On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 09:55:35PM +0200, Magnus Holmgren [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
On Monday 11 June 2007 21:41, Joey Hess wrote:
Alex Queiroz wrote:
On 6/11/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, I hate that convention. K and k should only ever refer to 1024.
Like in kg or
On Monday 11 June 2007 21:21, Joey Hess wrote:
Bastian Venthur wrote:
What I don't believe is your 80 colums argument. Could
you please name a few of the *many* programs which would have to drop
information, precision, or significantly change their display to use the
KiB unit?
iftop,
On Monday 11 June 2007 23:10, Hendrik Sattler wrote:
Abbreviations are ambiguous by design. Who actually says that KB means
kilobyte?
You're arguing that although IEC prefixes eliminate all ambiguity in the area
of amounts and rates of data, there is still some ambiguity left, i.e. IEC
On Monday 11 June 2007 23:56:16 Kevin Mark wrote:
Oddly enough if you had posted this a bit earlyer, one of the US folks
who will attend Debconf (this year in the UK) could have brought it with
them. This would make it easy to directly give it to many folks who are
part of Debian. Although it
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 02:56, Mark Reitblatt wrote:
On 6/11/07, Alex Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Fine. Stick with Kilobytes, but strictly define it as 10^3 bytes. Just
choose one over the other and be consistent.
That's not consistent. Kilobyte has always meant 2^10 bytes. kilo
in
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 08:36:39AM +0200, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
That's an argument that's been heard before but it's *wrong*. SI prefixes
*are* used with non-SI units without losing their normal meaning and there is
no reason why bytes should be an exception. Since kilo has always meant
Hi Thijs!
You wrote:
We are talking about tools like aptitude here, or at least, the OP does.
Did you ever have 2 GB free and decided to install a package that would
exactly fill that space in?
Afaik, we are talking about making the use of the prefixes consistent
over all of Debian, so that
Hi all,
Somebody asked about real world experiences. Ever tried fitting
mixed multiple data to a CD or DVD have to see in byte-size if
things are good or not. Ever downloaded an .iso only to find later it
doesn't fit the CD/DVD by some MiB . How much overburning can be done
by a CD/DVD
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 08:44, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 08:36:39AM +0200, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
That's an argument that's been heard before but it's *wrong*. SI prefixes
*are* used with non-SI units without losing their normal meaning and
there is no reason why
Magnus Holmgren [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
No it doesn't.
The SI binary prefixes are an abomination.
Why - besides pronunciation?
Well among other things, the end result of this whole mess will likely
be to _increase_ confusion, rather than lessen it:
Until now, in a typical computer app,
On Monday 11 June 2007 21:21, Joey Hess wrote:
Bastian Venthur wrote:
I agree with the sounds stupid part, although I don't belive this is a
valid argument.
It's a perfectly valid argument for me to use to ignore a bad standard.
If the standard makes me talk funny, I will ignore it or make
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 03:54:25PM +0900, Miles Bader wrote:
Until now, in a typical computer app, 900K had an unambiguous meaning:
900*1024.
No, its 900 Kelvin aka 626.85°C
Should I say that kb and Mb are kilo bases and mega bases, as in DNA?
Bastian
--
The sight of death frightens them
Le lundi 11 juin 2007 à 19:56 -0500, Mark Reitblatt a écrit :
That's not consistent. Kilobyte has always meant 2^10 bytes.
No, it has never. Kilo has always meant 10^3. Full stop. End of story.
Bye bye. People didn't invent the SI just so that a small group of
hackers decide that suddenly it is
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 09:20:30AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le lundi 11 juin 2007 à 19:56 -0500, Mark Reitblatt a écrit :
That's not consistent. Kilobyte has always meant 2^10 bytes.
No, it has never. Kilo has always meant 10^3. Full stop. End of story.
Bye bye. People didn't invent
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 08:54, Miles Bader wrote:
Magnus Holmgren [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
No it doesn't.
The SI binary prefixes are an abomination.
Why - besides pronunciation?
