history
when I log into free bsd I am in the sh shell. i type history at the command line and the machine says history not found. If I type h at the command line it works like i expect the history command to work. In the csh or tcsh shells history works as well as h. why does entering history at the command line work in the csh and tcsh shells but not in the sh shell. Considering that all three shells seem to have the same .cshrc file? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: history
On 9/19/13 3:36 PM, william benton wrote: when I log into free bsd I am in the sh shell. i type history at the command line and the machine says history not found. If I type h at the command line it works like i expect the history command to work. In the csh or tcsh shells history works as well as h. why does entering history at the command line work in the csh and tcsh shells but not in the sh shell. Considering that all three shells seem to have the same .cshrc file? Bourne shell (sh) has no history component. Bourne Again shell (bash) does, as well as C-shell and Turbo C-shell (csh/tcsh). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bourne_shell#Criticism Best, --Glenn ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: history
On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 19:36:43 +, william benton wrote: when I log into free bsd I am in the sh shell. i type history at the command line and the machine says history not found. If I type h at the command line it works like i expect the history command to work. That is strange. The sh shell (system scripting shell and emergency dialog shell in SUM) does not have a history function. % sh $ h h: not found $ history history: not found $ _ In the csh or tcsh shells history works as well as h. This is correct. A system-wide alias is defined for those shells: alias h 'history 25' It can be found in /etc/csh.cshrc. why does entering history at the command line work in the csh and tcsh shells but not in the sh shell. The sh shell (Bourne-like shell, actually a derivate of ash) does not have this functionality. Bash, the Bourne-again shell, supports the history function internally, and a h alias can be defined for this shell. % bash $ history [...] 501 history $ _ Considering that all three shells seem to have the same .cshrc file? They don't. The csh and tcsh (system default dialog shell) use the cshrc mechanism (/etc/csh.cshrc for global settings, .cshrc for user settings, and .login and .logout for interactive shells), while sh uses /etc/profile and .profile and .shrc similarly. Bash uses .profile as well as .bash_profile and .bash_login in a comparable manner. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Bash history empty on login
On Monday 07 January 2013 7:01:09 pm Andre Goree wrote: I'm not sure what's going on, as I've never had an issue like this in my years of using FreeBSD nor Linux. Each time I login, my history file is empty! I'm not sure what could be causing this, but below [1] is my .bashrc. I had . ~/.bashrc in ~/.profile, but I removed it while I'm trying to troubleshoot this issue. Does anyone have an idea or a direction to point me in? Thanks in advance. [1]# # ~/.bashrc # # If not running interactively, don't do anything [[ $- != *i* ]] return #PS1='[\u@\h \W]\$ ' alias ls='ls -G' alias ll='ls -lAhp' alias umount='sudo umount' alias grep='grep --color' alias nmap='sudo nmap' alias updatedb='sudo updatedb' alias pkg_add='sudo pkg_add' alias pkg_delete='sudo pkg_delete' alias top='top -aPStzj -s 1' alias portinstall='sudo portinstall' alias updatedb='sudo updatedb' PS1='\[\e[1;37m\][\u@\h \W]\$\[\e[0m\] ' export PATH=$PATH:/home/agoree/bin:/usr/local/kde4/bin/ #BASH history export HISTTIMEFORMAT=%h/%d - %H:%M:%S export HISTFILESIZE=10 #export VBOX_USB=usbfs -- Hope I'm not offending you if the following are things you've tried as a matter-of-course: After booting up, is history started, or do you have to do that manually? Have you run set -o to see if history is enabled? If it isn't, then set -o history. Is a clear command being issued from anywhere upon logout or reboot? Just some thoughts. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Bash history empty on login
On Tue, 08 Jan 2013 07:59:51 -0500, Dimitri Yioulos dyiou...@onpointfc.com wrote: Hope I'm not offending you if the following are things you've tried as a matter-of-course: After booting up, is history started, or do you have to do that manually? Have you run set -o to see if history is enabled? If it isn't, then set -o history. Is a clear command being issued from anywhere upon logout or reboot? Just some thoughts. No offense at all, thanks for your suggestions! I'm currently at work so I'll test this when I get home (this is on a desktop running 8.3-stable). I've never had to do anything special when using bash on FreeBSD. I'll be sure to check th output of set -o and report back here. If there's an erroneous 'clear' command somewhere, it must be on logout since I can easily test this problem being that I use tmux. :) I also do not have a .bash_logout file, if that matters. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll let you know what turns up. -- Andre Goree an...@drenet.info ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Bash history empty on login
On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 09:05-0500, Andre Goree wrote: On Tue, 08 Jan 2013 07:59:51 -0500, Dimitri Yioulos dyiou...@onpointfc.com wrote: Hope I'm not offending you if the following are things you've tried as a matter-of-course: After booting up, is history started, or do you have to do that manually? Have you run set -o to see if history is enabled? If it isn't, then set -o history. Is a clear command being issued from anywhere upon logout or reboot? Just some thoughts. No offense at all, thanks for your suggestions! I'm currently at work so I'll test this when I get home (this is on a desktop running 8.3-stable). I've never had to do anything special when using bash on FreeBSD. I'll be sure to check th output of set -o and report back here. If there's an erroneous 'clear' command somewhere, it must be on logout since I can easily test this problem being that I use tmux. :) I also do not have a .bash_logout file, if that matters. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll let you know what turns up. What are the permissions of ~/.bash_history? Usually they are set to 0600 in octal due to security concerns and rightfully so. Could they be (re)set to 0400 or even ? -- +---++ | Vennlig hilsen, | Best regards, | | Trond Endrestøl, | Trond Endrestøl, | | IT-ansvarlig, | System administrator, | | Fagskolen Innlandet, | Gjøvik Technical College, Norway, | | tlf. mob. 952 62 567, | Cellular...: +47 952 62 567, | | sentralbord 61 14 54 00. | Switchboard: +47 61 14 54 00. | +---++___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Bash history empty on login
On 01/08/13 09:11, Trond Endrestøl wrote: On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 09:05-0500, Andre Goree wrote: On Tue, 08 Jan 2013 07:59:51 -0500, Dimitri Yioulos dyiou...@onpointfc.com wrote: Hope I'm not offending you if the following are things you've tried as a matter-of-course: After booting up, is history started, or do you have to do that manually? Have you run set -o to see if history is enabled? If it isn't, then set -o history. Is a clear command being issued from anywhere upon logout or reboot? Just some thoughts. No offense at all, thanks for your suggestions! I'm currently at work so I'll test this when I get home (this is on a desktop running 8.3-stable). I've never had to do anything special when using bash on FreeBSD. I'll be sure to check th output of set -o and report back here. If there's an erroneous 'clear' command somewhere, it must be on logout since I can easily test this problem being that I use tmux. :) I also do not have a .bash_logout file, if that matters. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll let you know what turns up. What are the permissions of ~/.bash_history? Usually they are set to 0600 in octal due to security concerns and rightfully so. Could they be (re)set to 0400 or even ? I think I've found the culprit, however: [agoree@desktop ~]$ echo $HISTFILESIZE 1024000 [agoree@desktop ~]$ echo $HISTFILE /home/agoree/.bash_history [agoree@desktop ~]$ ll /home/agoree/.bash_history -rw--- 1 agoree agoree12k Jan 5 14:09 /home/agoree/.bash_history [agoree@desktop ~]$ cat /home/agoree/.bash_history cat: /home/agoree/.bash_history: Input/output error [agoree@desktop ~]$ file /home/agoree/.bash_history /home/agoree/.bash_history: ERROR: cannot read `/home/agoree/.bash_history' (Input/output error) I suppose I'm in need of a scrub, eh? Or perhaps just a tweak to $HISTFILE until I have the time (or energy) to deal with the scrub -- probably not a good idea, but sense all my important data is kept on a NAS... :p -- Andre Goree an...@drenet.info ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Bash history empty on login
On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 18:49-0500, Andre Goree wrote:
I think I've found the culprit, however:
[agoree@desktop ~]$ echo $HISTFILESIZE
1024000
[agoree@desktop ~]$ echo $HISTFILE
/home/agoree/.bash_history
[agoree@desktop ~]$ ll /home/agoree/.bash_history
-rw--- 1 agoree agoree12k Jan 5 14:09 /home/agoree/.bash_history
[agoree@desktop ~]$ cat /home/agoree/.bash_history
cat: /home/agoree/.bash_history: Input/output error
[agoree@desktop ~]$ file /home/agoree/.bash_history
/home/agoree/.bash_history: ERROR: cannot read
`/home/agoree/.bash_history' (Input/output error)
I suppose I'm in need of a scrub, eh? Or perhaps just a tweak to
$HISTFILE until I have the time (or energy) to deal with the scrub --
probably not a good idea, but sense all my important data is kept on a
NAS... :p
So, yeahhh...:
NAMESTATE READ WRITE CKSUM
zroot ONLINE 0 0 586
ad4s1dONLINE 0 0 0
ad8s1dONLINE 0 0 586
I don't know if this was intentional, but your zroot pool is
configured with absolutely no redundancy unless you have set the
zfs copies property to a value greater than 1 on selected file
systems if not all file systems. The text quoted below does not
indicate any of this.
You should at the very least mirror your zroot pool between no less
than 2 drives/partitions, shouldn't raidz{1,2,3} with the appropriate
number of drives/partitions prove tempting or possible hardwarewise.
errors: Permanent errors have been detected in the following files:
/usr/local/share/icons/hicolor/128x128/apps/vlc.png
zroot/usr:0x11ae0a
zroot/usr:0x109118
zroot/usr:0x11ae18
zroot/usr:0x11ae19
zroot/usr:0x11ae1d
zroot/usr:0x11ae1e
zroot/usr:0x18b61e
zroot/usr:0x18b622
zroot/usr:0x18b62e
zroot/usr:0x18b637
/usr/ports/sysutils/e2fsprogs/work/e2fsprogs-1.42.6/e2fsck/e2fsck.c.bak
zroot/usr:0x18b63c
zroot/usr:0x18b63d
zroot/usr:0x18b641
zroot/usr:0x18b642
zroot/usr:0x109256
/usr/home/agoree/.opera.bak/icons/www.google.com.idx
/usr/home/agoree/.opera.bak/download.dat
/usr/home/agoree/.cache/chromium/Default/Cache/data_1
/usr/home/agoree/.opera.bak/typed_history.xml
/usr/home/agoree/.bash_history
zroot/usr:0x109199
zroot/usr:0x11ad9b
/usr/local/share/locale/fo/LC_MESSAGES/cairo-dock.mo
/usr/local/lib/qt4/plugins/script/libqtscript_core.so.1.0.0
zroot/var:0x98bf
I'm very sorry for your loss, but apparently these files aren't
critical user data.
I'll probably just go ahead and reinstall -- I've been wanting to give
9.1 a try anyways.
Good luck and don't forget about redundancy! :D
--
+---++
| Vennlig hilsen, | Best regards, |
| Trond Endrestøl, | Trond Endrestøl, |
| IT-ansvarlig, | System administrator, |
| Fagskolen Innlandet, | Gjøvik Technical College, Norway, |
| tlf. mob. 952 62 567, | Cellular...: +47 952 62 567, |
| sentralbord 61 14 54 00. | Switchboard: +47 61 14 54 00. |
+---++___
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Bash history empty on login
I'm not sure what's going on, as I've never had an issue like this in my years of using FreeBSD nor Linux. Each time I login, my history file is empty! I'm not sure what could be causing this, but below [1] is my .bashrc. I had . ~/.bashrc in ~/.profile, but I removed it while I'm trying to troubleshoot this issue. Does anyone have an idea or a direction to point me in? Thanks in advance. [1]# # ~/.bashrc # # If not running interactively, don't do anything [[ $- != *i* ]] return #PS1='[\u@\h \W]\$ ' alias ls='ls -G' alias ll='ls -lAhp' alias umount='sudo umount' alias grep='grep --color' alias nmap='sudo nmap' alias updatedb='sudo updatedb' alias pkg_add='sudo pkg_add' alias pkg_delete='sudo pkg_delete' alias top='top -aPStzj -s 1' alias portinstall='sudo portinstall' alias updatedb='sudo updatedb' PS1='\[\e[1;37m\][\u@\h \W]\$\[\e[0m\] ' export PATH=$PATH:/home/agoree/bin:/usr/local/kde4/bin/ #BASH history export HISTTIMEFORMAT=%h/%d - %H:%M:%S export HISTFILESIZE=10 #export VBOX_USB=usbfs -- Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
Wojciech Puchar woj...@tensor.gdynia.pl wrote: there will no no next language. there is no need to have C follower. C is perfect Which C are you referring to here? The original KR, ANSI, or some other variant? ANSI C is different enough from KR C -- in strength of typing if nothing else -- that some would say ANSI C _is_ the next language following KR C. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
per...@pluto.rain.com wrote: Wojciech Puchar woj...@tensor.gdynia.pl wrote: there will no no next language. there is no need to have C follower. C is perfect Which C are you referring to here? The original KR, ANSI, or some other variant? ANSI C is different enough from KR C -- in strength of typing if nothing else -- that some would say ANSI C _is_ the next language following KR C. Chat about flavours of C, better on chat@ not questi...@. ( The daemons noise was enough old FAQ ) http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/freebsd-questions/x92.html Before submitting a question You can (and should) do some things yourself before asking a question on one of the mailing lists: http://www.freebsd.org/search/search.html#mailinglists Chat: Random topics (sometimes) related to FreeBSD. Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail plain text; Not HTML, quoted-printable base 64 spam formats. Avoid top posting, it cripples itemised cumulative responses. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Someone (at Bell Labs?) produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? there will no no next language. there is no need to have C follower. C is perfect ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On 11/14/10 20:44, Gary Kline wrote: TWo questions: didn't IBM create CPL? And doesn't BCPL Stand for British Computer Programming Language? (I did have both editions of the C book by Brian and DEnnis; then loaned the 2nd edition and never got ti back.) I think Dennis gives credit to BCPL Somewhere. Pretty sure those guys are all retired to somewhere *warm and sunny* by now! According to Wikipedia: The Combined Programming Language (CPL) was a computer programming language developed jointly between the Mathematical Laboratory at the University of Cambridge and the University of London Computer Unit during the 1960s hence CPL gained the nickname Cambridge Plus London Martin Richards, who invented/first implemented BCPL is technically retired but still active here in Cambridge (the UK one): http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mr10/index.html [Note the address of Cambridge Computer Lab :-)] -- Although the wombat is real and the dragon is not, few know what a wombat looks like, but everyone knows what a dragon looks like. -- Avram Davidson, _Adventures in Unhistory_ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
In freebsd-questions Digest, Vol 337, Issue 1, Message: 19
On Sun, 14 Nov 2010 17:29:10 -0700 Chad Perrin wrote:
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:39:32PM -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
About 2000, 2001 was when I shucked my muuz game/mind-machine
effort. It was over 10K line of C-ish code that I rehacked into
C++. Figured since C++ was _the_ new language that it was a
good move. Then I realized how you could spend a lifetime
learning C++ I backed off and kept it simple.
Deftly avoiding the whirlpool. Delphi was the similar suck from Pascal.
Hardly new. It hasn't been the Next Big Thing since the '80s. Java was
the Next Big Thing in the '90s. We don't exactly have a new Next Big
Thing for the '00s, from what I can see -- and maybe that's a good thing.
Agile development is the Next Big Thing for development methodologies,
but that's a somewhat separate issue.
Whatever that means, I'll take your word for it :)
Yeah, it's on amazon.com, but my bible {seriously!} is good
enough. Dog-earned and coffee-stained; but it's the same as the
2nd Ed. The 2nd is ANSI-ified, IIRC.
That's correct -- 2nd Ed is the ANSI C version of basically the same
text.
Hey, didn't know I had a rare '78 first ed; ANSI not even in the index.
I confess to buying it secondhand in '94 from a likely sorry bloke, and
wonder if anyone's published a diff (ono) to the 2nd ed?
But my most dog-eared, tabbed and note-stuffed reference is Kernighan
Plauger's Software Tools in Pascal ('81) - lovely if only for quality of
the writing and typesetting. Appropriate thread for a little heresy? :)
cheers, Ian
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History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
Chad Perrin per...@apotheon.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 13, 2010 at 02:32:04PM -0600, Robert Bonomi wrote: should the one-leter name for 'c++' be 'd' or 'p'? (nobody could decide/agree, which *IS* why it is 'c++' to this day) ... D is already another programming language ... It wasn't back then :) I don't know what this P has to do with it. You have revealed yourself as a newbie :) In the beginning there was CPL, the Combined Programming Language. It was large enough to be infeasible to implement using then-current technologies, so the Bootstrap Combined Programming Language (BCPL) was invented, with the intent that the first CPL compiler would be written in BCPL. CPL never amounted to much -- I don't know whether it was ever implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Someone (at Bell Labs?) produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
CPL never amounted to much -- I don't know whether it was ever implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Someone (at Bell Labs?) produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? Wow!!! I had forgotten... I have done some projects using BCPL... in a mainframe (S370) running MVS in the 70's... it was lightning fast. we had made a kind of TSO (time sharing option) that runs on top of VTAM, to bring online compile and run cobol programs to the desktop... while a batch work responds in 3 hours, a TSO (written in bcpl) responds in seconds... Thanks for remember the good old days ... it is still active!!! = http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mr10/BCPL.html Sergio ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
From owner-freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org Sun Nov 14 03:09:59 2010 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2010 01:00:35 -0800 From: per...@pluto.rain.com To: per...@apotheon.com Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?) Chad Perrin per...@apotheon.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 13, 2010 at 02:32:04PM -0600, Robert Bonomi wrote: should the one-leter name for 'c++' be 'd' or 'p'? (nobody could decide/agree, which *IS* why it is 'c++' to this day) ... D is already another programming language ... It wasn't back then :) I don't know what this P has to do with it. You have revealed yourself as a newbie :) In the beginning there was CPL, the Combined Programming Language. It was large enough to be infeasible to implement using then-current technologies, so the Bootstrap Combined Programming Language (BCPL) was invented, with the intent that the first CPL compiler would be written in BCPL. CPL never amounted to much -- I don't know whether it was ever implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Trivia: BCPL was the _first_ programming language to use 'curly braces' to group statements. It also used '//' to indroduce a 'single-line comment'. Someone (at Bell Labs?) Ken Thompson, 1969 produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Mostly one. Dennis Ritchie, circa 1972. Brian Kernighan contributed, and Ken stuck his oar in occasionally. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 01:00:35AM -0800, per...@pluto.rain.com wrote: Chad Perrin per...@apotheon.com wrote: ... D is already another programming language ... It wasn't back then :) It is now, though, so it's a little late. So sorry. I don't know what this P has to do with it. You have revealed yourself as a newbie :) No -- I've revealed myself as someone who doesn't care nearly as much about C++ as about C. In the beginning there was CPL, the Combined Programming Language. It was large enough to be infeasible to implement using then-current technologies, so the Bootstrap Combined Programming Language (BCPL) was invented, with the intent that the first CPL compiler would be written in BCPL. CPL never amounted to much -- I don't know whether it was ever implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Someone (at Bell Labs?) produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? . . . and there was a flamewar over it, blah blah blah, and finally it was C++. Okay. Good historical reference. Thanks. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgp5bl4l2AkvF.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 01:00:35AM -0800, per...@pluto.rain.com wrote: Chad Perrin per...@apotheon.com wrote: On Sat, Nov 13, 2010 at 02:32:04PM -0600, Robert Bonomi wrote: should the one-leter name for 'c++' be 'd' or 'p'? (nobody could decide/agree, which *IS* why it is 'c++' to this day) ... D is already another programming language ... It wasn't back then :) I don't know what this P has to do with it. You have revealed yourself as a newbie :) In the beginning there was CPL, the Combined Programming Language. It was large enough to be infeasible to implement using then-current technologies, so the Bootstrap Combined Programming Language (BCPL) was invented, with the intent that the first CPL compiler would be written in BCPL. CPL never amounted to much -- I don't know whether it was ever implemented at all -- but BCPL developed a following. Someone (at Bell Labs?) produced a derivative called B, from which a few researchers at Murray Hill derived C. Thus the question: should the next language in the series be named D (next alphabetically) or P (next letter of BCPL)? I'd vote for E since that might have more positive connotations that D. :-) Skip F altogether. Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. TWo questions: didn't IBM create CPL? And doesn't BCPL Stand for British Computer Programming Language? (I did have both editions of the C book by Brian and DEnnis; then loaned the 2nd edition and never got ti back.) I think Dennis gives credit to BCPL Somewhere. Pretty sure those guys are all retired to somewhere *warm and sunny* by now! gary ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org -- Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix http://journey.thought.org For non-text MUA's http://theopenpress.com/index.php?a=printcode=00id=88532 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 12:44:50PM -0800, Gary Kline wrote: I'd vote for E since that might have more positive connotations that D. :-) Skip F altogether. That might be a good point. Google has taught me that single-letter names for programming languages (or anything else, apparently) are not so good for the Internet age, however. Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. Perhaps ironically, some called C++ C With Classes early on, as I recall. Meanwhile, Objective-C ended up being what C++ initially claimed it would be (a strict superset of C that provided facilities for OOP), while C++ failed to live up to its own promises while expanding into all kinds of things that were not actually desired in those early days (like a politician once elected to office). This is, of course, largely the perspective of an outsider, so take it for what it's worth. TWo questions: didn't IBM create CPL? And doesn't BCPL Stand for British Computer Programming Language? (I did have both editions of the C book by Brian and DEnnis; then loaned the 2nd edition and never got ti back.) I think Dennis gives credit to BCPL Somewhere. Pretty sure those guys are all retired to somewhere *warm and sunny* by now! The second edition is still in stores all over the place. It's the first edition that would be difficult to find these days, I think. My father tells me he has a copy, though I've never seen it; I only have the second edition. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgpBjOf4A6ihn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
Quoth Gary Kline on Sunday, 14 November 2010: Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. The inventor of C++ is Bjarne Stroustrop. I had the chance opportunity to sit down at a table with him and have a conversation prior to an SD West conference several years ago. He's a nice guy, with a great sense of humor -- but even he admits C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do it blows your whole leg off. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bjarne_Stroustrup -- Sterling (Chip) Camden| sterl...@camdensoftware.com | 2048D/3A978E4F http://camdensoftware.com | http://chipstips.com| http://chipsquips.com pgpmezCqzSzcR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:41:41PM -0700, Chad Perrin wrote:
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 12:44:50PM -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
I'd vote for E since that might have more positive
connotations that D. :-) Skip F altogether.
That might be a good point.
Google has taught me that single-letter names for programming languages
(or anything else, apparently) are not so good for the Internet age,
however.
I won't argue the point! but how about IEEE? I subscribed
to that for years and some people noted that spoken as a word,
Ieee was like the primal scream! Hm maybe the EEE
language?!
Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray
(in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis
what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the
thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my
opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's
about it.
Perhaps ironically, some called C++ C With Classes early on, as I
recall. Meanwhile, Objective-C ended up being what C++ initially claimed
it would be (a strict superset of C that provided facilities for OOP),
while C++ failed to live up to its own promises while expanding into all
kinds of things that were not actually desired in those early days (like
a politician once elected to office). This is, of course, largely the
perspective of an outsider, so take it for what it's worth.
About 2000, 2001 was when I shucked my muuz game/mind-machine
effort. It was over 10K line of C-ish code that I rehacked into
C++. Figured since C++ was _the_ new language that it was a
good move. Then I realized how you could spend a lifetime
learning C++ I backed off and kept it simple.
TWo questions: didn't IBM create CPL? And doesn't BCPL
Stand for British Computer Programming Language? (I did have
both editions of the C book by Brian and DEnnis; then loaned the
2nd edition and never got ti back.) I think Dennis gives credit
to BCPL Somewhere. Pretty sure those guys are all retired to
somewhere *warm and sunny* by now!
The second edition is still in stores all over the place. It's the first
edition that would be difficult to find these days, I think. My father
tells me he has a copy, though I've never seen it; I only have the second
edition.
Yeah, it's on amazon.com, but my bible {seriously!} is good
enough. Dog-earned and coffee-stained; but it's the same as the
2nd Ed. The 2nd is ANSI-ified, IIRC.
gary
--
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
--
Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix
http://journey.thought.org
For non-text MUA's
http://theopenpress.com/index.php?a=printcode=00id=88532
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Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:02:49PM -0800, Chip Camden wrote: Quoth Gary Kline on Sunday, 14 November 2010: Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. The inventor of C++ is Bjarne Stroustrop. I had the chance opportunity to sit down at a table with him and have a conversation prior to an SD West conference several years ago. He's a nice guy, with a great sense of humor -- but even he admits C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do it blows your whole leg off. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bjarne_Stroustrup There's always the theory that Bjarne Stroustrup actually meant C++ as a joke: http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/c++/I_did_it_for_you_all It's generally regarded as a hoax, and there is an actually published interview that corresponds with this time period in IEEE's Computer Magazine that reads quite differently from this. Still . . . if this is real, it would certainly explain a lot. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgp1ZRsKuA2As.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:02:49PM -0800, Chip Camden wrote: Quoth Gary Kline on Sunday, 14 November 2010: Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. The inventor of C++ is Bjarne Stroustrop. I had the chance opportunity to sit down at a table with him and have a conversation prior to an SD West conference several years ago. He's a nice guy, with a great sense of humor -- but even he admits C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do it blows your whole leg off. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bjarne_Stroustrup I'm sure I had my share of disasters with C++ hacking test code , but OMG, the head banging was nothing compared to heavy C coding in the early days. The number of segv's brings back evil memories:-) That, and having to take a notebook and draw out where you were [or _thought_ you were] pointing to. --Things they can't teach very well in the classroom-- that sort of stuff. Great quote! -- Sterling (Chip) Camden| sterl...@camdensoftware.com | 2048D/3A978E4F http://camdensoftware.com | http://chipstips.com| http://chipsquips.com -- Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix http://journey.thought.org For non-text MUA's http://theopenpress.com/index.php?a=printcode=00id=88532 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 03:37:15PM -0700, Chad Perrin wrote: On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:02:49PM -0800, Chip Camden wrote: Quoth Gary Kline on Sunday, 14 November 2010: Just about the whole Murray Hill gang stopped by Cray (in Chippewa Falls), late 80's, and I remember asking Dennis what the deal was with C++; I remember him dodging the thing. Whoever-invented-C++ did a convoluted job, i s my opinion. It might be nice to add classes to C, but that's about it. The inventor of C++ is Bjarne Stroustrop. I had the chance opportunity to sit down at a table with him and have a conversation prior to an SD West conference several years ago. He's a nice guy, with a great sense of humor -- but even he admits C makes it easy to shoot yourself in the foot; C++ makes it harder, but when you do it blows your whole leg off. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bjarne_Stroustrup There's always the theory that Bjarne Stroustrup actually meant C++ as a joke: http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/c++/I_did_it_for_you_all It's generally regarded as a hoax, and there is an actually published interview that corresponds with this time period in IEEE's Computer Magazine that reads quite differently from this. Still . . . if this is real, it would certainly explain a lot. Hmmm. I'll ck out the quote when I'm using evo. I honestly doesn't see C++ as any joke--or attempt to be. What I can't grok is the supposed re-useability. Was/Isn't a big part of C++ supposed to be that you could easily reuse part of proven, flawless code? I probably never got that far into learning the language. I have and still do edit, cut/paste, hammer and saw away at my C examples to get at functions that are reusable. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] -- Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix http://journey.thought.org For non-text MUA's http://theopenpress.com/index.php?a=printcode=00id=88532 ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:39:32PM -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
About 2000, 2001 was when I shucked my muuz game/mind-machine
effort. It was over 10K line of C-ish code that I rehacked into
C++. Figured since C++ was _the_ new language that it was a
good move. Then I realized how you could spend a lifetime
learning C++ I backed off and kept it simple.
