Re: [HACKERS] Latest ecpg patch broke MSVC build

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
In hindsight, all these ecpg changes should have been made between beta1 and beta2 when we have time to deal with the fallout, not right before beta1. Or considered new features and held back for 8.4. Not picking on Michael, but the resemblance to the /contrib discussion is striking. Ecpg

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended trans action ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
Right. My thought is still that if it isn't good enough for core, it shouldn't be in contrib. If it *is* good enough, and we want it, we should accept that it came in long after freeze and put it in core anyway. If it *isn't*, then it should be on pgfoundry and be moved into core when

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended trans action ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
(1) we've always been laxer about contrib than the core code, While that appears to be true, I think (a) there is no technical reason allowing us to do that, and (b) most people don't seem to like it. I will even go so far as to say there are technical reasons not to do it. I beleive

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended transaction ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Mon, 2007-10-08 at 17:38 -0400, Robert Treat wrote: On Monday 08 October 2007 16:29, Magnus Hagander wrote: The whole contrib thing confuses a lot of users. Is it included, or isn't it? IMHO, that distinction need to be clear, and I thought we were working (if not actively then at least

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Gokulakannan Somasundaram
On 10/8/07, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gokulakannan Somasundaram wrote: I am always slightly late in understanding things. Let me try to understand the use of DSM. It is a bitmap index on whether all the tuples in a particular block is visible to all the

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Gokulakannan Somasundaram
On 10/8/07, Florian G. Pflug [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gokulakannan Somasundaram wrote: Hi Heikki, I am always slightly late in understanding things. Let me try to understand the use of DSM. It is a bitmap index on whether all the tuples in a particular block is visible to all the backends,

Re: [HACKERS] PG on NFS may be just a bad idea

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Mon, 2007-10-01 at 19:25 -0400, Tom Lane wrote: Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://blogs.netapp.com/dave/2007/08/oracle-optimize.html Not a whole lot of technical content there, but pretty interesting nonetheless. I *think* that the issues we're seeing are largely in the NFS

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Gokulakannan Somasundaram
On 10/9/07, Gokulakannan Somasundaram [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 10/8/07, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gokulakannan Somasundaram wrote: I am always slightly late in understanding things. Let me try to understand the use of DSM. It is a bitmap index on

Re: [HACKERS] Latest ecpg patch broke MSVC build

2007-10-09 Thread Michael Meskes
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 08:15:35AM +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: In hindsight, all these ecpg changes should have been made between beta1 and beta2 when we have time to deal with the fallout, not right before beta1. This one I totally agree with. Or considered new features and held back

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Gregory Stark
Gokulakannan Somasundaram [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On 10/9/07, Gokulakannan Somasundaram [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A function is said to be deterministic, if it returns the same value, irrespective of how many times, it is invoked. I think this definition clearly puts the random function

Re: [HACKERS] Latest ecpg patch broke MSVC build

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 10:00:51AM +0200, Michael Meskes wrote: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 08:15:35AM +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: In hindsight, all these ecpg changes should have been made between beta1 and beta2 when we have time to deal with the fallout, not right before beta1. This

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Csaba Nagy
[snip] In the case of User-Defined functions, the user should be defining it as Deterministic. The user CAN already define his functions as Deterministic=IMMUTABLE... the problem is that many of us will define functions as immutable, when in fact they are not. And do that by mistake... and

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Trevor Talbot
On 10/8/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had a thought a week ago. If we update the time zone database for future dates, and you have a future date/time stored, doesn't the time change when the time zone database changes. For example if I schedule an appointment in New Zealand

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended transaction ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 08:20:45AM +0100, Simon Riggs wrote: On Mon, 2007-10-08 at 17:38 -0400, Robert Treat wrote: On Monday 08 October 2007 16:29, Magnus Hagander wrote: The whole contrib thing confuses a lot of users. Is it included, or isn't it? IMHO, that distinction need to be

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended transaction ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Tatsuo Ishii
Did it? I see nothing for txid in relesase.sgml. Right. release.sgml will be updated in batches as we near final release. We don't update for individual commits. Ok. I will explain about txid for local users myself. -- Tatsuo Ishii SRA OSS, Inc. Japan ---(end of

