[GNC] Certificate of Deposit Early Withdrawal Penalty Account Entry

[Stephen]

I had a CD that I closed before it matured. The bank applied a penalty 
of 90 days interest at the CD rate. In fact the total penalty was 
figured as the sum of principal penalty of $1,366.62 and penalty amount 
paid from interest earned for the period of a partial month of $162.89 
for a total penalty of $1,529.51. The statement clearly shows a payment 
of +$162.89 and a penalty of -$162.89 and a penalty amount from 
principal of the $1,366.62.  The interest earned and penalized is a net 
$0 so I could just book the $1,366.62 as a charge to the CD account and 
as as an charge to an early withdrawal penalty account to obtain the 
closing balance on the account. But it seems to me that I should be 
booking at least 3 splits to show the interest earned account and 
interest earned penalized account and the rest of the penalty as a 
charge to the CD account but the numbers produce orphans or imbalances. 
I'm treating all entries as income items so interest earned, interest 
penalized, and a principal penalty. They are multiple entries and not 
multiple splits in the CD income account. Is this the correct way to 
book this? Some guidance would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

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Re: [GNC] TAX Report WAS Re: reports not working unless exported

[David T. via gnucash-user]

Phyllis, 

Tommy is right. In order for the tax report to work, you must go to Edit->Tax 
Report Options, locate each account in the left entry box, and enter the IRS 
form and line for which the account is relevant in the right box. It is a 
tedious process, but only has to be done once for a set of books (aside from 
changes that must be made as you modify your account structures or the tax code 
changes).

I did this many years ago, and have really liked the ability to get a quick 
snapshot of my overall tax situation in one quick report. Back in the day, you 
could use the report to populate several tax software packages (like TurboTax), 
but in recent years, these programs import forms directly from providers, 
rendering this aspect moot. But I still use this report regularly. 

When I set this up many years ago, it was necessary to assign each account 
separately, as in you had to exit the dialog after every account assigned; more 
recently, the interface has improved just a little bit, in that you can assign 
multiple accounts to the same IRS line at one pass (helpful for interest, 
dividend and capital gains accounts). But you cannot step through all your 
accounts and assign tax options sequentially in the one dialog. I don't know if 
this has changed, but I wouldn't expect it to have changed. 

David T. ​

On Jan 15, 2023, 1:36 AM, at 1:36 AM, Tommy Trussell  
wrote:
>reply below
>
>On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 3:49 PM Phyllis Bruce 
>wrote:
>
>> Okay, I can't stand it anymore.  I don't know what ubuntu is, or
>flatpak,
>> or a host of other terms you use.  I run windows and the latest
>version.
>> Embarrassed that I've not looked to documentation, but would that
>help me
>> or do I need to know?
>>
>> I will go to documentation to learn about the tax report.  There is
>> obviously something I'm not seeing but I did notice that when I chose
>> "Report Options" Start and end of accounting period, last year I got
>one
>> expense category for 2022.  I have so far been unable to add other
>income
>> or expense categories.  I know it's in the documentation and I will
>find it.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>> 
>>
>>
>The tax report is more complicated, and in fact I have never used it.
>But I
>just created a new subject for this thread.
>
>I believe you have to do quite a bit of setup to use the tax report --
>you
>have to identify the accounts that are relevant and you have to tag
>each of
>those accounts with the IRS form numbers.
>
>I believe the report also works for the German equivalent of the US
>IRS.
>
>
>
>
>>
>>> -
>>> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
>>> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>>>
>>
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Re: [GNC] reports not working unless exported

[David T. via gnucash-user]

Michael, 

The tax report is different from every other report; it loads account data 
directly upon running.  This is due to the fact that it relies on the user 
pre-assigning accounts (Phyllis's categories) to tax lines in advance. 

Otherwise, your advice is spot on. 

