[AsburyPark] Re: bang a drum

[Jack Pitzer]

You are wrong. I don't hate anybody, not even you, and I never mentioned the 
word hate.
But you did, several times. It's sad that you are trying to twist my words into 
hatred. That 
says quite a bit more about you then it says about me. I love my country, but I 
am 
saddened by what we've become. 
Please don't put words that I didn't use into my mouth.
I stand 100% behind every other statement I made.
The only one I'm willing to concede is it may have been in bad taste for me to 
call you 
ignorant.
Finally, many of Rev. Wrights statements were taken out of context via the 
YouTube 
soundbyte obsessed generation. I'm not saying I agree with him, but you only 
heard what 
the media wanted you to hear. I listened to complete versions of those same 
speeches, 
and they weren't as heinous as the general population has been led to believe. 
And let's 
not forget, Obama responded with one of the most eloquent speeches ever given 
about the 
race issue in our country, and he rejected Wright.
This isn't the America I grew up in, plus, I have a perspective that many of us 
don't have...I 
spent years and years of my life traveling around the world, and working 
alongside people 
of many different nationalities. I will never say "America is the greatest 
country" because I 
think we are a part of a larger world, and when you qualify anything as 
"greatest" "best" or 
"#1" you are speaking of competition. 

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Proving my point with bells.
> "And you call all that a "fresh breath of common sense"
> Unbelievable. And ignorant."
> 
> There's that hate-filled angry insults preceded by a few slanted headlines.
> Shooting wolves and delivering the front leg is a heinous act.
> Aborting babies is cool. Talking in tongues is bad, while the other guys 
> minister 
preaches
> against America in a racist voice.
> 
> And, of course, a woman's speech sickened you while it clearly has inspired 
> millions 
across the country you so
> readily declare your hatred of.
> 
> An ignorant person would read the headlines and day dream
> A person with a fresh breath of common sense would dig a little to get the 
> answers to 
those trivial things that perplex
> the high and mighty.
> 
> The wolves are like the deer, and sadly, the bears here in jersey.
> There's one simple answer for ya'.
>






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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[dapawprint]

http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantino\
ple/former/john_thermon_athenagoras.htm





--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "wernerapnj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" gabrielleobre@
wrote:
> >
> > is it this guy Werner?
> >
>
http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantino\
ple/former/jo
> hn_thermon_athenagoras.htm
> >
> > around the late 40;s 50's? sorry..kinda dumb of me not to go there
> > first, but i would have needed help anyway..its not that
clear..there
> > is also a constantinople guy.
> >
> >
> ==
>
> Seems so, This will clarify: http://tinyurl.com/3u9753
>
>
> (http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?
> name=News&file=article&sid=9073&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)
>
>
> "...His Eminence, Metropolitan Evangelos will also conduct a Trisagion
Service
> for the late Patriarch Athenagoras and place a wreath over a statue
erected by the City of
> Asbury Park in his honor on the Boardwalk. The Holy Cross Celebration
and Blessing of
> the Waters in Asbury Park was instituted by the then Archbishop of
North and South
> America and later Ecumenical Patriarch Athenagoras in 1947, with the
prayer that the
> world's oceans, which connect all peoples of the Earth, could also
become vessels that
> transmit the hope and triumph of Christ's Cross.
>
> The Holy Cross Celebration in Asbury Park, NJ, held annually in
September on the
> first Sunday following the Exaltation of the Holy Cross, is considered
to be one of
> the watershed and joyous events of the New Ecclesiastical Year for the
Greek
> Orthodox Metropolis of New Jersey, and as such, draws Orthodox
Faithful from
> throughout the Metropolitan area who join together in prayer as the
one Body of Christ."
>
> Werner
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[dapawprint]

http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantino\
ple/former/john_thermon_athenagoras.htm





--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "wernerapnj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" gabrielleobre@
wrote:
> >
> > is it this guy Werner?
> >
>
http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantino\
ple/former/jo
> hn_thermon_athenagoras.htm
> >
> > around the late 40;s 50's? sorry..kinda dumb of me not to go there
> > first, but i would have needed help anyway..its not that
clear..there
> > is also a constantinople guy.
> >
> >
> ==
>
> Seems so, This will clarify: http://tinyurl.com/3u9753
>
>
> (http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?
> name=News&file=article&sid=9073&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)
>
>
> "...His Eminence, Metropolitan Evangelos will also conduct a Trisagion
Service
> for the late Patriarch Athenagoras and place a wreath over a statue
erected by the City of
> Asbury Park in his honor on the Boardwalk. The Holy Cross Celebration
and Blessing of
> the Waters in Asbury Park was instituted by the then Archbishop of
North and South
> America and later Ecumenical Patriarch Athenagoras in 1947, with the
prayer that the
> world's oceans, which connect all peoples of the Earth, could also
become vessels that
> transmit the hope and triumph of Christ's Cross.
>
> The Holy Cross Celebration in Asbury Park, NJ, held annually in
September on the
> first Sunday following the Exaltation of the Holy Cross, is considered
to be one of
> the watershed and joyous events of the New Ecclesiastical Year for the
Greek
> Orthodox Metropolis of New Jersey, and as such, draws Orthodox
Faithful from
> throughout the Metropolitan area who join together in prayer as the
one Body of Christ."
>
> Werner
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> is it this guy Werner? 
> 
http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantinople/former/jo
hn_thermon_athenagoras.htm
> 
> around the late 40;s 50's?  sorry..kinda dumb of me not to go there
> first, but i would have needed help anyway..its not that clear..there
> is also a constantinople guy.
> 
>
==

Seems so, This will clarify: http://tinyurl.com/3u9753


(http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?
name=News&file=article&sid=9073&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)


"...His Eminence, Metropolitan Evangelos will also conduct a Trisagion Service
for the late Patriarch Athenagoras and place a wreath over a statue erected by 
the City of
Asbury Park in his honor on the Boardwalk. The Holy Cross Celebration and 
Blessing of
the Waters in Asbury Park was instituted by the then Archbishop of North and 
South
America and later Ecumenical Patriarch Athenagoras in 1947, with the prayer 
that the
world's oceans, which connect all peoples of the Earth, could also become 
vessels that
transmit the hope and triumph of Christ's Cross.

The Holy Cross Celebration in Asbury Park, NJ, held annually in September on the
first Sunday following the Exaltation of the Holy Cross, is considered to be 
one of
the watershed and joyous events of the New Ecclesiastical Year for the Greek
Orthodox Metropolis of New Jersey, and as such, draws Orthodox Faithful from 
throughout the Metropolitan area who join together in prayer as the one Body of 
Christ."

