Re: importing splits

[Matt Graham]

The easiest way would be saving  the spreadsheet to .csv format and importing 
that to Gnucash.

Id recommend:
- first removing any other text and stuff you have so that the spreadsheet is 
just the headings you want and the data you want in columns
- doing the import on a new test gnucash file first if you have a lot of data 
already in your gnucash book. Just in case.

Good luck!

Thanks and regards,
Matt


 Original message 
From: Jeff Abrahamson 
Date: 21/2/18 05:00 (GMT+10:00)
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: importing splits

I'm processing check deposits.  I have a spreadsheet with lovely columns
like name, check number, amount, and the account to debit.  It seems a
shame to retype it all.

I see some old discussion on the list that, essentially, says this is
not well supported if supported at all.


https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.gnucash.org%2Fpipermail%2Fgnucash-user%2F2014-October%2F056617.html=02%7C01%7C%7C78035f813c42409f0bb008d5788bde6b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636547464489079590=uG5aM8vQ0%2FJ6JvudouGDUL%2F%2BJaLVQvq%2FOQcX93gD%2BaA%3D=0

Is there anything since that might help?  I'm not sure converting
spreadsheets to QIF to then import into gnucash is better than retyping.

--

Jeff Abrahamson
+33 6 24 40 01 57
+44 7920 594 255

https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fp27.eu%2Fjeff%2F=02%7C01%7C%7C78035f813c42409f0bb008d5788bde6b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636547464489079590=Y%2FRcHTU8yWdltXDL4zBTAMPN8grAsKCwY7mf%2FQfmhyw%3D=0

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RE: Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

[Matt Graham]

Actually – better idea:
Can the digest produce a hyperlink at the end of each topic that is titled 
“Reply to this thread”. The hyperlink would be a standard “mailto:” hyper link 
that sets up an email to this user thread with the subject line of the thread. 
Would make it extremely easy to reply to a digest (and harder to do it wrong!).

Should be possible making the link address 
‘mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org?subject=Previous subject string’. Just don’t 
know if it is possible with mailman.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Matt Graham<mailto:matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 14 February 2018 8:44 AM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: RE: Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

No worries Liz,

I was thinking how off-putting it must be for a new user receiving messages 
from other users saying “Don’t post like that!!!”

My next idea would be for the server to automatically change the subject line 
to ‘ “Question from “ + User Name’ whenever someone replies straight to a 
digest.

Happy for no change though – just means we’ll probably still keep getting 
people replying to the digests like this. Ultimately, it isn’t a big issue, and 
if there is no easy way to fix it, we can just work with it.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Liz<mailto:ed...@billiau.net>
Sent: Tuesday, 13 February 2018 5:49 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Re: Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

On Sun, 11 Feb 2018 05:29:13 +
Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Probably stupid question – is there a way to set rules on the
> gnucash-user account?
>
> Ie anytime someone sends an email that starts with “Re gnucash-user
> Digest”, the system rejects their email with a response along the
> lines of “Please do not reply to the digest without changing the
> subject line. Start a new email with the subject line the same as the
> topic you wish to respond to.”
>
> Thanks and regards,
>
> Matt

I'm not aware of a place to put such an option.
I wouldn't like to get such an email if I was a new user with a
question related to a topic on the digest, and I'm not in favour of
making such a change.

Liz
Moderator
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RE: Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

[Matt Graham]

No worries Liz,

I was thinking how off-putting it must be for a new user receiving messages 
from other users saying “Don’t post like that!!!”

My next idea would be for the server to automatically change the subject line 
to ‘ “Question from “ + User Name’ whenever someone replies straight to a 
digest.

Happy for no change though – just means we’ll probably still keep getting 
people replying to the digests like this. Ultimately, it isn’t a big issue, and 
if there is no easy way to fix it, we can just work with it.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Liz<mailto:ed...@billiau.net>
Sent: Tuesday, 13 February 2018 5:49 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Re: Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

On Sun, 11 Feb 2018 05:29:13 +
Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Probably stupid question – is there a way to set rules on the
> gnucash-user account?
>
> Ie anytime someone sends an email that starts with “Re gnucash-user
> Digest”, the system rejects their email with a response along the
> lines of “Please do not reply to the digest without changing the
> subject line. Start a new email with the subject line the same as the
> topic you wish to respond to.”
>
> Thanks and regards,
>
> Matt

I'm not aware of a place to put such an option.
I wouldn't like to get such an email if I was a new user with a
question related to a topic on the digest, and I'm not in favour of
making such a change.

Liz
Moderator
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RE: inventory management examples or links

[Matt Graham]

https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Inventory_Handling

This issue must have come up before. The wiki could ideally use some discussion 
about separation of inventory and accounting systems. I imagine for a small 
business that just wants to keep track of a few things they would want them 
both integrated (but then later realise that they really need them separate – 
unless GNUcash wants to branch into both worlds).

I didn’t find anything in the tutorials and concepts guide under the business 
features – but unless Gnucash is going to get an “inventory” capability, that’s 
probably okay.

Adrien – do you have time to put your example on the wiki of how to integrate 
inventory systems with GNUcash’s accounting?

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Adrien Monteleone
Sent: Tuesday, 13 February 2018 10:11 PM
To: Bert Heijne
Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: inventory management examples or links

Bert,

I posted some more replies in the original thread containing various inventory 
related transaction examples and suggested accounts.

Let me know if you need anything specific that isn’t covered and I’ll see what 
I can do.

Really, these are just basic accounting entries for a retail business that you 
can find in any standard accounting text book, or online.

There’s nothing special about them with regards to Gnucash.

Regards,
Adrien

> On Feb 12, 2018, at 6:25 AM, Bert Heijne  wrote:
>
> Hello All.
>
> This is a nice treat about Inventory but are there some “real examples”  or “ 
> putting it all together”  of gnucash for Inventory or stock of goods 
> management?
> And how this is covered with the invoice.
> I now that gnu cash is not build for that but small stock would be nice
> Woocommerce webshop is in construction so this will be covered mostly by WC.
>
> Would be nice to see some real samples in gnucash to study.
> Any links or G search links  would be nice
>
> Gr. Bert
>
> Verzonden met Windows Mail
>
> Van: Robert Heller
> Verzonden: ‎zondag‎ ‎11‎ ‎februari‎ ‎2018 ‎17‎:‎15
> Aan: stepbystepf...@dialup4less.com
> CC: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
>
> At Sun, 11 Feb 2018 10:55:58 -0500 stepbystepf...@dialup4less.com wrote:
>
>>
>> On 2/11/2018 9:03 AM, Robert Heller wrote:
>>> At Sun, 11 Feb 2018 08:15:56 +0100 Jeff Abrahamson  wrote:
>>> ... transfer
>>> "money" from the vegetable account to a bank account (income when you sell
>>> vegetables) and when you transfer money from a bank account to the vegetable
>>> account (an expense when you buy vegetables). *I* do this which my inventory
>>> of thumb drives. GnuCash does not have "inventory" accounts or any way of
>>> dealing with inventory as such
>> Inventory MANAGEMENT is something else (gnucash lacks this but that
>> belongs in an inventory system*, not "general ledger".
>
> Yes, I understand.
>
>>
>> But you are saying that gnucash does not support inventory value and
>> cost accounting and that is simply not so.
>
> Only in the sense of not specificly labeling things as "inventory value and
> cost accounting". You are right, one can use gnucash to "manage" inventory
> value and cost accounting. From the point of a newbie, there isn't a specific
> menu of things relating to inventory value and cost accounting, so there is
> the *appearence* of a of lack of support for inventory. My intent was to point
> the OP in "right direction", one that is not obvious. Inventory value and cost
> accounting is handled in GnuCash under "other names" -- it is a matter of
> understanding that inventory is really a kind of asset (that is bought and
> sold) and can (should) be treated as such, at which point all of pieces fall
> into place. The OP wanted to treat his inventory as income or expense and that
> what was confusing (to him).
>
>>
>> Let's say incidental to its main activity an organization sells various
>> things (tee shirts, coffee mugs, etc.) as a fund raiser. You create
>> under Assets (after "current assets" and "fixed assets") a parent
>> "Inventory of goods". Under that might be accounts (more likely also
>> parents as batches of goods might have different basis) for "tee
>> shirts", "coffee mugs", etc. When the organization buys a new batch of
>> tee shirts that is a debit to "tee shirts" (or as I mentioned, perhaps
>> "tee shirts batch 4" --- the account description can include what the
>> unit price was for this batch) and a credit to checking << note: we get
>> confused using the supposedly more user friendly terms worrying about
>> what sort of "transfer" this is). Each sale of a tee shirt not only
>> debits cash and credits "sale of tee shirts" for the sale price but also
>> debits "cost of goods sold" and credits the inventory account "tee
>> shirts batch N" for the unit cost of batch N << going to be a 