⁣David T. ​

On Jan 15, 2023, 2:34 AM, at 2:34 AM, Michael or Penny Novack 
 wrote:
>On 1/14/2023 4:49 PM, Phyllis Bruce wrote:
>> Okay, I can't stand it anymore.  I don't know what ubuntu is, or
>flatpak,
>> or a host of other terms you use.  I run windows and the latest
>version.
>> Embarrassed that I've not looked to documentation, but would that
>help me
>> or do I need to know?
>>
>> I will go to documentation to learn about the tax report.  There is
>> obviously something I'm not seeing but I did notice that when I chose
>> "Report Options" Start and end of accounting period, last year I got
>one
>> expense category for 2022.  I have so far been unable to add other
>income
>> or expense categories.  I know it's in the documentation and I will
>find it.
>
>a) It might be slightly counterintuitive, but with gnucash you first
>run 
>a report and THEN (once the report exists) get to edit the report 
>(select desired options. What I suggest, if new to gnucash, for each 
>report you plan to run, try it (tell gnucash to run the report) and
>then 
>use edit => report options to set all the options you want (for
>example, 
>the effective date(s) of the report.
>
>    I strongly suggest (whenever dates are involved) that you use 
>explicit dates instead of things like "current accounting period" 
>because what THAT is will depend on the "real time" of when you are 
>running the report. Thus if on New Year's Eve I ran a report for 
>"current accounting period" I would get the report for 2022 but if I
>ran 
>it tonight I would not. Since you mention the Tax Report, if I ran
>that, 
>I would NEVER expect to be running it for the "current accounting
>period"
>
>b) What do you mean by the term "category". Because some other popular 
>software (not double entry bookkeeping) might use this term in a 
>particular way does not mean that gnucash does.
>
>Michael D Novack
>
>
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[GNC] Website from WIki

[Fred Tydeman]

I am doing a search (for T-bill) on the gnucash wiki.
I get the Search Results page (with 181 results).
On the left side of the page, I click on GnuCash Website.
That gets me:  Apache2 Ubuntu Default Page
That seems wrong to me.
The URL in the address bar of Google Chrome is:  gnucash.org
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Re: [GNC] Recommended Method of Entry for IRA Distributions

[Milton Stern]

Hi Everyone,

I was thinking, perhaps to have the initial 401k/IRA in the "Assets" as a
Deferred Income under the standard categories/subcategories (ex. Stocks,
Mutual Funds, Treasury Bills, CDs, etc.) (or Visa versa)?
When a distribution is taken, the vehicle is sold with proceeds going to
"Income" (perhaps to a sub-account descriptive of the vehicle and the
category?
Then a transfer of income to a bank-type account from the income account?
(Though it may not meet accounting standards, it should be able to track
the 401k/IRA and produce an income and asset reports.)
(Note that this does not directly address vesting, withholding nor
premature distributions.)

Thoughts?

Moshe




> Message: 8

Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2023 17:10:35 -0500
> From: Michael or Penny Novack 
> To: R Losey , "David T." 
> Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Recommended Method of Entry for IRA Distributions
> Message-ID: <378e51c5-61d1-4c7f-18c8-1db8c6a83...@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> On 1/13/2023 11:48 AM, R Losey wrote:
> > Thanks. The only minor drawback is that I seem to be entering the data
> > twice under "Income" just to keep track of IRA distributions?on their
> > own. But hey, it's one way to make it work.
> >
> > And, as has been pointed out, since this is not really "income", it
> > makes sense that the transaction has no net income. I think I'll adopt
> > this method for 2023.
> >
> > In hindsight, since the Fiduciary Trust that keeps the IRA has to
> > report to me on distributions, I haven't felt a need to have an
> > account for this and to double-check them.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 12, 2023 at 10:56 PM David T.  wrote:
> >
> > Two separate entries. In my mind, this would best be put in one
> > transaction, to make the association obvious.
> >
> > CR - Assets: IRA $1000
> > DB - Assets: Checking $1000
> > DB - Income: Deferred Income $1000
> > CR - Income: IRA Distribution $1000 *
> >
> <<< it most certainly COULD be in one entry. A transaction can have more
> than two accounts. It is only when entering via the shortcut "enter
> directly into the ledger" that gnucash allows you to do that is limited
> to two accounts. When entering a "split" in "journal mode" you can have
> more than two. In the old days ALL transactions were entered first in
> the journal and then posted to the ledger. But even in pen and ink days
> we had SOME shortcut possibilities, like "cashbook accounting" << where
> a small subset of the ledger allowed direct entry skipping the journal.>>
>
>
BUT -- I would not have "deferred income" under income, because it is
more like a standing account. The money that you put into the 401k/IRA
did not get counted in your income in those years. The money contributed
by your employer (401k) did not get counted as income back then, nor the
annual increases in fund value as you perhaps marked to market at year
end (the investment income of the fund).