Well among other things, the end result of this whole mess will likely
be to _increase_ confusion, rather
Miles Bader wrote:
Magnus Holmgren [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
No it doesn't.
The SI binary prefixes are an abomination.
Why - besides pronunciation?
Well among other things, the end result of this whole mess will likely
be to _increase_ confusion, rather than lessen it:
Until now, in a
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 03:29 -0400, Roberto C. Sánchez a écrit :
It has never been anything but a gross imprecision introduced by people
incapable of following rigorous standards.
It has never been anything more than people defaulting to a close
approximation. Language is imperfect.
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 09:36:34AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 03:29 -0400, Roberto C. Sánchez a écrit :
It has never been anything but a gross imprecision introduced by people
incapable of following rigorous standards.
It has never been anything more than
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 03:43 -0400, Roberto C. Sánchez a écrit :
What are you talking about? We all know that the *precise* meaning of
kilo is 1000. The point is that the term was also co-opted, since there
was not a better term. If you are talking about a contract, I would
expect that the
On Mon, 2007-06-11 at 19:56 -0500, Mark Reitblatt wrote:
On 6/11/07, Alex Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Fine. Stick with Kilobytes, but strictly define it as 10^3 bytes. Just
choose one over the other and be consistent.
That's not consistent. Kilobyte has always meant 2^10 bytes. kilo
in
On Thu, 07 Jun 2007, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
Otherwise, the discussions in this thread lead to several interesting
points (listed in the TODO in the repository) which will require some
rewrite and optimization of the format of the symbols file. I'll update
the wiki page and my implementation as
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:37 +0200, Christof Krüger wrote:
Another historic example is a floppy-MB:
A 1.44MB floppy disc can store 1,474,560 Bytes, that is 1440 KiB and
1.40625 MiB or approximately 1475KB or 1.48MB with kilo=10^3 and
mega=10^6.
However, these floppies were known as
On 12/06/07 15:37, Christof Krüger wrote:
Just because something has been done wrong for a long time doesn't make
it right. People who know the inconsistencies get used to them and do
not want to change it because it may be inconvenient for them or it
simply sounds stupid to them (what an
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 07:56:13PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
This assumes that experimental is used by a lot of people, which I
doubt, especially given the default apt pins and the numbers above.
There's also the fact that if you remove experimental it's easy enough
for people to set up their
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 09:24 +0100, Scott James Remnant a écrit :
Changing the unit prefixes is just a geek precision gratification that
will confuse everybody who is used to talking about kilobytes, and
gigabytes...
The confusion lies in the current situation. Bringing precision doesn't
Hi all,
Can somebody tell me how I can file upstream debian bugs from
bug tracker. Case in point
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deluge-torrent/+bug/119995 .
I know this is not the place, so let's take this off-list perhaps or
point to a better resource/mailing list where I can
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 11:40:46AM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Of course, I don't usually care that file sizes in my browser window are
displayed in kibibytes and mebibytes. Not until I select some of them,
see the total size, and ask myself whether they fit on a DVD.
If you want to figure
On 6/12/07, shirish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi all,
Can somebody tell me how I can file upstream debian bugs from
bug tracker. Case in point
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deluge-torrent/+bug/119995 .
I know this is not the place, so let's take this off-list perhaps or
point to
Hello!
Due to the removal of apache1 packages from the pool (including
libapache-mod-perl) quite a lot of packages aren't installable/buildable
anymore due to missing (build-)dependencies. I'm preparing a massbug
filing for those so the maintainers are aware of that their packages are
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 09:53:32AM +0900, Miles Bader wrote:
No one is actually confused.
This standard doesn't actually solve a real problem.
unit confusion can be very serious, eg: the mars orbiter
Regards,
Paddy
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On Tuesday 12 June 2007 08:54, Miles Bader wrote:
Now that a bunch of people are all in a misguided frenzy to correct
things (which weren't broken), there will almost certainly be cases
where some silly fool will change the _calculation_ but not the label
(e.g., in a case where space is at a
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 09:21, Marcus Better [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
José L. Redrejo wrote:
The activities make children practice on clicking, double-clicking, drag
and drop, moving and identify the mouse buttons.
