-Caveat Lector- from: prioryofsion digest 583 http://www.onelist.com The mailing list resource page can be found at the following address http://www.albino.com/circle/pos/ ---- An always interesting list. Om K ----- Message: 5 Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:20:20 +0200 From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Crowley and Gardner (was: Women) Ok, to clarify this subject a bit. (I expressed myself badly before.) Mathers was Crowley's teacher and initiator in his first years in the Golden Dawn (1898 and a couple of years). Later Crowley and Mathers became bitter enemies and he portrayed him (justified?) in a very disgusting way in some of his books (Moonchild and others). Anyway, this was in the beginning of Crowley's career as a magician. His contact with Gardner was much later, in the middle 40s, just before Crowley died. Gardner hired Crowley (at a generous fee), to write the rituals for his new Gardnerian witch-cult. Crowley wrote and when reading the Book of Shadows it only too obvious that it was Crowley who wrote it and there is a lot of word by word phrases from the Book of the Law and other books by Crowley. Of cource Gardner edited the material and added the floggingstuff, but Crowley gave the "spirit" to it. Love is the Law / Daedalus > -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- > Från: Magus Ater [SMTP:xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] > Skickat: xxxxxxxxxxx > Till: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Ämne: Re: [priory-of-sion] Women > > From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx) > > Dxxxxxxxxxxx writes: > > "Gerald Gardner for sure stole or lended much of his material from > Crowley when he re-fired the wicca-momentum. Mathers and the Golden Dawn > was way before that." > > Not so, but contrarywise. Crowley joined the Golden Dawn while Mathers > was its head and ultimately tried to take control of the organization > from him. Much of Crowley's magickal system was based on / extrapolated > from things he learned while in the Golden Dawn. His seminal "Book of > the Law was the result of a working that was based on the magick in the > Abra-Melin the Mage grimoire that Mathers discovered and translated. > The magickal tradition of Crowley could not be more closely intertwined > with Mathers. > > Mxxxxxxxx ===== Message: 10 Date: Fri, 7 May 99 23:53:44 -0700 From: Qxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Emma Calv=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=e9_in__the_GD=3f_=28Was:_Women=29?= Dxxxxxxxxx >Qxxxxxxxx >I would be very happy if you (or someone else) could give me sources to >that information! I knew that >Emma Calvé had some occult friends who mingled with Golden Dawn members, but >not that she was connected any closer than that to the GD. > That Sauniere was connected to the GD in any way is an exciting idea, >but I've never even >heard of that before. RA Wilson wrote in "Everything is under Control" >that Sauniere was >a member of one or more occult groups in Paris. But I have been unable to >verify that either. >It would be great if you could suggest a book where this information is >present. (I thought I >had read most of the English books on the subject). I'm trying to find my source-- which actually said Emma had been initiated in the Paris chapter of either the Golden Dawn or one of it's immediate successors. But just because that book says it doesn't guarantee that it's true, most of the books I read are bosh. Mathers did a lot of scrambling trying to keep his Parisian occult connections afloat. I have some serious prejudices against Mathers -- he changed his supposed sun sign to suit his mood and pretensions-- but his wife Moina apparently channeled most of the real occult stuff and I respect her. I believe Emma had a connection to several initiates-- the bedroom kind of connection. She reminds me of that actress mentioned in the Dumas Club who used her bedside manner to seek entry to the higher mysteries-- Adah Isaacs Menken, who is way too early for our story. It's a real wonder she didn't hook up with Crowley but perhaps she had more aesthetic tastes. She was Langued'oc born and bred by the way and spent a lot of time down south so could have met Sauniere on his own home territory if his trip to Paris is proved an absolute washout-- that, I think I got from either the Templar Revelation or The Tomb of God-- I read the both of them one right after the other and can't keep them straight. Give me a bit of time-- I'm a bit medicated at present and going through a kind of a healing crisis. Qxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxx ----- Aloha, He'Ping, Om, Shalom, Salaam. Em Hotep, Peace Be, Omnia Bona Bonis, All My Relations. Adieu, Adios, Aloha. Amen. Roads End Kris DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ========== CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. 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