Re: [Nut-upsdev] Minutemen UPS Driver

2023-12-17 Thread Manuel Wolfshant via Nut-upsdev 


Just my 2 cents here:

Background: For 20+ years I work in a company specialized in ASIC design in 
verification, having as clients some of the largest semiconductor manufacturers 
you've heard of. Among the chipsets my colleagues worked on are those for USB, 
WiFi, TBolt and even Ethernet that we now depend on in our current activities.

The sad truth is that nowadays the USB chipsets have become extremely complex 
due to the constant addition of features on top of the existing ones, while 
attempting to maintain backward compatibility. And errors are inevitable... 
leaving aside the intended lack of features associated with cost reduction ( 
which is a thing for all chipsets, especially those made from Chinesium and 
dedicated to a single purpose in life ). Add to that firmware errors and plain 
simple corner cutting.

So unfortunately Ted is right. Support for USB in UPSes is what it is and 
except for the (small) efforts made by 2 or maybe 3 major brands, for most of 
the other UPSes usage beyond "it keeps power on for a while when grid goes 
down" depends on a bit of luck. And, obviously, el cheapo units do not have 
serial interfaces. If you need reliability, the first step is going SNMP simply 
because the manufacturers investing in these interfaces tend to have higher 
quality products. If close to 100% reliability is your aim... follow Ted's 
advice and go for a generator with automatic switchover and all the additional 
dances coming with it.


Wolfy who two weeks ago had to unscrew the funnel mounted on the generator's 
tank because the jerrycan got stuck in it.


On December 15, 2023 2:30:39 PM GMT+02:00, Ted Mittelstaedt via Nut-upsdev 
 wrote:
>My personal experience with a number of UPSes that are monitored via USB cable 
>is that communications errors such as the ones referenced in the issue you 
>linked to below are a result of USB hardware incompatibilities between the USB 
>chipset and the USB port on the motherboard.*  This is NOT specific to the NUT 
>project as it affects both apcupsd and in fact, has been reported as an issue 
>with certain Windows systems and UPS brands.
>
>The true reality here is that nobody can rely on a UPS for reliable automated 
>server shutdowns.  If you need true reliability you need a generator on a 
>maintenance contract, and a UPS that gets mandatory battery replacements every 
>3 years and the UPS's purpose is only to carry the server while the generator 
>spins up.
>
>The only thing that monitoring a UPS is good for is REDUCING the frequency of 
>unexpected shutdowns that require an extensive fsck on restart.  In other 
>words - if you aren't willing to pay the money to REPLACE your Minuteman UPS 
>with a model that is better supported, and use serial port monitoring instead 
>of USB monitoring (since serial ports are more likely to not have 
>compatibility issues) then you aren't even in the class to even start 
>demanding you will have reliable shutdowns.  What you are going to get from 
>NUT + your Minuteman UPS is all you can expect - and it's going to be better 
>than a completely unmonitored UPS so take it and be happy with it.  And, hedge 
>your bets by using ext3 mounted with data=journal option, or use zfs and get 
>familiar with what zfs-scrub does and how to use it, and what zpool status 
>does and how to use it to repair a corrupt pool (AKA delete the file that's 
>corrupted) on a battery-backup hardware RAID card.
>
>Ted
>
>* Some people have found the insertion of a cheap USB hub in between the UPS 
>and the motherboard will fix USB communication errors. YMMV
>
>On 12/14/2023 6:12 AM, Charles Lepple via Nut-upsdev wrote:
>> I think the problem is that there were some communication errors, as noted 
>> here: https://github.com/networkupstools/nut/issues/555
>> 
>> I would want to test thoroughly before relying on it for automated shutdowns.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Charles Lepple
>> clepple@gmail
>> 
>>> On Dec 14, 2023, at 8:35 AM, Jim Klimov via Nut-upsdev 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's MinutemAn and such a key word exists in usbhid-ups subdriver 
>>> tripplite-hid :)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Specifically, the "PRO RT 2U" series is among the few mentioned by name:
>>> 
>>> $ git grep -i minuteman
>>> NEWS.adoc:   * add Delta Minuteman UPS VID/PID [PR #1230, issues #555 and 
>>> #1227]
>>> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman */
>>> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:        /* Delta/Minuteman Enterprise Plus 
>>> E1500RM2U */
>>> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:        /* Delta/Minuteman PRO1500RT2U */
>>> 
>>> 
>>>   Oddly, it seems nobody posted it to neither HCL nor DDL so far...
>>> 
>>> Hope this helps,
>>> Jim Klimov
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Dec 14, 2023 at 1:08 PM James Parascand via Nut-upsdev 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I am wondering if there is a way to have Nut Server monitor a
>>> Minutemen UPS.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> https://minutemanups.com/uninterruptible-power-supply/pro-rt2u-line-interactive-uninterruptible-power-supply/
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>>

Re: [Nut-upsdev] Minutemen UPS Driver

2023-12-15 Thread Ted Mittelstaedt via Nut-upsdev 
My personal experience with a number of UPSes that are monitored via USB 
cable is that communications errors such as the ones referenced in the 
issue you linked to below are a result of USB hardware incompatibilities 
between the USB chipset and the USB port on the motherboard.*  This is 
NOT specific to the NUT project as it affects both apcupsd and in fact, 
has been reported as an issue with certain Windows systems and UPS brands.