Since children probably learn this by age five or so with or without help,
On Tue June 12 2007 01:20:30 am Josselin Mouette wrote:
kilo in kilobyte is not an SI prefix.
It is not even a prefix.
Kilo is always a SI prefix.
In computing the K stands for kilobyte, not kilo + byte, and a
kilobyte has always been the number of memory locations addressable by
the A0-A9
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:24 +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote:
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:37 +0200, Christof Krüger wrote:
Another historic example is a floppy-MB:
A 1.44MB floppy disc can store 1,474,560 Bytes, that is 1440 KiB and
1.40625 MiB or approximately 1475KB or 1.48MB with
Am Dienstag, den 12.06.2007, 19:57 +1000 schrieb [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
On 6/12/07, shirish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi all,
Can somebody tell me how I can file upstream debian bugs from
bug tracker. Case in point
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deluge-torrent/+bug/119995 .
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 13:01 +0200, Christof Krüger wrote:
Let me give you an example from the real world:
There was a bridge to build over the river Rhine connecting Switzerland
and Germany. You have to know that sea levels are defined differently in
both countries so if you plan to build a
El mar, 12-06-2007 a las 18:26 +1000, Russell Coker
[EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 09:21, Marcus Better [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
José L. Redrejo wrote:
The activities make children practice on clicking, double-clicking, drag
and drop, moving and identify the
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 04:21:58PM +0800, Onno Benschop wrote:
(Ironically, my spell-checker had never heard of a kibibyte :)
Because it's not a correct word.
English linguistic is a descriptive science -- what is correct and what is
not depends on what people use. This stays in stark contrast
* Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2007-06-11 19:56]:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
* developers and most active contributors are pretty much using only
stable or unstable and not testing.
What's your data?
It is well known that 87.9% of the assertions made by Debian developers in
the mailing
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 14:09, Adam Borowski wrote:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 04:21:58PM +0800, Onno Benschop wrote:
(Ironically, my spell-checker had never heard of a kibibyte :)
Because it's not a correct word.
English linguistic is a descriptive science -- what is correct and what is
not
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On 11 Jun 2007, at 9:22 pm, Josselin Mouette wrote:
You seem to strongly believe the cheap desktop hard disk is different
from the server hard disk. This is entirely wrong. Apart from 10k and
15k rpm disks, these are all strictly the same. Only
I demand that Magnus Holmgren may or may not have written...
[snip]
Most of the time you won't have to say it. Spoken language tends to be less
formal than written language, and 2^10 bytes still is approximately a
kilobyte (and so on up to giga, where the approximation starts to fail). So
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007, Tim Cutts wrote:
That's not true, unfortunately. They also have different design
criteria for duty cycles, and more stringent MTBF testing
requirements. There's been a lot of assertion in this thread,
without any real data, so this post provides links to some hard data
On Wednesday 13 June 2007 00:36, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
I get 59 500 hits for kibibyte and 1.5 million hits for kilobyte.
That's about 4%, not 0.3%. In fact, it's sufficiently widespread to
earn a place in dictionaries, IMHO.
It has already happened, see http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A471476
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 02:36:55PM +0200, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
And what version is used is trivial to check. Oh, wait -- in this case not
that trivial, when using the Google test kilobyte is so much over the cap
that you need tricks like searching for kibibite foo and kilobyte foo,
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 13:57 +0100, Darren Salt a écrit :
I demand that Josselin Mouette may or may not have written...
When I use a computer program, I don't want to wonder whether it uses
precise units or approximate ones. A computer is a damn stupid machine
and it will never know
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 14:59 +0200, Adam Borowski a écrit :
I get 59 500 hits for kibibyte and 1.5 million hits for kilobyte.
That's
about 4%, not 0.3%. In fact, it's sufficiently widespread to earn a place
in
dictionaries, IMHO.
That's the cap I mentioned earlier -- most
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 14:57, Darren Salt wrote:
I demand that Josselin Mouette may or may not have written...