Werner






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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> is it this guy Werner? 
> 
http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantinople/former/jo
hn_thermon_athenagoras.htm
> 
> around the late 40;s 50's?  sorry..kinda dumb of me not to go there
> first, but i would have needed help anyway..its not that clear..there
> is also a constantinople guy.
> 
>

Seems so, This will clarify:  http://tinyurl.com/3u975


http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?
name=News&file=article&sid=9073&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0


"...His Eminence, Metropolitan Evangelos will also conduct a Trisagion Service 
for the late 
Patriarch Athenagoras and place a wreath over a statue erected by the City of 
Asbury 
Park in his honor on the Boardwalk. The Holy Cross Celebration and Blessing of 
the 
Waters in Asbury Park was instituted by the then Archbishop of North and South 
America 
and later Ecumenical Patriarch Athenagoras in 1947, with the prayer that the 
world's 
oceans, which connect all peoples of the Earth, could also become vessels that 
transmit 
the hope and triumph of Christ's Cross.

The Holy Cross Celebration in Asbury Park, NJ, held annually in September on 
the first 
Sunday following the Exaltation of the Holy Cross, is considered to be one of 
the 
watershed and joyous events of the New Ecclesiastical Year for the Greek 
Orthodox 
Metropolis of New Jersey, and as such, draws Orthodox Faithful from throughout 
the 
Metropolitan area who join together in prayer as the one Body of Christ."

Werner




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[AsburyPark] bang a drum

[traderdube]

Proving my point with bells.
“And you call all that a "fresh breath of common sense"
Unbelievable. And ignorant.”

There’s that hate-filled angry insults preceded by a few slanted headlines.
Shooting wolves and delivering the front leg is a heinous act.
Aborting babies is cool. Talking in tongues is bad, while the other guys 
minister preaches
against America in a racist voice.

And, of course, a woman's speech sickened you while it clearly has inspired 
millions across the country you so
readily declare your hatred of.

An ignorant person would read the headlines and day dream
A person with a fresh breath of common sense would dig a little to get the 
answers to those trivial things that perplex
the high and mighty.

The wolves are like the deer, and sadly, the bears here in jersey.
There's one simple answer for ya'. 



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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[Gabrielle Obre]

is it this guy Werner? 
http://www.orthodoxresearchinstitute.org/resources/hierarchs/constantinople/former/john_thermon_athenagoras.htm

around the late 40;s 50's?  sorry..kinda dumb of me not to go there
first, but i would have needed help anyway..its not that clear..there
is also a constantinople guy.


--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "wernerapnj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
wrote:
> >
> > I think I asked this before. Does anyone know who Patriarch
> > Athenegoras is? the guy by conventional hall.
> >
> =
> 
> Search: (greek Patriarch Athenagoras asbury park)
> 
> Werner
>





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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Gabrielle Obre]

this was such a nice thing to read. i am not a mother so i always
appreciate stuff like this from moms.   please god, give all young and
horny kids birth control. my dad used to say "I could never figure it
out...everyone was supposed to marry a virgin, but EVERYONE wanted to
get laid." lets hope the republicans don't win just so that Levi and
Bristol have a better chance at freedom. there is probably a contract
somewhere...



--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Jennifer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> One of my greatest fears is that my son would get a girl with a parent 
> like Palin pregnant.  I can only hope he will use condoms like I've 
> told him to even though the Sarah Palins of the world would consider 
> him way too young.  I feel for the kid who got her pregnant too.  
> That's two kids who probably may end up resenting one another a whole 
> lot over time.  Abstinence only parents seem to forget wat it was like 
> to be young and horny.
>





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[AsburyPark] Re: a question of balance

[Jack Pitzer]

Sarah Palin represents everything that I think is wrong with this country.
Her sarcastic, insult laden speech at the Republican convention sickened me, 
and that was 
her coming out party. She lost any respect that I had an open mind to at that 
very 
moment.
Her interviews with Katie Couric leave me speechless.
She advocates the senseless and violent killing of wolves.
She is a member of a church that thinks speaking in tongues is just fine.
She wants to see Roe vs. Wade overturned.
And you call all that a "fresh breath of common sense"
Unbelievable. And ignorant.

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Sorry Gabby, nothing to do with herbs on the list.
> All the extreme partisans who have gone overboard defending and exulting 
> their party's 
platforms and candidates really need to take a deep breath of fresh air. To 
think that this 
most important of elections can come down to party politics is a shame and a 
sin.  The 
most amazing thing about this polarized extremism is that is the part of peace 
love and 
understanding who are the radical hate spewing win at all costs while those 
button down 
conservatives are reeling from the past 8 years and have seemingly decided to 
flow with 
the times.
> 
> I sit at my laptop and read and read and read, hoping to gain the needed info 
> that will 
sway my vote, I especially try to take in everything Obama has to say; sadly, 
he hasn't 
come close to convincing me that he can do anything besides read a speech and 
act like a 
rock star whereas  I read the Republican hoopla and every now and then, 
contrary to their 
opponents, they bring up corruption and the need to stop accepting it, to fight 
it, and 
eliminate it.
> 
> Until Sarah Palin was nominated there was nary a mention of the "C" word. So 
> it took a 
woman, a Mom, A PTA member, a Mayor, a Govenor, and her fresh breath of common 
sense to tell America how she fought corruption.
> 
> Those of us who have worked and played and lived in Asbury Park for more than 
> a 
couple of weeks know exactly how corruption can ruin a good thing. Give credit 
where 
credit is due and open up your eyes to both sides and then try to make a 
learned decision. 
Or, be like a hinge swinging back and forth, rusting over time, but never going 
anywhere
>






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[AsburyPark] Re: a question of balance

[Gabrielle Obre]

sometimes these wonders just pop into my head...usually best to not
hit send.

DUDE...if you think that Palin is clean you are blinded.  she is all
female ugliness.  behind the scenes finagling, secrecy, i don't think
the world yet knows how ugly women can be. just like the librarian (i
think its the librarian) she scares the bejeezus out of me. AND...if
for no other reason, you are getting all the same creeps that we've
had...if nothing else a little freshening of the meat may be
beneficial.Palin is a ROVE creation more and more every day.

i am by no means a partisan person. i know the dems rot in many ways.
i am a Nader lover, but what good is someone like him when we have
done nothing to demand that we hear him and Paul and other third party
candidates. that is the real crime to me.  i consider our politics
fixed, just some minor differences between the parties...but after 8
years of complete deterioration, just change the (*&^%% sheets.




