Piccinini certainly reports this MH
--- On Tue, 3/6/08, "Mathias Rösel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > From: "Mathias Rösel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: [LUTE] Re: theorbo sizes; theorbo definitions > To: "David Tayler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu> > Date: Tuesday, 3 June, 2008, 2:17 PM > I seem to recall that chitarone / theorbo did at first not > refer to the > extended neck but to the reentrant high tuning which was at > first used > on bass lutes (then still without bass extension). > Chitarone being the > big version of the chitara francese, a type of _lute_ > played in Italy. > Only later, when the extension was put up, the extended > neck remained > its distinctive feature, and the instrument came to be > called theorbo > exclusively. > > According to that draught of a definition, archlutes, > arciliuti, and > liuti attiorbati are not theorbos. > > Not sure about chapter and verse, maybe Jan Grueter's > thesis on continuo > playing with lutes. > > Mathias > > "David Tayler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > schrieb: > > > > >Exactly-- > > > > the distinction is a modern one, the historical one > > semi-interchangeable based on time & region. > > The only way to "define" an archlute as > distinct from a theorbo is to > > ignore the myriad historical examples where the terms > are used interchangeably. > > This distinction is similar to calling the classical > piano the > > "fortepiano"--it is not the precise > historical term, it is what we > > choose to call it. > > > > What we need is a new definition, and I'm happy to > have you improve > > on mine, it is just a starting point. > > In its broadest sense, the term to me seems to me to > refer to the > > neck, as in the theorbo-lute. > > An archlute then, is in its most general sense a > theorbo (according > > to the people who played it), > > and in its narrow sense, as well as modern sense, a > special type of > > theorbo, perhaps based more on the lute, perhaps > several different instruments. > > > > I don't see how we can discount the historical > record. The time for > > saying "they must have been mistaken", > "they" being the eyewitnesses, > > surely is past. > > How can they have made hundreds of mistakes with the > terms? The fact > > that the historical record does not reflect in any > sense two types of > > instruments with two uniform terms should be > interpreted, not discounted. > > > > I think a critique would be most helpful if followed > by an improved definition. > > > > > > dt > > > > > > > > > > Theorbo > > > > A bass lute or renaissance lute with an > extended neck enabling > > > > additional, unfretted bass notes: > instruments based on, or developed > > > > from these models. > > > > > >This definition includes archlutes and most > baroque-era lutes, which > > >makes it useful for persons who are not > lute-literate and useless as > > >a term of art for us insiders. > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html __________________________________________________________ Sent from Yahoo! Mail. A Smarter Email http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
