The reason I asked about forum features is that this 'community' is currently a discussion list, and a blog/CMS is not a replacement for the purely conversational aspects. So Im just checking whether you are proposing that this list be conducted only using bloggy stuff, rather than as a forum that may be part of a larger system which has blog, news, group, poll & multimedia features as well, which is what I originally assumed was being proposed.
You can certainly link to your own blog here without fearing the spammer label. Paying bills and all the server tech & development issues are not problems too large to be overcome with a little concerted effort, the point I was trying to make is someone still ahs to do it, and we then become reliant on them rather than yahoo. What happens if they get hit by a bis, who owns the domain name, etc? In practice these issues may only cause problems once every few years or never, but as part of your motivation seems to be escaping yahoo, have to point out that yahoo's current role is not completely trivial to duplicate, that they have drawbacks but also some strengths. I dont really find the whole walmart thing to be a great fit for my feelings on yahoo and the like. Now despite any reservations I may have as to specifics, I would wholeheartedly support some sort of move that combined the best of yahoo groups, forums, blogs, news sites, wiki's, video, audio etc. My main reservation remains whether enough people are interested in it and see the need. As I am personally very interested in how much the net can be used to form communities to do stuff that people are often inclined to prefer doing in person, I wish I could help change this. I do not know if its causes are a failure of tools & services in the past thats puts people off, or people get familiar with what they know, or people meet in real life and maintain their relationships more in that way from that point. Or whether people do not actually have that much time per day to dedicate to online communities, or whether the most natural way people think of helping is by simple conversation-like responses rather than organizing knowledge into a highly structured form. Id like to use the ourmedia groups as an example of a drupal site where there is a community gathered at one site on a very broad topic, but with many subgroups of the users own creation, where interested members of the community can gather to discuss, blog etc around a specific topic or theme. But ourmedia has always been too slow for me to really get into below the surface at all, I just clicked on a group and it took nearly 20 seconds to lod the page, and that always send me running in the opposite direction. But regardless of that, has this use of groups worked at ourmedia, is there a real community there, and lots of subcommunities, making good use of the features? Did it take long for people to do this, has it faded or grown, have other services like blip suceeded? Im sort of guessing that if any of them had fully suceeded then this list may appear slightly more obsolete than it actually seems to be. Cheers Steve Elbows --- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, Ron Watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I agree that the development activity of scoop has not been very active, > > I am sure that Drupal has improved markedly over the last couple of > years and could probably easily replicate Scoop these days. > > Scoop is CMS and Bloggy, but it has that rating system and > recommended diaries that allow good content to bubble up nicely. > > The input and navigation interface are really rather simple, and I'm > just guessing, but I don't think there is a lot of modification > needed out of the box to get it to perform those functions, and those > functions work. > > If we had news stories, highlighted or reviewed and/or blogged video, > tutorials, group projects, etc. It would not seem so bloggy. Think of > a Community Media Blog. > > I put out a call for a group project a couple weeks ago to the > community here, and it's gone. Nobody will ever see it again. My > window for collaboration opened and closed in a day or so. That's not > cool. > > We can't even link to our own blog here without fearing the spammer > label. > > As far as paying a bill and such, I don't think that is too big a > problem. Someone in this community must have server space, and most > of the content would be hosted elsewhere (blip, dreamhost, flickr, > etc.) so data transfer wouldn't be too outrageous. > > Of course we could always fund drive and such; a far easier task if > you have something tangible and cool like a fat community site. > > Another 15 minutes I've just poured into the blackhole of Yahoo > lists. If I had a nickel for every minute I've spent on Yahoo Lists... > > I'm starting to feel the same kind of guilt I feel shopping at WalMart. > > Cheers, > > Ron Watson > > On the Web: > http://pawsitivevybe.com > http://k9disc.com > http://k9disc.blip.tv > > > On Feb 26, 2007, at 1:57 PM, Steve Watkins wrote: > > > At early stage of looking at scoop I cant see why it would be much > > different to learning any other CMS. For my own personal tastes scoop > > seems slightly long in the tooth and perhaps not kept fresh enough, > > and not enough add-ons to speed feature development, but I may be > > missing an active scoop devel community somewhere. Id rather use > > drupal, but its safe to say there are some people who dont like > > drupal, and like anything it has its flaws. > > > > Which bits of scoop make you so keen on it? Has it got anything > > resemblign a forum for discussions, I mosstly see CMS and bloggy > > stuff? > > > > The advantages to creating and maintaining it ourselves are apparent, > > but there are also some drawbacks. It means that 'we' has to be > > defined, that someone has to pay a bill and someone has to maintain > > the server and people have to invest time coding it. Im sure that just > > enough of this time & passion exists, but will require a lot of actual > > users to use the stuff in order to be anything approaching > > 'sustainable'. Right now theres no responsibility on any of us to make > > sure the server that runs this list stays operational. True we are > > therefore placing fate of group in yahoo hands, but they also have the > > resources to cope. > > > > Regarding how this community can be useful to to public at large, > > again Id agree that the yahoo list is not the best way. Sometimes new > > people have been directed here for help, often theyve been helped > > quickly, but it can be a bit daunting and the search falility and lack > > of groupings of posts into different subforums doesnt help. > > > > But in tthe past it seems like most people who wanted to help people > > in this way, with