[snip]
When I use a computer program, I don't want to wonder whether it uses
precise units or approximate ones. A computer is a damn stupid machine
and it will never know
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 07:56:13PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
This assumes that experimental is used by a lot of people, which I
doubt, especially given the default apt pins and the numbers above.
Le Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:08:20AM +0100, Mark Brown a écrit :
There's also the fact that if you
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 15:36, Adam Borowski wrote:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 02:36:55PM +0200, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 14:09, Adam Borowski wrote:
English linguistic is a descriptive science -- what is correct and what
is not depends on what people use. This stays
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 15:46, Magnus Holmgren wrote:
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 14:57, Darren Salt wrote:
I demand that Josselin Mouette may or may not have written...
[snip]
When I use a computer program, I don't want to wonder whether it uses
precise units or approximate ones. A
Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deluge-torrent/+bug/119995 .
I know this is not the place, so let's take this off-list perhaps or
point to a better resource/mailing list where I can direct that.
Cheers !
If you mean filing a bug
Scott James Remnant [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
This is a strong advocation for using powers of ten everywhere, and
abolishing the use of powers of two multiples altogether, no?
Nothing needs to be abolished but inconsistency. The same good would
be had by *knowing the difference*, and
I do not mean that any bug reported in Ubuntu should be automagically
reported to Debian's BTS. It should be a manual point-an-click
action to be used by Those In Charge in Ubuntu when they decide wisely
that it is Good to report the issue in Debianand *link* both
issues.
In case it's
Darren Salt [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
If I need to disambiguate, I'll say either real kilobyte or
something like marketroids' kilobyte. And as for the next step up,
well, gigabytes is a given, and it's tempting to say giblets...
That's assuming that everyone you converse with is aware of the
On 6/12/07, Adam Borowski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Except, I did not claim that one of the versions is superior. What I stated
was:
1. English is a language where the correct usage is what most people use,
2. kilobyte is preferred over kibibyte by a vast majority of those whose
communicate
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:57:17PM +0900, Charles Plessy wrote:
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 07:56:13PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
This assumes that experimental is used by a lot of people, which I
doubt, especially given the default apt pins and the numbers above.
Le Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:24 +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote:
The difference is a sufficiently small percentage, that most users will
not care.
No, like I said in my earlier post, the error grows quickly. As 1.024^x,
in fact.
x = 1 kibi vs. kilo 2.4%
x = 2 mebi vs. mega
shirish writes (Using standardized SI prefixes):
Please look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_prefix .
Urgh, these things are ugly and an abomination. We should avoid them.
Ian.
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On 06/12/2007 06:24 AM, Ingo Juergensmann wrote:
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 02:46:08PM -0600, Warren Turkal wrote:
I personally have 6 or 7 U320 73GB 10K RPM SCSI drives that I am not using
for
anything interesting. Can anyone tell me if these
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 15:50 +0100, Alex Jones wrote:
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 09:24 +0100, Scott James Remnant wrote:
The difference is a sufficiently small percentage, that most users will
not care.
No, like I said in my earlier post, the error grows quickly. As 1.024^x,
in fact.
x = 1
Pierre Habouzit [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:57:17PM +0900, Charles Plessy wrote:
There's also the fact that if you remove experimental it's easy enough
for people to set up their apt repositories somewhere if they want to
provide packages outside of unstable.
but
Actually bandwidth is mesured in bits per second and no bytes per second
On 6/12/07, Scott James Remnant [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Bandwidth should be quoted in true SI units over a metric of time,
e.g. kilobytes-per-second (e.g. the average UK DSL upload speed is
250kbps ==
On Tue, 2007-06-12 at 16:50 +0100, (``-_-´´) -- Fernando wrote:
Actually bandwidth is mesured in bits per second and no bytes per second
On 6/12/07, Scott James Remnant [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Bandwidth should be quoted in true SI units over a metric of time,
e.g.
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 16:52, Ian Jackson wrote:
shirish writes (Using standardized SI prefixes):
Please look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_prefix .