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Added the Skytools extended transaction ID module to contrib as

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 10:58 +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 08:20:45AM +0100, Simon Riggs wrote: On Mon, 2007-10-08 at 17:38 -0400, Robert Treat wrote: On Monday 08 October 2007 16:29, Magnus Hagander wrote: The whole contrib thing confuses a lot of users. Is it

Re: [HACKERS] ECPG regression tests

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
On Sat, Oct 06, 2007 at 11:50:39PM -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote: Andrew Dunstan wrote: Magnus Hagander wrote: Bingo. With that, all the ECPG regression tests now pass on MSVC builds. Andrew - please enable it for the buildfarm :-) Yes, when I have had a chance to test

[HACKERS] the best format of FAQ for you

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
Hello I would to manage czech FAQ with mediawiky http://www.pgsql.cz/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions and automaticly transform FAQ to any format. what is good format for you? I prefere plain html or DocBook? Current form of F.A.Q. is little bit obsolette. Regards Pavel Stehule

[HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
Hello I found lot of slow queries in some databases which I checked based on advice 4.1. from FAQ, To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; It's robust and slow on bigger tables. Can we add some better solutions? Regards Pavel Stehule

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Trevor Talbot
I wrote: On 10/8/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had a thought a week ago. If we update the time zone database for future dates, and you have a future date/time stored, doesn't the time change when the time zone database changes. For example if I schedule an appointment in

[HACKERS] IndexTuple Structure

2007-10-09 Thread Gokulakannan Somasundaram
Hi, When i saw the IndexTuple structure, i saw that 13 bits are allocated to store the size of the Values List of the IndexTuple Structure. Also the IID(ItemId Identifier) in the Page header stores the complete size of the IndexTuple. Can't we derive the size of the IndexTuple from the

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Florian G. Pflug
Csaba Nagy wrote: Can we frame a set of guidelines, or may be some test procedure, which can declare a certain function as deterministic? You mean postgres should check your function if it is really immutable ? I can't imagine any way to do it correctly in reasonable time :-) Imagine a

[HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
These messages from pg_ctl are not useful $ pg_ctl -D nonexistent stop pg_ctl: PID file nonexistent/postmaster.pid does not exist Is server running? The message should say pg_ctl: Data Directory nonexistent does not exist $ pg_ctl -D nonexistent start postgres cannot access the server

Re: [HACKERS] IndexTuple Structure

2007-10-09 Thread Gokulakannan Somasundaram
On 10/9/07, Gokulakannan Somasundaram [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, When i saw the IndexTuple structure, i saw that 13 bits are allocated to store the size of the Values List of the IndexTuple Structure. Also the IID(ItemId Identifier) in the Page header stores the complete size of the

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Csaba Nagy
I think you're overly pessimistic here ;-) This classification can be done quite efficiently as long as your language is static enough. The trick is not to execute the function, but to scan the code to find all other functions and SQL statements a given function may possibly call. If

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: These messages from pg_ctl are not useful $ pg_ctl -D nonexistent stop pg_ctl: PID file nonexistent/postmaster.pid does not exist Is server running? The message should say pg_ctl: Data Directory nonexistent does not exist Well, this

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 01:09:19PM +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: These messages from pg_ctl are not useful $ pg_ctl -D nonexistent stop pg_ctl: PID file nonexistent/postmaster.pid does not exist Is server running? The message should

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 13:20 +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 01:09:19PM +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: These messages from pg_ctl are not useful $ pg_ctl -D nonexistent stop pg_ctl: PID file

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Magne Mæhre
Trevor Talbot wrote: Actually, I'm used to knowing how PostgreSQL does it, but looking at things again I remember some confusion I had when first encountering the timestamp types. I don't know what the SQL Standard says; is the implication that timestamp with time zone actually stores the

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 13:20 +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 01:09:19PM +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: Well, this objection could apply to any place where a file is being opened. I'm curious how you plan to sort out

[HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
4.1) To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; + On bigger tables this solution is slow. Please, find smarter solution on network. 4.6) ILIKE is slow, specially on multibyte encodings. If is possible use FULLTEXT. LIKE '%some%' is slow always

