Macdonald Stainsby wrote:
> What do comrades have to say about the advance from utopian (west European)
> socialism, al la people in the tradition of Saint Simon, Babeuf and Owen- to
> scientific socialism: is there a link between the development of
> industrialisation and the development of Marx's ideas?
Yes, or Marx's ideas would be wrong (i.e. ideas are determined or at least
influenced by material reality) . In a less theoretical sense, M/E were reacting to
the horrible state the (nascent) working class had been reduced to through
industrialisation. They took England as their model since it was the most
industrialised hence most of M/E's ideas are really about England though they were
seeking a general, global model.
>
> Is the advance from utopian to scientific doctrine more identifiable with the
> influence of Hegelian dialectics on Marx and others?
No, Marx and Engels were rebelling against German idealistic metaphysics and
embraced materialism. Engels tells the story in Socialism:Utopian and Scientific.
Very crudely, the basic idea of German idealism was that ideas determine reality.
Engles accused the Utopians of this, of thinking up ideas and trying to implement
into reality when things worked the other way around: ideas and ultimately
socialism grow out of material reality. Being is determined by reality and not the
other way 'round.
>
> Or have I created a false dichotomy, with both being important?
It wasn't you who created the dichotomy it was German metaphysics, ideas are a part
of material reality (they occur in brains,physical things).
Sam Pawlett
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