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Re: [AsburyPark] a question of balance

[Jersey Shore John]

Yes. And THANK GOODNESS 8 years of "Politics By Rove" DID NOTHING to  
poison the well.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 6:24 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Sorry Gabby, nothing to do with herbs on the list.
> All the extreme partisans who have gone overboard defending and  
> exulting their party's platforms and candidates really need to take  
> a deep breath of fresh air. To think that this most important of  
> elections can come down to party politics is a shame and a sin. The  
> most amazing thing about this polarized extremism is that is the  
> part of peace love and understanding who are the radical hate  
> spewing win at all costs while those button down conservatives are  
> reeling from the past 8 years and have seemingly decided to flow  
> with the times.
>
> I sit at my laptop and read and read and read, hoping to gain the  
> needed info that will sway my vote, I especially try to take in  
> everything Obama has to say; sadly, he hasn't come close to  
> convincing me that he can do anything besides read a speech and act  
> like a rock star whereas I read the Republican hoopla and every now  
> and then, contrary to their opponents, they bring up corruption and  
> the need to stop accepting it, to fight it, and eliminate it.
>
> Until Sarah Palin was nominated there was nary a mention of the "C"  
> word. So it took a woman, a Mom, A PTA member, a Mayor, a Govenor,  
> and her fresh breath of common sense to tell America how she fought  
> corruption.
>
> Those of us who have worked and played and lived in Asbury Park for  
> more than a couple of weeks know exactly how corruption can ruin a  
> good thing. Give credit where credit is due and open up your eyes  
> to both sides and then try to make a learned decision. Or, be like  
> a hinge swinging back and forth, rusting over time, but never going  
> anywhere
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Man of Love

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I think I asked this before. Does anyone know who Patriarch
> Athenegoras is? the guy by conventional hall.
>
=

Search: (greek Patriarch Athenagoras asbury park)

Werner




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[AsburyPark] a question of balance

[traderdube]

Sorry Gabby, nothing to do with herbs on the list.
All the extreme partisans who have gone overboard defending and exulting their 
party's platforms and candidates really need to take a deep breath of fresh 
air. To think that this most important of elections can come down to party 
politics is a shame and a sin.  The most amazing thing about this polarized 
extremism is that is the part of peace love and understanding who are the 
radical hate spewing win at all costs while those button down conservatives are 
reeling from the past 8 years and have seemingly decided to flow with the times.

I sit at my laptop and read and read and read, hoping to gain the needed info 
that will sway my vote, I especially try to take in everything Obama has to 
say; sadly, he hasn't come close to convincing me that he can do anything 
besides read a speech and act like a rock star whereas  I read the Republican 
hoopla and every now and then, contrary to their opponents, they bring up 
corruption and the need to stop accepting it, to fight it, and eliminate it.

Until Sarah Palin was nominated there was nary a mention of the "C" word. So it 
took a woman, a Mom, A PTA member, a Mayor, a Govenor, and her fresh breath of 
common sense to tell America how she fought corruption.

Those of us who have worked and played and lived in Asbury Park for more than a 
couple of weeks know exactly how corruption can ruin a good thing. Give credit 
where credit is due and open up your eyes to both sides and then try to make a 
learned decision. Or, be like a hinge swinging back and forth, rusting over 
time, but never going anywhere  



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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Jennifer]

One of my greatest fears is that my son would get a girl with a parent 
like Palin pregnant.  I can only hope he will use condoms like I've 
told him to even though the Sarah Palins of the world would consider 
him way too young.  I feel for the kid who got her pregnant too.  
That's two kids who probably may end up resenting one another a whole 
lot over time.  Abstinence only parents seem to forget wat it was like 
to be young and horny.  




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[AsburyPark] Man of Love

[Gabrielle Obre]

I think I asked this before. Does anyone know who Patriarch
Athenegoras is? the guy by conventional hall.




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[AsburyPark] Re: Value

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
>

every order in the electronic system is there - shorts, longs, options 
etc. All that is racked in up in programs to make the best play at that 
moment.

The players need volatility to have fun and make money. Like one guy 
said this morning on tv... this is action. The more volatility - the 
more "opportunities" there are.






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[AsburyPark] Re: Value

[radio881gal]

What determines value?
A source once told me that the stock market is like attending a 
ballet. But the value isn't in what price you put on the performance, 
but what the majority of the audience thought of it. 
Share value dillution is another issue and a big problem. But a 
bigger one is the sophistication happening in the equity markets 
today, where huge blocks are trading, or crossing, without anyone 
knowing party A was trying to dump so many shares. They often trade 
in what are called dark pools. The process is meant to ultimately 
protect your retirement funds, for one example, from a drop in share 
price due to market impact. But now other sophisticated players -- 
Bloomberg for one -- have figured ways to mine these deep pools, for 
a price. So these customers will have information that the average 
investor doesn't have. It's another blow to the SEC's on-going 
efforts to keep the markets a level playing field for Joe Six-Pack, 
if you will.
Maureen 

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf"  wrote:
> >
> > What determines value?
> > 
> 
> another market problem..
> 
> a guy like me goes and makes some moves to buy some GE (General 
> Electric) for stability and now (as of this minute) a nice dividend 
> based on stock price. I buy it at what I think is a great value 
even 
> taking into account GE financing arm and god only knows.
> 
> Then, a few hours later, a guy named Warren Buffet must of heard 
that 
> I buy GE for all the right reasons, and he says shit, Dave must 
know 
> something. So he picks up the phone, calls Mrs. Buffet and gets her 
> ok to move $3 BILLION into GE, getting a 10% dividend and all kinds 
> of other goodies to protect, more or less his investment. Then GE 
> makes his deal even nicer, allowing Mr. B to get their new stock 
> offering(funny paper money a company is permitted to issue at will) 
> at quite a bit less then, say a guy like me got to buy. Even though 
> the news was public yesterday, the news news news didn't come til 
> today. 
> 
> Large companies have the ability to destroy the average stockholder 
> as will. They do this by issuing almost any form of collateral or 
> perceived collateral.
>





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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[radio881gal]

Tommy -
I should hire you as my agent or at least forward your very kind 
posting to some of my editors!
Glad to help.
Listen, you know Wall St. worked very hard for years at making the 
processes there as opaque as possible - through escoteric jargon and 
a lot fierce gatekeepers. When you got someone to speak on the record 
they'd talk a mile a minute. I'll never forget the Merrill Lynch 
spokeswoman who had a fit, after one of these conference calls, when 
I said don't worry about my being accurate I just taped it all. She 
was furious!! Now why wouldn't they want you to be accurate? So they 
can dismiss the whole story when you get something wrong?
Part of the reason why they went to these hugely complex instruments 
was because market reforms had removed so many veils that the markets 
were becoming transparent - perish the thought.
Maureen 

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Mo,
> 
> I did read the post that Frank made for you.  
> 
> I wasn't even aware of the issue until you posted it.  Thanks for 
> doing so - it's an interesting insight.
> 
> For those of you who don't know, this business stuff is Marueen 
> Nevin's area of journalistic expertise.
> 
> That's why I asked her the questions.
> 
> We're futunate to have folks like her on this board with expertise 
> in such an important current event  (wish she was back on the 
radio).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal"  
> wrote:
> >
> > To my knowledge these are actual trades that are reported in 
these 
> > indices, not assigned values based on aspects of the assets or 
> what 
> > an insurer would give you in an accident.
> > These indices are a recent benefit to the market, since OTC 
> products 
> > have typically lacked transparency for this as well as other 
> reasons. 
> > Did you read the open letter from the auditors that Frank posted 
> for 
> > me yesterday?
> > Maureen
> > 
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > Are creditex and markit reliable?  Do people routinely take 
> issue 
> > > with their amounts (like I do with blue book on cars?)
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal" 
 
