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On Sat, Feb 17, 2018 at 6:07 AM, Sean Whitton wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 16 2018, Michael Meskes wrote:
>> If we were to package applications as containers (not necessarily
>> docker-style!) we could and should have different rules for
>> those
>
> Yes, I think that Debian should eventually be
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Dear Raju,
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 09:18:06PM +0530, Raju Devidas wrote:
> Hello Kumar,
>
> I took a look at your repository on salsa.
> Before taking a look at your repository I have also taken a look at some
> other repositories on github which had steps for
> supporting Ubuntu on the RDP.
>
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On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 11:11 PM, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> What do you think? Do you have other ideas? Are there other persons
> who are annoyed by the current situation?
I think we should keep software that doesn't meet our standards
outside of Debian. There are plenty of ways to deploy such
Michael Meskes dijo [Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 10:07:06PM +0100]:
> > Is was a relevant part of the problem mentioned in Raphaels bug
> > report: Minified JS libraries without source code. this was one
> > of the starting points of this discussion. (#890598)
>
> Right, although merely technical since
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* Package name: golang-github-valyala-fasthttp
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On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 10:01:53PM +0100, Michael Meskes wrote:
True, that's why I think we should look for a different solutions.
There are different solutions, but the result isn't debian, it's
something else with a different set of expectations.
Mike Stone
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Hello Michael,
On Fri, Feb 16 2018, Michael Meskes wrote:
>> We cannot feasibly provide security updates when there is more than
>> one version of the library in the archive. We do not, and probably
>> never will have, the required manpower.
>>
>> This applies to the nixos/guix solutions too --
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* Package name: golang-gopkg-warnings.v0
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Programming
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> > Who said we cannot properly maintain this stuff? And where do you
> > think our expected level of quality (whatever that is) will not be
> > reached?
>
> In this thread, at least Raphaël and myself.
>
> And, I guess, many others (say, OwnCloud was already brought up to
> this thread).
As I
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> Depends how it would be done. Nixos style would probably very
> difficult for Debian. Packages with version number in their
> name would be no packaging problem at all, but we would have
> to make clear, that security support is not likely.
Sure, I don't see a problem with this.
> >
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Changed-By: Gregor
> stuff is packaged. The current "build everything from live git"
> paradigm
> just doesn't work well for a package-based distributon with a multi-
> year
True, that's why I think we should look for a different solutions.
Michael
--
Michael Meskes
Michael at Fam-Meskes dot De, Michael at
> As a sysadmin, I know I can trust that most of my system is OK if I
> just apt update / apt upgrade every so often. And I know the maybe
> five to ten software packages I have hand-installed. I know I must be
> aware of their alerts and whatnot.
Personally I'm afraid that a lot of sysadmins
Michael Meskes dijo [Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 06:12:04PM +0100]:
> > No, I think it's better if people know they're on their own for maintaining
> > something. What's surely worse is when we ship stuff that we know we can't
> > properly maintain in the long term. Better to be out of the archive than
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 01:59:55PM -0600, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
While I agree with you, just the number of node-.* (1249) or libjs-.*
(398) packages (which tend to fall within this fast-paced development
culture) makes me shiver... Who will maintain them at different
compatibility levels? Even more
On 2018-02-16 20:41, Michael Meskes wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 08:21:19PM +0100, W. Martin Borgert wrote:
> > But it's probably too much work, preparing infrastructure etc.
>
> Why?
Depends how it would be done. Nixos style would probably very
difficult for Debian. Packages with version
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 06:12:04PM +0100, Michael Meskes wrote:
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 11:12:51AM -0500, Michael Stone wrote:
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 04:58:04PM +0100, Michael Meskes wrote:
> I know that this does create some problems for us, e.g. on the security
> side, but the alternative
Michael Meskes dijo [Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 04:58:04PM +0100]:
> Can't we treat a .deb file like a container in the sense that it may
> include additional source if needed? I'd very much like this.
>
> I know that this does create some problems for us, e.g. on the security
> side, but the
W. Martin Borgert dijo [Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 06:59:21PM +0100]:
> If I understand Samuels idea correctly, he likes to have multiple
> versions of the same (JavaScript) library installed on Debian.
> Not "stuff", but proper Debian packages, with all bells and whistles.
> Only that you don't remove
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 07:26:35PM +0100, Innocent De Marchi wrote:
> I believe that the right way is to
> convince developers of the need to generate applications that respect
> the principles of free code.
Note that we don't want "applications that respect the principles of free
code", we
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 08:21:19PM +0100, W. Martin Borgert wrote:
This is true. We would have to be clear, that security support
would have to be limited to one (the latest?) version. This is
still a difference to some arbitrary compressed js files with no
source code, no copyright information
Raphael Hertzog dijo [Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 04:11:29PM +0100]:
> Hello everybody,
>
> the fact that I had to request the removal of dolibarr from Debian makes
> me sad (see below for the reasons) and I believe that we should be able
> to do better to provide complex applications to our end users.
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 08:21:19PM +0100, W. Martin Borgert wrote:
> This is true. We would have to be clear, that security support
> would have to be limited to one (the latest?) version. This is
> still a difference to some arbitrary compressed js files with no
> source code, no copyright
> We cannot feasibly provide security updates when there is more than one
> version of the library in the archive. We do not, and probably never
> will have, the required manpower.
>
> This applies to the nixos/guix solutions too -- we cannot expect our
> security team to go around backporting
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On 2018-02-16 11:51, Sean Whitton wrote:
> We cannot feasibly provide security updates when there is more than one
> version of the library in the archive. We do not, and probably never
> will have, the required manpower.