When you take distributions later is when it becomes income << you are
undeferring that amount >>

This is accounting, not gnucash

Michael D Novack


>
> * Income: IRA Distribution is used to document the distribution
> for tax purposes.
>
> David T.
> On Jan 13, 2023, at 7:21 AM, R Losey  wrote:
>
> Thanks for all of the information... however, getting back to the
original
> question, I'm not sure how to record IRA taxable distributions. I
thought I
> was doing it, but I am apparently not.
>
> Let me write through a couple of cases.  In the first one, I'm
selling
> $1000 worth (10 shares) of security A and having it go directly
to my
> checking account with no income tax withholding. (some of these
may be
> USA-centric terms; I apologize for that).
>
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Re: [GNC] reports not working unless exported

[Michael or Penny Novack]

On 1/14/2023 4:49 PM, Phyllis Bruce wrote:

Okay, I can't stand it anymore.  I don't know what ubuntu is, or flatpak,
or a host of other terms you use.  I run windows and the latest version.
Embarrassed that I've not looked to documentation, but would that help me
or do I need to know?

I will go to documentation to learn about the tax report.  There is
obviously something I'm not seeing but I did notice that when I chose
"Report Options" Start and end of accounting period, last year I got one
expense category for 2022.  I have so far been unable to add other income
or expense categories.  I know it's in the documentation and I will find it.


a) It might be slightly counterintuitive, but with gnucash you first run 
a report and THEN (once the report exists) get to edit the report 
(select desired options. What I suggest, if new to gnucash, for each 
report you plan to run, try it (tell gnucash to run the report) and then 
use edit => report options to set all the options you want (for example, 
the effective date(s) of the report.


   I strongly suggest (whenever dates are involved) that you use 
explicit dates instead of things like "current accounting period" 
because what THAT is will depend on the "real time" of when you are 
running the report. Thus if on New Year's Eve I ran a report for 
"current accounting period" I would get the report for 2022 but if I ran 
it tonight I would not. Since you mention the Tax Report, if I ran that, 
I would NEVER expect to be running it for the "current accounting period"


b) What do you mean by the term "category". Because some other popular 
software (not double entry bookkeeping) might use this term in a 
particular way does not mean that gnucash does.


Michael D Novack


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[GNC] TAX Report WAS Re: reports not working unless exported

[Tommy Trussell]

reply below

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 3:49 PM Phyllis Bruce  wrote:

> Okay, I can't stand it anymore.  I don't know what ubuntu is, or flatpak,
> or a host of other terms you use.  I run windows and the latest version.
> Embarrassed that I've not looked to documentation, but would that help me
> or do I need to know?
>
> I will go to documentation to learn about the tax report.  There is
> obviously something I'm not seeing but I did notice that when I chose
> "Report Options" Start and end of accounting period, last year I got one
> expense category for 2022.  I have so far been unable to add other income
> or expense categories.  I know it's in the documentation and I will find it.
>
> Thanks
>
>> 
>
>
The tax report is more complicated, and in fact I have never used it. But I
just created a new subject for this thread.

I believe you have to do quite a bit of setup to use the tax report -- you
have to identify the accounts that are relevant and you have to tag each of
those accounts with the IRS form numbers.

I believe the report also works for the German equivalent of the US IRS.




>
>> -
>> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
>> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>>
>
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Re: [GNC] reports not working unless exported

[Phyllis Bruce]

Okay, I can't stand it anymore.  I don't know what ubuntu is, or flatpak,
or a host of other terms you use.  I run windows and the latest version.
Embarrassed that I've not looked to documentation, but would that help me
or do I need to know?

I will go to documentation to learn about the tax report.  There is
obviously something I'm not seeing but I did notice that when I chose
"Report Options" Start and end of accounting period, last year I got one
expense category for 2022.  I have so far been unable to add other income
or expense categories.  I know it's in the documentation and I will find it.

Thanks

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 3:07 PM Tommy Trussell 
wrote:

> reply below
> On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 4:44 PM Jeff  wrote:
>
> > On 1/13/23 4:13 PM, Michael or Penny Novack wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >> I went to generate some reports for the year 2022 and not one of the
> > >> standard reports will work within GNC now.
> > >
> > >
> > > Explain what you mean by "will not work" Are you having a DATE
> > > problem? (you don't know how to specify the effective date(s) for a
> > > report?)
> > >
> > >
> > > Michael D Novack
> >
> > I've tried custom date ranges and using beginning of previous year/end
> > of previous year.  All I get is a blank tab or window, unless I export
> > the report to say an HTML file, which will display properly in Firefox.
> >
> > --
> > --JEffrey Black M.B.A.
> >
>
> Anyone who has any problems running the flatpak version of GnuCash should
> first try this in a terminal:
>
> $ flatpak update
>
> GnuCash seems particularly susceptible to problems with flatpak's shared
> components. I've noticed blank reports, weird colors with the interface,
> and other unusual behavior, all usually corrected by a flatpak update, once
> an update is available.
>
> -
> > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
> >
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Re: [GNC] reports not working unless exported

[Tommy Trussell]

reply below
On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 4:44 PM Jeff  wrote:

