Hi, Martin,
One last tidbit, if you still cannot see what I am talking about and
perhaps other things I am not saying that you might think I am saying,
let me show you what the originator of this thread is saying in a
quote:
If I can quote the original, Martin, that is all I have to say on this
Or, another quote from BaTien which notably leaves out STRUTS:
4) If we want to combine Jsf as view controller, Spring IoC and
commons-chain CoR, a practical infrastructure may be something like
followings:
a) Jsf as a view controller takes care of objects directly related
to User Interface
On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 17:20:08 -0800, Dakota Jack wrote:
How is JSF not OT with struts-dev or struts-user? Struts is not
dead yet, is it? And, if not, why is struts airtime free to JSF?
Integration with JSF has been on the Struts roadmap for at least a year. We
have a Struts-JSF taglib that is
On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 23:48:52 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi, Martin,
I don't think I said a thing about struts-chain. Why would you think
I thought something I never mentioned and ignore what I did say?
You replied to a message that asked a question about struts-chain. If
By the way, for the benefit of our developer community, i just read an
article Creating a Pet Store Application with JavaServer Faces,
Spring, and Hibernate
http://www.sys-con.com/story/?storyid=46977DE=1 that demonstrates the
readiness of involved technologies. I like to add 2 things to
Ted Husted wrote:
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:29:06 -0700, BaTien Duong wrote:
This is a showcase of open sources :-)
Are we talking about the next-generation of DB Group's PSI package?
Is this a framework that you will be able to share with the community, or will
the code remain in-house?
How is JSF not OT with struts-dev or struts-user? Struts is not dead
yet, is it? And, if not, why is struts airtime free to JSF?
Jack
On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 18:24:25 -0500, Deadman, Hal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
By the way, for the benefit of our developer community, i just read an
article
On Tue, 14 Dec 2004, Dakota Jack wrote:
How is JSF not OT with struts-dev or struts-user? Struts is not dead
yet, is it? And, if not, why is struts airtime free to JSF?
You don't consider a question about STRUTS-chain - a component in the
Struts sandbox - to be relevant to Struts?
--
Martin
Hi, Martin,
I don't think I said a thing about struts-chain. Why would you think
I thought something I never mentioned and ignore what I did say?
What you suggest I said is patently stupid. So, I have to admit I
don't think that. No one would think that. That would be perfect
straw man, if
Ted Husted wrote:
Is your implementation of Agility something you could share with us, BaTien?
-Ted.
Absolutely and hope some fruits may come out of this discussion.
Intention:
Expose some of my experience in using Jsf + Tiles + CoR agility + Spring
IoC to construct required infrastructure for
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:29:06 -0700, BaTien Duong wrote:
This is a showcase of open sources :-)
Are we talking about the next-generation of DB Group's PSI package?
Is this a framework that you will be able to share with the community, or will
the code remain in-house?
-Ted.
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 22:29:35 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Thanks, Craig. I think there might be a misunderstanding. See within.
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 18:32:06 -0800, Craig McClanahan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:36:09 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL
-Original Message-
From: Craig McClanahan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 29 November 2004 01:55
To: Struts Developers List; Dakota Jack
Subject: Re: Think Tank Thread on IoC, CoR, and HaD (hot arse deploy)
[was Re: Chain enhancement idea]
On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 15:36:27 -0800
Developers List
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Think Tank Thread on IoC, CoR, and HaD (hot arse deploy)
[was Re: Chain enhancement idea]
Here is code, as opposed to pretty pictures -- LOL ;-)
This is intended to demonstrate how simple Had is in contrast to
normal Service Locator
-Original Message-
From: BaTien Duong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
==
Craig McClanahan wrote:
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 14:20:02 -0600, Joe Germuska
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I need to have a hook into processValidate() on validation failure.