Urgh, these things are ugly and an abomination. We should avoid them.
Purely emotional arguments. I think it's to a big extent
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 05:49:18PM -0600, Wesley J. Landaker wrote:
Well, in SI units, KB never means kilobyte, and is not ambiguous at all;
it's a kelvin??bel.
Nope. kelvin is a unit, not a prefix. K as a prefix means kilo, so KB
is kilo bell. You better have small values or you are
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 04:20:42AM +0100, Alex Jones wrote:
Then why bastardise an SI prefix? This surely serves only to confuse
people. Why don't we invent a new word? Should we call it the
thousandbyte?
Because computer people have always bastardised everything. Booting,
window, mouse, etc.
Le mardi 12 juin 2007 à 12:19 -0400, Lennart Sorensen a écrit :
Nope. kelvin is a unit, not a prefix. K as a prefix means kilo, so KB
is kilo bell.
Prefixes are case-sensitive. Kilo is k. (This is also why there is
much less ambiguity with K used for kibibytes.)
--
.''`.
: :' : We are
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 06:25:22PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Prefixes are case-sensitive. Kilo is k. (This is also why there is
much less ambiguity with K used for kibibytes.)
Hmm, I used to think both k and K were accepted for kilo, but I can't
find anything that says K is accepted for
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Sorry, i forgot CUT it looks like a 0 proposal since it came first.
How and when do you plan to start a team for that and have you
considered who from other teams will need to join/agree on the idea?
I don't necessarily start a team for every proposal I make. :-)
I'm
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Let me outline the 'testing' pros and cons from my point of view:
cons
-
* testing metric is too simple, packages are allowed to enter testing
only after a certain period of time has passed no matter if much
people tested it before that and just when they don't
Josselin Mouette wrote:
The question is not whether to use powers of 2 or 10 (different software
use both), but rather to use the good prefixes depending on that
choice.
It sounds like you've surveyed a lot of software in Debian and found
some that uses 2 and some 10 for data storage
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 05:19:45AM +, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 02:32:35PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
On Mon, Jun 11, 2007 at 10:15:25PM +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote:
Le lundi 11 juin 2007 à 15:25 -0400, Joey Hess a écrit :
You seem to fancy the
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Paul Cager [EMAIL PROTECTED]
* Package name: plexus-i18n
Version : 1.0-beta-6
Upstream Author : Plexus Developers
* URL : http://plexus.codehaus.org
* License : Apache
Programming Lang: Java
Description : Plexus
2007/6/12, Josselin Mouette [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Sure, this is why googling for for returns 7 billion entries.
billion = 10^9 or
billion = 10^6 * 10^6 (IIRC, as used in Portugal - no jokes here!)
further argument to use powers, not words to define multiples.
P.S.: I googled 'for' ~7*10^9
On 6/12/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Sorry, i forgot CUT it looks like a 0 proposal since it came first.
How and when do you plan to start a team for that and have you
considered who from other teams will need to join/agree on the idea?
I don't necessarily
Hi Luk,
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
(...)
* Switch unstable (release) for not automatic updates
They are only automatic as far as the Release Team wants them to be as
explained earlier...
I'm not writing about automatic transition from unstable to
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 02:57:51PM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote:
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007, Tim Cutts wrote:
That's not true, unfortunately. They also have different design
criteria for duty cycles, and more stringent MTBF testing
requirements. There's been a lot of assertion in this thread,
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:29:59AM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
Considering that we know that experimental is not a full branch and
there's no migration from experimental to unstable, do you agree then
we could remove experimental and switch unstable automatic nature to
not automatic (release)
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007 15:42:08 -0300 Paulo Marcondes wrote:
billion = 10^6 * 10^6 (IIRC, as used in Portugal - no jokes here!)
=10^12 :)
and Germany, France, former UdSSR, insert your country here
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On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 09:25:13PM +, Evgeni Golov [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007 15:42:08 -0300 Paulo Marcondes wrote:
billion = 10^6 * 10^6 (IIRC, as used in Portugal - no jokes here!)