> On 1/13/23 4:13 PM, Michael or Penny Novack wrote:
> >
> >
> >> I went to generate some reports for the year 2022 and not one of the
> >> standard reports will work within GNC now.
> >
> >
> > Explain what you mean by "will not work" Are you having a DATE
> > problem? (you don't know how to specify the effective date(s) for a
> > report?)
> >
> >
> > Michael D Novack
>
> I've tried custom date ranges and using beginning of previous year/end
> of previous year.  All I get is a blank tab or window, unless I export
> the report to say an HTML file, which will display properly in Firefox.
>
> --
> --JEffrey Black M.B.A.
>

Anyone who has any problems running the flatpak version of GnuCash should
first try this in a terminal:

$ flatpak update

GnuCash seems particularly susceptible to problems with flatpak's shared
components. I've noticed blank reports, weird colors with the interface,
and other unusual behavior, all usually corrected by a flatpak update, once
an update is available.

-
> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>
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Re: [GNC] Scheduled Transactions Window Sorting

[Adrien Monteleone]

I find it is sticky regardless of the column used for sorting. I've 
tested each one, close and reopened the tab, and also closed and 
reopened the app entirely.


4.13 on MacOS Monterey.

-
I wonder if this is related to the sticky sorting in register problem 
some others are seeing?


Are the same folks having sort issues in various places?

Regards,
Adrien

On 1/14/23 12:43 AM, David T. via gnucash-user wrote:

Gnucash 4.13 Windows 10.

As I reacquaint myself with scheduled transactions, I find myself opening that 
window regularly. Each time I open the window, transactions are listed in last 
created order. This despite my having sorted the list alphabetically the 
previous time.

My question is this: is there some material reason why the Scheduled 
Transactions Window sort order isn't sticky (like most other windows in 
GnuCash), or is this simply an oversight?


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Re: [GNC] Recommended Method of Entry for IRA Distributions

[Michael or Penny Novack]

On 1/14/2023 1:07 AM, David T. wrote:


.
As for counting as income, most paychecks I've seen list the 
employee's gross income at the top, with contributions to tax-deferred 
accounts listed as deductions from the gross amount. This is why I 
placed deferred income under income; the income that my employer lists 
at year end includes this deferred income. I can, I imagine, chalk 
this up to another case of "their books, my books" (as in, "On their 
books, it's income; on my books it's not."), but I'd be happy to 
understand a little better.


The case of an IRA can be even more confusing, in that a person can 
make IRA contributions entirely separately from income transactions 
and have those contributions affect income at tax time.


David T.



This is accounting, not a matter of how to do in gnucash...

You are too focused on the term "income"

We'll back a few years (decades) to when I was getting a salary check. 
There would of course be a gross amount,  but notice I am not saying 
"income". There would be various deductions like you might expect, tax 
withholding, insurance, etc. But there could also be additions! For 
example, I was carrying 5 years group term, paying for four (deduction) 
but also receiving "imputed income" for the first year (the company paid 
for that, but the IRS considers the premium for coverage >$50,000 to be 
income). BUT one of the deductions from gross was money going into the 
401k (NOT counted as current income) and the company matched that (also 
no counted as current income). THAT is what a 401k/IRA is all about, 
deferring income.


Standing accounts  in the old days of pen and ink on paper the P 
was created in the "closing the books" operation. All the income and 
expense accounts would be closed into an account called "Profit and 
Loss" and then that account closed to equity by whatever "net profit" or 
"net loss" brought the Profit and Loss account to zero. AT THIS POINT 
all the temporary accounts (like income and expense accounts) would have 
zero balances and we are ready to begin the net accounting period. The 
"standing accounts" are the accounts that were not closed to zero in 
this process (accounts of types asset, liability, and equity.


You do what you want. But I would be considering "deferred income" to be 
a standing account. I would not expect its ever increasing balance 
(during the contributing and waiting years) to be appearing in total 
income each year. It eventually does appear in income for a current year 
when distributions are taken later in life. Because income accounts are 
"really" temporary accounts of fundamental type equity, under equity is 
where I would be keeping it.


BUT --- I am not an accountant. Do whatever YOUR accountant advises.

Michael D Novack



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Re: [GNC] Scheduled Transactions Window Sorting

[David Carlson]

David,

I would wait for a reply from one of the more active developers.  I do
agree with your sentiments.

