Pamela,
Good points. The arrangement in the US is apparently that the government
(NSF-sponsored funding, universities, labs. etc.) performs basic
research so that industry does not have to foot that bill or take that
risk. Then private industry does the lower risk "applied research" to
put products into the market.
For those who see this ploy as not exactly "capitalism as advertised",
but rather a highly subsidized machine - I would say that you are
connecting the dots properly.
Grant
On 1/28/17 4:53 PM, Pamela McCorduck wrote:
Before we blame any particular technology for what seems like an
epidemic of narcissism, we ought to remember that the 80s—or was it
the 70s?—were widely known as the Me Decade. Either way, long before
social media.
I’m always deeply amused by the libertarians who tell us how wicked
government interference is at exactly the time they’re making their
plush livings off a technology that wouldn’t have existed without
decades (the fifties, the sixties, the seventies) of government
investment. Would the Internet have happened anyway? Hard to imagine
private investors sitting still for an investment that wouldn’t pay
off for almost half a century.
So, drifting afar from a reality base isn’t unknown in Silly Valley.
On Jan 28, 2017, at 2:31 PM, Nick Thompson
<nickthomp...@earthlink.net <mailto:nickthomp...@earthlink.net>> wrote:
Steve –
Is there any way in which the computer industry has contributed to
the narcissistic pandemic that is sweeping the world. Is there
anything that participants in the computer industry could do tip the
world back toward a fact-based attractor?
If the answer to that question is no, then I suppose that starting
that barfight might be your highest and best use. Let me know which
bar you are going to, so I can come and watch.
But I think the question is yes.
Nick
Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology
Clark University
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
<http://home.earthlink.net/%7Enickthompson/naturaldesigns/>
*From:*Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com]*On Behalf Of*Steven A
Smith
*Sent:*Saturday, January 28, 2017 1:15 PM
*To:*The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
<friam@redfish.com <mailto:friam@redfish.com>>
*Subject:*Re: [FRIAM] [[Narcissism Again]again]
Toolkit? This rusty old box filled with rusty things that once
resembled sharp tools and useful fasteners?
I was thinking that if we *all* burned one gallon of petrol *less* a
month (and everyone "like us") the demand would drop commensurately
and the cost/value proposition for the pipelines we all love to hate
would (eventually) drop below a certain threshold.
Similarly, if we *all* made it a point to have one *more* thoughtful
conversation (not just a rant) with those not already in the choir,
we might reverse the tide of *ugly* populism and replace it with
something more human (maybe still a form of populism, but not
nationalistic/xenophobic/misogynistic?).
If we *all* quit worrying about how the Trump Ascension was going to
hurt *our* personal context and recognized how it was going to hurt
(or in some twisted or strange way help) the larger context and then
only consider how our personal context would be effected in turn by
the larger context (is a happier, healthier, more informed society
good or bad for you and your family? vs can I pay lower taxes, get
more government services and be afforded less expensive access to
other resources nominally part of the commons?)
et cetera, ad nauseum
I know I'm preaching (somewhat) to the choir here, time to take my
own advice and go start a barfight with a Trumpian or something,
- Steve
Ok Steve,
The only reason to accept responsibility is to Take Charge.
I have been able to think of only one concrete thing that I can do
with my limited set of skills: Write Apple and tell them to stop
calling new products “I-this” and “I-that.” When are they going to
release the WE-phone.
You must have something in your tool kit more effective than that!
Nick
Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology
Clark University
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
<http://home.earthlink.net/%7Enickthompson/naturaldesigns/>
*From:*Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com]*On Behalf Of*Steven
A Smith
*Sent:*Saturday, January 28, 2017 9:38 AM
*To:*The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee
Group<friam@redfish.com> <mailto:friam@redfish.com>
*Subject:*Re: [FRIAM] [[Narcissism Again]again]
What can WE hobbits do?
Scratch our hairy knuckles and indulge in second dinnerses?
Fun aside, I DO appreciate your sentiment here and agree that the
Narcissist in Chief is at least partly a (focused) reflection of our
own worst qualities, and *perhaps* if we tend our own garden even a
little, it will help with the greater picture.
