On Sun, May 11, 2014 at 11:12:08AM +1000, Brian May wrote:
What about the task of running a short program for a brief duration, e.g.
from cron scripts? Is using su considered acceptable?
e.g. /etc/cron.daily/spamassassin on wheezy has numerous references to su.
There are two reasons
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 07:01:14PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
Dependency-based boot, the change to /bin/sh, and UUID-based mounting were
all not drop-in replacements by that criteria.
Note that also none of them were forced on existing installations. The change
of /bin/sh to dash (which is
El Mon, 12 de May 2014 a las 10:53 PM, Brian May
br...@microcomaustralia.com.au escribió:
On 13 May 2014 15:44, Cameron Norman camerontnor...@gmail.com wrote:
I found another use of su that may need to be added to your list.
rabbitmq (oddly) wraps itself up in a shell script,
On 13 May 2014 16:15, Cameron Norman camerontnor...@gmail.com wrote:
It looks like it already does this. I assume the user running the command
manually would not hurt anything, correct?
I think the user running the command manually would have the same problems.
Especially as it is a daemon.
Hi!
On Mon, 2014-05-12 at 22:50:39 -0700, Noah Meyerhans wrote:
There are two reasons I use su in /etc/cron.daily/spamassassin. One is
to change uid/gid, and the other is to reset the shell environment to a
base state. The need for this was highlighted in bug 738951. I doubt
that this is a
On Tue, 13 May 2014 12:13:21 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 12:56:34AM +0200, Lubomir Rintel wrote:
* Package name: libdatabase-dumptruck
Version : 1.2
Upstream Author : Lubomir Rintel lkund...@v3.sk
* URL :
Hi,
Kevin Chadwick:
previously on this list Matthias Urlichs contributed:
I haven't yet seen a system where booting with init=/bin/bash works but
booting systemd in emergency mode does not.
Have you added me to a killfile?
* Am I under some sort of obligation to read each and every
Hi,
Steve Langasek:
As the maintainer of the pam package in Debian, I assure you: this is a bug
in dirmngr. System services should not (must not) call interfaces that
launch pam sessions as part of their init scripts. su is one of those
interfaces.
How difficult would it be, for the sake
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 07:47:06PM +0100, Gianfranco Costamagna wrote:
cppcheck [1] has been removed from testing [2] because of a sourceless
javascript file [3].
Indeed, sourceless files in the source is bad.
Because of this I packaged (with patch and thanks from Octavio) a new dfsg
On Mon, 12 May 2014, Noah Meyerhans wrote:
On Sun, May 11, 2014 at 11:12:08AM +1000, Brian May wrote:
What about the task of running a short program for a brief duration, e.g.
from cron scripts? Is using su considered acceptable?
I thought s-s-d is for starting dæmons, not for things
On Mon, 12 May 2014, James Cloos wrote:
Note that you cannot just strip colour profiles from image containers.
Doing so changes the output.
You'd have to replace the profile with a Free equivilent. Or, if no
free equivilent is available, edit the image to match a Free profile.
Can you
Hi,
Carlos Alberto Lopez Perez:
[...] they don't want you to have the option of NOT using their stuff.
http://www.landley.net/notes.html#23-04-2014
IMHO this is a gross mis-characterization.
A whole lot more correct IMHO would be the idea that their developer time
is best spent fixing the
Hi,
Bas Wijnen:
Sounds like those packages should conflict with each other. It isn't a reason
to uninstall anything.
If you've used aptitude for any length of time, its affinity towards
uninstalling half of your system in favor of *any* other way to resolve
a conflict should not be
Hi,
Cameron Norman:
Is it not possible to tell if the sysvinit or upstart packages were
installed manually, and give a prompt then (in addition to something like
you described) ?
In theory, yes you could discover whether a package was installed explicity
or has been pulled in as a
Il Martedì 13 Maggio 2014 11:19, Guus Sliepen g...@debian.org ha scritto:
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 07:47:06PM +0100, Gianfranco Costamagna wrote:
cppcheck [1] has been removed from testing [2] because of a sourceless
javascript file [3].
Indeed, sourceless files in the source is
Hi,
Le 13/05/2014 05:34, Thorsten Glaser a écrit :
On Mon, 12 May 2014, James Cloos wrote:
Note that you cannot just strip colour profiles from image containers.
Doing so changes the output.
You'd have to replace the profile with a Free equivilent. Or, if no
free equivilent is
Le lundi 12 mai 2014 à 11:42 -0700, Steve Langasek a écrit :
As far as GDM is concerned, any bug reported with systemd-shim installed
will be ignored. The bug script should probably be updated to that
effect, BTW.