Hardly new. It hasn't been the Next Big Thing since the '80s. Java was
the Next Big Thing in the '90s. We don't exactly have a new Next Big
Thing for the '00s, from what I can see -- and maybe that's a good thing.
Agile development is the Next Big Thing for development methodologies,
but that's a somewhat separate issue.
Yeah, it's on amazon.com, but my bible {seriously!} is good
enough. Dog-earned and coffee-stained; but it's the same as the
2nd Ed. The 2nd is ANSI-ified, IIRC.
That's correct -- 2nd Ed is the ANSI C version of basically the same
text.
--
Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ]
pgpr3nBarPs1j.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun 14 Nov 2010 at 16:29:10 PST Chad Perrin wrote: On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 02:39:32PM -0800, Gary Kline wrote: About 2000, 2001 was when I shucked my muuz game/mind-machine effort. It was over 10K line of C-ish code that I rehacked into C++. Figured since C++ was _the_ new language that it was a good move. Then I realized how you could spend a lifetime learning C++ I backed off and kept it simple. Hardly new. It hasn't been the Next Big Thing since the '80s. Java was the Next Big Thing in the '90s. We don't exactly have a new Next Big Thing for the '00s, from what I can see -- and maybe that's a good I'd say the Next Big Thing in the '00s was Python ... or was it XML? BTW, it's now the '10s. ;-) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: History of C (Re: Why do you use a devil as a mascot?)
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 09:54:42PM -0800, Charlie Kester wrote: I'd say the Next Big Thing in the '00s was Python ... or was it XML? Python hasn't been dominant enough. *Maybe* XML -- but that might be a bit of a stretch. It might be a couple years before we can identify it. Hm. Maybe JavaScript . . . ? You know, that AJAXy thing. BTW, it's now the '10s. ;-) Yeah, but there obviously hasn't been a Next Big Thing programming language for the '10s yet. Give it time. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgp7rDO0QKypC.pgp Description: PGP signature
No History after shutdown -h on FBSD 8 or 9
Aloha, Is there a reason the history no longer stays in memory on FreeBSD 8 9? Reko Turja sent me a work around for a reboot: shutdown -r +1 logout or shutdown -h +1 logout Both of the above work to save the history in a tcsh shell. We used to be able to use: shutdown -h now Is this not going to be possible from FreeBSD 8 onward? Thanks... ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + + http://aloha50.net - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* - 8.* + email: n...@hdk5.net All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: csh tcsh history missing after reboot FBSD_8
What can I do to get the history to remain in memory across a reboot? Changing the capicity of set history to greater than 100 does not affect it. How about: shutdown -r +1 logout -Reko ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
csh tcsh history missing after reboot FBSD_8
Aloha, Terminal history gone. I cannot get any recent version of FreeBSD 8.* to keep the csh or tcsh history across a reboot in root or usr. It stays after exit and a new login however. This happens on several machines that previously ran FreeBSD 7* with no issues. One runs AMD64 and one i386 versions.I can load Manolis Kiagias Desk top version on them and it works fine as do other 7.* versions. I suspect it has to do with PXE ? or something changed in the later versions of 8 Current BETA 1 and 2 since I have 2 boxes running early versions of 8 CURRENT where everything works fine and the history remains in tact following a reboot. What can I do to get the history to remain in memory across a reboot? Changing the capicity of set history to greater than 100 does not affect it. Thanks ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + + http://aloha50.net - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* - 8.* + email: n...@hdk5.net All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: csh tcsh history missing after reboot FBSD_8
On Wed, 19 Aug 2009, Al Plant wrote: Aloha, Terminal history gone. I cannot get any recent version of FreeBSD 8.* to keep the csh or tcsh history across a reboot in root or usr. It stays after exit and a new login however. Does the history stick around if you do shutdown -r now instead of reboot? -Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota USA ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: csh tcsh history missing after reboot FBSD_8
Warren Block wrote: On Wed, 19 Aug 2009, Al Plant wrote: Aloha, Terminal history gone. I cannot get any recent version of FreeBSD 8.* to keep the csh or tcsh history across a reboot in root or usr. It stays after exit and a new login however. Does the history stick around if you do shutdown -r now instead of reboot? -Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota USA Aloha Warren, No. I used shutdown -r now and shutdown -h now and they both blow it away. -- ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + + http://aloha50.net - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* - 8.* + email: n...@hdk5.net All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: csh tcsh history missing after reboot FBSD_8
On Wed, 19 Aug 2009, Al Plant wrote: Warren Block wrote: On Wed, 19 Aug 2009, Al Plant wrote: Terminal history gone. I cannot get any recent version of FreeBSD 8.* to keep the csh or tcsh history across a reboot in root or usr. It stays after exit and a new login however. Does the history stick around if you do shutdown -r now instead of reboot? No. I used shutdown -r now and shutdown -h now and they both blow it away. My thinking was that reboot is more abrupt than shutdown, and killed the shell without giving it a chance to write out the history. But I've never noticed the history in a csh being written out before a reboot of either type. -Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota USA ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: .cshrc History missing
Al Plant wrote: Polytropon wrote: Allthough I'm not familiar with the particular problem you described, I observed that the history sometimes (!) does not survive a reboot. It may have to do with a situation where more than one shell is running. Idea: The last shell closed (even forced) saves its history, so the history of the other shells gets lost. I've set those globally in /etc/csh.cshrc: set history = 100 set savehist = 100 Sometimes, history survives, sometimes it doesn't. Very strange... Aloha Poly, I'm glad to have somebody confirm this. I thought it was funny that this was happening. I have earlier CURRENT 8 running on a couple of machines and they never acted this way. This is root that is doing this on my test box. set history = 100 set savehistory = 100 are in the .cshrc file. I'll look in /etc/csh.cshrc Thanks... Yeah. The history mechanism in tcsh doesn't cope very well with multiple ttys being closed down at once, as you tend to find when logging out of an X session. You get the history from just one of those shells. It's not a complete cure, but telling the shell to merge it's history with what's already there: set history = 500 set savehist = (1000 merge) This helps, but it is not completely reliable when several shells are shutdown in quick succession. Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard Flat 3 PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate Kent, CT11 9PW signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
.cshrc History missing
Aloha, I have been trying the new FreeBSD 8 Current, Head and Beta* on an AMD64 box with 2 CPU's. The OS loads and everything works under all versions including i386, but the key stroke history on csh does not survive over a reboot or shutdown. I have never seen this happen before and I have been using FreeBSD for a very long time.. since FreeBSD 2.* . Anyone have any ideas what I should check for either with hardware or in .cshrc or elsewhere? Thanks... ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + + http://aloha50.net - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* - 8.* + email: n...@hdk5.net All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: .cshrc History missing
Allthough I'm not familiar with the particular problem you described, I observed that the history sometimes (!) does not survive a reboot. It may have to do with a situation where more than one shell is running. Idea: The last shell closed (even forced) saves its history, so the history of the other shells gets lost. I've set those globally in /etc/csh.cshrc: set history = 100 set savehist = 100 Sometimes, history survives, sometimes it doesn't. Very strange... -- Polytropon From Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: .cshrc History missing
Polytropon wrote: Allthough I'm not familiar with the particular problem you described, I observed that the history sometimes (!) does not survive a reboot. It may have to do with a situation where more than one shell is running. Idea: The last shell closed (even forced) saves its history, so the history of the other shells gets lost. I've set those globally in /etc/csh.cshrc: set history = 100 set savehist = 100 Sometimes, history survives, sometimes it doesn't. Very strange... Aloha Poly, I'm glad to have somebody confirm this. I thought it was funny that this was happening. I have earlier CURRENT 8 running on a couple of machines and they never acted this way. This is root that is doing this on my test box. set history = 100 set savehistory = 100 are in the .cshrc file. I'll look in /etc/csh.cshrc Thanks... ~Al Plant - Honolulu, Hawaii - Phone: 808-284-2740 + http://hawaiidakine.com + http://freebsdinfo.org + + http://aloha50.net - Supporting - FreeBSD 6.* - 7.* - 8.* + email: n...@hdk5.net All that's really worth doing is what we do for others.- Lewis Carrol ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