- Candide
Nick
Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology
Clark University
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
<http://home.earthlink.net/%7Enickthompson/naturaldesigns/>
*From:*Friam [mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com]*On Behalf Of*Jochen
Fromm
*Sent:*Saturday, January 28, 2017 1:39 AM
*To:*The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee
Group<friam@redfish.com> <mailto:friam@redfish.com>;
Friam<Friam@redfish.com> <mailto:Friam@redfish.com>
*Cc:*penny thompson<penny.thomp...@earthlink.net>
<mailto:penny.thomp...@earthlink.net>; 'Bruce
Simon'<bjs...@yahoo.com> <mailto:bjs...@yahoo.com>; 'Dix
McComas'<dixmccom...@gmail.com> <mailto:dixmccom...@gmail.com>;
'Grant Franks'<grantfra...@earthlink.net>
<mailto:grantfra...@earthlink.net>
*Subject:*Re: [FRIAM] [[Narcissism Again]again]
Yes, agree. Trump’s point of view is “Whatever I can win with is
true.” And if he wins with what we call “a lie”, it is true for
him. Exactly.
If you ask how we can counter and resist him, then I would say
peaceful protests are the right way. The women's march was
impressive, and the rebellion of the social media managers from the
national parks is really refreshing. Who would have thought that
the national parks would strike back? Like Treebeard who becomes alive.
In JK Rowling's novels it is the little creatures like the house
elves that beat the evil in the end. In Tolkien's Lord of the Rings
it is the Hobbits that beat the evil enemy. I think in this case
people like Ken Bone are the Hobbits of the 21st century. The
modern Hobbits are adverage midwestern guys who support Mr. T-Rump
and his "party" on Twitter and hope to get a bit rich and famous
along the way.
People like Ken Bone are like Frodo the Hobbit, Mr. T-Rump is
Sauron and Jack Dorsey is the ringwraith. Will Ken Bone throw the
ring into Mt. Doom, i.e. will he stop following Trump on Twitter
and/or quit Twitter completely? If we all stop following and
listening him he loses his power. This includes the senior
Republican politicians who do not speak up against him because they
hope for a job in his administration.
Cheers,
Jochen
Sent from my Tricorder
-------- Original message --------
From: Nick Thompson <nickthomp...@earthlink.net
<mailto:nickthomp...@earthlink.net>>
Date: 1/28/17 01:57 (GMT+01:00)
To: Friam <Friam@redfish.com <mailto:Friam@redfish.com>>
Cc: penny thompson <penny.thomp...@earthlink.net
<mailto:penny.thomp...@earthlink.net>>, 'Bruce Simon'
<bjs...@yahoo.com <mailto:bjs...@yahoo.com>>, 'Dix McComas'
<dixmccom...@gmail.com <mailto:dixmccom...@gmail.com>>, 'Grant
Franks' <grantfra...@earthlink.net <mailto:grantfra...@earthlink.net>>
Subject: [FRIAM] [[Narcissism Again]again]
Hi everybody,
I kind of got buried by the list last week, but we seem to keep
coming back to this topic, even when we are talking about globalism.
So. Let me just share one thought. I have said a hundred times
that I think the great achievement of the Right in my life time has
been to problematize (Ugh!) the Deweyan consensus of the 1950’s
One of the elements of that consensus was that there is a truth of
most matters and if we gather inclusively, talk calmly, reason
closely, study carefully, investigate rigorously, we will,
together , come to it. What was, at the time of my coming of age,
the shared foundation of argument, became over last 50 years,/a
position in the argument. /The alternative to this Deweyan position
seems to be something like, “/There is no truth of the matter;
there is only the exercise of power. He who wins the argument, by
whatever means, wins the truth. Truth is not something that is
arrived at; it is won.”/
So. My sense of trump is that in fact, he is not lying. On the
contrary, he does not share the view of discourse that makes lying
a possibility. From Trump’s point of view, “Whatever I can win with
is true.” Hence, if he wins with what we call “a lie”, it is true.
I feel we are straying along the edge of some*Nietzschean*chasm
here. Unfortunately I haven’t read any Nietzsche . A brief
rummage in Wikipedia, led me toThe Parable of the Madman
<http://sourcebooks.fordham.edu/mod/nietzsche-madman.asp>. And THAT
led me to wonder if the TV Series,Madmen
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Men>, about marketing execs in
the 60’s, was written with Nietzsche in mind. In any case, if
there is ever a domain in which the truth is that which wins, it
would be marketing.
So, if we are going to counter Trump, it cannot be by demonstrating
that he lies. It has to be by demonstrating that liars don’t win.
Heavy lift.
Nick
Nicholas S. Thompson
Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology
Clark University
http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/
<http://home.earthlink.net/%7Enickthompson/naturaldesigns/>
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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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