The true reality here is that nobody can rely on a UPS for reliable 
automated server shutdowns.  If you need true reliability you need a 
generator on a maintenance contract, and a UPS that gets mandatory 
battery replacements every 3 years and the UPS's purpose is only to 
carry the server while the generator spins up.


The only thing that monitoring a UPS is good for is REDUCING the 
frequency of unexpected shutdowns that require an extensive fsck on 
restart.  In other words - if you aren't willing to pay the money to 
REPLACE your Minuteman UPS with a model that is better supported, and 
use serial port monitoring instead of USB monitoring (since serial ports 
are more likely to not have compatibility issues) then you aren't even 
in the class to even start demanding you will have reliable shutdowns.  
What you are going to get from NUT + your Minuteman UPS is all you can 
expect - and it's going to be better than a completely unmonitored UPS 
so take it and be happy with it.  And, hedge your bets by using ext3 
mounted with data=journal option, or use zfs and get familiar with what 
zfs-scrub does and how to use it, and what zpool status does and how to 
use it to repair a corrupt pool (AKA delete the file that's corrupted) 
on a battery-backup hardware RAID card.


Ted

* Some people have found the insertion of a cheap USB hub in between the 
UPS and the motherboard will fix USB communication errors. YMMV


On 12/14/2023 6:12 AM, Charles Lepple via Nut-upsdev wrote:
I think the problem is that there were some communication errors, as 
noted here: https://github.com/networkupstools/nut/issues/555


I would want to test thoroughly before relying on it for automated 
shutdowns.


--
Charles Lepple
clepple@gmail

On Dec 14, 2023, at 8:35 AM, Jim Klimov via Nut-upsdev 
 wrote:


That's MinutemAn and such a key word exists in usbhid-ups subdriver 
tripplite-hid :)



Specifically, the "PRO RT 2U" series is among the few mentioned by name:

$ git grep -i minuteman
NEWS.adoc:   * add Delta Minuteman UPS VID/PID [PR #1230, issues #555 
and #1227]

drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman */
drivers/tripplite-hid.c:        /* Delta/Minuteman Enterprise Plus 
E1500RM2U */

drivers/tripplite-hid.c:        /* Delta/Minuteman PRO1500RT2U */


  Oddly, it seems nobody posted it to neither HCL nor DDL so far...

Hope this helps,
Jim Klimov


On Thu, Dec 14, 2023 at 1:08 PM James Parascand via Nut-upsdev 
 wrote:


I am wondering if there is a way to have Nut Server monitor a
Minutemen UPS.


https://minutemanups.com/uninterruptible-power-supply/pro-rt2u-line-interactive-uninterruptible-power-supply/

Thanks
James
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Re: [Nut-upsdev] Minutemen UPS Driver

2023-12-14 Thread Charles Lepple via Nut-upsdev 
I think the problem is that there were some communication errors, as noted 
here: https://github.com/networkupstools/nut/issues/555

I would want to test thoroughly before relying on it for automated shutdowns.

-- 
Charles Lepple
clepple@gmail

> On Dec 14, 2023, at 8:35 AM, Jim Klimov via Nut-upsdev 
>  wrote:
> 
> That's MinutemAn and such a key word exists in usbhid-ups subdriver 
> tripplite-hid :)
> 
> 
> Specifically, the "PRO RT 2U" series is among the few mentioned by name:
> 
> $ git grep -i minuteman
> NEWS.adoc:   * add Delta Minuteman UPS VID/PID [PR #1230, issues #555 and 
> #1227]
> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman */
> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman Enterprise Plus E1500RM2U 
> */
> drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman PRO1500RT2U */
> 
> 
>   Oddly, it seems nobody posted it to neither HCL nor DDL so far...
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Jim Klimov
> 
> 
> On Thu, Dec 14, 2023 at 1:08 PM James Parascand via Nut-upsdev 
>  > wrote:
>> I am wondering if there is a way to have Nut Server monitor a Minutemen UPS.
>> 
>> https://minutemanups.com/uninterruptible-power-supply/pro-rt2u-line-interactive-uninterruptible-power-supply/
>> 
>> Thanks
>> James
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Re: [Nut-upsdev] Minutemen UPS Driver

2023-12-14 Thread Jim Klimov via Nut-upsdev 
That's MinutemAn and such a key word exists in usbhid-ups subdriver
tripplite-hid :)


Specifically, the "PRO RT 2U" series is among the few mentioned by name:

$ git grep -i minuteman
NEWS.adoc:   * add Delta Minuteman UPS VID/PID [PR #1230, issues #555 and
#1227]
drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman */
drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman Enterprise Plus
E1500RM2U */
drivers/tripplite-hid.c:/* Delta/Minuteman PRO1500RT2U */


  Oddly, it seems nobody posted it to neither HCL nor DDL so far...

Hope this helps,
Jim Klimov


On Thu, Dec 14, 2023 at 1:08 PM James Parascand via Nut-upsdev <
nut-upsdev@alioth-lists.debian.net> wrote:

> I am wondering if there is a way to have Nut Server monitor a Minutemen
> UPS.
>
>
> https://minutemanups.com/uninterruptible-power-supply/pro-rt2u-line-interactive-uninterruptible-power-supply/
>
> Thanks
> James
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[Nut-upsdev] Minutemen UPS Driver

2023-12-14 Thread James Parascand via Nut-upsdev 
I am wondering if there is a way to have Nut Server monitor a Minutemen UPS.

https://minutemanups.com/uninterruptible-power-supply/pro-rt2u-line-interactive-uninterruptible-power-supply/

Thanks
James
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