Users replying to digest rather than starting a new thread

[Matt Graham]

Probably stupid question – is there a way to set rules on the gnucash-user 
account?

Ie anytime someone sends an email that starts with “Re gnucash-user Digest”, 
the system rejects their email with a response along the lines of “Please do 
not reply to the digest without changing the subject line. Start a new email 
with the subject line the same as the topic you wish to respond to.”

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Geert Janssens
Sent: Saturday, 10 February 2018 11:59 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 179, Issue 34

Op zaterdag 10 februari 2018 13:30:36 CET schreef Adonay Felipe Nogueira:
> I once *heard* that GNU Mailman version 3 has forum-like interface but
> with proper mailing list integration. We are using GNU Mailman, but not
> the last version, and I don't know why. I know little about the
> internals of GnuCash project's infrastructure because I'm just a user.

Mailman 3 in combination with Hyperkitty would indeed provide the combined
functionality.

The problem is both are missing from Fedora repositories. I have asked about
this and the answer was they are not stable enough. Not a good base to build a
user facing platform on yet.

I'm still hoping it will materialize one day, though I'm no longer holding my
breath on that...

Geert


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The Wiki, and documentation

[Matt Graham]

Thanks Dave (And sorry – I knew I forget at least one of the regular mailing 
list people... Should have just said that you all rock ☹ )

Anyway – your comments make a good point regarding the never ending push to try 
to keep it all up to date. I know that the Tut and concepts guide and manual 
are done within xml DocBook. Does anyone know of any way to have one source of 
all information that the system can then produce the wiki pages, manual and 
tut/concepts guide? They are all different forms of information, but just 
wondering whether, for example, “GNUCash Windows Installation” could have one 
file that has tags or something for the different information in the different 
areas (so the “how to” section gets automatically pulled to the manual, the 
detailed tutorial and cool stuff to do gets pulsed into the concepts, and the 
detailed discussions and troubleshooting gets shunted to the wiki). Hopefully 
you could also define some “FAQ” questions for any of the topics that are 
automatically pulled to that page.

Maybe I’m just overthinking it... I have a habit of doing that.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: David T.<mailto:sunfis...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, 9 February 2018 4:27 PM
To: Matt Graham<mailto:matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>
Cc: Adrien Monteleone<mailto:adrien.montele...@gmail.com>; 
gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Re: Cash Flow View

Matt,

The wiki can always use help, so thank you! I think your approach makes sense. 
I will note that there already is a set of installation pages, and it may be 
most useful simply to move the relevant questions and answers to them. I 
suspect that there are similar overlaps in other areas of the FAQ. In each 
case, I would hope that you would keep a general question in the FAQ along with 
a reference to the appropriate dedicated wiki page. But by all means, move 
content to more specific pages wherever possible!

One major challenge in all the GnuCash documentation (the wiki, the website, 
and the Help and Guide) is making sure that the information is up to date, 
accurate, and still relevant. While it may be interesting to refer to technical 
accounting discussions from the lists in 2005, are the discussions still 
useful, and should readers need to know about them? I would hope that as you 
move things around, some of the more dated entries could be removed or placed 
in a different context to reflect their time-dated nature.

Generally, I think that information that addresses problems for versions that 
are no longer officially supported should either be deleted or archived in a 
special GnuCash salt mine, so that current users of the software aren’t 
worrying whether they need to manage their dbus daemons or not.

David

> On Feb 9, 2018, at 9:03 AM, Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> G’day All,
>
> I was thinking about what Adrien said in a past email: “Many questions lately 
> seem to be asked a bit too quickly.”. I agree – I sometimes wonder whether 
> people do a simple google before asking.
>
> Still, when I tried to go onto the GNUCash FAQ wiki to find the answer and 
> send it to someone, I found it really hard to find it (but it was there when 
> I searched the page). Due to the huge amount of ‘questions’ on there, It is 
> very difficult to quickly scan down to find stuff you are interested in.
>
> I have edited the page to take the actual questions out of the table of 
> contents – so hopefully people can more easily find their answer through 
> browsing their area (eg the “Using the Business Features” area if they are 
> wondering about how to do invoice stuff). Devs/experts, feel free to revert 
> it back if you don’t like it.
> I fiddled with “mw-collapsable” to get an expandable table of contents, but 
> couldn’t get it working well.
>
> To further improve it all, I’m considering trying to establish more wiki 
> pages to take a lot of the questions off the FAQ. Eg all the installation 
> questions would probably be better placed on wiki pages, with the FAQ just 
> having entries “Installing on Windows”, “Installing on Mac” and “Installing 
> on Linux” to link users to the right wiki page
>
> Anyone got any other ideas to make it easier for people to find the answers 
> without taking up Adrien/John/Geert/Mike’s time? (you all rock, by the way)
>
> Thanks and regards,
>
> Matt
>
> From: Adrien Monteleone<mailto:adrien.montele...@gmail.com>
> Sent: Thursday, 8 February 2018 6:29 AM
> To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
> Subject: Re: Cash Flow View
>
> I second Mike’s comments generally.
>
> What would probably address most concerns in this regard is a default 
> multi-column report that included the basics—Income Statement, Balance Sheet, 
> and perhaps Income/Expense graphs. This would b

Re: New Entities

[Matt Graham]

The only other thing to add - this all presumes that you need separation. 
Probably do for your businesses (tax and legal reasons - I have no idea), but 
don't forget that GNUCash reports are very flexible - you choose the accounts 
you want included.

I don't use the business features though - I'm not sure whether they would be 
as flexible.

You could have two different root accounts for each business (each with their 
own assets, expenses, liabilities, and income sub accounts) and go from there.

I'm sure I just gave a few accountants on this list a heart attack...

Ultimately, as others have said, opening different files for each business is 
probably a better way to go.

David/Adrian/John - is opening multiple windows a feature we should be putting 
into bugzilla for eventual incorporation? I'm getting the impression that V3.0 
onwards will be much easier to fix up stuff like this.