=10^12 :)
and Germany, France, former UdSSR, insert your country here
Anywhere
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Do you think that the numbers are positive in terms of testing usage,
really? I see the numbers even if not that reliable as proof of my
argument that just a few (almost half if compared with unstable) bug
reporters are actually using testing.
Not better numbers, but
On 6/12/07, Wouter Verhelst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:29:59AM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
Considering that we know that experimental is not a full branch and
there's no migration from experimental to unstable, do you agree then
we could remove experimental and
Em Ter, 2007-06-12 às 16:19 +0200, Christian Perrier escreveu:
Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deluge-torrent/+bug/119995 .
I know this is not the place, so let's take this off-list perhaps or
point to a better resource/mailing list
On 6/12/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Do you think that the numbers are positive in terms of testing usage,
really? I see the numbers even if not that reliable as proof of my
argument that just a few (almost half if compared with unstable) bug
reporters are
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 21:40, Gustavo Franco wrote:
* What effect do you think removing experimental will have on
unstable? * How do you think it will have that effect?
I think it will have a positive effect if we add 'NotAutomatic: yes'
into unstable release file.
Are you also willing
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 21:51, Gustavo Franco wrote:
I don't get it, as you also realized: unstable _is_ experimental.
No, it most certainly is *not*, and any developers who treat it as such
should be drawn and quartered.
pgpvlthFzQSRb.pgp
Description: PGP signature
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 04:40:54PM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Wouter Verhelst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 10:29:59AM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
Considering that we know that experimental is not a full branch and
there's no migration from experimental to
Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Do you think that the numbers are positive in terms of testing usage,
really? I see the numbers even if not that reliable as proof of my
argument that just a few (almost half if compared with unstable)
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Do you think that the numbers are positive in terms of testing usage,
really? I see the numbers even if not that reliable as proof of my
argument that
Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
I don't get it at all why removing experimental would bring us
anything but a
more experimental unstable...
Sure, a more
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Hi Luk,
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
(...)
* Switch unstable (release) for not automatic updates
They are only automatic as far as the Release Team wants them to be as
Gustavo Franco wrote:
Hi Luk,
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Gustavo Franco wrote:
(...)
* Switch unstable (release) for not automatic updates
They are only automatic as far as the Release Team wants them to be as
explained earlier...
I'm not writing about automatic
On 6/12/07, Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tuesday 12 June 2007 21:40, Gustavo Franco wrote:
* What effect do you think removing experimental will have on
unstable? * How do you think it will have that effect?
I think it will have a positive effect if we add 'NotAutomatic: yes'
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 05:32:21PM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
On 6/12/07, Luk Claes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
NO!
unstable is meant for packages that should be in the next stable
release, as such only packages that are in the maintainer's opinion
ready to migrate to testing should be
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007 at 05:25:59PM -0300, Gustavo Franco wrote:
Promote 'quite probably broken in some ways' stuff isn't the motto.
Upload everything that we've in experimental actually seems to be more
appropriate.
Eh, you lost, now. Please go read what experimental is for.
I don't think I
On 12/06/07 at 22:23 +0200, Luk Claes wrote:
NO!
unstable is meant for packages that should be in the next stable release,
as such only packages that are in the maintainer's opinion ready to migrate
to testing should be uploaded to unstable.
Then shouldn't we have a more aggressive policy
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
I tried to give a meaningful answer to that in
[EMAIL PROTECTED], but received no reply; I guess
it got drowned in the silly all disks are reliable! noise.
Perhaps you may want to read the three final paragraphs there and give
your opinion.
Well,
Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
On 12/06/07 at 22:23 +0200, Luk Claes wrote:
NO!
unstable is meant for packages that should be in the next stable release,
as such only packages that are in the maintainer's opinion ready to migrate
to testing should be uploaded to unstable.
Then shouldn't we have
On Tue, Jun 12, 2007, Luk Claes wrote:
Making unstable not automatic would
mean less testing of individual versions in unstable AFAICS which is a bad
thing IMHO.
I wonder whether it would make sense to suggest default pinning levels
in Release files to
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