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Magne Mæhre: SQL itself doesn't say anything how the data element should be stored, only how it should be operated upon.  It do, however,say that a datetime/time WITH TIME ZONE represents the time in UTC (SQL 2003, §4.3).  All operations on the element are

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Nikolay Samokhvalov
Hubert recently posted his thoughts on this topic: http://www.depesz.com/index.php/2007/09/16/my-thoughts-on-getting-random-row/ I've encountered with this problem several times in web development and every time found out that the best (in terms of performance) solution is to use some pseudo

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Nikolay Samokhvalov [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hubert recently posted his thoughts on this topic: http://www.depesz.com/index.php/2007/09/16/my-thoughts-on-getting-random-row/ I've encountered with this problem several times in web development and every time found out that the best (in

[HACKERS] permission denied for tablespace pg_global?

2007-10-09 Thread Hiroshi Saito
Hi. I'm looking at the strange phenomenon -- C:\Program Files\PostgreSQL\8.3-beta1\binpsql postgres postgres Password for user postgres: Welcome to psql 8.3beta1, the PostgreSQL interactive terminal. Type: \copyright for distribution terms \h for help with SQL commands \? for

Re: [HACKERS] the best format of FAQ for you

2007-10-09 Thread Robert Treat
On Tuesday 09 October 2007 05:55, Pavel Stehule wrote: Hello I would to manage czech FAQ with mediawiky http://www.pgsql.cz/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions and automaticly transform FAQ to any format. what is good format for you? I prefere plain html or DocBook? Current form of

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 14:25 +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 13:20 +0200, Magnus Hagander wrote: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 01:09:19PM +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: Well, this objection could apply to any place where a

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Pavel Stehule escribió: p.s. can we create some general F.A.Q XML format and store FAQ there? WIP Proposal: faq name = . language = entry number=1.1.1 query/query ansver ... we need some tags from html: pbraibullitable There is a DocBook spec for FAQ lists.

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Alvaro Herrera [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule escribió: p.s. can we create some general F.A.Q XML format and store FAQ there? WIP Proposal: faq name = . language = entry number=1.1.1 query/query ansver ... we need some tags from html:

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Trevor Talbot
On 10/9/07, Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Independent of what any specification might say, however, the currently implemented behavior is clearly wrong in my mind and needs to be fixed. I don't think it's wrong, just a particular choice. As an example, consider an interval

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Kevin Grittner
On Mon, Oct 8, 2007 at 10:48 PM, in message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had a thought a week ago. If we update the time zone database for future dates, and you have a future date/time stored, doesn't the time change when the time zone database changes. For

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Kevin Grittner
On Tue, Oct 9, 2007 at 6:49 AM, in message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Magne Mæhre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Interestingly, if you cast a TIMESTAMP WITH TIME ZONE to a character value, it should be converted with the _original_ time zone value (SQL 2003, *5.8) _unless_ you specify AT LOCAL. A

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Trevor Talbot: I don't think it's wrong, just a particular choice.  As an example, consider an interval scheduling system that handles everything in absolute time (UTC), but uses local time as a convenience. We are not considering an interval scheduling

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 14:25 +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: I believe, however, that this approach is wrong. The real error, as you put it, is the one reported by the kernel -- by definition. Everything else is at best a hint. Are you objecting to making the wording of the hint/error

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Csaba Nagy wrote: You mean postgres should check your function if it is really immutable ? I can't imagine any way to do it correctly in reasonable time :-) I would say that in the general case it's analogous to the halting problem, not solvable at all let alone in any reasonable

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread D'Arcy J.M. Cain
On Mon, 8 Oct 2007 20:02:56 -0700 Joshua D. Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The money data type has been deprecated for years. It is completely non standard and essentially duplicative of numeric/decimal. What is the point? It may be deprecated (maybe not) and it may have drawbacks but it is

Re: [HACKERS] ECPG regression tests

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Magnus Hagander wrote: (Hint: if you don't put the PlatformSDK directories first in the INCLUDE and LIB lists bad and inexplicable things can happen.) Pick up the latest version of run_build.pl in CVS if you want to run this in your buildfarm animal now. A release will be forthcoming