Thanks and regards,
Matt


 Original message 
From: Roger Hatton 
Date: 7/2/18 08:58 (GMT+10:00)
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: New Entities

Does GNU Cash support more than one entity?
In other words separate ledgers for separate business names?
Using the one single downloaded GNU Cash system?
Process advice appreciated.
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RE: Future allocated money vs Budgets

[Matt Graham]

So there really is more than one way to skin a cat... or make a budget. 
Whatever.

Since we are talking about something very personal to the needs of individuals, 
perhaps Gnucash needs a ‘add module’ system, where we can write modules that 
perform data access and manipulation? So we could write an “envelope budgeting” 
module that can overlay in the Gnucash environment.

Seems a waste to have to export to another tool to do a small part of budgeting.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Mike or Penny Novack
Sent: Monday, 5 February 2018 3:12 AM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets

On 2/4/2018 1:21 AM, Christopher Lam wrote:
> Looks nice. My main concern with these "shadow accounts" is that they will,
> by default, be counted in the Net worth reports, income reports, etc, and
> must be manually deselected every time.
>
> In my view budget allocations are technically "outside the books" and must
> therefore ideally be recorded in ways that don't affect the everyday data
> and reports.
>
The problems people have been discussing are really "work flow" and "how
done" issues.

a) As noted in the second paragraph, technically "outside the books". So
ONE solution is to do just that, a separate set of "books" (gnucash can
handle many). That obviously would mean no effect on reports run against
the regular books. And of course that could be using the built in budget
facility.

b) But it seems most would prefer not having to switch books to record
the effect on budget items resulting from the real transactions. I can
think of MANY ways to put the "budget" accounts so that they would have
no net effect on reports, total of the parent standing accounts (asset,
liability, equity). What I can't see is any easy way to "automate"
because IN GENERAL users, especially non-organizational users, will be
ADJUSTING budget allocations on the fly as needed << don't need a vote
of some board to authorize that >>

c) Some people seem to be confused about "liabilities" thinking that
they NECESSARILY represent an actual debt (the most common use) instead
of possibly representing a CONDITIONAL debt. I will note that some of
the things I have mentioned in this context (especially for non-profit
orgs) may be changing << I have heard that new accounting practice will
allow some restricted funds not to be considered liabilities
until/unless something prevents their use for the intended purpose
instead of as now from the get go as a conditional debt* >>

d) IF I wanted to put the "envelopes" in my main books, I could put them
under assets, liabilities, or equity WITHOUT affecting the totals of any
of those. Thus:
Budget (the parent)
  Total allocated funds(debit side?)
Allocations   (credit side?)
Each individual envelope
<< all that matters is that Total Allocated Funds and
Allocations be on opposite sides --- which means the total for the
parent "Budget" will be ZERO >>

Michael D Novack

* In my practical experience, donors of conditional gifts or grants
often will agree to a change of use, extension of time to use, etc. But
I have never had to deal with governmental grants, etc. which I suspect
would be less forgiving. But I also have practical experience where ALL
there is is budget accounting << the organization or committee has no
funds in hand --- the budget represents what will be reimbursed if the
committee votes to authorize an expenditure and some committee member
goes out and spends the money --- and then submits the receipts to the
town treasurer for reimbursement. The committee must track "how much do
we have left to spend" or somebody will be out of pocket >>


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RE: Entering Budget Values

[Matt Graham]

Ah, okay. Weird.

I’ve also realised that when you start a new budget you should see all ‘zeros’ 
in each ‘cell’ too. So I was on the wrong lines talking about that (thought the 
cells might be there with no values entered, but by default you would see 0.00 
in each cell until you enter something. Light grey for ones that it has 
calculated from sub-accounts, black for ones that are lowest level or you have 
entered.

Can you see the four “Totals” rows at the bottom – Income, Expenses, Transfers, 
and Total? Do they have Zeros next to each period?

The only other thing I can think of is if you have accidently created a budget 
report, rather than a budget. You created it through “Actions” => “Budget” => 
“New Budget”, right? You could try creating another budget for the same time 
period and seeing if it displays the same behaviour.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: BCnon-admin<mailto:bmclar...@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, 5 February 2018 4:59 AM
To: Matt Graham<mailto:matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Entering Budget Values


Matt,

Hierarchy is good. "no cells" means that I would expect to see cells like on an 
excel spreadsheet but there aren't any - the space under the time period is 
just a blank page.

BC

On 2/3/2018 10:05 PM, Matt Graham wrote:
Hi Bruce!

Have you established your account hierarchy? The budget view should mirror your 
normal account hierarchy and allow you to enter values against each time 
period. So when you say ‘no cells’, do you mean you can see the accounts on the 
left and the periods along the top?

Additionally, do you have any hidden accounts? The default is no, so this 
shouldn’t be the problem, but accounts can be hidden so you don’t see them 
which could theoretically be why you aren’t seeing the cells.

Finally, are you Windows? There is a bug in windows whereby the display can be 
incredibly slow to respond. I have to click on a cell and wait almost a minute 
(no joke) before I can enter the value

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Bruce Clark<mailto:bmclar...@comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, 4 February 2018 2:24 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Entering Budget Values

Today is my first day with GnuCash and everything was going well until I tried 
to enter budgets for my accounts. I have selected 2018 as my time frame (12 
periods). ‘Help’ says all I have to do is select a cell (month) and enter the 
value but I don’t have any cells. Where have I gone wrong?

Bruce Clark
bmclar...@comcast.net<mailto:bmclar...@comcast.net>
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RE: Future allocated money vs Budgets

[Matt Graham]

Welcome to the discussion!

So if I understand correctly, you have written scripts to automate the use of 
extra accounts to track allocated money? That was the line I was going down too 
(except building them into GNUCash), but Chris Lam’s discussion on “Budget 
transactions” is starting to look to me like a simpler and more elegant way to 
do what we want, whilst fitting in with other uses of budgets and automating 
what we want... Have a look on the Dev list for more details – can’t remember 
how much he posted on the user list about it.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: ebridges
Sent: Sunday, 4 February 2018 11:39 AM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets

Sorry for the delayed response, just managing to catch up on this thread.

I've been looking at how to do envelope-style budgeting for my personal
finances using GnuCash for about 6-7 months.  Like you, this began with this
article from 2008 "[Better Budgeting with
GnuCash"](https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fallmybrain.com%2F2008%2F12%2F15%2Fbetter-budgeting-with-gnucash%2F=02%7C01%7C%7C9b6d2224a4b3476a8f9b08d56b67cddb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636533015939354212=frZ3TUMhMzf%2FA2zBxsSTJZLW5UYLhrctdjhiXmgtvwE%3D=0).

After toying around with that approach, I decided there were two drawbacks
to it:

1. It was tedious.  Manually creating a split for every expense to draw down
budget accounts ("envelopes") that were allocated previously, was super
boring and error prone.  In addition, because of the detailed nature of
doing this work, one would be discouraged from allocating all of your income
to different "envelopes".
2. It was fragile.  By treating "Budgeted Cash" as an asset made allocated
money difficult to reconcile to money that was drawn out of your budget
accounts.  A useful insight in that article is to consider a budget account
as a liability.  However, it categorizes budgeted cash as an Asset, when it
is more useful to consider it also as a liability.  Doing so allows you to
reconcile allocated money to monies spent out of the "envelopes".