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Tommy -
> > > > Not sure if here you're referring to my post about the Wall 
> St. 
> > > > bailout.
> > > > If you are, I'd want to say that there are indexes by 
Creditex 
> > and 
> > > > Markit,  which contain traded prices on Credit Default Swaps 
> > (CDS) 
> > > > and Collaterolized Debt Obligations (CDOs). Paulson doesn't 
> want 
> > > > taxpayers paying the low prices the professional traders are 
> > > > currently paying for these. He's already said he wants 
> taxpayers 
> > > to 
> > > > buy these assets at future maturity rates. Wasn't that what 
> > Asbury 
> > > > Park residents wanted and didn't get in the redevelopment and 
> > > rehab 
> > > > zones? 
> > > > Maureen
> > > > 
> > > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with 
> an 
> > > asset 
> > > > > that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to 
> set 
> > a 
> > > > > value.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their 
assets 
> at 
> > > a 
> > > > > fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when 
someone 
> > > else 
> > > > is 
> > > > > valuing an asset under Mark to Market?
> > > > > 
> > > > > Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.
> > > > > 
> > > > > If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt 
with 
> > > burden 
> > > > > of valuing unique property?  :-)
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech" 
> > >  
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi Folks,
> > > > > >Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having 
> an 
> > > issue 
> > > > > with
> > > > > > her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along 
the 
> > > > > following.
> > > > > >  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com 
> > > > website, 
> > > > > but
> > > > > > hoped those interested might like to read the following 
as 
> > > well:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > -- Forwarded message --
> > > > > > From: Jay Hyde 
> > > > > > Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> > > > > > Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> > > > > > Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> > > > > > To: maureen@
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > September 30, 2008
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Dear Member of Congress:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > >  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that 
> proposals 
> > > > > advocating
> > > > > > suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting 
> are 
> > > not 
> > > > in 
> > > > > the
> > > > > > best interest of investors or the capital markets and 
> should 
> > > be 

[AsburyPark] Re: Value

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "oakdorf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> What determines value?
> 

another market problem..

a guy like me goes and makes some moves to buy some GE (General 
Electric) for stability and now (as of this minute) a nice dividend 
based on stock price. I buy it at what I think is a great value even 
taking into account GE financing arm and god only knows.

Then, a few hours later, a guy named Warren Buffet must of heard that 
I buy GE for all the right reasons, and he says shit, Dave must know 
something. So he picks up the phone, calls Mrs. Buffet and gets her 
ok to move $3 BILLION into GE, getting a 10% dividend and all kinds 
of other goodies to protect, more or less his investment. Then GE 
makes his deal even nicer, allowing Mr. B to get their new stock 
offering(funny paper money a company is permitted to issue at will) 
at quite a bit less then, say a guy like me got to buy. Even though 
the news was public yesterday, the news news news didn't come til 
today. 

Large companies have the ability to destroy the average stockholder 
as will. They do this by issuing almost any form of collateral or 
perceived collateral.




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

You said I offered no support. I did. Now, you've got other requests  
all lined up in order to cover yourself. Too bad. Next!

On Oct 2, 2008, at 1:33 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> John when the topic was which party did or did not want regulation
> of Fannie and Freddie, I posted a congressional hearing with members
> of each party weighing in.
>
> To prove "racism" by Republicans, you posted a column about the KKK
> and then others about college kids who call themselves conservative
> acting racist.
>
> Hardly the same.
>
> Will you EVER say anything about that congressional hearing?
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Support:
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/4srqem
> >
> > On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:
> >
> > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> > > >campaign
> > > > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
> > >
> > > You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just
> yelling
> > > accusations. There's no challenge in that.
> > >
> > > What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't
> respond
> > > this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said
> there,
> > > and instead are content to call people names).
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[justifiedright]

John when the topic was which party did or did not want regulation 
of Fannie and Freddie, I posted a congressional hearing with members 
of each party weighing in.

To prove "racism"  by Republicans, you posted a column about the KKK 
and then others about college kids who call themselves conservative 
acting racist.

Hardly the same.

Will you EVER say anything about that congressional hearing?



--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Support:
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/4srqem
> 
> On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:
> 
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> > >campaign
> > > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
> >
> > You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just 
yelling
> > accusations. There's no challenge in that.
> >
> > What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't 
respond
> > this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said 
there,
> > and instead are content to call people names).
> >
> >
> >
>





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[AsburyPark] Value

[oakdorf]

What determines value?

One partiular unit in North Beach has the master bed and part of the 
liv rm blocked by roof infront of it. It's like the architect could 
calculate correctly. The rest of the lv rm has nice south view and 
east views

I think the original asking price when "things were hot" was around 
$1.1m or $999.

I showed it yesterday and the sale price is alot,lot less.

For value, the couple asked good questions

- flimsly shower doors, the ac unit exhaust blows onto the tiny 
balcony etc..

They were looking at value.

Then came the "how much are the taxes..." and then an explanation of 
the abatement...

Value today is what you have in your pocket and what you are willing 
to take out of your pocket for that perceived value. 

If you bought a house intending to flip it, good chance you and or 
your bank are screwed...for now. UNless you have someone who is 
looking for a principal residence and likes your home, the price and 
value they see in it.

I got a Jeep. I thought that much off the sticker price is a better 
value for what I really needed it for compared to my first choices 
which I didn't want to struggle to pay for. 

And I don't know how some guys manage to drive Range Rovers around 
the streets of NYC ):






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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[justifiedright]

Mo,

I did read the post that Frank made for you.  

I wasn't even aware of the issue until you posted it.  Thanks for 
doing so - it's an interesting insight.

For those of you who don't know, this business stuff is Marueen 
Nevin's area of journalistic expertise.

That's why I asked her the questions.

We're futunate to have folks like her on this board with expertise 
in such an important current event  (wish she was back on the radio).