On Saturday 25 April 2009 09:12:50 pm Giorgos Keramidas wrote: On Fri, 24 Apr 2009 05:35:34 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory Do you really want just the `CVSROOT/history' file? We allow mirroring of the entire repository, which you can then use to extract any sort of historical commit data. (Well, _almost_ anything. Some things like repo-copies and renames of raw repository files have been done without any sort of record, so it may be impossible to recover *those* particular bits.) I'm basically looking for a list of all commits over the past N (2) years with committer, timestamp, affected file(s) and/or subsystems and possibly diff size information, etc. I don't know anything about the history file in particular other than that's what cvs complained about when I tried the cvs history commands against anoncvs. It looks like the /pub/FreeBSD/development/FreeBSD-CVS/src ftp path may have what I'm looking for (though it may be scattered through the individual files). I'll probably (try to) set up a local CVS repo and source it from there and see where that gets me. My CVS-fu is weak so I'm still open to pointers. We also have a Subversion repository now, that you can use to grab commit information. It takes slightly more disk space than the CVS repository, but subversion can export XML formatted commit logs, which may be slightly more useful if you plan to automate parts of the parsing and info-gathering. Yes, I'll definitely be automating the parsing, etc. Is it safe to assume that the cvs2svn migration went successfully? XML logs do sound appealing and aggregated (same time, multiple files) commits would be more useful than per-file. Can I just check everything out from svn://svn.freebsd.org/base/? Thanks! JN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 11:23:32 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: On Saturday 25 April 2009 09:12:50 pm Giorgos Keramidas wrote: On Fri, 24 Apr 2009 05:35:34 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory Do you really want just the `CVSROOT/history' file? We allow mirroring of the entire repository, which you can then use to extract any sort of historical commit data. (Well, _almost_ anything. Some things like repo-copies and renames of raw repository files have been done without any sort of record, so it may be impossible to recover *those* particular bits.) I'm basically looking for a list of all commits over the past N (2) years with committer, timestamp, affected file(s) and/or subsystems and possibly diff size information, etc. I don't know anything about the history file in particular other than that's what cvs complained about when I tried the cvs history commands against anoncvs. It looks like the /pub/FreeBSD/development/FreeBSD-CVS/src ftp path may have what I'm looking for (though it may be scattered through the individual files). I'll probably (try to) set up a local CVS repo and source it from there and see where that gets me. My CVS-fu is weak so I'm still open to pointers. There are online instructions for mirroring a full CVS copy, so it should be relatively easy to do that. It mostly boils down to setting up the necessary disk space somewhere locally, installing one of the CVSup ports and configuring a `supfile' like this: *default host=CHANGE_THIS.freebsd.org *default base=/path/to/local/cvs/mirror *default prefix=/path/to/local/cvs/mirror *default release=cvs *default delete use-rel-suffix *default compress cvs-all Yo should change `CHANGE_THIS' with the hostname of a CVSup mirror (a full list can be found in the Handbook), and then point the local CVS mirror directory from `/path/to/local/cvs/mirror' to the place you will keep the mirror. To pull over the CVS mirror files, you can then run: # cvsup -g -L 2 supfile Note that this will take quite some time if you are starting from an empty mirror, and it may be a good idea to rerun cvsup 1-2 times after it's done, to make sure you have the latest changes -- including any changes that were committed between the time you started mirroring and the time the first run was done. FYI, my local copy of the repository uses around 4 GB today, so you should plan to keep the mirror on a disk with at least this amount of space (a few extra GB won't hurt either): # du -sh /home/ncvs 4.0G/home/ncvs # We also have a Subversion repository now, that you can use to grab commit information. It takes slightly more disk space than the CVS repository, but subversion can export XML formatted commit logs, which may be slightly more useful if you plan to automate parts of the parsing and info-gathering. Yes, I'll definitely be automating the parsing, etc. Is it safe to assume that the cvs2svn migration went successfully? XML logs do sound appealing and aggregated (same time, multiple files) commits would be more useful than per-file. Can I just check everything out from svn://svn.freebsd.org/base/? The conversion from CVS to Subversion was ``good enough'' from what I see in the svn commit logs. So it may be a good idea to use `svnsync' to mirror the /base/ repository locally and take it from there. The instructions for mirroring the Subversion repository are a bit more involved, but if you decide to go that way, let me know and I will write a short description of how to do it. pgpray5r6lHUa.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: CVS history access?
On Monday 27 April 2009 12:39:53 pm Giorgos Keramidas wrote: On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 11:23:32 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I'm basically looking for a list of all commits over the past N (2) years with committer, timestamp, affected file(s) and/or subsystems and possibly diff size information, etc. I don't know anything about the history file in particular other than that's what cvs complained about when I tried the cvs history commands against anoncvs. It looks like the /pub/FreeBSD/development/FreeBSD-CVS/src ftp path may have what I'm looking for (though it may be scattered through the individual files). I'll probably (try to) set up a local CVS repo and source it from there and see where that gets me. My CVS-fu is weak so I'm still open to pointers. There are online instructions for mirroring a full CVS copy, so it should be relatively easy to do that. It mostly boils down to setting up the necessary disk space somewhere locally, installing one of the CVSup ports and configuring a `supfile' like this: *default host=CHANGE_THIS.freebsd.org *default base=/path/to/local/cvs/mirror *default prefix=/path/to/local/cvs/mirror *default release=cvs *default delete use-rel-suffix *default compress cvs-all Thanks! I had forgotten about the cvs-all target. [additional helpful info snipped] We also have a Subversion repository now, that you can use to grab commit information. It takes slightly more disk space than the CVS repository, but subversion can export XML formatted commit logs, which may be slightly more useful if you plan to automate parts of the parsing and info-gathering. Yes, I'll definitely be automating the parsing, etc. Is it safe to assume that the cvs2svn migration went successfully? XML logs do sound appealing and aggregated (same time, multiple files) commits would be more useful than per-file. Can I just check everything out from svn://svn.freebsd.org/base/? The conversion from CVS to Subversion was ``good enough'' from what I see in the svn commit logs. So it may be a good idea to use `svnsync' to mirror the /base/ repository locally and take it from there. I installed the subversion-freebsd port and pulled in src from head. This lets me do e.g. svn log -g --xml locally and get an XML list of commits along the main (head/current) development line going back to 1993. For files changed with each revision I can do svn diff -c NUM --summarize. Is there a way to get this information integrated with the svn log output short of running the command for each revision in the log output? The instructions for mirroring the Subversion repository are a bit more involved, but if you decide to go that way, let me know and I will write a short description of how to do it. I checked out base/head and am in the process of checking out base/stable so I can get commit data from -STABLE branches as well. (I'll probably figure out when each branch (in CVS terms) was created and then use svn log to just get commits after that date for each branch). I don't know that I need to mirror the whole SVN repository but at this point I am planning on going the SVN route so if you have additional tips they would be appreciated. Thanks! JN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 15:03:30 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I installed the subversion-freebsd port and pulled in src from head. This lets me do e.g. svn log -g --xml locally and get an XML list of commits along the main (head/current) development line going back to 1993. For files changed with each revision I can do svn diff -c NUM --summarize. Is there a way to get this information integrated with the svn log output short of running the command for each revision in the log output? It's already part of 'svn log --xml' output if you use the -v option. When you use -v *and* --xml at the same time, an additional element is inserted to each changeset listing all the path changes: $ svn log -v --xml -c 191585 file:///home/svn/base ?xml version=1.0? log logentry revision=191585 authorrpaulo/author date2009-04-27T18:59:40.453027Z/date % paths % path %kind= %action=M/projects/mesh11s/sys/net80211/ieee80211_output.c/path % /paths msgAppend Mesh Configuration IE on probe responses and beacons. Sponsored by: The FreeBSD Foundation /msg /logentry /log I think the paths list of path changes is what you are after :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
On Monday 27 April 2009 03:29:03 pm Giorgos Keramidas wrote: On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 15:03:30 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I installed the subversion-freebsd port and pulled in src from head. This lets me do e.g. svn log -g --xml locally and get an XML list of commits along the main (head/current) development line going back to 1993. For files changed with each revision I can do svn diff -c NUM --summarize. Is there a way to get this information integrated with the svn log output short of running the command for each revision in the log output? It's already part of 'svn log --xml' output if you use the -v option. When you use -v *and* --xml at the same time, an additional element is inserted to each changeset listing all the path changes: $ svn log -v --xml -c 191585 file:///home/svn/base ?xml version=1.0? log logentry revision=191585 authorrpaulo/author date2009-04-27T18:59:40.453027Z/date % paths % path %kind= % action=M/projects/mesh11s/sys/net80211/ieee80211_output.c/path % /paths msgAppend Mesh Configuration IE on probe responses and beacons. Sponsored by: The FreeBSD Foundation /msg /logentry /log I think the paths list of path changes is what you are after :) Exactly right. Thanks much! JN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
On Fri, 24 Apr 2009 05:35:34 -0400, John Nielsen li...@jnielsen.net wrote: I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory Do you really want just the `CVSROOT/history' file? We allow mirroring of the entire repository, which you can then use to extract any sort of historical commit data. (Well, _almost_ anything. Some things like repo-copies and renames of raw repository files have been done without any sort of record, so it may be impossible to recover *those* particular bits.) We also have a Subversion repository now, that you can use to grab commit information. It takes slightly more disk space than the CVS repository, but subversion can export XML formatted commit logs, which may be slightly more useful if you plan to automate parts of the parsing and info-gathering. pgpYDpC9NfRqa.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Format of history output Sometimes is very Different.
Matthew Seaman writes: tcsh(1) includes timestamps in it's .history. bash(1) doesn't. Not sure about other shells, but the historical (ahem!) behaviour of csh(1) was not to use timestamps, and I think most shells subsequently developed have carried on the same history format, with tcsh(1) being the exception. Thanks to you and N. Raghavendra ra...@mri.ernet.in for your help. That has got to be what I did. On the times I have seen this, I was in a hurry and may have somehow invoked tcsh as I never use it normally. The prompt defaults to a symbol. If one runs the command tcsh history, tcsh gives an error as there is no such file called history but if you launch tcsh at the command prompt and then execute history, that is the very output I was talking about. I am still not sure how I didn't notice the different prompt and the fact that I was in some other kind of shell, but I guess some of us are crazier than we like to admit. At least I now know what generates that output and why I couldn't find anything in the bash documentation. The closest I get to tcsh is csh in root. Again, many thanks. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK Systems Engineer OSU Information Technology Department Telecommunications Services Group ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Format of history output Sometimes is very Different.