For the past month, I've been able to apply an approach to my existing
reconciliation process that I believe will prove to be a very useful and
easy to manage approach to envelope budgeting for personal finance.

To simplify allocating income and expenses to envelopes I use two tools:

* 
[QifQif](https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2FKraymer%2Fqifqif=02%7C01%7C%7C9b6d2224a4b3476a8f9b08d56b67cddb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636533015939354212=pGZVbq9N4uDjNAI2fJg0WroQ2t4MpcVUpqglYYVmmuw%3D=0)
 which makes it easy to quickly
insert categories into a QIF file;
* 
[qif-split](https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Febridges%2Fqif-split=02%7C01%7C%7C9b6d2224a4b3476a8f9b08d56b67cddb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636533015939354212=eSOJkz3h29fzh4kHHVH5xf6sYk4Do7LBns%2B3jBCtfzA%3D=0),
 a tool that I wrote,
which adds splits to QIF files according to some rules defined in a file.

After downloading transactions for my credit card & bank accounts in QIF
format, I first process the file with QifQif to match up every transaction
to one of my accounts from GnuCash.  QifQif supports using wild cards and
regexes for matching payees to accounts, and then adds the account as a
category to the QIF transaction.

After categorization of the transactions, the files can be processed by
`qif-split`, and split according to predefined rules.

I have been using `QifQif` for about a year, and have found it to be very
reliable and easy to work with.  In the past month, I began using
`qif-split` to allocate income and expenses to budget accounts.

The `qif-split` configuration rules splitting the incoming transactions are
twofold

1. Allocating income as credits to various envelopes, or
2. Allocating expenses as debits to those same envelopes.

These allocations are balanced with corresponding debits or credits to a
"Budgeted Cash" account.  Because of these balanced entries, the toplevel
"Budgets" account will always self-reconcile (i.e. its balance will always
be 0).  When the balance of a given budget subaccount ("envelopes") is
negative, then you've overspent that category.

By using `qif-split` to automatically generate split transactions, and by
altering my chart of accounts to roll up budgeted cash alongside the
budgeted expenses it makes envelope-style budgeting very straightforward in
GnuCash.




--
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RE: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

’s up to you.

As an alternative to making the Allocated account in Equity, you could create a 
new top level Asset account called ‘Allocated' (or ‘Budgeted’) and still use 
the special purpose accounts under Equity. This is more of a ‘correct’ 
situation since you’re using equity accounts to lay claim to assets. The only 
difference is you’d have to make sure NOT to include ANY of these accounts when 
you run a balance sheet or both your assets and equity will be overstated.  
(until you spend everything to zero) I wouldn’t put this under ‘Current Assets’ 
like I would the sub-account approach, because then Current will always be 
inflated by the amount allocated/budgeted. The downside is your top level 
Assets & Equity accounts will always be overstated as long as the balances of 
those special accounts are not zero.

The big advantage of this approach, other than being technically correct from 
an accounting standpoint is that each allocation would be a proper debit to an 
asset and credit to equity, (increasing both) and each expenditure would be a 
credit to the asset and debit to equity. (decreasing both) If you combined your 
splits in a single expense transaction, you’d be debiting expenses and equity 
while crediting assets. That route is even less mental gymnastics since it 
doesn’t require the use of any reverse-balanced account.

If on the other hand, you want to segregate funds within their physical 
location, and save the extra work of additional splits, and not have to worry 
about inflated top level accounts, or making sure not to include your special 
accounts in Balance Sheet reports, then I’d just opt to use asset sub-accounts 
as I already outlined.

Best of luck to you.

Regards,
Adrien

> On Jan 30, 2018, at 5:05 PM, Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Again, thank you Adrien for being patient with me. I’m probably getting 
> myself confused too, but I’m starting to get more and more clear on it all. I 
> know I’m definitely weird, and whilst I think the purpose I have is common, 
> the way I use it probably isn’t.
>
> We have some different assumptions going on.
>
> Lets start with sub-accounts. Sub-accounts are a great way to do it – if you 
> spend from that sub-account at least most of the time. We have discussed how 
> to handle the splits when you spend from a different account and want to 
> record it against that allocation, so it works, and probably works well 
> (although would be very confusing for beginners to get their head around 
> initially).
>
> But instead of using a sub-account to record the money that has been 
> segmented, what if I use a completely separate account? Why? Because I don’t 
> want to touch the balances of my core asset accounts – the ones that 
> correspond to bank accounts or physical cash. Maybe this is my silly desire 
> of mine. There is nothing wrong (or difficult) with adding virtual 
> sub-accounts, because gnucash is really good at handling sub-accounts (with 
> the reconciliation stuff we talked about). So now I need a new location in 
> the hierarchy to store my allocated money – best done as an asset, and since 
> it isn’t a sub-account, it needs to be balanced with another account (also 
> best done as an asset). We’ll get to your example in a minute.
>
> Assumption 2: That I only (or mainly) segment cash when I receive it. 
> Probably true for most people, and I’m glad you mentioned it because I should 
> use that for most of the examples when I write something up for the tutorials 
> and concepts guide. That isn’t how I work. I plan everything out in advance 
> to make sure I have the cash flow. I allocate to various purposes on the 
> first day of the month, rather than allocating by pay. I do this so that I 
> get a regular and measureable allocation to things I want to spend on 
> (restaurants & Cafes, spending money, etc). I can afford to do this because I 
> am very (very very very) good with sticking to a budget and savings in 
> general. So I just make sure I have more money in my account than I plan to 
> spend that month (transferring the rest away to investments or to reduce my 
> loans), and I have no cashflow problems. So for me, I want to do an 
> allocation on the start of every month, that doesn’t correspond to income. No 
> real problem. Still, lets carry on with your example of allocating out of pay:
>
> If, rather than a sub-account, I use a separate asset account then there is 
> no balancing Cr to an asset to increase the allocation. In your example, you 
> had a balancing Cr on the parent when you allocated the money. So, we receive 
> a $1000 pay check, and want to allocate $500 to the four accounts:
> Cr Income: Salary $1000
> Dr Asset:Current:Checking $1000
> Cr Asset:Current:AllocatedCash $500
> Dr. Assets:Allocated:Vacation$250
> Dr. Ass

RE: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

Hi Dave!

Yep, that is pretty much the conclusion I’ve come to. Not sure what you are 
asking about in “where are you balancing the funds”. The Cr and Dr are balanced 
in the example. Maybe you are asking the location in the hierarchy for the 
accounts? It all goes up to the root account “Assets”. For this idea, I had 
Current Assets, Fixed assets, and Allocated Assets. All the little allocation 
accounts were stored in the Allocated Assets branch.
They were balanced by a single account under current assets called 
“AllocatedCash” (as per the example below). This is the weird one – a negative 
asset account that reflects how much I SHOULDN’T spend out of current assets 
unless I am spending on my allocated causes.

As per Adrian’s discussions, if you are spending out of the account that you 
have put your sub-account into, then there are less splits and it is far easier 
to understand. Using Adrien’s idea, at WORST you have a couple of transactions 
that are just as complex as every transaction the other way – but this is only 
in the rare event that you spend out of a different account from that which 
your sub-account is in.