A better solution would be for you to step down as maintainer, since you
On Tue, 13 May 2014 11:31:19 +0200
Matthias Urlichs matth...@urlichs.de wrote:
Hi,
Cameron Norman:
Is it not possible to tell if the sysvinit or upstart packages were
installed manually, and give a prompt then (in addition to
something like you described) ?
In theory, yes you could
Quoting David Prévot (2014-05-13 12:00:40)
Le 13/05/2014 05:34, Thorsten Glaser a écrit :
Also, where is a Free profile? ISTR that PDF/{A,X} creation requires
a profile too; I’ve used one that came as example somewhere
currently.
The icc-profiles-free package is in main.
ghostscript also
With gcc-4.9 now available in testing, it is time to prepare for the change of
the default to 4.9, for a subset of architectures or for all (release)
architectures. The defaults for the gdc, gccgo, gcj and gnat frontends already
point to 4.9 and are used on all architectures. Issue #746805
On Sun, 11 May 2014 22:34:47 -0700, Steve Langasek vor...@debian.org
wrote:
On Sun, May 11, 2014 at 09:10:21AM +0200, Marc Haber wrote:
The plain fact:
Using systemd breaks something that worked for probably a decade or longer
before however long that su is in that init script. So on what
On Mon, 12 May 2014 19:01:14 -0700, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org
wrote:
Dependency-based boot, the change to /bin/sh, and UUID-based mounting were
all not drop-in replacements by that criteria.
The update to the first Debian stable release running systemd will
most probably be the most painful
On Mon, 12 May 2014 13:58:31 +0200, Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org
wrote:
Le lundi 12 mai 2014 à 12:16 +0200, Andrew Shadura a écrit :
As far as GDM is concerned, any bug reported with systemd-shim installed
will be ignored. The bug script should probably be updated to that
effect, BTW.
On Mon, 12 May 2014 13:35:15 +0200, Tollef Fog Heen tfh...@err.no
wrote:
On 12 May 2014 11:54, Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org wrote:
Systemd is the default init system for jessie, and it should be listed
as the first alternative. The fact that an alternative codepath exists
for users with
On Tue, 13 May 2014 11:44:13 +0200, Matthias Urlichs
matth...@urlichs.de wrote:
It's also demonstrably false. Otherwise systemd would not be compatible
with existing SysV init scripts (to the point that I can run them manually
and, if they happen to load the LSB stuff, they transparently redirect
2014-05-13 15:01 GMT+02:00 Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de:
On Mon, 12 May 2014 13:58:31 +0200, Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org
wrote:
Le lundi 12 mai 2014 à 12:16 +0200, Andrew Shadura a écrit :
As far as GDM is concerned, any bug reported with systemd-shim installed
will be
On Mon, 12 May 2014 21:16:49 +0200, Bas Wijnen wij...@debian.org
wrote:
I, as a user, did not expect to be moved over to systemd, and given the
discussions about it and the older TC decisions about network manager getting
its dependencies right (to stop forcing all of gnome onto the user's
Le mardi 13 mai 2014 à 15:01 +0200, Marc Haber a écrit :
This sort of behavior is precisely why many users are migrating away
from Debian.
You are entitled to think that users make decisions on the alleged
behavior of people they never heard of.
My opinion is that many users are migrating
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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On 05/13/2014 05:44 AM, Matthias Urlichs wrote:
Hi,
Carlos Alberto Lopez Perez:
[...] they don't want you to have the option of NOT using their
stuff. http://www.landley.net/notes.html#23-04-2014
IMHO this is a gross
On Tue, 13 May 2014, Josselin Mouette wrote:
My opinion is that many users are migrating away from Debian because we
are unable to make decisions on important technical topics and leave
them with 3 different setups, none of which actually work, instead of
providing one that is correctly
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: ChangZhuo Chen (陳昌倬) czc...@gmail.com
* Package name: gcin-voice
Version : 0~20140513-1
Upstream Author : Edward Der-Hua Liu
* URL : http://hyperrate.com/thread.php?tid=30325#30325
* License : GPL-3 or LGPL-3
Le 13 mai 2014 03:01, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org a =C3=A9crit :
Am 13.05.2014 02:54, schrieb Russ Allbery:
Yeah, that's just what I was thinking. Any software that doesn't
honor an invoke-rc.d policy is RC-buggy anyway, and it would be good
to catch and fix that.
Could you also open a
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 8:56 PM, Matthias Klose d...@debian.org wrote:
With gcc-4.9 now available in testing, it is time to prepare for the change of
the default to 4.9, for a subset of architectures or for all (release)
architectures. The defaults for the gdc, gccgo, gcj and gnat frontends
❦ 13 mai 2014 15:01 +0200, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de :
Thank you so much for volunteering to contribute to GNOME packaging and
to make it work on configurations nobody will actually ever use.
