On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Behcet Sarikaya <sarikaya2...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 3:00 PM, Tom Herbert <therb...@google.com> wrote: >> On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Linda Dunbar <linda.dun...@huawei.com> >> wrote: >>> Tom, >>> >>> Are you saying that the term “VM” should only be described in motivation and >>> the proposed scheme should work for address mobility enabled by any methods? >>> >> Yes, that is my hope, with the constraint that this solution is for >> address mobility in realm DC network virtualization (i.e. this should >> not be reinventing mobile IP for instance) > > > Is this a comment on draft-sarikaya-nvo3-vmm-dmm-pmip-03.txt? >
i don't know... Consider in Iast week's Interim meeting I described the "virtualizing existing jobs" use case of networking virtualization. In this model, we would like to be able to migrate existing jobs between servers. For the networking part of this, we need to migrate addresses and and connection state. These jobs don't run in VMs, they run in the host's stack with some sort of containerization. While job is not migrating there is no impact, performance and behavior are unchanged. At most we need to perform encapsulation, but we may even be able to obviate that with some create use of IPv6 addressing (Identifier/Locator). Is this use case considered in your draft? Side note on your draft: From the introduction "Currently these networks are organized as one large Layer 2 network in a single building". I don't believe this is universally true and I hope it's not a fundamental design point, there are Layer 3 switched data center networks. Thanks, Tom > Regards, > > Behcet >> >> Tom >> >>> >>> >>> Linda >>> >>> >>> >>> From: nvo3 [mailto:nvo3-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tom Herbert >>> Sent: Monday, October 06, 2014 2:16 PM >>> >>> While it's a better title, I think my comment was meant to be more general. >>> VMs (and hypervisors) are references to specific mechanisms of server >>> virtualization, but not the only mechanisms that can be deployed (e.g. >>> container virtualization is not normally a VM and does not have an explicit >>> hypervisor). VM is really just one use case of network virtualization and >>> not in itself a networking term, so I think that mechanisms or protocols for >>> network virtualization really should be described without reference to VMs >>> unless there really is something VM specific about that. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Tom >>> >>> >>>> Anyone has better suggestions? >>>> >>>> >>>> Thank, Linda >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: nvo3 [mailto:nvo3-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Black, David >>>> Sent: Friday, October 03, 2014 8:15 PM >>>> To: Tom Herbert >>>> Cc: nvo3@ietf.org >>>> Subject: Re: [nvo3] FW: New Version Notification for >>>> draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility-scheme-00.txt >>>> >>>>> I would suggest that "Address mobility scheme" might be a better >>>>> title. VM migration is one instance of when we need address mobility, >>>>> but we'll need this in with container migration or when we just want >>>>> to move an virtual address between servers. >>>> >>>> I agree, and I think Larry pointed this out earlier. >>>> >>>>> Also, w.r.t. VM or >>>>> container migration, addresses are not the only networking state we >>>>> need to consider, we need consider how to move connection state (e.g. >>>>> open TCP connections bond to the address being moved)-- this seems to >>>>> be out of scope for this draft. >>>> >>>> OTOH, I would caution about getting too involved in this as both ends of >>>> the spectrum of connection state preservation are reasonable and used in >>>> practice: >>>> >>>> - VM live migration preserves TCP connections and the like. >>>> - IP address takeover on hardware failure doesn't preserve >>>> anything whose state was solely on the hardware that's now a >>>> smoking pile of parts. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> --David >>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Tom Herbert [mailto:therb...@google.com] >>>>> Sent: Friday, October 03, 2014 9:04 PM >>>>> To: Linda Dunbar >>>>> Cc: nvo3@ietf.org; Larry Kreeger (kreeger); Black, David >>>>> Subject: Re: [nvo3] FW: New Version Notification for >>>>> draft-merged-nvo3-vm- mobility-scheme-00.txt >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 10:22 AM, Linda Dunbar <linda.dun...@huawei.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> > As NVO3 new charter encourage solutions proposals, we added more >>>>> comprehensive solutions for the issues described in the >>>>> draft-ietf-nvo3-vm- mobility-issues. We now call it >>>>> "draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility-scheme-00" >>>>> > >>>>> I would suggest that "Address mobility scheme" might be a better >>>>> title. VM migration is one instance of when we need address mobility, >>>>> but we'll need this in with container migration or when we just want >>>>> to move an virtual address between servers. Also, w.r.t. VM or >>>>> container migration, addresses are not the only networking state we >>>>> need to consider, we need consider how to move connection state (e.g. >>>>> open TCP connections bond to the address being moved)-- this seems to >>>>> be out of scope for this draft. >>>>> >>>>> Tom >>>>> >>>>> > Comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated. >>>>> > >>>>> > Linda >>>>> > >>>>> > -----Original Message----- >>>>> > From: internet-dra...@ietf.org [mailto:internet-dra...@ietf.org] >>>>> > Sent: Friday, October 03, 2014 12:18 PM >>>>> > To: Rahul Aggarwal; Wim Henderickx; Ravi Shekhar; Luyuan Fang; Linda >>>>> > Dunbar; >>>>> Rahul Aggarwal; Luyuan Fang; Wim Henderickx; Ravi Shekhar; Yakov >>>>> Rekhter; Yakov Rekhter; Linda Dunbar; Ali Sajassi; Ali Sajassi >>>>> > Subject: New Version Notification for >>>>> > draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility-scheme- >>>>> 00.txt >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > A new version of I-D, draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility-scheme-00.txt >>>>> > has been successfully submitted by Linda Dunbar and posted to the >>>>> > IETF >>>>> repository. >>>>> > >>>>> > Name: draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility-scheme >>>>> > Revision: 00 >>>>> > Title: NVO3 VM Mobility Scheme >>>>> > Document date: 2014-10-03 >>>>> > Group: Individual Submission >>>>> > Pages: 24 >>>>> > URL: >>>>> > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-merged-nvo3-vm- >>>>> mobility-scheme-00.txt >>>>> > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-merged-nvo3-vm- >>>>> mobility-scheme/ >>>>> > Htmlized: >>>>> > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-merged-nvo3-vm-mobility- >>>>> scheme-00 >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Abstract: >>>>> > This document describes the schemes to overcome the network-related >>>>> > issues to achieve seamless Virtual Machine mobility in the data >>>>> > center and between data centers. >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >>>>> > submission >>>>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >>>>> > >>>>> > The IETF Secretariat >>>>> > >>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>> > nvo3 mailing list >>>>> > nvo3@ietf.org >>>>> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> nvo3 mailing list >>>> nvo3@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> nvo3 mailing list >> nvo3@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3 _______________________________________________ nvo3 mailing list nvo3@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3