I still haven’t fully wrapped my head around Adrien’s most recent email, so 
that could create some more “Aha!” moments too.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: David T.<mailto:sunfis...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, 31 January 2018 2:31 PM
To: matt_graham2...@hotmail.com<mailto:matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>; Adrien 
Monteleone<mailto:adrien.montele...@gmail.com>; 
gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: RE: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

Matt,

I see one huge problem: where are you balancing the funds for the allocated 
accounts? They need balancing, and once you add something to balance them, you 
might as well male them Subaccounts of checking anyway.

Cheers,
David

On Wed, Jan 31, 2018 at 4:06, Matt Graham
<matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>

[Snip]
If, rather than a sub-account, I use a separate asset account then there is no 
balancing Cr to an asset to increase the allocation. In your example, you had a 
balancing Cr on the parent when you allocated the money. So, we receive a $1000 
pay check, and want to allocate $500 to the four accounts:
Cr Income: Salary $1000
Dr Asset:Current:Checking $1000
Cr Asset:Current:AllocatedCash $500
Dr. Assets:Allocated:Vacation$250
Dr. Assets:Allocated:Insurance  $150
Dr. Assets:Allocated:Dining  $ 50
Dr. Assets:Allocated:Coffee  $ 50

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RE: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

type if I was using a sub-account and didn’t spend from that sub 
account:
Dr Expenses:Dining $20
Cr Assets:MyCash $20
Cr Assets:Checking:Dining $20
Dr Assets:Checking $20

So if I (foolishly) chose a sub-account for allocation that I never spent from, 
doing it the separated way is no extra work – still similar four splits. But as 
you say, if you use a sub-account and spend from it most of the time, the messy 
four line transaction becomes a simple
Cr Checking:Dining $20
Dr Expenses:Dining $20

Does this make sense?

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Adrien Monteleone<mailto:adrien.montele...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, 30 January 2018 6:45 PM
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org<mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

Matt,

You lost me again.

I don’t understand why you’d have a negative 'segmented spending money' asset.

You receive a paycheck, say $1000.

You earmark 50% of that into various sub-accounts.

You still have $1000.

There’s no negative balance on any asset account.

Perhaps your checking account holds $500 of that money, and each of four 
sub-accounts hold $250, $150, $50 & $50 respectively. That all adds up to $1000.

The act of earmarking funds moves you from one account with a single positive 
$1000 balance to 5 accounts totaling a positive $1000 balance NONE of which are 
negative.

Where’s the ‘negative segmented money account?’

Please describe with debits and credits. I don’t see it. What I see is this:

Receipt of money with segregation:

Dr. Assets:Checking $500
Dr. Assets:Checking:Vacation$250
Dr. Assets:Checking:Insurance   $150
Dr. Assets:Checking:Dining  $ 50
Dr. Assets:Checking:Coffee  $ 50
Cr. Income:Salary   $1000

When you go out for lunch I see this:

Dr. Expenses:Dining $20
Cr. Assets:Checking:Dining  $20

How does recording an expense INCREASE the allocated cash for Dining as you 
describe? (making it less negative) How was it negative in the first place? 
What transaction did you record to make it so? Note, for an asset to be 
‘negative’ it has to have a ‘credit’ balance, that is, credits have to be 
greater than debits. Making an asset account ‘less negative’ is a debit 
transaction. (since asset accounts are usually debit positive balanced) Debits 
don’t decrease an asset, they increase it. Spending money never gives you more 
to spend, it means you have less. Spending money is always (eventually) a 
credit to assets, never a debit.

I can’t see any scenario where that above example of going out for lunch looks 
like this:

Dr. Expenses:Dining $20
Dr. Assets:Checking:Dining  $20
Cr. $40

If that would even begin to make any sense why $40 is moving somewhere instead 
of just $20.

Note, doing this:

Dr. Assets:Checking:Dining  $20
Cr. Expenses:Dining $20

Is an incorrect transaction if you SPENT the money. (as opposed to receiving a 
refund, or correcting a prior error) Crediting an expense is a refund/reversing 
condition, not a normal expenditure.

When you record the receipt of money, that goes to an income/revenue account, 
split with the physical asset account for the form you received the payment in. 
Generally, this will be a credit to ‘income’ and a debit to ‘cash.’ Where and 
how do you record the receipt of money as a credit to an asset instead and how 
does that balance against your credit to your income account?

i.e.—

Dr. $1000
Cr. Income:Salary   $1000
Cr. Assets:??

Regards,
Adrien


> On Jan 29, 2018, at 11:25 PM, Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Ah, true. I guess this is why I favored "triggered transactions " rather than 
> "template transactions".
>
> I want a transaction involving expense account "spending money" to 
> automatically add two more splits to reduce the asset account "segmented 
> spending money" balanced by increasing the value of "allocated cash" asset 
> acct (increase = make it less negative).
>
> For saving up for something expensive, I would still set up the above, but I 
> would need to manually change the numbers if I wanted to return the 
> allocation to zero.
>
> So when I enter:
>
> Cr account I used to pay insurance 1150
> Dr expense account for insurance (with the trigger attached) 1150
>
> I would want gnucash to automatically add the splits
>
> Cr account I am using to segment insurance money 1150
> Dr account showing allocated cash 1150.
>
> I would the (during my reconciling/budget review) need to amend that 
> transaction (or create a new one to return the insurance allocation to zero.
>
> For many of my other money allocations (eg restaurants/cafe) I wouldnt change 
> it - underspendi

RE: Merging Files or Other Method getting Transactions into main File.

[Matt Graham]

Hi Mike,

So if I understand correctly from looking through the email chains:

  1.  You had everything entered into the mobile app
  2.  You exported from the mobile app and hit the bug where splits lose their 
values in the export
  3.  You imported all the transactions into GNUCash desktop in a new file (so 
get the splits, but no values) then painfully went through and entered all the 
transaction amounts for the splits
  4.  You tried exporting from Gnucash desktop in a variety of formats and 
importing back into your main file, and it didn’t work. So you are now 
re-entering all of those transactions manually into your main file That is 
incredibly painful.

Is all of this correct?

To try to save you a lot of painful hours of concentration, and assuming my 
above is correct, my questions are:

  1.  Is this the kind of data that you are willing/able to send to one of us 
so that we can see what the outputs are ourselves? (probably the qif export 
from the desktop gnucash). Obviously, don’t post it to gnucash-user because 
then the world will have it online. Usually this is not an option for people, 
but if it is then it could really help the troubleshooting. Export/import qif 
from gnucash has always been really good for me.
  2.  If that is not an option, when you exported from Gnucash desktop in qif 
format. What do you see when you open the file in Wordpad or Notepad (I’m 
assuming you use windows)? It will be a large file, with lots of text, but it 
would give us clues as to what is going wrong.

Thanks and regards,

Matt

From: Mike Stillingfleet
Sent: Tuesday, 30 January 2018 8:33 PM
To: Geert Janssens; 
gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Merging Files or Other Method getting Transactions into main File.

Thanks Geert,  yes I have previously had a go at that other forum no response.

I have this morning created reports from the corrected XML file.

I am starting to input manually.  It may take a week or so to re-input the data 
but carrying on with the current effort is completely pointless.

I do think that the GNU cash Web site should take down any link to the App and 
further issue a massive health warning about the App.

Having said that.  Since upgrading I gave scheduled a daily QIF download from 
the App.