Currently that can only be
6:16
To: 'Struts Developers List'
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Think Tank Thread on IoC, CoR, and HaD (hot arse deploy)
[was Re: Chain enhancement idea]
I think I got a book at home in the attic that went into so-called
``Hot Deployment'' in great detail. (Been a year since I last
looked
At 3:31 PM + 11/30/04, Pilgrim, Peter wrote:
The theory is to compose
your own request processor, but has anyone got a working
example of such a beastie (yet)?
Well, I'm not sure what you mean, but I have a production app which
includes eight locally developed commands interspersed among the
Peter, Thanks for your view. I have made a good working prototype sice
the first email. Interested persons can see my updates below:
Pilgrim, Peter wrote:
-Original Message-
From: BaTien Duong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Greetings and request expert advice:
Commons-chain invented
Thanks for the information, Peter. A couple of comments within. To
think ahead to the next couple of submissions, I know about Halloway,
and based most of what I have done so far on his thinking.
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 11:04:58 -, Pilgrim, Peter
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hence WebLogic
Hi, Paul,
Sorry to disappoint you, but thanks for stopping in to say you are not
interested. LOL Seriously, this is a think tank thread not a
completed idea which is being ballyhooed thread. If you know a better
way than is being presented, please step up. I have not seen this
conversation
Thanks again. More useful information, Craig. I am trying to figure
out a good way to do a Registry.java class without messing up garbage
collection. I was hoping to use finalize() to keep track outside of
the garbage collection loop of live classes, but have discovered, I
think, that only
I'm putting a cap on my work here for the moment. I would be
interested if anyone has some ideas, directions, etc. they could offer
on the Registry issues. I would like to thank everyone, even Paul
;-), for their assistance on this thread. I need to do some homework
and then will be back on
Is your implementation of Agility something you could share with us, BaTien?
-Ted.
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 12:23:39 -0700, BaTien Duong wrote:
Here is how based on my working prototype:
Using commons-chain Agility, i build a request/response framework
for communicating and specialized processing
Here is code, as opposed to pretty pictures -- LOL ;-)
This is intended to demonstrate how simple Had is in contrast to
normal Service Locator or Inversion of Control (Dependency Injection)
frameworks. Remember, THIS IS ALL THE CODE. There are no
NanoContainers. Not XML. No Config classes,
If I'm reading the code right, your factory for any given class has
to know a bunch of nitty gritty details in order to implement the
transferState() method, right? So, whenever I add new state
information to the application class, I have to update transferState()
as well?
I don't see any
Thanks for this thoughtful response, Craig. Very helpful. Notes are within:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 09:02:04 -0800, Craig McClanahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
If I'm reading the code right, your factory for any given class has
to know a bunch of nitty gritty details in order to implement the
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 15:04:48 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Thanks for this thoughtful response, Craig. Very helpful. Notes are within:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 09:02:04 -0800, Craig McClanahan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
If I'm reading the code right, your factory for any given
Just a few notes and more later after some thought:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:01:43 -0800, Craig McClanahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 15:04:48 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yup! Dang! LOL Nothing is free, is it? I have changed the factory
transfer state
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:36:09 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I am not sure what you mean by transparently swap. IoC requires
fairly extensive configuration for this transparency. I don't see
what is transparent about the IoC setting of an implementation at all.
Am I missing
Thanks, Craig. I think there might be a misunderstanding. See within.
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 18:32:06 -0800, Craig McClanahan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:36:09 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I am not sure what you mean by transparently swap. IoC requires
Just a lurker; I'm trying to follow along but I still don't get it.
Dakota Jack wrote:
You can tell me to use create on demand instead, but then I don't
need anything fancier than an IoC framework that lets me reconfigure
on the fly.
And, current IoC approaches provide me other important
Hi, Don,
I'm thinking out loud here.
I have been chewing on this because I am in a mode where I have to
think about where to put my energies the next few years. So, I might
as well jump in here and see what people think. At least I know
enough to listen.