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Florian G. Pflug wrote: I think you're overly pessimistic here ;-) This classification can be done quite efficiently as long as your language is static enough. The trick is not to execute the function, but to scan the code to find all other functions and SQL statements a given function may

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Csaba Nagy
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 11:22 -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote: Csaba Nagy wrote: You mean postgres should check your function if it is really immutable ? I can't imagine any way to do it correctly in reasonable time :-) I would say that in the general case it's analogous to the halting

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Martijn van Oosterhout
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 05:04:39PM +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: We are not considering an interval scheduling system, we are considering a database system. Such a system should have the basic property that if you store A, it will read out as A. The money type is similarly buggy: if you

Re: [HACKERS] Including Snapshot Info with Indexes

2007-10-09 Thread Florian G. Pflug
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Florian G. Pflug wrote: I think you're overly pessimistic here ;-) This classification can be done quite efficiently as long as your language is static enough. The trick is not to execute the function, but to scan the code to find all other functions and SQL statements a

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread Joshua D. Drake
On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 11:26:16 -0400 D'Arcy J.M. Cain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 8 Oct 2007 20:02:56 -0700 Joshua D. Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The money data type has been deprecated for years. It is completely non standard and essentially duplicative of numeric/decimal. What is

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Gregory Stark
Nikolay Samokhvalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hubert recently posted his thoughts on this topic: http://www.depesz.com/index.php/2007/09/16/my-thoughts-on-getting-random-row/ I've encountered with this problem several times in web development and every time found out that the best (in terms

Re: [HACKERS] Uninformative messages from pg_ctl

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb Simon Riggs: On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 14:25 +0200, Peter Eisentraut wrote: I believe, however, that this approach is wrong. The real error, as you put it, is the one reported by the kernel -- by definition. Everything else is at best a hint. Are you

[HACKERS] Possible bugreport 8.3 beta1 on Win32: Looking like a deadlock with AutoVacuum

2007-10-09 Thread Deblauwe Gino
OS: Windows XP Pro SP2 CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3500+ RAM: 2GB DB: PostgreSQL 8.3beta1, compiled by Visual C++ build 1400 I've come to the conclusion that it seems like a deadlock occurs when dropping a column in a table the same moment that table is autovacuumed. Example: ALTER TABLE bondetail

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Chris Browne
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Alvaro Herrera) writes: Pavel Stehule escribió: p.s. can we create some general F.A.Q XML format and store FAQ there? WIP Proposal: faq name = . language = entry number=1.1.1 query/query ansver ... we need some tags from html: pbraibullitable

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread D'Arcy J.M. Cain
[Note: Cc list trimmed as everyone is probably on the list anyway] On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 09:02:09 -0700 Joshua D. Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: However, keep in mind that I really don't care if Money is deprecated or not. I do care that the docs say it is, and it may not be. :) Understood.

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Nikolay Samokhvalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hubert recently posted his thoughts on this topic: http://www.depesz.com/index.php/2007/09/16/my-thoughts-on-getting-random-row/ I've encountered with this problem several times in web development

Re: [HACKERS] Possible bugreport 8.3 beta1 on Win32: Looking like a deadlock with AutoVacuum

2007-10-09 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Deblauwe Gino wrote: OS: Windows XP Pro SP2 CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3500+ RAM: 2GB DB: PostgreSQL 8.3beta1, compiled by Visual C++ build 1400 I've come to the conclusion that it seems like a deadlock occurs when dropping a column in a table the same moment that table is autovacuumed. Example:

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb D'Arcy J.M. Cain: +    Due to locale changes this type may have problems with dump and +    restore and care should be taken. With respect, this kind of advice is useless. What are the problems, when do they occur, and what should be done about them? We

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Trevor Talbot wrote: I wrote: On 10/8/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I had a thought a week ago. If we update the time zone database for future dates, and you have a future date/time stored, doesn't the time change when the time zone database changes. For example if

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was* after beta1. Oh, so it didn't hold up beta1 --- that's good. -- Bruce

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread D'Arcy J.M. Cain
On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 19:02:38 +0200 Peter Eisentraut [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Am Dienstag, 9. Oktober 2007 schrieb D'Arcy J.M. Cain: +    Due to locale changes this type may have problems with dump and +    restore and care should be taken. With respect, this kind of advice is useless. What

