[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-07 Thread jonathan mawson
If there's no rational reason to use Lift, then perhaps you could find another community to spend your time in. I didn't say that there was no rational reason to use Lift BUT THAT YOU ARE FAILING TO COMMUNICATE WHAT THAT REASON MIGHT BE TO POTENTIAL USERS! You can't expect potential users to

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-07 Thread David Pollak
Jonathan, your comments are someplace between not helpful and troll-like. It'd be best if you did not continue to participate in this thread. On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 5:36 AM, jonathan mawson umpti...@gmail.com wrote: If there's no rational reason to use Lift, then perhaps you could find

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-07 Thread Naftoli Gugenheim
I think that Jonathan was impolite in expressing his frustration at being misunderstood. But are his points not valuable? - David Pollakfeeder.of.the.be...@gmail.com wrote: Jonathan, your comments are someplace between not helpful and troll-like. It'd be best

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-07 Thread David Pollak
On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 12:15 PM, Naftoli Gugenheim naftoli...@gmail.comwrote: I think that Jonathan was impolite in expressing his frustration at being misunderstood. First, don't you think that it's ironic that someone who was trying to teach us about marketing was so incapable of expressing

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread Francois Armand
Le 06/03/2010 06:58, Warren Henning a écrit : tl;dr Want a cookie for your efforts? If you don't like Lift, don't use it. Problem solved. Hooray, turkey for everyone! I don't think that this type of email that is really constructive, and I'm little surprised at it, Lift community is

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread Jeppe Nejsum Madsen
cageface milese...@gmail.com writes: [lots of stuff about layout] I agree and as Marius wrote it's (the website at least) is a known issue and is being worked on. But it's moving slowly. I think the underlying problem here is that the Lift committers are mostly code geeks and not really into

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread Timothy Perrett
Firstly, Lift is not Rails. It really bugs me when people are like oh, well rails does XYZ. Its apples and oranges in many respects - especially when you consider the ages of the respective projects... Lift is much, much younger than Rails. Moreover, Lift is a very advanced framework -more so

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread Jeppe Nejsum Madsen
Timothy Perrett timo...@getintheloop.eu writes: Sorry Jeppe, but I disagree. On which part :-) Maybe the not really into the visual aesthetics. What I meant was not that we don't care, but more that we will rather spend time on coding. The issue to date has been getting someone to work on it

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
Warren Henning wrote: tl;dr Want a cookie for your efforts? If you don't like Lift, don't use it. Problem solved. Hooray, turkey for everyone! There are few things sillier than investing time - serious time from lots of people - in a framework aimed at programmers and then

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
Jeppe Nejsum Madsen wrote: Timothy Perrett timo...@getintheloop.eu writes: Sorry Jeppe, but I disagree. On which part :-) Maybe the not really into the visual aesthetics. What I meant was not that we don't care, but more that we will rather spend time on coding. The issue to date

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
As this is likely to be very controversial, I'll recap one more time while my gf finishes dying her hair - - Don't ignore people like Mark. His feedback was detailed, thoughtful, and invaluable if want non-committers to use Lift - Do decide how you are going to position Lift. Position being

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
Timothy Perrett wrote: By all means, come here with questions and you will find this group to be very responsive and helpful, but do not come here and automatically assume that you can illuminate to us the errors in our project marketing or experience. What's automatic about Mark's

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
Thanks for your comments. I did Ruby/Rails for 2 years until I found Scala in November 2006. Please allow me to rebut your thoughtful post. On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 8:43 PM, cageface milese...@gmail.com wrote: Like many other web developers, I abandoned some heavyweight Java web frameworks

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 9:58 PM, Warren Henning warren.henn...@gmail.comwrote: tl;dr Want a cookie for your efforts? If you don't like Lift, don't use it. Problem solved. Hooray, turkey for everyone! Warren -- this comment is way out of bounds for the Lift list. You know I love your

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
Re. branding == What can you do for me, just compare the sites from Grails and Lift. Grails: Have your next Web 2.0 project done in weeks instead of months. Grails delivers a new age of Java web application productivity. - Ok, this is (claimed to be) a high productivity Web 2.0 framework.

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 9:02 AM, jonathan mawson umpti...@gmail.com wrote: Timothy Perrett wrote: By all means, come here with questions and you will find this group to be very responsive and helpful, but do not come here and automatically assume that you can illuminate to us the

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 9:19 AM, jonathan mawson umpti...@gmail.com wrote: As this is likely to be very controversial, I'll recap one more time while my gf finishes dying her hair - - Don't ignore people like Mark. His feedback was detailed, thoughtful, and invaluable if want non-committers

Re: [Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 5:50 AM, jonathan mawson umpti...@gmail.com wrote: Jeppe Nejsum Madsen wrote: Timothy Perrett timo...@getintheloop.eu writes: Sorry Jeppe, but I disagree. On which part :-) Maybe the not really into the visual aesthetics. What I meant was not that we don't

[Lift] Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread cageface
On Mar 6, 10:06 am, David Pollak feeder.of.the.be...@gmail.com wrote: And where are the bugs in the existing user guide? The only outright bug is that you can't copy paste the second maven invocation and the fix is extremely non-obvious. -- You received this message because you are subscribed

[Lift] Re: Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread jonathan mawson
You mistake different with harder. People who are used to one way to do things will find different harder than the same. No, I don't. Different *is* harder. When there is a convention it should be followed unless there is a good reason not to do so. This is one of the half dozen or so key

Re: [Lift] Re: Re: [lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-06 Thread David Pollak
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 3:29 PM, jonathan mawson umpti...@gmail.com wrote: You mistake different with harder. People who are used to one way to do things will find different harder than the same. No, I don't. Different *is* harder. When there is a convention it should be followed unless

[Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-05 Thread cageface
Like many other web developers, I abandoned some heavyweight Java web frameworks about 6 years ago for Rails and have been working pretty much exclusively in Rails ever since. However, I've always had a secret lust for functional languages so when I heard about Scala and Lift I decided to take a

Re: [Lift] superficial first impressions from a rails junkie

2010-03-05 Thread Warren Henning
tl;dr Want a cookie for your efforts? If you don't like Lift, don't use it. Problem solved. Hooray, turkey for everyone! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Lift group. To post to this group, send email to lift...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from