Hi,
I think this is an important discussion and I am regarding all your
questions in that spirit.
i) The question of "lesser-evilism" - Biden is of course as you point out
> just another face of ruthless capital. But, open fully-fledged fascism does
> have worse consequences of organising for the
Good morning John:
I appreciate very much the tone of your remarks - and certainly the
passion-spirit in them.
I return to an earlier note of yours, in this strand. I have read the other
responses also. However I was rather immersed in other pressing stuff and could
not respond earlier. But
This thread can be summed up as follows:
The good news is that many workers, including unionized workers, have finally
broken with the Democratic party, as we hoped.
The bad news is...
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UCLA was worse than that ---
The short bursts of informations we have about UCLA does not tell the whole
of it --
from what I've heard (and there will be more extensive writing soon) there
was not just ONE attack --- the mob was energized and attacked continuously
from the moment the Chancellor
Yes, the Populists succumbed to racism in 1896, but they did so by largely
folding themselves into the Democratic party--THE PARTY OF SLAVERY,
SECESSION, AND SEGREGATION! Every time Democratic apologists try to appeal
to a progressive legacy in the party, they wind up cherry-picking. :-)
The
John, I respect what you are saying and especially your practice ---
I would argue that in a situation where workers have completely lost
"faith" in the alleged "pro-labour" party --- in the US that would be the
Democrats --- the real problem is how many workers are seduced by the siren
Song of
Marx said we should be where the workers are. The workers aren't in those
parties any more, because as we all know they long since ceased to be mass
workers' parties.
He didn't say we should vote the way they vote. He said we should be
leading them towards a better politics and a better world.
On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 04:32 PM, Charlie wrote:
>
> Marv asserts, "the working class masses ... identify the Democratic,
> Labour and other left-centre parties with the advent of the welfare state
> and the conservative parties with having resisted it and wanting it
> dismantled." Another
Marv asserts, "the working class masses ... identify the Democratic, Labour and
other left-centre parties with the advent of the welfare state and the
conservative parties with having resisted it and wanting it dismantled."
Another fact-free assertion.
*Compare 2008:* "Election-night polling
Marv's comment may be true in general, but sometimes the actions of liberal
capitalist governments antagonise the working class to such an extent that
workers either don't vote at all or vote for right wing parties. For example,
some sections of the working class that voted for Obama in 2008
On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 09:24 PM, John Edmundson wrote:
>
> We've had 100 years of failure by these parties. Yet people still want us
> to support them. Why?
The short answer is because the working class masses still prefer them to the
right-wing parties which they view as the greater threat to
Surely Marv, the point of the very different times is that 100 years ago
working people hadn't seen that the 'Labour' parties were not going to
deliver. We've had 100 years of failure by these parties. Yet people still
want us to support them. Why?
I voted Labour once, in my first ever election,
Fain to "the powers that be:" "if you can’t take the outcry, stop supporting
the war." That is, if you can surf the protest wave, you can support the war.
Is this sloppy thinking or more of his feisty collaborationism (
On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 04:26 PM, John Edmundson wrote:
>
> I sense Lenin spinning in his grave every time a Marxist says 'Vote Biden'
> or 'Vote Democrat", or 'Vote Labour'. The rope stopped supporting the
> hanging man a century ago.
A reminder that conditions were somewhat different then,
Because Biden is a mouthpiece for US capitalism and imperialist domination.
Need there be more reason than that? I sense Lenin spinning in his grave
every time a Marxist says 'Vote Biden' or 'Vote Democrat", or 'Vote
Labour'. The rope stopped supporting the hanging man a century ago. The
only
Hello John: Can you tell me again - excuse my thickness, but what are the exact
benefits not voting for Biden? Other of course than massaging one's own
self-righteousness?
Hari
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And socialists are still encouraged to hold their noses and vote for him .
. .
On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 4:03 AM Dennis Brasky via groups.io wrote:
> Here’s the political background to the police raids against antiwar
> students on campuses across the country this week, violent crackdowns that
>
Here’s the political background to the police raids against antiwar
students on campuses across the country this week, violent crackdowns that
have Joe Biden’s fingerprints all over them: On Tuesday, *Biden demonized
the protesters as hate groups.* On the same day 22 Democratic House members
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