Re: [List admins] Invitation to test mailing list mirroring and emulation in Wikimedia Space

2019-10-31 Thread masti 

  
  
+1
webbased solutions are not good equivalent to mailing list. The
latter are much more flexible.
So I also would rather see mailing list migration to someting newer
than Mailman 2 than move to a webbased solution

masti

On 29.10.2019 19:27, MA wrote:


  
  Hi,


I feel the same as Risker and think we should
  instead investigate how to upgrade our mailing lists to
  Mailman 3.


Regards, M.
  
  
  
El mar., 29 oct. 2019 18:27,
  Risker  escribió:


  
Hi Quim -


Perhaps it would be helpful if you were to identify
  what types of lists are suitable for mirroring, and what
  happens when they are mirrored, because that is not clear
  from your post.  (And no, I don't want to have to have
  *another* software experience just to ask these
  questions.)


For example:

  
Are all mirrored lists publicly accessible and
  viewable?  Is there a way to control even read-only
  access?

Are private mailing lists suitable for Discourse?
Is everything archived? If so, how, and who controls
  them?

Can archives be modified, and if so, by whom?
How does editing/responding to mailing list posts on
  the Discourse mirror get reflected in the main mailing
  list? 

Can lists have individual guidelines that are
  different from the "common" ones?   

  
  I will note that all of the lists I administer are
*not* public lists, and several are non-archiving.  They
each have different guidelines as to what should and
should not be included and/or discussed on them.  
  
  
  
  Risker/Anne
  

  
  
  
On Tue, 29 Oct 2019 at
  13:02, Quim Gil 
  wrote:


  Hi, I have just published a proposal to
start testing mailing list mirroring and emulation at
the Discourse instance we have at Wikimedia Space.


If you are interested in discussing and exploring
  potential post-Mailman scenarios, join in.
  
  
  Check the proposal at https://discuss-space.wmflabs.org/t/testing-the-path-from-mailing-lists-to-wikimedia-space/1934.
Feedback is welcome there or here.  :)  
  
  
  If you want to propose a mailing list to mirror
or you are personally interested in testing mailing
list emulation, let's talk.
  


-- 

  

  Quim Gil (he/him)
Senior Manager of Community Relations @
Wikimedia Foundation
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Qgil-WMF

  

  

  
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Re: [List admins] Invitation to test mailing list mirroring and emulation in Wikimedia Space

2019-10-31 Thread Luca Martinelli 
Dear all,

I'm not against this decision, in fact I'm in favour and I think it
would be the only possibility for Wikimedia Space to actually work out
in the end.

Given all the problems with personal data that we have, we might need
to decide if some *public* ML wants to be a beta-tester for Space. Who
wants to go forward? :)

L.

Il giorno gio 31 ott 2019 alle ore 11:23 Quim Gil 
ha scritto:
>
> Yes Platonides, your comment (and bd808's at Space) makes me realize that I 
> hadn’t stressed this point, which is completely assumed in this topic.
>
> This proposal is about testing, and a private mailing list with sensitive 
> information wouldn’t be a good candidate for these first tests even if Space 
> would be in production and not in Cloud VPS.
>
> We can still test private mailing list mirroring, for instance taking any 
> public mailing list and mirroring privately to test access control without 
> compromising anything.
>
> We can also test private mailing list emulation by having non-confidential 
> chit chat in a private setting to test access control, again without 
> compromising anything.
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 8:17 AM Platonides  wrote:
>>
>> Hello Quim
>>
>> Given that this is currently implemented on WMCS, I would think that their 
>> terms would prevail and certain private mailing lists NOT allowed be copied 
>> at all there  (for instance a list where checkusers disccussed about vandal 
>> ranges), since it's on an "untrusted" network/servers that shall not contain 
>> such private data. Other private mailing lists may qualify, depending on 
>> what is actually discussed there (e.g. I would see no issue with a signpost 
>> editorial comments mailing list). And obviously, the content of public lists 
>> is simply... public.
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> ___
>> Listadmins mailing list
>> Listadmins@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/listadmins
>>
>> By sending a message to this list, you email all admins of all lists. To 
>> request technical changes for a specific list, instead create a task in 
>> Phabricator. See https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists
>
>
>
> --
> Quim Gil (he/him)
> Senior Manager of Community Relations @ Wikimedia Foundation
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Qgil-WMF
> ___
> Listadmins mailing list
> Listadmins@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/listadmins
>
> By sending a message to this list, you email all admins of all lists. To 
> request technical changes for a specific list, instead create a task in 
> Phabricator. See https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists



-- 
Luca "Sannita" Martinelli
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Sannita

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Re: [List admins] Invitation to test mailing list mirroring and emulation in Wikimedia Space

2019-10-31 Thread Quim Gil 
Yes Platonides, your comment (and bd808's at Space) makes me realize that I
hadn’t stressed this point, which is completely assumed in this topic.

This proposal is about testing, and a private mailing list with sensitive
information wouldn’t be a good candidate for these first tests even if
Space would be in production and not in Cloud VPS.

We can still test private mailing list mirroring, for instance taking any
public mailing list and mirroring privately to test access control without
compromising anything.

We can also test private mailing list emulation by having non-confidential
chit chat in a private setting to test access control, again without
compromising anything.

On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 8:17 AM Platonides  wrote:

> Hello Quim
>
> Given that this is currently implemented on WMCS, I would think that their
> terms would prevail and certain private mailing lists NOT allowed be copied
> at all there  (for instance a list where checkusers disccussed about vandal
> ranges), since it's on an "untrusted" network/servers that shall not
> contain such private data. Other private mailing lists may qualify,
> depending on what is actually discussed there (e.g. I would see no issue
> with a signpost editorial comments mailing list). And obviously, the
> content of public lists is simply... public.
>
> Best regards
>
> ___
> Listadmins mailing list
> Listadmins@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/listadmins
>
> By sending a message to this list, you email all admins of all lists. To
> request technical changes for a specific list, instead create a task in
> Phabricator. See https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists



-- 
Quim Gil (he/him)
Senior Manager of Community Relations @ Wikimedia Foundation
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Qgil-WMF
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Re: [List admins] Invitation to test mailing list mirroring and emulation in Wikimedia Space

2019-10-31 Thread Platonides 
Hello Quim

Given that this is currently implemented on WMCS, I would think that their
terms would prevail and certain private mailing lists NOT allowed be copied
at all there  (for instance a list where checkusers disccussed about vandal
ranges), since it's on an "untrusted" network/servers that shall not
contain such private data. Other private mailing lists may qualify,
depending on what is actually discussed there (e.g. I would see no issue
with a signpost editorial comments mailing list). And obviously, the
content of public lists is simply... public.

Best regards
___
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Listadmins@lists.wikimedia.org
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/listadmins

By sending a message to this list, you email all admins of all lists. To 
request technical changes for a specific list, instead create a task in 
Phabricator. See https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists