On Thursday 27 September 2012 15:32:45 Tony Su wrote: > Everything you suggest is possible and I'm of course willing to setup any > demo people may be interested in. > > The main thing is I would want some kind of concensus from "The Powers > that Be" there would be some kind of future if it really solves the > problem satisfactorly, no one wants to waste time on something that can't > happen.
I actually blogged about decision making in openSUSE at some point, see: http://blog.jospoortvliet.com/2011/10/discuss-here.html Hopefully that clarifies some things ;-) > The reason why I used the term "shepherding" is because I am always > interested in building something that can live independently of myself-- > I'm not looking to make myself indispensible, from the first day of > anything I do I'm looking to bring on others who want to build the same > thing. > > Also, awhile back I started penciling out what mass Translation for > openSUSE might become. Yes, all things start small. But, if this becomes > important to more people in openSUSE, I'd like to involve anyone who wants > this to enhance what they do and avoid being unable to deliver. > > Tony > > On Sep 27, 2012 2:38 AM, "Jos Poortvliet" <j...@opensuse.org> wrote: > > On Wednesday 26 September 2012 15:18:09 Tony Su wrote: > > > Hello Jan (and whoever else receives this, I'm not subscribed to all > > > the mail-lists on CC) > > > > > > Yes, it's quite possible that the initial translations might not be > > > "good enough" -- and ultimately since machine translations today still > > > cannot usually provide better than word for word literal word > > > substitution, "good enough" is probably best defined as understandable > > > although not with the smooth idiomatic linguistic structures that can > > > best be provided by a human being. > > > > > > What machine translation can provide is the ability to get the proper > > > meaning across, to communicate an idea properly. And, if human > > > resources aren't available, this is better than no communication at > > > all. > > > > > > As for accuracy... Particularly for short, "standard expressions" that > > > crop up again and again in the types of documents we produce, > > > Web-based translations provide a means for anyone to submit an > > > improvement or correction. Assuming that Google or Microsoft or > > > whoever is used as the Translation Partner properly evaluates, accepts > > > and implements suggestions for future use of the same expression, we > > > should expect that within rather short order future documents should > > > be translated extremely well. > > > > > > If there is any interest in openSUSE/SUSE to investiggate the > > > capabilities of this technology, a project should be designated that > > > can properly evaluate whether machine translation is worthless or > > > promising and if desired I am willing to shepherd it. > > > > 'shepherd' or 'do' ;-) > > > > I wouldn't know what would be needed to actually TEST this out - but > > you're right that there are plenty of pages not translated in plenty of > > languages. > > > > Quite a few of our sites are in github, maybe you can set up a test > > version with a translation system of, say, openbuildservice.org: fork > > https://github.com/openSUSE/o-b-s.org and add the translation system, > > then run it somewhere so ppl can check it out. If it's better than what > > we have (and from your comments I take it it will be) you can just make > > a merge request to the github repo and the maintainers get it up. And > > done, one down, a dozen to go :D > > > > Then there is the wiki. How do we support our translators with this, can > > google translate be helpful for that? For example, maybe it is possible > > to have an auto-translate run over our wiki pages so all pages get > > translations > > in say the basic 25 languages or so. Then people can edit as things used > > to are... > > > > Is that possible? Is there a mediawiki tool which can crawl our > > en.opensuse.org wiki and, for pages that have no de.opensuse.org, > > fr.opensuse.org etc etc equivalents, create and fill them? If you 'just' > > manage to do that, our wiki has become far more accessible to non-native > > speakers... > > > > Cheers, > > Jos > > > > > Tony > > > > > > On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 1:46 AM, Jan Engelhardt <jeng...@inai.de> wrote: > > > > On Tuesday 2012-09-11 23:20, Tony Su wrote: > > > >>Highly recommend posting machine-translated copy using either Google > > > >>Translate(http://translate.google.com/) or Microsoft > > > >>Translate(http://www.bing.com/translator) > > > >> > > > >>Both are free and only take seconds then ask for a native speaker > > > >>review to clean up any idioms and colloquials. > > > >> > > > > The time to weed out the bugs of automatic translation is close to > > > > doing a non-automated, more targeted translation. Especially the > > > > farther east you go on the globe (Japanese TL with Google is pretty > > > > much unusable in either direction) and/or dealing with > > > > highly-technical words (and fillers) - which the announcement is in > > > > no > > > > way short of, like "Call For Papers", "to keynote", "to kick off", > > > > "workshop", "track", "session", "usability expert", and (obviousisms > > > > like) "speakers talking".
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