--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> To my knowledge these are actual trades that are reported in these 
> indices, not assigned values based on aspects of the assets or 
what 
> an insurer would give you in an accident.
> These indices are a recent benefit to the market, since OTC 
products 
> have typically lacked transparency for this as well as other 
reasons. 
> Did you read the open letter from the auditors that Frank posted 
for 
> me yesterday?
> Maureen
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > Are creditex and markit reliable?  Do people routinely take 
issue 
> > with their amounts (like I do with blue book on cars?)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal"  
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Tommy -
> > > Not sure if here you're referring to my post about the Wall 
St. 
> > > bailout.
> > > If you are, I'd want to say that there are indexes by Creditex 
> and 
> > > Markit,  which contain traded prices on Credit Default Swaps 
> (CDS) 
> > > and Collaterolized Debt Obligations (CDOs). Paulson doesn't 
want 
> > > taxpayers paying the low prices the professional traders are 
> > > currently paying for these. He's already said he wants 
taxpayers 
> > to 
> > > buy these assets at future maturity rates. Wasn't that what 
> Asbury 
> > > Park residents wanted and didn't get in the redevelopment and 
> > rehab 
> > > zones? 
> > > Maureen
> > > 
> > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with 
an 
> > asset 
> > > > that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to 
set 
> a 
> > > > value.
> > > > 
> > > > Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their assets 
at 
> > a 
> > > > fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when someone 
> > else 
> > > is 
> > > > valuing an asset under Mark to Market?
> > > > 
> > > > Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.
> > > > 
> > > > If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt with 
> > burden 
> > > > of valuing unique property?  :-)
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech" 
> >  
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Folks,
> > > > >Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having 
an 
> > issue 
> > > > with
> > > > > her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the 
> > > > following.
> > > > >  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com 
> > > website, 
> > > > but
> > > > > hoped those interested might like to read the following as 
> > well:
> > > > > 
> > > > > -- Forwarded message --
> > > > > From: Jay Hyde 
> > > > > Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> > > > > Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> > > > > Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> > > > > To: maureen@
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > September 30, 2008
> > > > > 
> > > > > Dear Member of Congress:
> > > > > 
> > > > >  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that 
proposals 
> > > > advocating
> > > > > suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting 
are 
> > not 
> > > in 
> > > > the
> > > > > best interest of investors or the capital markets and 
should 
> > be 
> > > > rejected. 
> > > > > 
> > > > >  The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in 
the
> > > > > fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to 
> informed 
> > > > market
> > > > > decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our 
view, 
> > > > investor
> > > > > confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask 
> the 
> > > > actual
> > > > > value of financial assets at a given point in time.  
> > > > > 
> > > > >  It is important to underscore that mark-to-market 
accounting 
> > has
> > > > > contributed positively to revelations about the severity 
of 
> the
> > > > > economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and 
> certain
> > > > > institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 
> > > > > 
> > > > >  Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and 
> Exchange
> > > > > Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting 
> > > > Standards
> > > > > Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-
market 
> > or 
> > > > fair
> > > > > value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-
> > market
> > > > > requirements for certain financial institutions when 
preparing
> > > > > financial s

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

Support:

http://tinyurl.com/4srqem

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> 

Once you ever get to see the fine print or hear it - JPM didn't take 
$6BILLON of Bear Alt-a mortages (the mortages many people were stuck 
into, regardless of incomes etc - a simple late for $10 (ten dollars) 
stuck you there) - and the banks got a higher rate (.25-.50) to resell.

So who covers the $6 Billion? Feds.

It's called an eraser. My accounting teacher would take off points on 
tests (which were returns) if we erased

JPM and Citi both got what they wanted - for free. A huge network of 
banks - branches in key locations that instantly makes them both 
powerhouses. If you go back 2-4 years - the movements in the banks 
stocks were based on takeover rumours - the same for Merrill etc.

Regional bank stocks moved based on the nationals desire to grow 
nationally. The FDIC raising of coverages was what the banks wanted 
years ago. Merrill had a service so that an individual with more then 
$100k could deposit monies throughout the country into hundreds of 
banks - so that they were all FDIC insured.

Learn to read for what you sign for.
 
ps...for sale 2001 s500 120,000 miles. Tommy check the blue book and 
give me a call.







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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

Support:

http://tinyurl.com/5jeklj

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

Support:

http://tinyurl.com/3pn4oa

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

Support:

http://tinyurl.com/5dq2n7


On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

Support:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se2dFXXeK3c

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

The "support" is everywhere, if you are blind to it:

http://tinyurl.com/2mucwp

On Oct 2, 2008, at 12:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama
> >campaign
> > IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.
>
> You aren't giving any support for what you say. Your're just yelling
> accusations. There's no challenge in that.
>
> What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond
> this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there,
> and instead are content to call people names).
>
>
> 




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[radio881gal]

To my knowledge these are actual trades that are reported in these 
indices, not assigned values based on aspects of the assets or what 
an insurer would give you in an accident.
These indices are a recent benefit to the market, since OTC products 
have typically lacked transparency for this as well as other reasons. 
Did you read the open letter from the auditors that Frank posted for 
me yesterday?
Maureen

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Are creditex and markit reliable?  Do people routinely take issue 
> with their amounts (like I do with blue book on cars?)
> 
> 
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal"  
> wrote:
> >
> > Tommy -
> > Not sure if here you're referring to my post about the Wall St. 
> > bailout.
> > If you are, I'd want to say that there are indexes by Creditex 
and 
> > Markit,  which contain traded prices on Credit Default Swaps 
(CDS) 
> > and Collaterolized Debt Obligations (CDOs). Paulson doesn't want 
> > taxpayers paying the low prices the professional traders are 
> > currently paying for these. He's already said he wants taxpayers 
> to 
> > buy these assets at future maturity rates. Wasn't that what 
Asbury 
> > Park residents wanted and didn't get in the redevelopment and 
> rehab 
> > zones? 
> > Maureen
> > 
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with an 
> asset 
> > > that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to set 
a 
> > > value.
> > > 
> > > Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their assets at 
> a 
> > > fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when someone 
> else 
> > is 
> > > valuing an asset under Mark to Market?
> > > 
> > > Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.
> > > 
> > > If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt with 
> burden 
> > > of valuing unique property?  :-)
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech" 
>  
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi Folks,
> > > >Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having an 
> issue 
> > > with
> > > > her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the 
> > > following.
> > > >  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com 
> > website, 
> > > but
> > > > hoped those interested might like to read the following as 
> well:
> > > > 
> > > > -- Forwarded message --
> > > > From: Jay Hyde 
> > > > Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> > > > Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> > > > Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> > > > To: maureen@
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > September 30, 2008
> > > > 
> > > > Dear Member of Congress:
> > > > 
> > > >  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that proposals 
> > > advocating
> > > > suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting are 
> not 
> > in 
> > > the
> > > > best interest of investors or the capital markets and should 
> be 
> > > rejected. 
> > > > 
> > > >  The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in the
> > > > fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to 
informed 
> > > market
> > > > decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our view, 
> > > investor
> > > > confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask 
the 
> > > actual
> > > > value of financial assets at a given point in time.  
> > > > 
> > > >  It is important to underscore that mark-to-market accounting 
> has
> > > > contributed positively to revelations about the severity of 
the
> > > > economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and 
certain
> > > > institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 
> > > > 
> > > >  Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and 
Exchange
> > > > Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting 
> > > Standards
> > > > Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-market 
> or 
> > > fair
> > > > value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-
> market
> > > > requirements for certain financial institutions when preparing
> > > > financial statements to be used by investors. 
> > > > 
> > > >  Although determining fair values for financial instruments 
in 
> an
> > > > illiquid market can be challenging, the best estimate of the 
> > prices
> > > > that would be received for such instruments in orderly 
> > transactions
> > > > occurring at the measurement date remains the most relevant
> > > > information for investors and policymakers. To lessen the
> > > > uncertainties about the value of these securities, it is 
> critical 
> > > that
> > > > investors continue to have the insight provided by the 
> > application 
> > > of
> > > > mark-to-market accounting principles. 
> > > > 
> > > >  Many of the current requirements stem from the Savings & 
Loan 
> > > crisis
> > > > in the 1980s, when we learned that not knowing th