We are eagerly waiting for your patches.
This sort of behavior is precisely why many
On Mon, May 12, 2014 at 07:01:14PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
Dependency-based boot, the change to /bin/sh, and UUID-based mounting
were all not drop-in replacements by that criteria.
Note that also none of them were forced on existing installations. The
change of /bin/sh to dash (which is
How difficult would it be, for the sake of compatibility if nothing
else, to teach su not to create a new PAM session when it doesn't
already run within one?
You don't want to do that in general since that defeats the primary
purpose of su: creating a new session as a different user.
It's
Am 13.05.2014 17:44, schrieb Yunqiang Su:
Do you plan make 4.9 the only version of gcc in jessie?
This first depends on building the kernel, both linux and kfreebsd, and eglibc
using gcc-4.9.
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Matthias Urlichs matth...@urlichs.de wrote:
In theory, yes you could discover whether a package was installed
explicity or has been pulled in as a dependency.
In practice, however, a normal Debian installation marks each and
every package as being installed explicitly.
? huh ? This has
On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:10 AM, Matthias Klose d...@debian.org wrote:
Am 13.05.2014 17:44, schrieb Yunqiang Su:
Do you plan make 4.9 the only version of gcc in jessie?
This first depends on building the kernel, both linux and kfreebsd, and eglibc
using gcc-4.9.
I tried build eglibc with
Hi,
since the discussion goes back and forth on this blog-post, I thought I
throw in the actual answer of lennart poettering to it:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/+LennartPoetteringTheOneAndOnly/posts/aSYnf3wNf8h
And this is pretty much all of my contribution to it, it just annoyed
me, that no one
The update to the first Debian stable release running systemd will most
probably be the most painful update Debian has ever had since switching
to glibc (which was well before I started using Linux).
I highly doubt it.
We would be wise to make the last non-systemd release an LTS one so that
On Mon, 12 May 2014, Tollef Fog Heen wrote:
]] Andrew Shadura
This sort of behaviour is precisely why so many people not only
dislike systemd, but also it's maintainers.
Are you aware that Joss isn't a systemd maintainer? (He's one of the
GNOME maintainers.)
There’s not really a line
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Benjamin Drung benjamin.dr...@profitbricks.com
* Package name: django-sortedm2m (binaries: python-sortedm2m,
python3-sortedm2m, and python-sortedm2m-data)
Version : 0.7.0
Upstream Author : Gregor Müllegger gre...@muellegger.de
* URL
Apologies for the last few mangled messages with bad attributions or
character sets. Emacs 24 didn't like its header and body separator
overridden (it thought my separator was a continuation line of a previous
header), which caused subtle problems with mail sending until I figured
out what was
Le 13 mai 2014 17:42, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org a écrit :
Le 13 mai 2014 03:01, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org a =C3=A9crit :
Am 13.05.2014 02:54, schrieb Russ Allbery:
Yeah, that's just what I was thinking. Any software that doesn't
honor an invoke-rc.d policy is RC-buggy anyway,
Thorsten Glaser t...@mirbsd.org writes:
On Mon, 12 May 2014, Tollef Fog Heen wrote:
Are you aware that Joss isn't a systemd maintainer? (He's one of the
GNOME maintainers.)
There’s not really a line between them, you know. (But it was nice to
have a published list of those people who maybe
Hi,
Le 13/05/2014 17:36, Russ Allbery a écrit :
Right, which I've been arguing for already in this thread. I don't think
we should force this on upgrades. There should be a prompt and an
opportunity to not change init systems.
Instead of or in addition to such prompting, I expect this
On Tue, May 13, 2014 18:03, Russ Allbery wrote:
The update to the first Debian stable release running systemd will most
probably be the most painful update Debian has ever had since switching
to glibc (which was well before I started using Linux).
I highly doubt it.
We would be wise to
* Thorsten Glaser (t...@mirbsd.org) wrote:
(But it was
nice to have a published list of those people who maybe could
accidentally be hit by a tactical small-bus…)
These comments are not necessary nor appropriate, ever.
Thanks,
Stephen
signature.asc
Description:
On Tue, 13 May 2014, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
(But it was nice to have a published list of those people who maybe
could accidentally be hit by a tactical small-bus…)
This is absolutely inappropriate and has no place on a Debian mailing
list or anywhere else. Please retract this statement.