guides and information, set up their own sites to do > > so. I dont know if a wiki or any other collaborative CMS or forum > > could deliver the results that freevlog has, for example. Wikis and > > stuff can do great things, but usually find far less people prepared > > to contribute to them than are prepared to supply the same information > > as part of a list or forum conversation. > > > > I dunno, as I said Id love to see a change happen and I think there is > > some merit in bringing lots of different kinds of information and > > communication systems together into one community site that works on > > multiple fronts. It certainly would help me to remember the other > > stuff exists if it were all under one roof. > > > > On a semi-related note Id love to see more experimental non-commercial > > community video sites, trying things out, experiemnting with strange > > tech, and being genuinely community run & driven. But thats easy to > > say is another thing I cant explain properly without showing everyone > > a working example, which wouldnt work without people, oh I dunno, Im > > making no sense, I'll stew on this one for a while. > > > > Cheers > > > > Steve Elbows > > > > --- In videoblogging@yahoogroups.com, Ron Watson <k9disc@> wrote: > > > > > > > > I know that people have started wikis and other CMS apps, but these > > > require a bit of knowledge and experience, or people have to learn > > > something new. > > > > > > When I think of the hundreds of conversations that I would like to > > > recall and/or research, hundreds of valuable threads and ideas, I > > > have no idea where to begin with these groups. > > > > > > The feature set of scoop is what I think we need, and where I think > > > we should move, especially if we are going have an impact and > > > transfer this groups values to people. > > > > > > I love blip, but I'm just thinking of an independent place for > > > videobloggers to congregate and share information. Something that > > we, > > > not Yahoo, create and maintain. If we want an additional feature we > > > install it. If we have a problem we resolve it. > > > > > > Ron Watson > > > > > > On the Web: > > > http://pawsitivevybe.com > > > http://k9disc.com > > > http://k9disc.blip.tv > > > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 2007, at 11:46 AM, sdickert@ wrote: > > > > > > > Okay - if off Yahoo is what you desire - what are the feat you > > want? > > > > > > > > Ability to email each other on a mailing list? > > > > Community/moblogging? > > > > Threaded comments? > > > > Personal diaries? > > > > Forums with threads? > > > > > > > > What are the features you desire? What is the problem you want to > > > > solve? > > > > > > > > I think of what blip.tv offers and what blubrry.com offers. > > What do > > > > you specifically want? > > > > --- > > > > Sanford Dickert > > > > Rawlings Atlantic Inc > > > > (954) 323 4450 > > > > > > > > Sent from my treo 650 > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > > > From: Ron Watson <k9disc@> > > > > Subj: Re: [videoblogging] Re: Vlogging about Vlogging - Vlogging > > > > about Life > > > > Date: Sun Feb 25, 2007 5:03 pm > > > > Size: 2K > > > > To: videoblogging@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > What are the Yahoo groups core values and how do we transmit > > them to > > > > > > the newbies and other folks stepping up to the camcorder? > > > > > > > > While I love this group and find the information to be totally > > > > priceless, I find this juxtaposition that Steve puts up here to be > > > > quite interesting. > > > > > > > > We're doing all of our serious business at the Wal-Mart of the > > net, a > > > > Yahoo Group. > > > > > > > > It's pretty ironic, really. > > > > > > > > All the reliance that we have on the Open Source Community, all > > the > > > > talk of grassroots and content creator control, and here we are > > > > spending hours and hours on a Yahoo List. > > > > > > > > Talk about flushing stuff down the memory hole. > > > > > > > > These lists were not meant to be communities. > > > > > > > > They are dysfunctional on their face, and are really only suitable > > > > for announcements and such. > > > > > > > > What this Yahoo Group needs is a Scoop site. > > > > > > > > This Yahoo group should build the dailyKos of Videoblogging. > > > > > > > > That's what we need to do, and that's how we're going to be > > able to > > > > compete with all of the MyHeavy's that are going to be coming > > at us. > > > > > > > > We need a megaphone, and all we got here is a mailing list; we > > can't > > > > even embed images! > > > > > > > > Anyway, I'd be happy to pitch in wholeheartedly, although I don't > > > > have the DB/MYSQL knowledge to get Scoop configured, I'm sure I > > could > > > > help dial her in. > > > > > > > > I don't think any of the other CMS setups are as community > > organized > > > > as scoop, and don't think they would be as effective as scoop > > for a > > > > couple thousand users. > > > > > > > > Check out: > > > > http://boomantribune.com > > > > http://dailykos.com > > > > > > > > If you haven't seen a scoop site. > > > > > > > > Anyway, just shooting my mouth off again, but I think the > > disconnect > > > > I felt at Steve's quoted comment is something that we must deal > > with > > > > if we are to mold any sort of values for newbies and the public in > > > > general. > > > > > > > > I think the way to do that is to get our attention off this > > list and > > > > on building something. > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > Ron Watson > > > > > > > > On the Web: > > > > http://pawsitivevybe.com > > > > http://k9disc.com > > > > http://k9disc.blip.tv > > > > > > > > On Feb 25, 2007, at 2:48 PM, Steve Garfield wrote: > > > > > > > > > At the public access station where I taught video blogging for a > > > > > number of sessions, they've done away with the stand alone video > > > > > blogging class and now have an 'Adding Multimedia to Your Web > > Page' > > > > > class because people want to know how to put pictures, audio and > > > > > video on the web to share... > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cctvcambridge.org/?q=node/94#html > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 25, 2007, at 2:08 PM, Gena wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > There are other folks "teaching" vlogging such as Videomaker > > > > > magazine > > > > > > who calls it "Vodcasting" They started a series of > > articles, have > > > > > some > > > > > > training videos and they are putting they thoughts and > > > > > interpretations > > > > > > on how to do it for their readers. Different views, different > > > > > agendas. > > > > > > > > --- message truncated --- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