GNU Cash so far appears to be able to handle these tiny QIF files. But I would 
urge users not to enter a volume of data on the App. It is a disastrous waste 
of time.





On Tue, Jan 30, 2018, at 8:22 AM, Geert Janssens wrote:
> Op dinsdag 30 januari 2018 07:59:01 CET schreef john_mike:
> > Confused!
> >
> > Back ground : Trying to get damaged transactions from phone to main file.
> > Transactions entered whilst phone app had some sort of double minus problem.
> >
> >
> > What I have done:
> >
> > The only way to repair the transactions was to export as an XML file. Open
> > that XML in GNUCash. Go through line by line and enter amounts.
> >
> > Now I want these transactions to be imported into my main file.
> >
> >
> > I have attempted to export these corrected transactions to a QIF File. But
> > this option does not seem to exist. So have followed the export to CSV file.
> >
> > Now when attempting to import these CSV files to my main file. It fails.
> >
> I'm sorry you have such trouble trying to interchange data between these two
> applications.
>
> But you really should ask help on the Gnucash for Android forum, which is not
> here. The issue starts there in this particular case, and there nothing
> gnucash on desktop can do about this I'm afraid.
>
> CSV import in gnucash 2.6 and before has a very limited scope: it was written
> solely for importing bank statements and the options to tweak it show this.
> GnuCash data (like exported from gnucash to CSV) on the other hand has much
> more detail and the importer has no knowledge of how to interpret this. So in
> 2.6, a CSV export/import cycle won't work. The upcoming 3.0 will allow this,
> but for your specific problem it will come a few months too late probably.
>
> Good luck solving your issue!
>
> Geert
>
>


--
  Mike Stillingfleet
  mikestillingfl...@fastmail.co.uk
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Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

Ah, true. I guess this is why I favored "triggered transactions " rather than 
"template transactions".

I want a transaction involving expense account "spending money" to 
automatically add two more splits to reduce the asset account "segmented 
spending money" balanced by increasing the value of "allocated cash" asset acct 
(increase = make it less negative).

For saving up for something expensive, I would still set up the above, but I 
would need to manually change the numbers if I wanted to return the allocation 
to zero.

So when I enter:

Cr account I used to pay insurance 1150
Dr expense account for insurance (with the trigger attached) 1150

I would want gnucash to automatically add the splits

Cr account I am using to segment insurance money 1150
Dr account showing allocated cash 1150.

I would the (during my reconciling/budget review) need to amend that 
transaction (or create a new one to return the insurance allocation to zero.

For many of my other money allocations (eg restaurants/cafe) I wouldnt change 
it - underspending means the money is available for later.

Am I understanding you right?


Thanks and regards,
Matt


 Original message 
From: Mike or Penny Novack <stepbystepf...@dialup4less.com>
Date: 30/1/18 09:31 (GMT+10:00)
To: Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com>
Cc: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

On 1/28/2018 8:11 PM, Matt Graham wrote:
 When you look at what liabilities really are, Adrien and I concluded 
on this thread that this situation (segmenting money for future) is really 
using a separate asset account. After all - creating a liability INCREASES your 
cash available. ...
Yes, the problem precisely, we aren't assigning the same meaning to "available" 
and "liability"

But your example of what you would like to see:

Template transactions (I'd probably call them "Triggerred transactions", but it 
doesn'tmatter) sound awesome. As someone else highlighted, there are 
implementation difficulties to consider, but I dont think that it would be too 
onerous.

In terms of spending from another account but recording against a sub-account, 
its easy:
Dr Exp whatever account
Cr Cash I pay for something awesome
Dr Parent account the amount I paid
Cr sub-account the amount I paid

SPECIAL CASE of a GENERAL requirement. The special case might be easy to 
implement BUT in general the amounts are NOT going to be the same.

This is actually a fairly common situation for me, say one of the organizations 
SELLS a tee shirt (fundraising, but tee shirts might also be being given away 
to volunteers).
Db   Cash
Cr   Sales
Db   Cost of goods sold
Cr   Tee shirt inventory
<< the shirts might be being sold for $20 but cost the organization $7 >>

Or, and though this is common with our restricted funds (not exactly matching) 
I will give an example precisely for your situation. You socked away into this 
reserve $100/mo toward the annual renewal of your car insurance based on your 
ESTIMATE of what that annual bill will be. But when the bill arrives it is for 
$1150 or $1250. In both cases you pay the bill and release the restriction, 
yes? << in one case, you had more in the fund than needed but it still can be 
released to general purposes, in the other you used all of the fund AND had to 
add some general funds >>

Michael D Novack



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Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

Agree with your other email! A program should entertain whatever users are 
requesting for better functionality. Of course, open source volunteer 
developers can't be expected to drop everything to implement "my awesome idea". 
Hence why I'm going to try to contibute (sigh, always need more time).

Template transactions (I'd probably call them "Triggerred transactions", but it 
doesn'tmatter) sound awesome. As someone else highlighted, there are 
implementation difficulties to consider, but I dont think that it would be too 
onerous.

In terms of spending from another account but recording against a sub-account, 
its easy:
Dr Exp whatever account
Cr Cash I pay for something awesome
Dr Parent account the amount I paid
Cr sub-account the amount I paid

This is (like all of our segregating money transactions) a virtual one, but it 
wont affect your reconciling (because as discussed previously we are 
reconciling by the parent and including sub-accounts).
Hmmm now that I re-read your email, I think you might have meant this 
already. Sorry!

Thanks and regards,
Matt


 Original message 
From: Adrien Monteleone <adrien.montele...@gmail.com>
Date: 28/1/18 15:33 (GMT+10:00)
To: GNU Cash User <gnucash-user@gnucash.org>
Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

You can already use formulas in scheduled transactions, I just don’t think you 
can use a present GC register value as a variable. (such as x% of the balance 
of Assets:Checking) I could be wrong. It should be possible though to use the 
value of one split as a variable so some auto-allocation might be possible.

There’s also the issue with triggering the transaction based on an event other 
than a date stamp. (such as triggering after you post a credit to income or a 
debit to an checking account)

What we really need there isn’t so much a Scheduled Transaction but a Template 
Transaction. (that can retain formulas)

As for keeping accounts straight, if someone in the real world wants to spend 
money from a savings account by writing a check on their checking account - 
that’s physically impossible. (barring auto adjusting as overdraft protection) 
I don’t see why GnuCash should be any different. Trying to make that possible I 
think would lead to all sorts of confusion as to where money came from or where 
it should be. To help reduce the tendency to do so, I suggested splitting up 
the sub-accounts based on where you are most likely to draw funds from for 
those particular purposes. Otherwise, you’d have to do a transfer from say 
‘Savings’ to ‘Checking’ in GnuCash first just like you would in the real world. 
But if you’re in the habit of spending from any ole’ source for any ole’ 
purpose then by all means, keep the sub-accounts separate, you’ll just have to 
include the transfer split in the expense transaction or else do a separate 
transfer transaction.