At 2009-04-24T08:35:22-05:00, Martin McCormick wrote: Thanks to you and N. Raghavendra ra...@mri.ernet.in for your help. That has got to be what I did. You are welcome :-) Raghavendra. -- N. Raghavendra ra...@mri.ernet.in | http://www.retrotexts.net/ Harish-Chandra Research Institute | http://www.mri.ernet.in/ See message headers for contact and OpenPGP information. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
CVS history access?
I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory I'm not too experienced with cvs so if I'm missing something let me know. The Mailman archives for freebsd-cvs are one option, but I was hoping for more of a direct approach if possible. Thanks, JN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 John Nielsen wrote: I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory I'm not too experienced with cvs so if I'm missing something let me know. The Mailman archives for freebsd-cvs are one option, but I was hoping for more of a direct approach if possible. cvs log filename works, but I don't think that history has even been available on any system I've ever had access to. There's pretty good info available from the cvs log command ... here's a few lines from cvs log Makefile from usr/src/Makefile: - revision 1.114 date: 2005/12/02 01:17:20; author: deraadt; state: Exp; lines: +2 -2 do not enter lkm - revision 1.113 date: 2005/09/16 12:28:34; author: jmc; state: Exp; lines: +3 -2 use shell-neutral language (in a comment); from ray lai; ok krw@ - revision 1.112 date: 2005/01/09 20:36:20; author: espie; state: Exp; lines: +12 -282 move cross-stuff into its own file. okay mickey@, niklas@ Thanks, JN ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (FreeBSD) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAknyMz0ACgkQz62J6PPcoOlbBACeLN3fD31obO7yEVTDnql8qQ+v VnAAnAjt2yRDr1y+LHfErKgdUX/UcwtW =Nzdn -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: CVS history access?
John Nielsen wrote: I'm working on a machine learning project and I'd like to use the FreeBSD src CVS commit history as a datasource. Is there a resource-friendly way for me to download some or all of it? Format isn't too big an issue. I tried a few cvs history commands against the anoncvs servers but get this: cvs [history aborted]: cannot open history file: /home/ncvs/CVSROOT/history: No such file or directory I'm not too experienced with cvs so if I'm missing something let me know. The Mailman archives for freebsd-cvs are one option, but I was hoping for more of a direct approach if possible. Thanks, JN It seems history is optional in CVS, and it does not exist (at least anymore) in the FreeBSD CVS. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Format of history output Sometimes is very Different.
the normal output of the history command resembles: 1 env 2 ssh system1.somedomain.com 3 scan cur etc. On occasion, I have seen a history output that shows the list of commands plus the time they were executed. I am not sure exactly how I got that output as I couldn't duplicate it on demand. Any ideas on what I did to get that alternative output? Thank you. Martin McCormick ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Format of history output Sometimes is very Different.
Martin McCormick wrote: the normal output of the history command resembles: 1 env 2 ssh system1.somedomain.com 3 scan cur etc. On occasion, I have seen a history output that shows the list of commands plus the time they were executed. I am not sure exactly how I got that output as I couldn't duplicate it on demand. Any ideas on what I did to get that alternative output? tcsh(1) includes timestamps in it's .history. bash(1) doesn't. Not sure about other shells, but the historical (ahem!) behaviour of csh(1) was not to use timestamps, and I think most shells subsequently developed have carried on the same history format, with tcsh(1) being the exception. Cheers, Matthew -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard Flat 3 PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate Kent, CT11 9PW signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Format of history output Sometimes is very Different.
At 2009-04-23T15:31:51-05:00, Martin McCormick wrote: On occasion, I have seen a history output that shows the list of commands plus the time they were executed. I am not sure exactly how I got that output as I couldn't duplicate it on demand. Any ideas on what I did to get that alternative output? In tcsh, one way to do that is `history -T'. Raghavendra. -- N. Raghavendra ra...@mri.ernet.in | http://www.retrotexts.net/ Harish-Chandra Research Institute | http://www.mri.ernet.in/ See message headers for contact and OpenPGP information. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Way to prune/limit the ZFS zpool history?
Hello. I've been experimenting with a series scripts that takes ZFS snapshots every minute, eventually destroying the oldest so that only so many remain available for a given window of time. This may seem a trivial concern with hard drive sizes being what they are these days, but after running a zpool history I started thinking that a ZFS create and destroy being performed every minute would add up to a lot over the course of a few years (current estimate is 62MB/year for the naming scheme of my snapshots). From what I understand, ZFS compresses metadata by default, so this history probbaly won't take up much space in the grand scheme of things. However, I was curious just the same about wether or not there was a way to prune down, or limit the size of, the zpool history. Also, is there any substantial performance penalty to having a huge history? Thanks for any pointers. -- Geoff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Way to prune/limit the ZFS zpool history?
In the last episode (Jan 20), Geoff Fritz said: I've been experimenting with a series scripts that takes ZFS snapshots every minute, eventually destroying the oldest so that only so many remain available for a given window of time. This may seem a trivial concern with hard drive sizes being what they are these days, but after running a zpool history I started thinking that a ZFS create and destroy being performed every minute would add up to a lot over the course of a few years (current estimate is 62MB/year for the naming scheme of my snapshots). According to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gdswe?l=ena=view , the zpool history file is between 128K and 32MB, depending on the size of the pool. The FreeBSD import at /sys/cddl/contrib/opensolaris/uts/common/fs/zfs/spa_history.c agrees with the docs :) -- Dan Nelson dnel...@allantgroup.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: Way to prune/limit the ZFS zpool history?
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 10:17:47PM -0600, Dan Nelson wrote: In the last episode (Jan 20), Geoff Fritz said: I've been experimenting with a series scripts that takes ZFS snapshots every minute, eventually destroying the oldest so that only so many remain available for a given window of time. This may seem a trivial concern with hard drive sizes being what they are these days, but after running a zpool history I started thinking that a ZFS create and destroy being performed every minute would add up to a lot over the course of a few years (current estimate is 62MB/year for the naming scheme of my snapshots). According to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gdswe?l=ena=view , the zpool history file is between 128K and 32MB, depending on the size of the pool. The FreeBSD import at /sys/cddl/contrib/opensolaris/uts/common/fs/zfs/spa_history.c agrees with the docs :) I always forget that ZFS is documented on Sun's site as well as the man pages. Hopefully some day the FreeBSD docs will catch up w/ Sun's. Thanks a bunch for the pointer. Very informative. -- Geoff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Incorrect commandline history with bash
Hi, I just migrated from Linux and I am now using FreeBSD 6.3. My keyboard layout is US-ISO and my TERM is con25. I am using bash#3 as my login shell. (I installed the bash package from the distribution media, not from /usr/ports). The problem is that bash does not remember my commands correctly. Almost all commands I enter in a login session are forgotten in the next session. Using the Up and Down arrow keys navigates a mangled and incomlete command history. Even using Ctrl-r for a reverse find almost never fetches a command I had actually typed in previously. The following are the contents of my .bash_profile and .bashrc: #.bash_profile : [ -f ~/.bashrc ] source ~/.bashrc #end-of-file #.bashrc : export HISTFILESIZE=200 shopt -s cmdhist shopt -s histappend #end-of-file If anyone can help me to get bash remembering my command history correctly, I will be grateful. Thanks [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
How to delete One line on tcsh history....??
Hi guys, I've been trying to delete one line from my user tcsh history cause i made a su and it seems didnt hit enter very well so i typed the password on the console...Now anyone that can look my history will see my pass... I tried to edit and delete a few lines but it all comes againtried history clear but when i login again it apperas all again..hehe... Its so secure and cool tcsh taht i have no idea how to do it...been a bash user... Cheers and thanks, Agustin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to delete One line on tcsh history....??
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Agus wrote: | Hi guys, | | I've been trying to delete one line from my user tcsh history cause i made a | su and it seems didnt hit enter very well so i typed the password on the | console...Now anyone that can look my history will see my pass... | | I tried to edit and delete a few lines but it all comes againtried | history clear but when i login again it apperas all again..hehe... | Its so secure and cool tcsh taht i have no idea how to do it...been a bash | user... You can clear your history (the whole history will be lost!!) by | history -c No clue whether you can remove a single line.. | Cheers and thanks, | Agustin - -- Pietro Cerutti [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Public Key: http://gahr.ch/pgp -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEAREKAAYFAkgssGYACgkQwMJqmJVx944nJwCeNA0pEAxNW2MAa+p09T61ZIuy LnEAoJSvP23/4hTq3iDW0xf/tGmfNfTS =xmcm -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to delete One line on tcsh history....??
Agus wrote: I've been trying to delete one line from my user tcsh history cause i made a su and it seems didnt hit enter very well so i typed the password on the console...Now anyone that can look my history will see my pass... I tried to edit and delete a few lines but it all comes againtried history clear but when i login again it apperas all again..hehe... Its so secure and cool tcsh taht i have no idea how to do it...been a bash user... I use this strategy with bash, so YMMV: $ vim .bash_history (kill line) $ kill -9 $$ $$ should expand to the pid of the running shell; if it doesn't in tcsh, sub it out yourself. The kill -9 prevents the shell from doing it's normal exit stuff (like writing out the history) and just kills the process. You'll need to kill -9 any shell that you launched while the bad line was in the history file. -- Chris Cowart Network Technical Lead Network Infrastructure Services, RSSP-IT UC Berkeley pgp9sn6dYe85v.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: How to delete One line on tcsh history....??
