridge refill (or even lower), creating cheaper devices on one hand (good), but creating more electronic waste at the other hand (bad). So if you want to reduce garbage, get a printer that will serve you for a long time. When I was at university, there was a student, a rich one as one could assume: When he had emptied a printer, he bought a new one, dropping the old one into the garbage can. He even bought a new printer when he failed to plug in the one he just bought, and he also bought a new one when he didn't get the drivers installed of another new printer. He threw away two (maybe more?) fully functional printers. You see, money can compensate stupidity. His educational result? He got a degree in computer science. :-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
RW rwmailli...@googlemail.com wrote: Mike Jeays wrote: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. How do they compare for light and occasional use? I'm thinking in terms of a few pages, a few times a year, so presumably the consumables become perishables. Laser 'consumables' do _not_ suffer problems if the printer is only used occasionally. This is, in fact, one of the *BIG* advantaes of lasers over inkpee units. The 'cost per page' of output, at the rated pagecount is substantially lower for lasers, *AND* you will get the rated pagecount, even if it takes a decade, or longer. I've got a low-end laser I bought, *used*, over a decade ago. I have -yet- to replace the _used_ toner cartridge that came with the printer. Print quality is still as good as when I got it. My 'total cost of ownership' is, so far, around $3/year, and _declining_. Or, under two cents per page, _including_ the cost of the hardware. With inkpee printers you have to print a some pages every couple of weeks (preferably somewhat more often) or you run a _high_ probability of the cartridge having gotten 'gummed up', and rendered unusable, *despite* the amount of ink remaining in it. In 'lightly used' units, this can result in a _tripling_ (or more) of the (already high) 'true cost' per page of output. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
Hi, On Saturday 31 March 2012 11:28:55 Polytropon wrote: On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 00:12:07 -0400, Matt Emmerton wrote: When I was at university, there was a student, a rich one as one could assume: When he had emptied a printer, he bought a new one, dropping the old one into the garbage can. He even bought a new printer when he failed to plug in the one he just bought, and he also bought a new one when he didn't get the drivers installed of another new printer. He threw away two (maybe more?) fully functional printers. I know a person who did this too. But for the purpose of saving money. It was during a time when new printers with refill have been cheaper than the refill. This guy actually saved money and has had the latest model. I do not know if the pricing is still this strange. Erich ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Printer recommendation please
Hi, On Saturday 31 March 2012 11:12:07 Matt Emmerton wrote: On Fri, 30 Mar 2012 16:14:20 -0400 Mike Jeays wrote: I strongly recommend a laser printer over an inkjet even for home use. The reduced running costs and better reliability are easily worth the lack of colour, IMO. How do they compare for light and occasional use? I'm thinking in terms of a few pages, a few times a year, so presumably the consumables become perishables. Toner really doesn't go bad, and good laser printers are built to last. My first laser printer was an HP LaserJet 5P that my local bank branch was throwing away in 2003. It ran on its existing toner cartridge for 5 or 6 years under light use - maybe 500 pages per year. yes, take a laser. Inkjets just dry out before the next use. You need then to take some time to fix it. I have had only one in my life. I thought it was a good buy until I realised this problem. My first laser printer was a IIP running for at least a decade until the electronics gave way. I just realised that I have had no laser printer failing mechanically. The problem might will be to find a cheap one which works with FreeBSD. Friends bought the cheapest Samsung AIO. It did not give them any problems running Linux. Erich Matt ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