--
Thibaut Paumard thib...@debian.org (2014-05-13):
Le 13/05/2014 17:36, Russ Allbery a écrit :
Right, which I've been arguing for already in this thread. I don't think
we should force this on upgrades. There should be a prompt and an
opportunity to not change init systems.
Instead of or
Didier 'OdyX' Raboud dixit:
Le mardi, 13 mai 2014, 16.25:31 Thorsten Glaser a écrit :
On Mon, 12 May 2014, Tollef Fog Heen wrote:
Are you aware that Joss isn't a systemd maintainer? (He's one of
the GNOME maintainers.)
There’s not really a line between them, you know. (But it was
On
Cyril Brulebois dixit:
The sad thing is: almost nobody reads the release notes.
Many people run testing or unstable, so there are no “release”s
to have notes for, either… (but yes, even those who run stable
don’t).
bye,
//mirabilos
--
“When udev happened I wrote mdev.”
-- Rob Landley
Thijs Kinkhorst dixit:
On Tue, May 13, 2014 18:03, Russ Allbery wrote:
You're aware, right, that my primary background is with enterprise use,
and I've been doing large-site systems administration for twenty years?
systemd is a godsend with basically no downside for our enterprise use
[…]
I
Thorsten Glaser t...@mirbsd.org (2014-05-13):
(But it was nice to have a published list of those people who maybe
could accidentally be hit by a tactical small-bus…)
That's absolutely shocking and intolerable.
KiBi.
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Description: Digital signature
Thorsten Glaser t...@mirbsd.de writes:
Yes, there were issues with e.g. grub1 to grub2, but do you honestly
think that sysadmins in a medium-sized company will cope with these?
• no /etc/init.d/$foo (to tabcomplete, no less!) any more
I've been telling people to stop using this for years.
On Tuesday 13 May 2014 11:06:10 Russ Allbery wrote:
Thorsten Glaser t...@mirbsd.de writes:
Yes, there were issues with e.g. grub1 to grub2, but do you honestly
think that sysadmins in a medium-sized company will cope with these?
• no /etc/init.d/$foo (to tabcomplete, no less!) any more
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 07:42:32PM +0100, David Goodenough wrote:
The big shame with service is that tab completion does not work properly.
If I use /etc/init.d/ then tab tells me what is there and spells it right.
Sounds like maybe you need a better shell.
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On Tue, 2014-05-13 at 19:42 +0100, David Goodenough wrote:
On Tuesday 13 May 2014 11:06:10 Russ Allbery wrote:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
The big shame with service is that tab completion does not work properly.
In
In data martedì 13 maggio 2014 19:42:32, David Goodenough ha scritto:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
The big shame with service is that tab completion does not work properly.
If I use /etc/init.d/ then tab tells me
Am 13.05.2014 20:42, schrieb David Goodenough:
On Tuesday 13 May 2014 11:06:10 Russ Allbery wrote:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
The big shame with service is that tab completion does not work properly.
If I use
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 07:42:32PM +0100, David Goodenough wrote:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
The big shame with service is that tab completion does not work properly.
If I use /etc/init.d/ then tab tells me what is
Op dinsdag 13 mei 2014 19:36:35 schreef Thorsten Glaser:
Thijs Kinkhorst dixit:
I could not agree more. In our enterprise environment, I have no
expectation at all that systemd will cause us significant trouble on
upgrades. Our troubles have centered things like grub1 to grub2 or,
Yes,
* Russ Allbery r...@debian.org [140513 18:21]:
We would be wise to make the last non-systemd release an LTS one so that
enterprise users can stay on that release until the systems these
installations run are retired.
You're aware, right, that my primary background is with enterprise use,
Le 13/05/2014 19:38, Thorsten Glaser a écrit :
Cyril Brulebois dixit:
The sad thing is: almost nobody reads the release notes.
Many people run testing or unstable, so there are no “release”s
to have notes for, either… (but yes, even those who run stable
don’t).
People who run testing or
Russ Allbery dixit:
• no /etc/init.d/$foo (to tabcomplete, no less!) any more
I've been telling people to stop using this for years. You should stop
using this too, regardless of what init system you're using, since it
doesn't sanitize environment variables. You leak all kinds of crap from
Thibaut Paumard dixit:
People who run testing or unstable should be prepared to deal with
occasional breakages.
With occasional *temporary* breakages, such as packages disappearing
(in testing) or needing to be set on “hold” temporarily, yes.
With the init system suddenly be swapped out under
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 08:23:55PM +, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
It doesn’t work on lenny, and (unless service /etc/init.d/foo is
allowed) does not tabcomplete well (in all scenarios).