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Bruce Momjian wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was* after beta1. Oh, so it didn't hold up

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Kevin Grittner
On Tue, Oct 9, 2007 at 12:11 PM, in message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Trevor Talbot wrote: Actually, I'm used to knowing how PostgreSQL does it, but looking at things again I remember some confusion I had when first encountering the timestamp types. I don't

Re: [HACKERS] type money causes unrestorable dump

2007-10-09 Thread Gregory Stark
D'Arcy J.M. Cain [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: That said, I wonder if there is another answer to this question. Perhaps the functions in cash.c can be pulled out and made into external functions that can be fed an int (long) and output the desired format. That way we could use the existing int

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was* after beta1.

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Martijn van Oosterhout
On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 06:40:23PM +0200, Pavel Stehule wrote: It needs always seq scan :(, and take space on buffer cache. Solution based on random generated PK are much faster. I collaborate with one my customer. He shows random products from 10K products on every page of one eShop. And he

Re: [HACKERS] mal advice in FAQ 4.1.

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Martijn van Oosterhout [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Tue, Oct 09, 2007 at 06:40:23PM +0200, Pavel Stehule wrote: It needs always seq scan :(, and take space on buffer cache. Solution based on random generated PK are much faster. I collaborate with one my customer. He shows random

Re: [HACKERS] First steps with 8.3 and autovacuum launcher

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Thu, 2007-10-04 at 17:33 -0400, Alvaro Herrera wrote: Simon Riggs escribió: Seems like we don't need to mess with the deadlock checker itself. We can rely on the process at the head of the lock wait queue to sort this out for us. So all we need do is look at the isAutovacuum flag on

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Pavel Stehule wrote: 4.1) To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; + On bigger tables this solution is slow. Please, find smarter solution on network. Well, give me a better example that works. 4.6) ILIKE is slow, specially on

Re: [HACKERS] Timezone database changes

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Kevin Grittner wrote: Probably, but we need a lot more than that to conform to the standard and to avoid surprising behavior.  The first of the two statements below is valid ANSI syntax to add one day to the current moment. That's the lack of standard interval support, which is an entirely

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was* after

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Jan Wieck wrote: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Doing it the way you did with no warning, right before beta, and then leaving is the worse of all times. I am surprised we are not

[HACKERS] Locale + encoding combinations

2007-10-09 Thread Dave Page
I'm working on some code for pgInstaller that will check the locale and encoding selected by the user are a valid combination. The changes recently added to initdb (which highlighted the UTF-8 issue on Windows that Tom posted about) appear to only allow the default encoding for the locale to be

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Bruce Momjian wrote: Andrew Dunstan wrote: Can somebody please explain to me what beta means if you can commit new stuff after it has been declared? We allow /contrib to be more lax about beta changes. I think we should be looking long and hard at that. I can't see any

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner
Bruce Momjian wrote: Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was*

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Dave Page
Bruce Momjian wrote: Can somebody please explain to me what beta means if you can commit new stuff after it has been declared? We allow /contrib to be more lax about beta changes. Why? When people were complaining about not being able to use TSearch because their ISPs wouldn't install

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Dave Page wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Can somebody please explain to me what beta means if you can commit new stuff after it has been declared? We allow /contrib to be more lax about beta changes. Why? When people were complaining about not being able to use TSearch because their

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Stefan Kaltenbrunner
Magnus Hagander wrote: Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Uh, it *was*

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Jan Wieck
On 10/9/2007 1:06 AM, Bruce Momjian wrote: Jan Wieck wrote: On 10/8/2007 1:34 PM, Tom Lane wrote: Magnus Hagander [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Marko Kreen wrote: Because of the bad timing it would have been -core call anyway whether it gets in or not so Jan asked -core directly. That's my

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Magnus Hagander
Bruce Momjian wrote: Dave Page wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Can somebody please explain to me what beta means if you can commit new stuff after it has been declared? We allow /contrib to be more lax about beta changes. Why? When people were complaining about not being able to use TSearch

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule wrote: 4.1) To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; + On bigger tables this solution is slow. Please, find smarter solution on network. Well, give me a better