[AsburyPark] Re: 50 Drug Arrests Bring State Atty Gen'l, County Prosecutor, County Sheriff to AP

[radio881gal]

Hi Denise -
This press conference was held at 10 AM this morning.
I was sitting next to Michelle Sahn from the Asbury Park Press, so I 
doubt it could've been in the Press before this. And, I haven't seen 
the report on Channel 12 yet, although its crew was there, too.
The arrests began on Sept 26 and ended this morning (Oct.2).
Sound from my interviews with Sheriff Guadagno and Chief Kinmon are 
up there now.
I'm working on the sound from the podium now, which was very soft.
I hope you'll check the report on AsburyRadio.com and leave your 
comments.
All best,
Maureen


--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, denise <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Maureen was this in the paper? 
> 
> 
> 
> - Original Message 
> From: radio881gal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 12:04:57 PM
> Subject: [AsburyPark] 50 Drug Arrests Bring State Atty Gen'l, 
County Prosecutor, County Sheriff to AP
> 
> 
> 22 of those arrested today are Gang Members, say law enforcement. 
See 
> report with photo and sound on AsburyRadio. com
> A cold kept me away from last night's council meeting. Sorry!!
> Maureen
> 
>  
> 
> 
>   
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





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[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[justifiedright]

I agree Denise, and I hope Pete doesn't hold it against the current 
topic matter, because as he say, he's done this on other topics.


--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, denise <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> My question is how long is it going to take for Pete to do 
something about this.
> 
> Pete should have stepped in with the first comment
> 
> This is not the first racist coment  by Mike Hemeon 

> > wrote:
> > >
> > >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he 
was
> > >in Iraq.
> 
> I know discussions on here get pretty heated but enough is enough
> 
> 
> 
> - Original Message 
> From: Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 10:53:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story
> 
> 
> MH: The Face of Republicanism.
> 
> On Oct 2, 2008, at 9:52 AM, justifiedright wrote:
> 
> > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, Mike Hemeon 

> > wrote:
> > >
> > >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he 
was
> > >in Iraq.
> >
> > Black assed? What's wrong with you? You need to stop that. Pete
> > could chuck you from the board for that.
> >
> >
> > 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
>  
> 
> 
>   
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[denise]

My question is how long is it going to take for Pete to do something about this.

Pete should have stepped in with the first comment

This is not the first racist coment  by Mike Hemeon 
> wrote:
> >
> >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was
> >in Iraq.

I know discussions on here get pretty heated but enough is enough



- Original Message 
From: Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 10:53:36 AM
Subject: Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story


MH: The Face of Republicanism.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 9:52 AM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, Mike Hemeon 
> wrote:
> >
> >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was
> >in Iraq.
>
> Black assed? What's wrong with you? You need to stop that. Pete
> could chuck you from the board for that.
>
>
> 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 


  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>   The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama 
>campaign  
> IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.

You aren't giving any support for what you say.  Your're just yelling 
accusations.  There's no challenge in that.

What say you about that congressional hearing (if you don't respond 
this time I'll just figure you don't want to face what was said there, 
and instead are content to call people names).




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Re: [AsburyPark] 50 Drug Arrests Bring State Atty Gen'l, County Prosecutor, County Sheriff to AP

[denise]

Maureen was this in the paper? 



- Original Message 
From: radio881gal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 12:04:57 PM
Subject: [AsburyPark] 50 Drug Arrests Bring State Atty Gen'l, County 
Prosecutor, County Sheriff to AP


22 of those arrested today are Gang Members, say law enforcement. See 
report with photo and sound on AsburyRadio. com
A cold kept me away from last night's council meeting. Sorry!!
Maureen

 


  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[justifiedright]

Are creditex and markit reliable?  Do people routinely take issue 
with their amounts (like I do with blue book on cars?)



--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "radio881gal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> Tommy -
> Not sure if here you're referring to my post about the Wall St. 
> bailout.
> If you are, I'd want to say that there are indexes by Creditex and 
> Markit,  which contain traded prices on Credit Default Swaps (CDS) 
> and Collaterolized Debt Obligations (CDOs). Paulson doesn't want 
> taxpayers paying the low prices the professional traders are 
> currently paying for these. He's already said he wants taxpayers 
to 
> buy these assets at future maturity rates. Wasn't that what Asbury 
> Park residents wanted and didn't get in the redevelopment and 
rehab 
> zones? 
> Maureen
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with an 
asset 
> > that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to set a 
> > value.
> > 
> > Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their assets at 
a 
> > fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when someone 
else 
> is 
> > valuing an asset under Mark to Market?
> > 
> > Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.
> > 
> > If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt with 
burden 
> > of valuing unique property?  :-)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech" 
 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Folks,
> > >Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having an 
issue 
> > with
> > > her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the 
> > following.
> > >  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com 
> website, 
> > but
> > > hoped those interested might like to read the following as 
well:
> > > 
> > > -- Forwarded message --
> > > From: Jay Hyde 
> > > Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> > > Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> > > Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> > > To: maureen@
> > > 
> > > 
> > > September 30, 2008
> > > 
> > > Dear Member of Congress:
> > > 
> > >  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that proposals 
> > advocating
> > > suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting are 
not 
> in 
> > the
> > > best interest of investors or the capital markets and should 
be 
> > rejected. 
> > > 
> > >  The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in the
> > > fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to informed 
> > market
> > > decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our view, 
> > investor
> > > confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask the 
> > actual
> > > value of financial assets at a given point in time.  
> > > 
> > >  It is important to underscore that mark-to-market accounting 
has
> > > contributed positively to revelations about the severity of the
> > > economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and certain
> > > institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 
> > > 
> > >  Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and Exchange
> > > Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting 
> > Standards
> > > Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-market 
or 
> > fair
> > > value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-
market
> > > requirements for certain financial institutions when preparing
> > > financial statements to be used by investors. 
> > > 
> > >  Although determining fair values for financial instruments in 
an
> > > illiquid market can be challenging, the best estimate of the 
> prices
> > > that would be received for such instruments in orderly 
> transactions
> > > occurring at the measurement date remains the most relevant
> > > information for investors and policymakers. To lessen the
> > > uncertainties about the value of these securities, it is 
critical 
> > that
> > > investors continue to have the insight provided by the 
> application 
> > of
> > > mark-to-market accounting principles. 
> > > 
> > >  Many of the current requirements stem from the Savings & Loan 
> > crisis
> > > in the 1980s, when we learned that not knowing the real, 
current
> > > values of financial instruments held by financial institutions 
> can 
> > be
> > > devastating when the bubble finally bursts and institutions 
are 
> > forced
> > > to close their doors. The current requirements provide a 
uniform 
> > and
> > > consistent method to measure market values and provide 
investors
> > > increased disclosures about those measurements. Suspending
> > > mark-to-market accounting would throw financial reporting back 
to 
> a
> > > time of less comparability, less consistency and less 
> transparency.
> > > 
> > >  If there are concerns with the impact of asset valuations on 
> > capital
> > > requirements of financial institutions, regulators have 
> > alternatives
> > > other than obscuring i