On Tue, 13 May 2014 18:57:03 +0200, Thijs Kinkhorst wrote:
I could not agree more. In our enterprise environment, I have no
expectation at all that systemd will cause us significant trouble on
upgrades. Our troubles have centered things like grub1 to grub2 or,
indeed, new PHP and Perl
Steve Langasek dixit:
On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 08:23:55PM +, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
It doesn’t work on lenny, and (unless service /etc/init.d/foo is
allowed) does not tabcomplete well
On Tuesday 13 May 2014 21:09:14 Salvo Tomaselli wrote:
In data martedì 13 maggio 2014 19:42:32, David Goodenough ha scritto:
service foo action works across Linux distributions, with or without
systemd, and does the right thing.
The big shame with service is that tab completion does
Le mardi 13 mai 2014 à 22:46 +0100, David Goodenough a écrit :
Does bash-completion work when the command is sudo not service?
Yes.
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: :' :
`. `'
`-
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Am 13.05.2014 23:46, schrieb David Goodenough:
Does bash-completion work when the command is sudo not service? Never seems
to for me. I never log in as root, I always do root things using sudo.
Sure, works fine.
--
Why is it that all of the instruments seeking intelligent life in the
gregor herrmann wrote...
Which kind of problems did you see with new Perl versions (I could
imagine incompatible old third-party software), and is there
something the Debian perl maintainers and/or the Debian Perl Group
can do to improve the situation?
At first I was about to say those who
Hi All!
Emailing this to save systemd folks NFS grief...
NOTE: This all needs to be actioned for Jessie release
Also Note this fixes bugs #748074 (rpcbind) and #622394 (nfs-common)
We don't need a socket activated rpcbind, but using socket activation
for NFS RPC daemons using upstream systemd
On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 6:33 AM, Christoph Biedl wrote:
In 5.18, upstream decided to discourage usage of smart matches and
given..when after these have existed since 5.10 (or: more than six
years) by marking them as experimental, and did this in a very harsh
way. This will drive me away from
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Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 02:15:27 +0200
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Binary: gcc-4.9-base libgcc1 libgcc1-dbg libgcc2 libgcc2-dbg libgcc-4.9-dev
libgcc4 libgcc4-dbg lib64gcc1 lib64gcc1-dbg lib64gcc-4.9-dev lib32gcc1
lib32gcc1-dbg lib32gcc-4.9-dev
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Format: 1.8
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2014 17:40:18 +0200
Source: grfcodec
Binary: grfcodec
Architecture: source amd64
Version: 6.0.4-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Matthijs Kooijman matth...@stdin.nl
Changed-By: Matthijs Kooijman
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Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 18:58:45 +0200
Source: openttd
Binary: openttd openttd-dbg openttd-data
Architecture: source amd64 all
Version: 1.4.0-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Matthijs Kooijman matth...@stdin.nl
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Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 15:08:57 +0200
Source: openttd-opengfx
Binary: openttd-opengfx
Architecture: source all
Version: 0.5.1-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Matthijs Kooijman matth...@stdin.nl
Changed-By: Matthijs
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Date: Sun, 11 May 2014 10:33:02 +0200
Source: nml
Binary: nml
Architecture: source all
Version: 0.3.1-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Matthijs Kooijman matth...@stdin.nl
Changed-By: Matthijs Kooijman matth...@stdin.nl
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Date: Mon, 12 May 2014 23:53:26 +0100
Source: perl
Binary: perl-base libcgi-fast-perl perl-doc perl-debug libperl5.18 libperl-dev
perl-modules perl
Architecture: source all i386
Version: 5.18.2-4
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
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Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:17:37 +0400
Source: tcludp
Binary: tcl-udp
Architecture: source amd64
Version: 1.0.10-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Sergei Golovan sgolo...@debian.org
Changed-By: Sergei Golovan
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Format: 1.8
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 11:44:23 +0300
Source: status-4-evar
Binary: xul-ext-status4evar
Architecture: source all
Version: 2014.05.03.06-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Mozilla Extension Maintainers
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Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 10:29:41 +0200
Source: wcslib
Binary: libwcs4 wcslib-dev wcslib-doc wcslib-tools
Architecture: source amd64 all
Version: 4.23-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Debian Astronomy Maintainers
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Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 01:33:30 -0700
Source: intel-gpu-tools
Binary: intel-gpu-tools
Architecture: source amd64
Version: 1.6-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian X Strike Force debia...@lists.debian.org
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Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 10:25:38 +0200
Source: libonig
Binary: libonig2 libonig2-dbg libonig-dev
Architecture: source amd64
Version: 5.9.5-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Jörg Frings-Fürst deb...@jff-webhosting.net
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