I like what Vic was saying about CoR
On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 15:36:27 -0800, Dakota Jack [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
With hot deploy, instead of switching the implementation and the name
of the implementation class, e.g. ColonSeparatedMovieFinder for
DatabaseMovieFinder, you just have an implementation called
Craig McClanahan wrote:
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 14:20:02 -0600, Joe Germuska [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I need to have a hook into processValidate() on validation failure.
Currently that can only be done by copy-and-pasting the processValidate()
method from RequestProcessor into a subclass and
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 11:03:23 -0700, BaTien Duong
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
3) CoR is finer grain than IoC in the construction and rounting of
services within and between software layers, while IoC is aprropriate at
the application level.
I don't think of these as mutually exclusive.
Not you personally BaTien, I don't understand why some people seem to
confuse Inversion of Control (IoC) and Chain of Responsibility (CoR),
and worse, think they are somehow solving the same problem. IoC helps
us create components by managing their lifecycle and providing their
dependencies.
Without disagreeing with anything you have said, Don, I think the
confusion is caused in part by the fact that CoR is anticipated in
part for its pluggable nature. In this respect, there is a real
connection in functionality between CoR and IoC that is not as
attenuated as the one between HashMap
I look at technology as solutions to problems. IoC solves the problem
of how can I define and configure a component external to the component
and calling code, and CoR tackles the problem of a how can I define a
process or sequence of processes in a pluggable manner.
True, both patterns have
Craig McClanahan wrote:
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 11:03:23 -0700, BaTien Duong
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
3) CoR is finer grain than IoC in the construction and rounting of
services within and between software layers, while IoC is aprropriate at
the application level.
I don't think of these
Don Brown wrote:
I look at technology as solutions to problems. IoC solves the problem
of how can I define and configure a component external to the
component and calling code, and CoR tackles the problem of a how can I
define a process or sequence of processes in a pluggable manner.
True,
Well put, Sir. I think this about does it. I would advocate not
only the CoR coding now being done but also an eventual IoC using all
three types of injection for the major components in Struts. This
would be, I think, the cat's meow, or the tree's bark. /// ;-)
Jack
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004
How would plugins work with the chain configuration?
I've written ActionServlet/RequestProcessor extensions and plugins in
the past. Often, the reason is to inject custom pre-, actual, or
post-processing at specific steps. An example would Tiles, which IIRC
intercepts the forward processing to
At 11:26 AM -0600 11/23/04, Hubert Rabago wrote:
How would plugins work with the chain configuration?
I've written ActionServlet/RequestProcessor extensions and plugins in
the past. Often, the reason is to inject custom pre-, actual, or
post-processing at specific steps. An example would Tiles,
Inline.
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:42:37 -0600, Joe Germuska [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
At 11:26 AM -0600 11/23/04, Hubert Rabago wrote:
It would be nice if plugins can inject chain elements at specific
points in the chain at startup, programatically. This way, plugins
can be programmed to modify
At 11:58 AM -0600 11/23/04, Hubert Rabago wrote:
Specific apps would be able to do this, but I was trying to think from
the perspective of a plugin developer. I haven't looked at an example
yet, but would the use of tiles require both a struts-config change to
activate the plugin, as well as a
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:26:16 -0600, Hubert Rabago [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
How would plugins work with the chain configuration?
I've written ActionServlet/RequestProcessor extensions and plugins in
the past. Often, the reason is to inject custom pre-, actual, or
post-processing at specific
Joe Germuska [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
into an action-chain and view-chain, but maybe it should be more
finely grained?
Hubert Rabago [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The extreme case I have in mind would be one chain for each step that
the current request processor does. Yes, I know, it's extreme.
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 14:20:02 -0600, Joe Germuska [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I need to have a hook into processValidate() on validation failure.
Currently that can only be done by copy-and-pasting the processValidate()
method from RequestProcessor into a subclass and sticking a hook into the
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