Regards,
Adrien

> On Jan 27, 2018, at 9:25 PM, Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Nice! It seems like we are getting somewhere. I am convinced that the process 
> we think of budgeting where we are saving up for something is really a case 
> of segmenting money within a sub-account. And it looks like Gnucash is 
> already happy with this kind of situation - with the include sub-accounts in 
> the recociliation window.
>
> I'm going to try this out over the next week or so and then try to 
> contriubute to the Tutorial and concepts guide on it. It can get pretty 
> complicated (for beginners) when you segment the money in your savings 
> acount, and then want to spend out of cash/checking etc. Is a pretty common 
> thing that people want out of Gnucash.
>
> After trying it, I'll also be in a position to suggest any feature changes 
> that would make it easier. Hinted already by others is the feature of 
> "formula" based data entry - doing data entry a bit like a spreadsheet, where 
> simple equations can be used often based on the values present in other 
> accounts/transactions... I'll leave that for now and explore it in my next 
> big discussion with you all!
>
> Thanks again - greatly appreciate your time,
> Matt
>
>
>  Original message 
> From: Adrien Monteleone <adrien.montele...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:adrien.montele...@gmail.com>>
> Date: 27/1/18 18:15 (GMT+10:00)
> To: GNU Cash User <gnucash-user@gnucash.org <mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org>>
> Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]
>
> That’s an interesting use of future dated transactions. Thanks!
>
>
> Regards,
> Adrien
>
> > On Jan 26, 2018, at 5:21 PM, Tommy Trussell <tommy.truss...@gmail.com 
> > <mailto:tommy.truss...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > I was following the budget discussion, and I decided to split 

Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

:-) you missed one of the previous posts. Using Liability accounts that way is 
adding anoter "layer" of accounting to your system. When you look at what 
liabilities really are, Adrien and I concluded on this thread that this 
situation (segmenting money for future) is really using a separate asset 
account. After all - creating a liability INCREASES your cash available. 
However, shifting it to another asset account (either sub-account or completely 
different area) reduces cash available AND allows you to record the increasing 
amount you have segmented. If I get a chance, I think I'll type all this up 
with some examples (it is easier to show with exampes).

Thanks and regards,
Matt
 Original message 
From: Mike or Penny Novack <stepbystepf...@dialup4less.com>
Date: 29/1/18 00:51 (GMT+10:00)
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

On 1/27/2018 10:25 PM, Matt Graham wrote:
> Nice! It seems like we are getting somewhere. I am convinced that the process 
> we think of budgeting where we are saving up for something is really a case 
> of segmenting money within a sub-account. And it looks like Gnucash is 
> already happy with this kind of situation - with the include sub-accounts in 
> the recociliation window.
Not exactly. This is a case where the term "budgeting" is being used in
different ways meaning different things. Budgets my be legal
(organizations, government entities) or advisory (personal, business)
though of course businesses might have requirements to set aside funds
<< might be in the terms of a loan, etc. >>

ONE way of doing this is with liability accounts (typical -- account for
amounts needed for taxes) but that method can also be used for "reserve
funds" <<  I deal mainly with non-profits where "restricted funds" are
common >>

Note that partitioning of a checking account in this way earlier
described is still just "advisory" as it would NOT prevent you from
writing a check for more than the balance remaining in the unrestricted
portion of the account. Just you can't do that without seeing that you
are doing it.

Michael D Novack


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Re: Does anyone successfully use GNU Android App. If not get it off the main web site.

[Matt Graham]

I find the android app useful, exporting transactions by qif file and then 
bringing them into my desktop app. It is very limited, as you say. Really needs 
to implement proper access to the ".gnucash" files so that we can keep the two 
in sync easily.

Pretty sure that app is also open source on github, so the best way to get it 
improved is to help out, or donate/set bounties.

Having said all that, it would be ideal to have an "official" mobile version of 
GNUcash with as close as possible to full functionality. Hopefully using a 
large part of the desktop code (translated to Java for android though)
Coding party, anyone?

Thanks and regards,
Matt


 Original message 
From: jeffrey black 
Date: 29/1/18 07:12 (GMT+10:00)
To: john_mike , gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: Does anyone successfully use GNU Android App. If not get it off 
the main web site.

On 1/28/2018 8:31 AM, john_mike wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> I gave up trying to import the QIF file generated by the Android App.
>
> I exported from Android as XML then opened that file in GNU Cash. This had
> the dates of the transactions the narrative (well some of it) and the
> relevant accounts and about 30% of the values.
>
> I have nearly gone blind going through each transaction on my phone and
> entering the amount in the GNU Cash file.
>
> Now I need to work out how to import these completed transactions into my
> main file.
>
> I think I am done with the Android App. Every time I try to use it in messes
> up. It is therefore a huge waste of time.
>
> One of the reasons I started with GNU was the option of having the Android
> companion.
>
> Clearly it doesn't work. Clearly it was never intended to be a 'clone' of
> the main GNU Cash Application.
>
> Might I suggest that it is removed from the GNU Cash web site. It is
> detrimental to GNU Cash which by and large works. The Android App is just a
> huge waste of time.
>
> I wondered if there is any intention to create an App that works.
>
> All I wish to do is record stuff on the phone and load it to the PC. Is this
> possible / achievable.
>
> What I don't want is to spend time recording stuff on my phone and then
> spend 3-4 days transferring it across as that is completely pointless and
> very frustrating. It would be much better to remove the current offering
> from the system as it is setting a false user expectation. Which it turn
> leads to mistrust of GNU Cash.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from: 
> https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fgnucash.1415818.n4.nabble.com%2FGnuCash-User-f1415819.html=02%7C01%7C%7Cbd466c05436a48f13b8008d5668b7b25%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636527671605334518=KJJZ1IZM9TtHb4ZGAQvB7q7BoxVmbU9XwNp00kb%2BI%2FM%3D=0
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> .
>
I use the Android app on my LG phone.  For me it works wonderfully.  It
does lack a few features of  GnuCash on the desktop.  Most notably Check
number.  And it requires a little getting used to for doing split
transactions.

I do need to trim my account list on the phone, I have all of my
accounts in the app.  I don't really need accounts like depreciation
while pumping gas.  The really nice thing is I can log my transactions
as I do them rather than reading a bunch of crumpled up receipts at the
end of the week.

All I do is export the app data to a qif file and use the usb port to
transfer it to my desktop.  Never had a problem with it. I have never
tried exporting as xml.

Keep in mind the android app is an entirely separate product, developed
by a different group.


--JEffrey Black M.B.A.

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Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

[Matt Graham]

Nice! It seems like we are getting somewhere. I am convinced that the process 
we think of budgeting where we are saving up for something is really a case of 
segmenting money within a sub-account. And it looks like Gnucash is already 
happy with this kind of situation - with the include sub-accounts in the 
recociliation window.

I'm going to try this out over the next week or so and then try to contriubute 
to the Tutorial and concepts guide on it. It can get pretty complicated (for 
beginners) when you segment the money in your savings acount, and then want to 
spend out of cash/checking etc. Is a pretty common thing that people want out 
of Gnucash.

After trying it, I'll also be in a position to suggest any feature changes that 
would make it easier. Hinted already by others is the feature of "formula" 
based data entry - doing data entry a bit like a spreadsheet, where simple 
equations can be used often based on the values present in other 
accounts/transactions... I'll leave that for now and explore it in my next big 
discussion with you all!

Thanks again - greatly appreciate your time,
Matt


 Original message 
From: Adrien Monteleone 
Date: 27/1/18 18:15 (GMT+10:00)
To: GNU Cash User 
Subject: Re: Subaccounts [WAS Re: Future allocated money vs Budgets]

That’s an interesting use of future dated transactions. Thanks!


