Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[Fred Tydeman]

On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 7:03 AM john  wrote:

> Nope. Whoever implemented that 20 years ago didn't hook it up to anything
> and nobody has since. Maybe because the implementation itself isn't very
> useful. It's saved as a string, and only  "Asia/Tokyo", "Australia/Sydney",
> "America/New_York", "America/Chicago", "Europe/London", or "Europe/Paris"
> are available. To apply it to a time would require conversion to a
> gmtoffset.
>
> But once you had that what would you do with it? Quotes almost never have
> a time on them. I guess you could apply a rule that says that if right now
> is between 0900 and 1600 on the indicated date (quotes do usually have
> dates) in the security's time zone then that's the time of the quote,
> otherwise it's 1600 in that timezone on the indicated date. The quote
> display would have to be tz-sensitive too. I'm not at all convinced that
> doing all of that would materially improve anything, and implementing it
> would be a lot of work.
>

Would it be correct and helpful if
  Currently, the timezone setting is ignored
were added to the Investment section on creating a new security
in the Gnucash Guide?
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[john]

Nope. Whoever implemented that 20 years ago didn't hook it up to anything and 
nobody has since. Maybe because the implementation itself isn't very useful. 
It's saved as a string, and only  "Asia/Tokyo", "Australia/Sydney", 
"America/New_York", "America/Chicago", "Europe/London", or "Europe/Paris" are 
available. To apply it to a time would require conversion to a gmtoffset.

But once you had that what would you do with it? Quotes almost never have a 
time on them. I guess you could apply a rule that says that if right now is 
between 0900 and 1600 on the indicated date (quotes do usually have dates) in 
the security's time zone then that's the time of the quote, otherwise it's 1600 
in that timezone on the indicated date. The quote display would have to be 
tz-sensitive too. I'm not at all convinced that doing all of that would 
materially improve anything, and implementing it would be a lot of work.

Regards,
John Ralls

> On Apr 3, 2023, at 1:21 AM, Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> 
> So, does it matter what Timezone I pick for a security in the Security Editor?
> In particular, "Use local time" versus "America/New_York"?
> 
> On Sun, Apr 2, 2023 at 6:57 PM john  > wrote:
>> 
>> > On Apr 2, 2023, at 1:37 AM, Fred Tydeman > > > wrote:
>> > 
>> > I am talking about price quotes.  I am trying to get month end and quarter 
>> > end valuations.
>> > So that I can compare what GnuCash has versus statements from broker (to 
>> > see if I have
>> > any missing or wrong transactions).
>> > 
>> > In a couple of years, I plan on living full time on a ship as it travels 
>> > around the world.
>> 
>> So the problem is that the quotes were as usual undated and although it was 
>> still 31 March at home it was 1 April where you are now and since the quotes 
>> didn't have a date on them GnuCash was marking them as 1 April, and that 
>> breaks reports using the nearest before price source.
>> 
>> The easiest way to handle that is to set the TZ variable to whatever time 
>> zone the market you're interested is in, but there's no good solution even 
>> possible if you hold securities traded in multiple time zones, especially if 
>> some are in Asia and others in America.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> John Ralls
>> 

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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[Fred Tydeman]

So, does it matter what Timezone I pick for a security in the Security
Editor?
In particular, "Use local time" versus "America/New_York"?

On Sun, Apr 2, 2023 at 6:57 PM john  wrote:

>
> > On Apr 2, 2023, at 1:37 AM, Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> >
> > I am talking about price quotes.  I am trying to get month end and
> quarter end valuations.
> > So that I can compare what GnuCash has versus statements from broker (to
> see if I have
> > any missing or wrong transactions).
> >
> > In a couple of years, I plan on living full time on a ship as it travels
> around the world.
>
> So the problem is that the quotes were as usual undated and although it
> was still 31 March at home it was 1 April where you are now and since the
> quotes didn't have a date on them GnuCash was marking them as 1 April, and
> that breaks reports using the nearest before price source.
>
> The easiest way to handle that is to set the TZ variable to whatever time
> zone the market you're interested is in, but there's no good solution even
> possible if you hold securities traded in multiple time zones, especially
> if some are in Asia and others in America.
>
> Regards,
> John Ralls
>
>
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[john]

> On Apr 2, 2023, at 1:37 AM, Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> 
> I am talking about price quotes.  I am trying to get month end and quarter 
> end valuations.
> So that I can compare what GnuCash has versus statements from broker (to see 
> if I have
> any missing or wrong transactions).
> 
> In a couple of years, I plan on living full time on a ship as it travels 
> around the world.

So the problem is that the quotes were as usual undated and although it was 
still 31 March at home it was 1 April where you are now and since the quotes 
didn't have a date on them GnuCash was marking them as 1 April, and that breaks 
reports using the nearest before price source.

