Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
Joel Rees via Gnupg-users wrote: Can I ask what new reason to make Stallman a scapegoat has emerged? The recent round of attacks on Stallman seem to have begun after RMS returned to the FSF Board. There is some controversy over the factual basis for these attacks. (In other words, there are accusations that the current accusations against RMS have no basis in fact and are basically made up.) There was similar controversy over the events that led to RMS leaving the FSF Board previously. Based on what I have seen, some of the accusations are fabricated, some are RMS's words twisted and taken out of context, and some are legitimate complaints about Stallman as a person and his past behavior. That said, this list is supposed to be for discussion of issues related to the use of GPG, and RMS is not related to that, so this thread really should be dropped and I am only writing this so that future readers of the list archive will not be left hanging and thinking that that question was dodged. As to your other question, I cannot speak for the motivations of other people. -- Jacob ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
On 4/9/21 19:59, Werner Koch via Gnupg-users wrote: > Hi! > > can we please stop this thread? PLEASE! Thank you. > > This is a technical and privacy oriented mailing list and not a medium > to discuss the pros and cons of a certain person. There are a enough > other places for such chitchat.> Indeed. as ever, Rembrandt --- 松下問童子 言師採藥去 只在此山中 雲深不知處 ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
Hi Werner, Am Fr den 9. Apr 2021 um 18:59 schrieb Werner Koch via Gnupg-users: > can we please stop this thread? > > This is a technical and privacy oriented mailing list and not a medium > to discuss the pros and cons of a certain person. There are a enough > other places for such chitchat. So please tell this to Robert J. Hansen who did twice bring some political cancel culture discussions to this list. I endorse Joel Rees question. There is no reason to try to cancel out RMS. I am not a big fan of him and his personality might be questionnaire to some, but there is no reason why he should be banned from anything. In fact, RMS did very great thinks for us as community. So please give at least something that justifies all that hate writings against RMS. Gruß Klaus -- Klaus Ethgen http://www.ethgen.ch/ pub 4096R/4E20AF1C 2011-05-16Klaus Ethgen Fingerprint: 85D4 CA42 952C 949B 1753 62B3 79D0 B06F 4E20 AF1C signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
Hi! can we please stop this thread? This is a technical and privacy oriented mailing list and not a medium to discuss the pros and cons of a certain person. There are a enough other places for such chitchat. Salam-Shalom, Werner -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
Can I ask what new reason to make Stallman a scapegoat has emerged? And why so many apparent core members of the gnupg community seem to be joining the cancel culture? ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
The only thing that I can say is that I would rather see a FAQ that reflect the current inplementation of GPG than a non-up to date FAQ per lack of user consensus (1). The problem there is without community buy-in, the FAQ lacks credibility. It's supposed to be the *community's* FAQ, which is why people consider it authoritative. "This is Rob's thinking" would be, to say the least, controversial: some people think I explain things accurately and clearly, and others think I've been sniffing glue since a tender age. ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
On 4/8/2021 5:19 PM, Robert J. Hansen via Gnupg-users wrote: If anyone in the community has strong feelings about the FAQ -- what should go in, what should be left out, etc. -- now's the time. The only thing that I can say is that I would rather see a FAQ that reflect the current inplementation of GPG than a non-up to date FAQ per lack of user consensus (1). EG: Due to a lack of consensus, the FAQ was never updated to reflect that '3072' is now the default in GPG. That is to say, that in my view a FAQ that explains clearly how to use GPG is somewhat more importent than comunity feedback. A statement to that effect at the top of the page could be added describing why this way was chosen. 1) https://lists.gnupg.org/pipermail/gnupg-users/2021-March/064974.html -- John Doe ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
The FAQ (https://www.gnupg.org/faq/gnupg-faq.html) claims the other way round, namely: Yep. Which was why I stepped away: I've ended my affiliations with FSF and GNU. However, that FAQ was last overhauled in October 2017, and apparently the relationship has changed in the last three and a half years. ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
I'm just a user, but since this mailing list is called "users", and
for clairity:
>>Always has, hasn't it. I look at that for hm a long time, and it
always was like that.
The FAQ (https://www.gnupg.org/faq/gnupg-faq.html) claims the other
way round, namely:
>GnuPG is free cryptographic software from the GNU Project which helps people
>ensure the confidentiality, integrity and assurance of their data. Let’s try
>that again: GnuPG is…
>GNU Project. The GNU Project is a group that aims to give people the ability
>to do all their computing with free software.
So I, as a user, was completely sure that GnuPG _is_ (or, at least,
was) an official GNU Project.
Regarding the Stallman story, the community seems to be split roughly
by a third, with one third of activists having signed an open letter
with criticism, and two thirds considering the criticism unjustified
(and having signed the support letter).
On Fri, 9 Apr 2021 at 01:59, Steffen Nurpmeso wrote:
>
> This is solely my opinion. But i have to say it now.
>
> Robert J. Hansen wrote in
> <3e47e65a-790f-e323-7a0c-c14660cd2...@sixdemonbag.org>:
> |A few weeks have passed, and I figured a recap might be appropriate:
> |
> | * FSF continues to support RMS
>
> I have no opinion on that. I do not know him, nor whatever.