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

  The racist response in the Republican Party to the Obama campaign  
IS the issue. Stop trying to sweep this under the rug.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 11:45 AM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > MH: The Face of Republicanism.
>
> John I'm not shouting you down here, but you aren't even talking
> issues now. You're just name calling. I know the heat of the moment
> can catch up with anyone but I also know you can do better than that
> in a discussion.
>
> Pete's not going to put up with that and he's going to make some
> changes we are all going to hate.
>
> Join the discussion.
>
> Did you look at the video of the congressional hearing?
>
> What's your thought on that?
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[radio881gal]

Tommy -
Not sure if here you're referring to my post about the Wall St. 
bailout.
If you are, I'd want to say that there are indexes by Creditex and 
Markit,  which contain traded prices on Credit Default Swaps (CDS) 
and Collaterolized Debt Obligations (CDOs). Paulson doesn't want 
taxpayers paying the low prices the professional traders are 
currently paying for these. He's already said he wants taxpayers to 
buy these assets at future maturity rates. Wasn't that what Asbury 
Park residents wanted and didn't get in the redevelopment and rehab 
zones? 
Maureen

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with an asset 
> that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to set a 
> value.
> 
> Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their assets at a 
> fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when someone else 
is 
> valuing an asset under Mark to Market?
> 
> Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.
> 
> If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt with burden 
> of valuing unique property?  :-)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech"  
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Folks,
> >Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having an issue 
> with
> > her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the 
> following.
> >  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com 
website, 
> but
> > hoped those interested might like to read the following as well:
> > 
> > -- Forwarded message --
> > From: Jay Hyde 
> > Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> > Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> > Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> > To: maureen@
> > 
> > 
> > September 30, 2008
> > 
> > Dear Member of Congress:
> > 
> >  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that proposals 
> advocating
> > suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting are not 
in 
> the
> > best interest of investors or the capital markets and should be 
> rejected. 
> > 
> >  The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in the
> > fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to informed 
> market
> > decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our view, 
> investor
> > confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask the 
> actual
> > value of financial assets at a given point in time.  
> > 
> >  It is important to underscore that mark-to-market accounting has
> > contributed positively to revelations about the severity of the
> > economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and certain
> > institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 
> > 
> >  Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and Exchange
> > Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting 
> Standards
> > Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-market or 
> fair
> > value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-market
> > requirements for certain financial institutions when preparing
> > financial statements to be used by investors. 
> > 
> >  Although determining fair values for financial instruments in an
> > illiquid market can be challenging, the best estimate of the 
prices
> > that would be received for such instruments in orderly 
transactions
> > occurring at the measurement date remains the most relevant
> > information for investors and policymakers. To lessen the
> > uncertainties about the value of these securities, it is critical 
> that
> > investors continue to have the insight provided by the 
application 
> of
> > mark-to-market accounting principles. 
> > 
> >  Many of the current requirements stem from the Savings & Loan 
> crisis
> > in the 1980s, when we learned that not knowing the real, current
> > values of financial instruments held by financial institutions 
can 
> be
> > devastating when the bubble finally bursts and institutions are 
> forced
> > to close their doors. The current requirements provide a uniform 
> and
> > consistent method to measure market values and provide investors
> > increased disclosures about those measurements. Suspending
> > mark-to-market accounting would throw financial reporting back to 
a
> > time of less comparability, less consistency and less 
transparency.
> > 
> >  If there are concerns with the impact of asset valuations on 
> capital
> > requirements of financial institutions, regulators have 
> alternatives
> > other than obscuring information relevant to investors. 
Regulators 
> may
> > modify those requirements based on criteria other than fair value
> > accounting measurements to the extent they deem appropriate.
> > 
> >  Other capital markets participants also have expressed concern 
> about
> > the lack of transparency that would be created by a suspension of
> > mark-to-market accounting. The Council of Institutional Investors,
> > which represents 130 public, corporate and unio

[AsburyPark] 50 Drug Arrests Bring State Atty Gen'l, County Prosecutor, County Sheriff to AP

[radio881gal]

22 of those arrested today are Gang Members, say law enforcement. See 
report with photo and sound on AsburyRadio.com
A cold kept me away from last night's council meeting. Sorry!!
Maureen




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[justifiedright]

How do you use Mark to Market accounting when dealing with an asset 
that is not widely traded?  You have no data upon which to set a 
value.

Also, when a firm goes under and is selling off their assets at a 
fire sale, is it fair to use those sale numbers when someone else is 
valuing an asset under Mark to Market?

Maybe the realty experts on the board can opine.

If only we had someone on the board who regularly dealt with burden 
of valuing unique property?  :-)







--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "asburycheech" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> Hi Folks,
>Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having an issue 
with
> her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the 
following.
>  She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com website, 
but
> hoped those interested might like to read the following as well:
> 
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: Jay Hyde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
> Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
> Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> September 30, 2008
> 
> Dear Member of Congress:
> 
>  The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that proposals 
advocating
> suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting are not in 
the
> best interest of investors or the capital markets and should be 
rejected. 
> 
>  The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in the
> fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to informed 
market
> decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our view, 
investor
> confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask the 
actual
> value of financial assets at a given point in time.  
> 
>  It is important to underscore that mark-to-market accounting has
> contributed positively to revelations about the severity of the
> economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and certain
> institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 
> 
>  Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and Exchange
> Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting 
Standards
> Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-market or 
fair
> value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-market
> requirements for certain financial institutions when preparing
> financial statements to be used by investors. 
> 
>  Although determining fair values for financial instruments in an
> illiquid market can be challenging, the best estimate of the prices
> that would be received for such instruments in orderly transactions
> occurring at the measurement date remains the most relevant
> information for investors and policymakers. To lessen the
> uncertainties about the value of these securities, it is critical 
that
> investors continue to have the insight provided by the application 
of
> mark-to-market accounting principles. 
> 
>  Many of the current requirements stem from the Savings & Loan 
crisis
> in the 1980s, when we learned that not knowing the real, current
> values of financial instruments held by financial institutions can 
be
> devastating when the bubble finally bursts and institutions are 
forced
> to close their doors. The current requirements provide a uniform 
and
> consistent method to measure market values and provide investors
> increased disclosures about those measurements. Suspending
> mark-to-market accounting would throw financial reporting back to a
> time of less comparability, less consistency and less transparency.
> 
>  If there are concerns with the impact of asset valuations on 
capital
> requirements of financial institutions, regulators have 
alternatives
> other than obscuring information relevant to investors. Regulators 
may
> modify those requirements based on criteria other than fair value
> accounting measurements to the extent they deem appropriate.
> 
>  Other capital markets participants also have expressed concern 
about
> the lack of transparency that would be created by a suspension of
> mark-to-market accounting. The Council of Institutional Investors,
> which represents 130 public, corporate and union pension funds with
> combined assets of more than $3 trillion, stated in a recent 
letter to
> the SEC that "[a]ny termination or suspension of fair value 
accounting
> will lessen transparency and investor confidence in the capital
> markets at a time when such confidence is critical to the 
stability of
> our markets and the overall economy."
> 
>  Likewise, the CFA Institute, a global, professional association of
> more than 97,000 investment professionals with offices around the
> world, recently wrote to both members of Congress and the SEC and
> noted that "[c]easing fair value reporting will only serve to
> undermine the confidence of investors in our financial institutions
> and lead to a further crisis of confidence in our government and 
the
> regulatory bodies overseeing those institutions."
> 
>  The proposed Eme

[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Jersey Shore John 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> MH: The Face of Republicanism.