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 8:32 AM David T. via gnucash-user <
gnucash-user@gnucash.org> wrote:

> Well, thanks for the confirmation.
>
> I disagree with the conclusion, though. Based on your reasoning, registers
> should only save a chronological sort; thankfully, they allow other sort
> orders for users who prefer them.
>
> ⁣David T. ​
>
> On Jan 14, 2023, 4:15 PM, at 4:15 PM, John Layman <
> john.lay...@laymanandlayman.com> wrote:
> >I'm running 4.13 on Windows 10 and can tell you that sort order is
> >'sticky' only if you are sorting on one of the two occurrence columns.
> >It's a calendar-oriented feature, so I can't say I consider that an
> >oversight.
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >From: gnucash-user
> > On Behalf Of
> >David T. via gnucash-user
> >Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2023 1:44 AM
> >To: Gnucash Users 
> >Subject: [GNC] Scheduled Transactions Window Sorting
> >
> >Hello,
> >
> >Gnucash 4.13 Windows 10.
> >
> >As I reacquaint myself with scheduled transactions, I find myself
> >opening that window regularly. Each time I open the window,
> >transactions are listed in last created order. This despite my having
> >sorted the list alphabetically the previous time.
> >
> >My question is this: is there some material reason why the Scheduled
> >Transactions Window sort order isn't sticky (like most other windows in
> >GnuCash), or is this simply an oversight?
> >
> >⁣David T. ​
> >___
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-- 
David Carlson
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Re: [GNC] Scheduled Transactions Window Sorting

[David T. via gnucash-user]

Well, thanks for the confirmation. 

I disagree with the conclusion, though. Based on your reasoning, registers 
should only save a chronological sort; thankfully, they allow other sort orders 
for users who prefer them. 

⁣David T. ​

On Jan 14, 2023, 4:15 PM, at 4:15 PM, John Layman 
 wrote:
>I'm running 4.13 on Windows 10 and can tell you that sort order is
>'sticky' only if you are sorting on one of the two occurrence columns.
>It's a calendar-oriented feature, so I can't say I consider that an
>oversight.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: gnucash-user
> On Behalf Of
>David T. via gnucash-user
>Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2023 1:44 AM
>To: Gnucash Users 
>Subject: [GNC] Scheduled Transactions Window Sorting
>
>Hello, 
>
>Gnucash 4.13 Windows 10.
>
>As I reacquaint myself with scheduled transactions, I find myself
>opening that window regularly. Each time I open the window,
>transactions are listed in last created order. This despite my having
>sorted the list alphabetically the previous time. 
>
>My question is this: is there some material reason why the Scheduled
>Transactions Window sort order isn't sticky (like most other windows in
>GnuCash), or is this simply an oversight?
>
>⁣David T. ​
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Re: [GNC] GnuCash 4.900 Released

[Geert Janssens]

Op zaterdag 14 januari 2023 00:23:21 CET schreef Fred Tydeman:
> On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 3:00 PM David H  wrote:
> > Yeah seems to be a typo which will cause the remote-add to fail if you
> > already have the flathub repository installed as follows:-
> > 
> > Wiki says - flatpak remote-add --user --if-not-exists *flathub*
> > https://flathub.org/beta-repo/flathub-beta.flatpakrepo
> > Should be - flatpak remote-add --user --if-not-exists *flathub-beta*
> > https://flathub.org/beta-repo/flathub-beta.flatpakrepo
> 
> Thanks.  That fix lets me get farther.
> I have done a fresh install of Fedora 37 with Gnome 43.2 on Intel 64-bit
> CPU.
> When I try to install the beta, I get an error saying that beta requires
> runtime org.gnome.Platform/x86_64/43
> Is there some way to force the beta to use the system wide Gnome?

No, you can't. Runtimes are a fundamental base concept of flatpaks (and snaps 
or 
appimages by the way) and you can't avoid them.

These runtimes ensure that there's a known common set of libraries available on 
the system 
for the flatpak application to depend on, regardless of the state of the base 
system. Aside 
from allowing the application to install on systems that don't have the proper 
base system, it 
also eliminates a whole host of compatibility issues early on in the 
development process. 
Issues that otherwise have to be solved by distribution maintainers when they 
package the 
applications for the regular packaging system of said distro.

Personally I think both systems (flatpaks vs distro packages) have their own 
distinct 
advantages and disadvantages. And I think both have their place. However in 
this particular 
scenario - distributing beta software for testing - I believe the isolation is 
actually a big 
advantage.

So if you want to install the (beta) gnucash flatpak on your system you will 
also have to 
accept to install the required gnome runtime for it.

If this is a hurdle for you, consider you can also only install it for as long 
as you want to beta 
test gnucash. You can easily remove this runtime together with the gnucash beta 
flatpak 
when you're done testing with the "flatpak uninstall" command.

Regards,

Geert
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