> I saw some code from him twenty years ago and did not like it :)
> However, i did say in the past that i would allow him to travel by
> airplane, if it would be me, which is much more than i allow
> myself. And i stand to this opinion.
>
> | * FSFE has ended collaboration with FSF and GNU ("we see
> | ourselves unable to collaborate both with the FSF and any
> | other organisation in which Richard Stallman has a
> | leading position")
>
> The thing is that we live in a bigot world as gods and destroy
> live without just any respect. Most humans are very small minded
> and go for "each cheap piece of meat" just "to sneak away with
> it". Really, i am bored, thus. Sigh. Anyhow. In the western
> world cruelty and abuse and anti-social behaviour rather has
> become the norm, but everywhere you find that elder suppress the
> younger. Even more so if you _see_.
>
> So to tear open the indolence and coldness with which especially
> solvent white (but not only white) people perch upon exploitation
> of all possible kinds, environment, finite resources, literally
> billions of livestock, child and other sexual abuse can only be
> a good thing. The living conditions that our/the tremendous
> military and economic terror generates. All this nothing but
> a shame, that hole is too dark and deep, yet it exists.
>
> Quite the opposite, who does risk a saturated and comfortable life
> in order to aid for something better, at times is called a hero.
> Well i would not go that far here, Mr. Stallman is from or
> directly descends from a generation which actually had a quite
> good outcome of people who tried to make the white race better.
> Unfortunately, without success. :(
>
> Anyhow. There are too many narrow-minded individuals who (due to
> whatever shortcoming) are not capable to put things in the actual
> context of actual life as it really is (imho).
>
> | * GnuPG has clarified it's not part of GNU
>
> Always has, hasn't it. I look at that for hm a long time, and it
> always was like that.
>
> Thank you. And have a nice day.
>
> --steffen
> |
> |Der Kragenbaer,The moon bear,
> |der holt sich munter he cheerfully and one by one
> |einen nach dem anderen runter wa.ks himself off
> |(By Robert Gernhardt)
>
> ___
> Gnupg-users mailing list
> Gnupg-users@gnupg.org
> http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
--
Yours sincerely, Vladimir Nikishkin
(Sent from GMail web interface.)
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Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
This is solely my opinion. But i have to say it now.
Robert J. Hansen wrote in
<3e47e65a-790f-e323-7a0c-c14660cd2...@sixdemonbag.org>:
|A few weeks have passed, and I figured a recap might be appropriate:
|
| * FSF continues to support RMS
I have no opinion on that. I do not know him, nor whatever.
I saw some code from him twenty years ago and did not like it :)
However, i did say in the past that i would allow him to travel by
airplane, if it would be me, which is much more than i allow
myself. And i stand to this opinion.
| * FSFE has ended collaboration with FSF and GNU ("we see
| ourselves unable to collaborate both with the FSF and any
| other organisation in which Richard Stallman has a
| leading position")
The thing is that we live in a bigot world as gods and destroy
live without just any respect. Most humans are very small minded
and go for "each cheap piece of meat" just "to sneak away with
it". Really, i am bored, thus. Sigh. Anyhow. In the western
world cruelty and abuse and anti-social behaviour rather has
become the norm, but everywhere you find that elder suppress the
younger. Even more so if you _see_.
So to tear open the indolence and coldness with which especially
solvent white (but not only white) people perch upon exploitation
of all possible kinds, environment, finite resources, literally
billions of livestock, child and other sexual abuse can only be
a good thing. The living conditions that our/the tremendous
military and economic terror generates. All this nothing but
a shame, that hole is too dark and deep, yet it exists.
Quite the opposite, who does risk a saturated and comfortable life
in order to aid for something better, at times is called a hero.
Well i would not go that far here, Mr. Stallman is from or
directly descends from a generation which actually had a quite
good outcome of people who tried to make the white race better.
Unfortunately, without success. :(
Anyhow. There are too many narrow-minded individuals who (due to
whatever shortcoming) are not capable to put things in the actual
context of actual life as it really is (imho).
| * GnuPG has clarified it's not part of GNU
Always has, hasn't it. I look at that for hm a long time, and it
always was like that.
Thank you. And have a nice day.
--steffen
|
|Der Kragenbaer,The moon bear,
|der holt sich munter he cheerfully and one by one
|einen nach dem anderen runter wa.ks himself off
|(By Robert Gernhardt)
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Re: Follow-up on L'Affaire Stallman
On Thu, 8 Apr 2021 11:19, Robert J. Hansen said: > Werner, are you still set on org-mode as the native format, or has > Markdown+Pandoc matured enough to also be acceptable? Yes, pretty please. The FAQ is part of the website which gets automatically build from org-mode. However, if you want to do a complete rewrite, you may start in markdown and I will convert it back then. But please keep the links intact. Thanks for reconsidering to work with us. In fact I have quite some difficulties with the FSF and that started many years ago. There is a reason why some of us maintainers started the https://gnu.tools thing. Shalom-Salam, Werner p.s. I would really like to avoid the RFC-4880bis experience where way to much time was spent on converting a nearly finished draft to whatever markdown dialect is currently en-vogue (some Ruby thing right now). -- Die Gedanken sind frei. Ausnahmen regelt ein Bundesgesetz. signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Gnupg-users mailing list Gnupg-users@gnupg.org http://lists.gnupg.org/mailman/listinfo/gnupg-users