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Pavel Stehule wrote: 2007/10/9, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule wrote: 4.1) To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; + On bigger tables this solution is slow. Please, find smarter solution on

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Dave Page
Bruce Momjian wrote: Dave Page wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: Can somebody please explain to me what beta means if you can commit new stuff after it has been declared? We allow /contrib to be more lax about beta changes. Why? When people were complaining about not being able to use TSearch

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Jan Wieck
On 10/9/2007 4:22 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: Jan Wieck wrote: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Doing it the way you did with no warning, right before beta, and then leaving is the worse

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/10/9, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule wrote: 2007/10/9, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavel Stehule wrote: 4.1) To SELECT a random row, use: SELECT col FROM tab ORDER BY random() LIMIT 1; + On bigger tables this

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Pavel Stehule wrote: Better universal solution doesn't exist. Exists only unelegant solutions - but mutch faster. SELECT id, ... FROM data WHERE id = ANY(ARRAY( SELECT (random()*:max_id)::int FROM generate_series(1,20)))

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Jan Wieck wrote: On 10/9/2007 4:22 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: Jan Wieck wrote: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Doing it the way you did with no warning, right before beta, and then

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Jan Wieck
On 10/9/2007 5:13 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: Jan Wieck wrote: On 10/9/2007 4:22 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: Jan Wieck wrote: I don't see how timing has anything to do with this. You could have added it between beta1 and beta2 after sufficient hackers discussion. Doing it the way you did

Re: [HACKERS] Locale + encoding combinations

2007-10-09 Thread Peter Eisentraut
Dave Page wrote: Is there any reason not to accept other combinations that setlocale() is happy with? setlocale() sets the locale. How does it accept a combination? -- Peter Eisentraut http://developer.postgresql.org/~petere/ ---(end of

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Pavel Stehule
ok. I accept it. Can be some note there? Not this strange select. Well, with 8.3 having this be faster I am thinking we should wait to see if the hacks are needed. difference, on 10K lines (on small think table) postgres=# select * from test where i = any(array(select

Re: [HACKERS] Locale + encoding combinations

2007-10-09 Thread Dave Page
Peter Eisentraut wrote: Dave Page wrote: Is there any reason not to accept other combinations that setlocale() is happy with? setlocale() sets the locale. How does it accept a combination? setlocale(LC_CTYPE, English_United Kingdom.65001) will return null (and not change anything)

Re: [HACKERS] ECPG regression tests

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Magnus Hagander wrote: (Hint: if you don't put the PlatformSDK directories first in the INCLUDE and LIB lists bad and inexplicable things can happen.) Pick up the latest version of run_build.pl in CVS if you want to run this in your buildfarm animal now. A release

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 17:13 -0400, Bruce Momjian wrote: I go back to my original question, do you understand the process that has to be followed for patch submission/application, and that it applies to all of us, including you? I think you're braking a little hard here. Nothing bad has

Re: [HACKERS] some points for FAQ

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Pavel Stehule wrote: ok. I accept it. Can be some note there? Not this strange select. Well, with 8.3 having this be faster I am thinking we should wait to see if the hacks are needed. difference, on 10K lines (on small think table) postgres=# select * from test where i =

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Andrew Dunstan
Simon Riggs wrote: That close to release, only Core members should be doing that and Jan is Core. My understanding (not being a member :-) ) is that Core is an administrative group, not a group of committers. Some members of Core are committers, some not, some committers are in Core,

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Simon Riggs
On Tue, 2007-10-09 at 17:55 -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: That close to release, only Core members should be doing that and Jan is Core. My understanding (not being a member :-) ) is that Core is an administrative group, not a group of committers. Some members of Core

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Joshua D. Drake
On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 17:55:48 -0400 Andrew Dunstan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: That close to release, only Core members should be doing that and Jan is Core. My understanding (not being a member :-) ) is that Core is an administrative group, not a group of

Re: [HACKERS] Skytools committed without hackers discussion/review

2007-10-09 Thread Bruce Momjian
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Simon Riggs wrote: That close to release, only Core members should be doing that and Jan is Core. My understanding (not being a member :-) ) is that Core is an administrative group, not a group of committers. Some members of Core are committers, some

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