2008/5/15 Pietro Cerutti [EMAIL PROTECTED]: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Agus wrote: | Hi guys, | | I've been trying to delete one line from my user tcsh history cause i made a | su and it seems didnt hit enter very well so i typed the password on the | console...Now anyone that can look my history will see my pass... | | I tried to edit and delete a few lines but it all comes againtried | history clear but when i login again it apperas all again..hehe... | Its so secure and cool tcsh taht i have no idea how to do it...been a bash | user... You can clear your history (the whole history will be lost!!) by | history -c No clue whether you can remove a single line.. | Cheers and thanks, | Agustin - -- Pietro Cerutti [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Public Key: http://gahr.ch/pgp -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEAREKAAYFAkgssGYACgkQwMJqmJVx944nJwCeNA0pEAxNW2MAa+p09T61ZIuy LnEAoJSvP23/4hTq3iDW0xf/tGmfNfTS =xmcm -END PGP SIGNATURE- Cool, thanks guys.I used the history command and worked; weird, i had tried that...maybe i used it in another place... Thanks guys. Cheers, Agustin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. jerry Seem to recall it occurring when I deleted the directory I was 'in'. I may have imagined it though! -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Jerry McAllister wrote: On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. It's a fortune. Whether it has also ever been an error message I cannot say, but not in 5.4 unless it's well hidden. Gee, Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore. find /usr/src -type f -print0 | xargs -0 egrep -l Kansas --Alex ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Alex Zbyslaw wrote: Jerry McAllister wrote: On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. It's a fortune. Whether it has also ever been an error message I cannot say, but not in 5.4 unless it's well hidden. Gee, Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore. find /usr/src -type f -print0 | xargs -0 egrep -l Kansas Seems it was replaced in 2000 with unable to return to working directory. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/usr.sbin/pkg_install/delete/perform.c.diff?r1=1.20;r2=1.21 -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Favourite worst written error message in history: Keyboard not found. Press F1 to continue. I have always loved this one!! Who made that up!? Someone at IBM. That's what the original IBM PC, PC-AT, and (presumably) PC-XT displayed if the keyboard was dead or not plugged in. It was probably a case of modular code: any problem in POST would display a message and return a fail status, and the generic code would append Press F1 to continue. and wait. Not a bad idea at all -- certainly better than blindly trying to boot the machine without giving the operator a chance to decide what to do about the problem -- but this particular combination does have a chicken- egg aspect :( ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] This still happened on my fairly recent ASUS p4s8x Pentium 4 motherboard. I think you could make almost any motherboard yield that error, even these days. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 08:14:44PM -0700, Garrett Cooper wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. As such, I tend to think of my Perl installs as being Artistic License, not GPL. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] MacUser, Nov. 1990: There comes a time in the history of any project when it becomes necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Re[2]: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Gerard Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 9:30 AM To: User Questions Subject: Re[2]: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! On July 04, 2007 at 09:53AM Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: [snip] Actually perl has a lot of problems too. One of the biggest is that perl script writers always seem to think like you, in that perl is consistent across all platforms. The biggest problems I've seen with perl scripts are when people use perl extensions that are not on the system. You then have to go find the extension they use and very few of the perl script writers seem to be smart enough to put a section at the beginning of their scripts that define the CPAN location of the particular extensions they are using. The second biggest problem is perl script writers using constructs that are valid in Perl 5.6 and later but not valid in Perl 5.0 I don't know how many times I've wanted to strangle someone when trying to run a perl script under Perl 5.0 that had ONE single friggin statement in the entire thousand line script that isn't valid under 5.0 but is under 5.6 And I've also run across a number of Perl extensions that won't run under 5.0 as well, even though the authors are supposed to regression test under 5.0 I was under the impression that Perl 5.6.0 was released on 2000-Mar-22, while Perl 5.000 was issued on or about 1994-Oct-17. For the life of me, I cannot comprehend why anyone would be using such an antiquated version. I should have said the perl 5.0 family. Including 5.004 which is still being maintained by the Perl maintainers. Perl 5.005-04 just came out in 2004 by the way. perl 5.6.2 came out in Nov 2003. I have a rather limited knowledge of Perl; That's apparent. however, I am not going to be bothered regression testing it under a seven year old obsoleted version. There were major structural changes in perl 5.0 and 5.6 The changes going from 5.6 to 5.8 and 5.9 are much less. You can take it as a given that anything that runs on perl 5.005-04 will run on all perl 5.0 versions, anything that runs on perl 5.6.2 will run on all 5.6 versions, etc. The whole reason that the perl project maintains 5.0, 5.6, 5.8 and so on is that they know that there's systems that have lots of tested programs that have been tested under 5.0 and the system maintainers have not yet gone through the process of testing all that software on newer perl versions. Despite what you probably believe, when an organization has a server that is running fine, they are not frothing at the mouth to upgrade it to the latest version. This is why IMHO that perl is not a good choice to use for building large systems, not because the perl maintainers don't understand the importance of backwards compatability, but because too many programmers like yourself simply don't. If I was building a system that was ONLY going to use perl and the modules supplied with it, and NOT use any other 3rd party modules, then I would consider using perl, there wouldn't be anything wrong with it. But most of the perl scripts out there use many 3rd party modules (and I understand why, it saves them time) and that is where you have the problem, is with those. I believe that FreeBSD-3.4 was released around 12/21/1999 or there about. Should we also be testing against that version also? I wasn't talking about 1999 software I was talking about 2004 software. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Anything you have actually seen is fair game. Ted -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of doug Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 12:19 PM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! How far do we get to go back in time? From the first online fortran compiler: ugh1 and ugh2. In fairness these were conditions that were not supposed to happen, but somehow they always do. In more recent times I always liked, invalid page fault this perhaps as late as win98. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? Seem to recall it occurring when I deleted the directory I was 'in'. I may have imagined it though! -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Chad Perrin Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:39 AM To: FreeBSD Questions Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 08:14:44PM -0700, Garrett Cooper wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. Not correct. The Artistic license is less restrictive than the GPL so GPL advocates can take a Perl install and call it GPLd perl - but the Perl FAQ makes it very clear the intent of the Perl maintainers is not to use GPL. As they said, there is no GNU Perl I challenge you to point to one, single Perl scrap of code, that is ONLY gpled. As far as I know, anyone submitting patches or modifications to the Perl maintainers has been required to license their patches under Artistic for them to be included. Of course, if people put Perl extensions under GPL the Perl maintainers cannot help that. I do not think, however, that any extensions that are included with the default install are GPL-only. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 09:19:00AM -0700, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Chad Perrin Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:39 AM To: FreeBSD Questions Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. Not correct. The Artistic license is less restrictive than the GPL so GPL advocates can take a Perl install and call it GPLd perl - but the Perl FAQ makes it very clear the intent of the Perl maintainers is not to use GPL. As they said, there is no GNU Perl I challenge you to point to one, single Perl scrap of code, that is ONLY gpled. Nothing I said should in any way be construed to mean that Perl, or any part of it, is in any way solely GPLed. I have no idea where you would have gotten such an impression. See above, where I point out that Perl is dual-licensed -- *not* solely GPLed. Also see the rest of what I said in the earlier email, in text you cut out of the quote, indicating that for my purposes Perl is installed under terms of the Perl Artistic License (and not the GPL). Nothing you have said suggests at all that my statement was incorrect, except the two words not correct. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Dr. Ron Paul: Liberty has meaning only if we still believe in it when terrible things happen and a false government security blanket beckons. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 22:05:50 -0600 Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). A huge number of ports and packages have it as a dependency. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Bill Campbell Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 9:36 AM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Actually perl has a lot of problems too. One of the biggest is that perl script writers always seem to think like you, in that perl is consistent across all platforms. The biggest problems I've seen with perl scripts are when people use perl extensions that are not on the system. You then have to go find the extension they use and very few of the perl script writers seem to be smart enough to put a section at the beginning of their scripts that define the CPAN location of the particular extensions they are using. The second biggest problem is perl script writers using constructs that are valid in Perl 5.6 and later but not valid in Perl 5.0 I don't know how many times I've wanted to strangle someone when trying to run a perl script under Perl 5.0 that had ONE single friggin statement in the entire thousand line script that isn't valid under 5.0 but is under 5.6 And I've also run across a number of Perl extensions that won't run under 5.0 as well, even though the authors are supposed to regression test under 5.0 Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. ksh is consistent across platfroms, of course, you generally have to compile it for the system your on. If you cannot work within a limited construct set your not much of a programmer. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 7:34 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. Lots of programs use configure and if they don't see the gnu libraries they will use the more traditional bsd ones, but if they see the gnu stuff they will silently use it. For example, one I see a lot is programs using gdbm if they see it, and if they don't they will use ndbm. This can cause major problems for commercial users. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re[2]: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On July 04, 2007 at 09:53AM Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: [snip] Actually perl has a lot of problems too. One of the biggest is that perl script writers always seem to think like you, in that perl is consistent across all platforms. The biggest problems I've seen with perl scripts are when people use perl extensions that are not on the system. You then have to go find the extension they use and very few of the perl script writers seem to be smart enough to put a section at the beginning of their scripts that define the CPAN location of the particular extensions they are using. The second biggest problem is perl script writers using constructs that are valid in Perl 5.6 and later but not valid in Perl 5.0 I don't know how many times I've wanted to strangle someone when trying to run a perl script under Perl 5.0 that had ONE single friggin statement in the entire thousand line script that isn't valid under 5.0 but is under 5.6 And I've also run across a number of Perl extensions that won't run under 5.0 as well, even though the authors are supposed to regression test under 5.0 I was under the impression that Perl 5.6.0 was released on 2000-Mar-22, while Perl 5.000 was issued on or about 1994-Oct-17. For the life of me, I cannot comprehend why anyone would be using such an antiquated version. I have a rather limited knowledge of Perl; however, I am not going to be bothered regression testing it under a seven year old obsoleted version. I believe that FreeBSD-3.4 was released around 12/21/1999 or there about. Should we also be testing against that version also? -- Gerard ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 12:26:01PM +0100, RW wrote: On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 22:05:50 -0600 Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). A huge number of ports and packages have it as a dependency. Yes, of course -- there's a great deal of Perl-based software on various unices that is written in Perl. I seem to recall having Perl available before I had most of my usual software installed on this system, however. In retrospect, though, I think something associated with Portupgrade uses Perl -- and I would have had that installed by the time I recall having Perl available -- so that's probably the culprit in this case. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] print substr(Just another Perl hacker, 0, -2); ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