>
> This applies to the nixos/guix solutions too -- we cannot expect our
>
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W. Martin Borgert, on ven. 16 févr. 2018 18:59:21 +0100, wrote:
> If I understand Samuels idea correctly, he likes to
I don't.
I'm just saying what I'm noticing, not what I like.
> This is very much a web application problem. Other software is
> less affected in my experience.
Sure. But the
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Hello Michael,
On Fri, Feb 16 2018, Michael Meskes wrote:
> Who said we cannot properly maintain this stuff? And where do you
> think our expected level of quality (whatever that is) will not be
> reached?
We cannot feasibly provide security updates when there is more than one
version of the
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Description :
Hi Raphael
On 16/02/2018 17:11, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> Dolibarr is not alone:
>
> - while gitlab is packaged in Debian, its packaging took years and the
> result is brittle because it can break in many ways whenever one the
> dozens of dependencies gets updated to some new upstream
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Hello everybody,
>
> I'm sure we are missing lots of good applications due to our
> requirements. What can we do to avoid this?
>
Is it a goal of Debian to accumulate applications? It is a priority to
offer a robust and solid system: Other Debian derivatives accept
relaxations: I think Debian
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Le vendredi 16 février 2018 à 16:11 +0100, Raphael Hertzog a écrit :
> Hello everybody,
>
> the fact that I had to request the removal of dolibarr from Debian
> makes
> me sad (see below for the reasons) and I believe that we should be
> able
> to do better to provide complex applications to our
Recently on Planet: https://apebox.org/wordpress/linux/1229
--
WBR, wRAR
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Description: PGP signature
Quoting Holger Levsen :
I very much disagree that Debian is loosing relevance, like many software
projects Debian usage is still growing. and other projects grow as well.
I agree.
you can use their package managers, and thus these features, on Debian
today. there's
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Changed-By: Thorsten Glaser
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On Fri, 16 Feb 2018 14:10:30 +0100, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Fri, 19 Jan 2018, Jeremy Bicha wrote:
>> 3. If a team manages to get a lists.debian.org address, it's
>> recommended that they switch the Maintainer fields in their packages
>> from the Alioth list address to that address,
Holger Levsen, on ven. 16 févr. 2018 17:25:06 +, wrote:
> > Or we could try to embrace the multiple-library-versions-in-the-same-root
> > issue like distributions such as NixOS and Guix do.
>
> you can use their package managers, and thus these features, on Debian
> today. there's also
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On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 04:34:39PM +0100, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> Well, strictly speaking Debian does not actually need to be involved
> then, applications are already doing that. But it's indeed a sign that
> Debian is losing relevance, which is concerning and Debian could have to
> do something
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 18:03:43 +0100
Source: golang-robfig-config
Binary: golang-github-robfig-config-dev
Architecture: source
Version: 0.0~git20141208-4
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: pkg-go
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:39:36 +0100
Source: python-fuse
Binary: python-fuse
Architecture: source
Version: 2:0.2.1-16
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Sebastien Delafond
Changed-By: Sebastien Delafond
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Hash: SHA512
Format: 1.8
Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:56:29 +0100
Source: python-h2
Binary: python-h2 python3-h2
Architecture: source
Version: 3.0.1-3
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Sebastien Delafond
Changed-By: Sebastien
On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 11:12:51AM -0500, Michael Stone wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 04:58:04PM +0100, Michael Meskes wrote:
> > I know that this does create some problems for us, e.g. on the security
> > side, but the alternative is, as you mentioned, manually installed
> > software and that
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:55:22 +0100
Source: thunar
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Architecture: source
Version: 1.6.14-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Xfce Maintainers
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:48:17 +
Source: ryu
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Version: 4.21+dfsg1-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian OpenStack
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:51:26 +0100
Source: golang-github-go-openapi-spec
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Architecture: source
Version: 1:0.0~git20160808.0.6aced65-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:53:49 +0100
Source: golang-github-jaytaylor-html2text
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Architecture: source
Version: 0.0~git20170918.0.0ee88d3-4
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: QA
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:49:04 +0100
Source: golang-github-go-openapi-loads
Binary: golang-github-go-openapi-loads-dev
Architecture: source
Version: 0.0~git20160704.0.18441df-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 09:58:46 +0100
Source: golang-github-go-macaron-i18n
Binary: golang-github-go-macaron-i18n-dev
Architecture: source
Version: 0.0~git20160612.0.ef57533-6
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: QA Group
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:23:41 +0100
Source: python-libtmux
Binary: python-libtmux python3-libtmux
Architecture: source
Version: 0.7.7-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Sebastien Delafond
Changed-By:
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:18:27 +0100
Source: tmuxp
Binary: tmuxp python-tmuxp python3-tmuxp
Architecture: source
Version: 1.3.5-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Sebastien Delafond
Changed-By:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:14:03 +
Source: glib-networking
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Architecture: source
Version: 2.55.90-1
Distribution: experimental
Urgency:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:08:47 +0100
Source: exo
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Architecture: source
Version: 0.12.0-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 17:02:25 +0100
Source: aptly
Binary: aptly
Architecture: source
Version: 1.2.0-3
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Sebastien Delafond
Changed-By: Sebastien Delafond
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Format: 1.8
Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:42:50 +0100
Source: xrdp
Binary: xrdp xorgxrdp xrdp-pulseaudio-installer
Architecture: source amd64
Version: 0.9.5-2
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Debian Remote Maintainers
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Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 16:41:12 +0100
Source: python-astropy
Binary: python-astropy
Architecture: source
Version: 2.0.4-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Debian Astronomy Maintainers
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