The easiest way to handle that is to set the TZ variable to whatever time zone 
the market you're interested is in, but there's no good solution even possible 
if you hold securities traded in multiple time zones, especially if some are in 
Asia and others in America.

Regards,
John Ralls

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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[David T. via gnucash-user]

When I reconcile my brokerage account statements with my GnuCash books, I 
reconcile actual transactions and ensure that commodity balances are correct. 
As long as those are accurate, the valuation at any given time is essentially 
arbitrary; it only becomes important at the time of sale. 

A valuation at any given point only serves to make you feel something--good for 
how high it is, bad if it is lower than your hope.

⁣David T. ​

On Apr 2, 2023, 11:37 AM, at 11:37 AM, Fred Tydeman  
wrote:
>I am talking about price quotes.  I am trying to get month end and
>quarter
>end valuations.
>So that I can compare what GnuCash has versus statements from broker
>(to
>see if I have
>any missing or wrong transactions).
>
>In a couple of years, I plan on living full time on a ship as it
>travels
>around the world.
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[Fred Tydeman]

I am talking about price quotes.  I am trying to get month end and quarter
end valuations.
So that I can compare what GnuCash has versus statements from broker (to
see if I have
any missing or wrong transactions).

In a couple of years, I plan on living full time on a ship as it travels
around the world.
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[David T. via gnucash-user]

I hesitate to jump in, since John is so much more knowledgeable and informed, 
but his reply (and my understanding of the back side functioning in this area) 
would suggest that the quote source doesn't usually include any time zone 
information, and the time zone that GnuCash inserts into its data set is chosen 
specifically to ensure that quote dates won't change when viewed in different 
times zones. So, it's not clear to me why you would encounter date changes. 

That being said, I have a few questions, the first being, how long is your 
trip? If it's a short term thing, perhaps you can accept the discrepancy until 
you return to your home time zone, at which time the shift would presumably 
revert to your expectation.  

The second is, how important is it to know that a given price relates to 
Monday, as opposed to Tuesday? My experience is that the specific dates of such 
valuations is secondary to the general valuation at some point in time. Any 
concern with a specific date and time is either related to an actual event 
(purchase/sale), or is due to my own obsessive nature. The former gets handled 
in the actual transaction, while the latter takes therapy.  ;)

The third is, are you actually discussing price quotes, or perhaps 
transactions? Your initial query refers to securities, while John interpreted 
that to mean price quotes. Transactions can have more specific times associated 
with them (although I can't imagine an actual security having any sort of time 
attached to it). Perhaps this is a source of confusion in this exchange? 

⁣David T. ​

On Apr 2, 2023, 6:41 AM, at 6:41 AM, Fred Tydeman  
wrote:
>I am on a trip where I am 10 hours ahead of home timezone.
>So prices appear to be one day ahead of home time
>with the default of Local timezone.
>So, I am hoping that picking New York timezone will help.
>
>On Sat, Apr 1, 2023 at 8:54 PM john  wrote:
>
>> There's nothing to do either.
>>
>> Do you have a price-source that actually sets a time? Most don't so
>we set
>> the default time (10:59 AM UTC) so that the date is right in all
>timezones.
>>
>> Regards,
>> John Ralls
>>
>>
>> > On Mar 31, 2023, at 10:51 PM, Fred Tydeman 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Is there a way to set a default timezone for adding security?
>> > Is there a way to mass change the timezones for existing
>securities?
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>>
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[Fred Tydeman]

I am on a trip where I am 10 hours ahead of home timezone.
So prices appear to be one day ahead of home time
with the default of Local timezone.
So, I am hoping that picking New York timezone will help.

On Sat, Apr 1, 2023 at 8:54 PM john  wrote:

> There's nothing to do either.
>
> Do you have a price-source that actually sets a time? Most don't so we set
> the default time (10:59 AM UTC) so that the date is right in all timezones.
>
> Regards,
> John Ralls
>
>
> > On Mar 31, 2023, at 10:51 PM, Fred Tydeman 
> wrote:
> >
> > Is there a way to set a default timezone for adding security?
> > Is there a way to mass change the timezones for existing securities?
> > ___
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>
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Re: [GNC] Security timezone

[john]

There's nothing to do either.

Do you have a price-source that actually sets a time? Most don't so we set the 
default time (10:59 AM UTC) so that the date is right in all timezones.

Regards,
John Ralls


> On Mar 31, 2023, at 10:51 PM, Fred Tydeman  wrote:
> 
> Is there a way to set a default timezone for adding security?
> Is there a way to mass change the timezones for existing securities?
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> gnucash-user mailing list
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[GNC] Security timezone

[Fred Tydeman]

Is there a way to set a default timezone for adding security?
Is there a way to mass change the timezones for existing securities?
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