How far do we get to go back in time? From the first online fortran compiler: ugh1 and ugh2. In fairness these were conditions that were not supposed to happen, but somehow they always do. In more recent times I always liked, invalid page fault this perhaps as late as win98. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- Fuzzy love, -CyberLeo Technical Administrator CyberLeo.Net Webhosting http://www.CyberLeo.Net [EMAIL PROTECTED] Furry Peace! - http://www.fur.com/peace/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, 4 Jul 2007, CyberLeo Kitsana wrote: Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- IBM: keyboard no present, press F1 to continue. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Eduardo Viruena Silva wrote: On Wed, 4 Jul 2007, CyberLeo Kitsana wrote: Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- IBM: keyboard no present, press F1 to continue. Perhaps this has been mentioned before from Unix, I don't know: Bad Magic Number -- Tim Daneliuk [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. ... This can cause major problems for commercial users. How? Last I heard, the *L*GPL only requires making the *library* source available (and that only if the library has been modified). It doesn't extend to the using application. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Or, change all the gnu ports to install into something like /usr/local/gnu or /usr/local/gpl instead of straight into /usr/local. You'd still have the gnu libs when needed, but without having them included in normal search paths. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. ... This can cause major problems for commercial users. How? Last I heard, the *L*GPL only requires making the *library* source available (and that only if the library has been modified). It doesn't extend to the using application. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Or, change all the gnu ports to install into something like /usr/local/gnu or /usr/local/gpl instead of straight into /usr/local. You'd still have the gnu libs when needed, but without having them included in normal search paths. That would seriously muck up a lot of people's assumptions on locations for programs, and would be incredibly necessary. Plus it would make searching for programs in $PATH a slight bit more time consuming (on the order of milliseconds I know, but those milliseconds are the exact reason why I have to manually profile pkg_install to determine bottlenecks). Also, please don't muck up email addresses. It's not cool, by any means. -Garrett ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Reminds me of a typical windows user i dealt with who saw an error about explorer.exe and how it could not be read and let it slide. :-P using my wicked non user friendly skillz of the damned, i personally like the concept of a simple pebkac error when bind refuses to start due to a named.conf setting or similar. sortof creates a challenge, an adventure to find what's causing the issue yourself. wait. i shouldn't be promoting ideas on how make things worse off on freebsd-questions. pardon this useless email. -ben Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Mon, Jul 02, 2007 at 03:11:56PM -0500, Martin McCormick wrote: #! /bin/sh a = 5 that's enough to make it happen. Run that, and you get: a: not found Interestingly enough, if you run that same script in a Debian Linux environment, you get: ./testfile: line 2: a: command not found This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$ uname -s Linux [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$ ls -l `which bash sh` -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 616248 Aug 13 2006 /bin/bash lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 Mar 25 20:36 /bin/sh - bash -- Paul Chvostek [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. Martin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 08:44:14 -0500 Martin McCormick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's why there is a POSIX standard, and why many people think it's bad idea to get into the habit of using bash specific scripts. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
You could make it more zen-like, perhaps: You are out of tune with the Universe, grasshopper. Continue your studies And, if everything was correct it could issue: awakening has been attained, entering zazen Ted -Original Message- From: nawcom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 2:24 AM To: Ted Mittelstaedt Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! Reminds me of a typical windows user i dealt with who saw an error about explorer.exe and how it could not be read and let it slide. :-P using my wicked non user friendly skillz of the damned, i personally like the concept of a simple pebkac error when bind refuses to start due to a named.conf setting or similar. sortof creates a challenge, an adventure to find what's causing the issue yourself. wait. i shouldn't be promoting ideas on how make things worse off on freebsd-questions. pardon this useless email. -ben Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 Marijuana will be legal some day, because the many law students who now smoke pot will someday become congressmen and legalize it in order to protect themselves. -- Lenny Bruce ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 2007-07-03 at 09:36 -0700, Bill Campbell wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 Marijuana will be legal some day, because the many law students who now smoke pot will someday become congressmen and legalize it in order to protect themselves. -- Lenny Bruce sh should always be sh compatible on every platform (surprisingly). It may even be defined in one of the POSIX standards. This is why you write shell scripts in sh, even if you prefer csh, ksh or bash as your actual shell. Tom signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 07:34:20PM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Amazon.com interview candidate: When C++ is your hammer, everything starts to look like your thumb. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Baltasar Gracian: A wise man gets more from his enemies than a fool from his friends. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) One of the reasons I started using perl almost 20 years ago was that it was cleaner and more consistent than tying a bunch of utilities together with the shell (not to mention only having to master one type of regular expressions :-). I now use python for the vast majority of my development work instead of perl as I find it much cleaner with better object oriented features. When I write shell scripts, I use a very limited set of features which are /bin/sh compatible. As soon as I start having to do anything much more than run a program against a list of files, I switch to python. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 ``Intellectually, teachers fall between education theorists and bright cocker spaniels. (Probably closer to the education theorists. The AKC has been doing wonders with spaniels.) If you think I'm kidding look at the GREs for education majors, whose scores are the lowest of all fields, and remember that these are the smart ones.'' -- http://www.FredOnEverything.net ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 09:29:03PM -0700, Bill Campbell wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) One of the reasons I started using perl almost 20 years ago was that it was cleaner and more consistent than tying a bunch of utilities together with the shell (not to mention only having to master one type of regular expressions :-). I now use python for the vast majority of my development work instead of perl as I find it much cleaner with better object oriented features. I'm of a similar mind, except that for OOP stuff I prefer Ruby, and for non-OOP stuff I still generally use Perl. Python doesn't really whet my whistle, so to speak. When I write shell scripts, I use a very limited set of features which are /bin/sh compatible. As soon as I start having to do anything much more than run a program against a list of files, I switch to python. $language =~ s/python/Perl/ Otherwise, ditto what you said. Much like PHP, I find that shell languages as scripting syntaxes don't really scale well in terms of maintainability. YMMV, of course. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Baltasar Gracian: A wise man gets more from his enemies than a fool from his friends. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Jeffrey Goldberg writes: I still remember as a newcomer to Unix a long long time ago getting Bad magic number In retrospect, I suspect that I'd typed ld where I'd meant to type ls. I have been doing things on Unix systems since about 1990 and the thing I run across that makes me ready to split a brick with my bare hands to this very day is the not found message one can get in a badly written shell script such as the following: #! /bin/sh a = 5 that's enough to make it happen. Run that, and you get: a: not found Interestingly enough, if you run that same script in a Debian Linux environment, you get: ./testfile: line 2: a: command not found Most of you will probably instantly see what I did wrong in that there shouldn't be any spaces between the variable name, the = sign and the 5 which could be anything else. I just picked a 5 for the heck of it. If you are in a big messy shell script, just seeing a: not found Doesn't tell me much except I know it's not working. The problem could be either that there is a typo or it could be that $a is null. I usually find that I snuck a space in and didn't even think about it at the time. I don't know if error messages from other OS's are off limits, but some of the ones from the most widely-used OS on Earth are treasures. How about running a gigantic piece of commercial software that does God knows what on your computer, and getting an error like: The software has performed an illegal operation. I bet there is a second line that they had to print in text using the same forground and background color so as to keep from getting fired that reads: Now, try and find it. Ha ha ha ha! Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. I like the quotation I read once that said that Unix is a user-friendly operating system. It is just particular about who it makes friends with. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK Systems Engineer OSU Information Technology Department Network Operations Group ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Enforcing Password History
I have some 6.1 stable systems that I would like to enforce password histories on. pam_unix, pam_passwdqc and login.conf do not seem to support this functionality. Does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks. -Joshua ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thursday 31 May 2007, Tom Wilson wrote: I always liked one of the messages from an old version of the VMS (4 or 5?) C compiler(may not be exactly it, but this was included): Bad Code Or the Level I BASIC error messages on a TRS-80. What? How? Sorry? And that's all folks. The entire repertoire of error reporting on Level I Basic :-) Of course, fitting a BASIC interpretor and OS into only 4K of ROM was quite an achievement in itself. I doubt there were many spare bytes for more informative error reports. -- Dave ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
At 14:38 31/05/2007, Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits And the Need 0KB more memory to manage memory from MacOS system7? A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Jun 5, 2007, at 4:39 PM, Eduardo Morras wrote: At 14:38 31/05/2007, Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits And the Need 0KB more memory to manage memory from MacOS system7? I still remember as a newcomer to Unix a long long time ago getting Bad magic number In retrospect, I suspect that I'd typed ld where I'd meant to type ls. -j -- Jeffrey Goldberghttp://www.goldmark.org/jeff/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