Regards,
Adrien

> On Jan 26, 2018, at 5:21 PM, Tommy Trussell  wrote:
>
> I was following the budget discussion, and I decided to split my comment
> into a different thread. I'm not responding to any particular comment, and
> this isn't quite germane to budgeting.
>
> But I want to clear up a few misunderstandings I'm seeing folks express
> about reconciling with sub-accounts. Subaccounts work very well, but they
> do take a little maintenance.
>
> WHEN TO USE SUBACCOUNTS
>
> You can use subaccounts for several purposes, including budgeting, holding
> onto money that isn't "yours" (a bond you're holding from a contractor for
> successful completion of a project, for instance), identifying earmarked
> funds, OR (as in the example below) simply stopping yourself from spending
> down the account more than you'd like.
>
> (If folks have additional suggested uses for subaccounts, bring em on!)
>
> EXAMPLE: MINIMUM BALANCE VIEW
>
> Here's a real-world (well it's real in MY world) example -- avoiding
> "minimum balance" fees. The bank name has been changed to protect the
> bookkeeper. ;-)
>
> I have a checking account at BigBank.
>
> Assets:Current Assets:BigBank Checking
>
> The terms on that bank account say it doesn't cost me anything UNLESS the
> balance drops below $2500, at which point I have to pay $8.50/month. (There
> are some other miscellaneous fees, all higher when the balance goes low.)
>
> SO to help avoid the $8.50/month expense, I created a sub account:
>
> Assets:Current Assets:BigBank Checking:Minimum Balance
>
> Then I created a transaction dated 2/15/2015, transferring $2500 from the
> account to its subaccount:
>
> (This is a representation of the BigBank Checking two-line auto-split
> register. Items in the right column are "cr" and items in the left column
> are "dr".)
>
>  2/15/2015 min Minimum Balance   2500.00cr
>Assets:Current Assets:BigBank Checking:Minimum Balance   $2500.00dr
>Assets:Current Assets:BigBank Checking   $2500.00cr
>
> When I reconciled my account the first time after creating this
> transaction, I made sure to tick the "Include Subaccounts" checkbox on the
> Reconcile Information dialog. I (as always) verified the ENDING balance
> information exactly as it was shown on the bank's statement.
>
> Also that first time I reconciled, I noticed TWO items to clear that
> weren't actually on the bank statement -- $2500 in the funds in side and
> $2500 in the funds out side of the reconcile window. I marked them BOTH as
> "cleared."
>
> From now on, I notice a few things have changed from before --
>
> o - My default balance when I reconcile AND the running balance in the
> BigBank Checking register will always show $2500 lower than I actually
> have.
>
> o - When I reconcile I always have to remember to override the default and
> enter the ENDING balance as it is shown on BigBank's statement.
>
> o - When I reconcile the "Include Subaccounts" checkbox is ticked and it
> needs to stay ticked. (It seems to "remember" the setting from session to
> session, as you would hope.)
>
> o - I also notice when I'm reconciling that when I "jump" to a transaction
> by double-clicking on an item in the funds in / funds out lists, the
> transaction opens into a different kind of "general ledger" style register
> that includes ALL transactions in the account and subaccounts. It exactly
> resembles the kind of register that appears when you search for
> transactions. It has a "plus" (+) mark in its tab and looks different from
> the "ordinary" register.
>
>
> 

RE: Future allocated money vs Budgets

[Matt Graham]

nt to 
stick with GnuCash, you’d have to set up a spreadsheet to handle the envelope 
part, at least the calculations as to how much to segregate at each opportunity 
and keep track of any goals.

But I’d proffer that something along the lines of MoneyWell is more suited to 
the task, especially for those who live from a checking account. As far as I 
know it’s Mac only however. (there are mobile versions, but I don’t think they 
are stand-alone) For those who handle a fair amount of cash, or want to track 
investments and asset values, or need to track A/P and A/R, GnuCash is better 
suited. MoneyWell was designed specifically to implement the envelope method 
(using ‘buckets’) to automatically ‘flow’ money you receive to targeted 
purposes such as your utilities, rent, car, savings, etc. I’ve played with it 
quite a bit, and I’d like GnuCash to have something similar, but I find it too 
limited for all my other accounting purposes. If there were a way to get 
transactions in and out easily, I might use it for daily purposes and budgeting 
and keep GnuCash for the overall big picture stuff.

Regards,
Adrien

> On Jan 25, 2018, at 9:29 PM, Matt Graham <matt_graham2...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi All!
> I’m going to discuss (and get people’s opinions) on a way in which many users 
> (myself included) struggle to get “what they want” from GNUCash budgeting. 
> GNUcash is very strict on proper double-entry bookkeeping practices (which I 
> love). In accounting, “budgeting” means that you are plotting out exactly 
> when you are going to change account values in what way. It is forecasting 
> the future states of the accounts.
>
> So if you have a monthly bill of $50 you need to pay – easy. You enter it 
> into the monthly periods - both expense account and asset account. You know 
> you will spend that amount, and you (usually) know what asset account you are 
> spending it out of. This is budgeting, and allows you to see that you are not 
> losing money overall and sending yourself broke by end of year.
>
> The next thing that people call “budgeting” is when they want to save up for 
> something, but don’t have a distinct plan of when it will be spent or how it 
> will be paid for. My example is “Spending Money” (but perhaps “holiday 
> savings” is a better example). I allocate $100 every month to myself and my 
> wife to spend as we want (hobbies, clothes, etc). If we don’t spend it, it 
> builds up allowing us to buy bigger stuff later. So I should put $100 in each 
> budget period against those two expense accounts, right? NO, NO, NO From 
> an accounting perspective, nothing is necessarily going to be spent out of my 
> “Spending money” expense account. It is an allocation of money, not a 
> spending of money. I can’t predict in advance any real changes to my asset or 
> expense accounts from this monthly “allocation of money”. What I am doing 
> from an accounting perspective is setting up a liability on myself – a 
> promise to give money later to someone (in this case a promise to give money 
> to myself). The reduction in my assets (cash) is as completely fake as the 
> increase in liability – none of my cash or credit accounts have changed in 
> value.
>
> For now I’m going to call this application “Future allocated money”, and 
> controversially say that it is NOT “budgeting”.
>
> So if you have some ‘budget’ purpose such as this, and lament that GNUCash 
> can’t give you the running total, the way to deal with it is the way this 
> person describes:
> https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fallmybrain.com%2F2008%2F12%2F15%2Fbetter-budgeting-with-gnucash%2F=02%7C01%7C%7C2d1add0a2c6a4643591d08d5647e306d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636525415498305568=s61s%2FSFcqv5L1C0v2xEma0%2BbaPC4eQl2EyPXGHLgTcc%3D=0
>
> The fake asset account is used to show the money that has been allocated for 
> certain purposes in the future (ie is unavailable). It needs to be a fake 
> account, because usually we don’t know in advanced which asset account we are 
> going to spend the allocated money out of. If you know which asset account 
> you are going to be spending the money out of, then sure you can just create 
> a sub-account to record the amount allocated to this. In this case, you don’t 
> really need to record the liability at all (the liability is effectively 
> shown in your sub-account), and the transactions become easier – just 
> transferring between that sub-account and the actual expense account when you 
> spend. But for most people, you need a fake asset account because you don’t 
> know in advance which account you will spend out of.
>
> The fake liability account is your running amount you can spend at any time.
>
> The problem in doing this?
> It creates extra transactions that look rea