John I'm not shouting you down here, but you aren't even talking 
issues now.  You're just name calling.  I know the heat of the moment 
can catch up with anyone but I also know you can do better than that 
in a discussion.

Pete's not going to put up with that and he's going to make some 
changes we are all going to hate.

Join the discussion.

Did you look at the video of the congressional hearing?

What's your thought on that?




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[asburycheech]

Hi Folks,
   Maureen Nevin who is a member of this group is having an issue with
her internet connection, so she asked me to pass along the following.
 She has a lot of good information on her asburyradio.com website, but
hoped those interested might like to read the following as well:

-- Forwarded message --
From: Jay Hyde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM
Subject: CAQ Urges Congress to Reject Proposals to Suspend
Mark-to-Market (Fair Value) Accounting
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


September 30, 2008

Dear Member of Congress:

 The Center for Audit Quality (CAQ) believes that proposals advocating
suspension of mark-to-market (or fair value) accounting are not in the
best interest of investors or the capital markets and should be rejected. 

 The principles of mark-to-market accounting are rooted in the
fundamental virtue of transparency and are central to informed market
decisions and efficient allocation of capital. In our view, investor
confidence would be undermined by efforts designed to mask the actual
value of financial assets at a given point in time.  

 It is important to underscore that mark-to-market accounting has
contributed positively to revelations about the severity of the
economic crisis facing our country's credit markets and certain
institutions, but it did not create the economic crisis. 

 Recently, some have suggested that the Securities and Exchange
Commission (Commission or SEC) or the Financial Accounting Standards
Board (FASB) should suspend the application of mark-to-market or fair
value accounting or somehow impose a moratorium on mark-to-market
requirements for certain financial institutions when preparing
financial statements to be used by investors. 

 Although determining fair values for financial instruments in an
illiquid market can be challenging, the best estimate of the prices
that would be received for such instruments in orderly transactions
occurring at the measurement date remains the most relevant
information for investors and policymakers. To lessen the
uncertainties about the value of these securities, it is critical that
investors continue to have the insight provided by the application of
mark-to-market accounting principles. 

 Many of the current requirements stem from the Savings & Loan crisis
in the 1980s, when we learned that not knowing the real, current
values of financial instruments held by financial institutions can be
devastating when the bubble finally bursts and institutions are forced
to close their doors. The current requirements provide a uniform and
consistent method to measure market values and provide investors
increased disclosures about those measurements. Suspending
mark-to-market accounting would throw financial reporting back to a
time of less comparability, less consistency and less transparency.

 If there are concerns with the impact of asset valuations on capital
requirements of financial institutions, regulators have alternatives
other than obscuring information relevant to investors. Regulators may
modify those requirements based on criteria other than fair value
accounting measurements to the extent they deem appropriate.

 Other capital markets participants also have expressed concern about
the lack of transparency that would be created by a suspension of
mark-to-market accounting. The Council of Institutional Investors,
which represents 130 public, corporate and union pension funds with
combined assets of more than $3 trillion, stated in a recent letter to
the SEC that "[a]ny termination or suspension of fair value accounting
will lessen transparency and investor confidence in the capital
markets at a time when such confidence is critical to the stability of
our markets and the overall economy."

 Likewise, the CFA Institute, a global, professional association of
more than 97,000 investment professionals with offices around the
world, recently wrote to both members of Congress and the SEC and
noted that "[c]easing fair value reporting will only serve to
undermine the confidence of investors in our financial institutions
and lead to a further crisis of confidence in our government and the
regulatory bodies overseeing those institutions."

 The proposed Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 restates
the authority of the Commission to suspend the application of
Statement of Financial Accounting Standards No. 157, Fair Value
Measurements (FAS 157), and requires that the Commission conduct a
study on the effects of FAS 157 on financial institutions' balance
sheets, the impact of such accounting on bank failures in 2008, the
quality of financial information available to investors, and other
matters, and report its findings to Congress within 90 days. While a
restatement of existing SEC authority and a study of mark-to-market
accounting and its effects are not necessarily harmful in their own
right, efforts to weaken the transparency provided by the current
standard should be avoided, especia

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jersey Shore John]

MH: The Face of Republicanism.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 9:52 AM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was
> >in Iraq.
>
> Black assed? What's wrong with you? You need to stop that. Pete
> could chuck you from the board for that.
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[Jersey Shore John]

The Right "does" racism all the time- in private. It's better when  
they expose themselves, openly, for what they really are and what  
they really think.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 9:47 AM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > YEah. Now that is one thing that Obama will bring to the picture.
> >Legalized pot! He loves the stuff, but what brother doesn't. I be
> >rollin a blunt right now!
>
> Whoa whoa whoa - that's gotta be a terms of service violation. Even
> if it isn't, we don't do racism around here.
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[Jersey Shore John]

Blame is ALWAYS "unhelpful", when the blame falls on Republicans.

On Oct 2, 2008, at 9:35 AM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > and i don't think it is possible to point the blame for the mess in
> > any one place, of course it feels good when we can find evidence
> >that
> > its the other teams fault, but thats all ego and nonsense. the
> > responsibility is all of ours. and we'll all be reasonably
> > ok..especially if we are here participating in this forum...though
>
> I understand the need for all to take responsibility and blame is
> unhelpful.
>
> I just don't understand then when people claim the lack of
> regulation of Fannie and Freddie was a Republican problem when the
> video of the congressional hearing shows the opposite, as does
> McCain's 2005 bill he proposed to regulate them (remember I'm no
> McCain fan; just telling the facts).
>
> I've always thought that Presidents generally don't affect the
> economy, rather they ride or crash the cyclical wave the are lucky
> enough/unlucky enough to meet.
>
> I'm pretty sure two Presidents directly affected the economy, one a
> Dem the other an R - FD Roosevelt and Reagan. I wish we could talk
> to them both right now.
>
> > love the physics/god stuff. i am a big fan of the physics as God
> > idea. the first thing that blew my mind was listening to a
> >physicist
> > describe how everything is mostly space, including us..and energy
> > connects all of us. we are not separate sacs of skin and bones.
> >our
> > seeming division is not real.
>
> You, your neighbor, your dog, that flower you are smelling and the
> computer you are typing on are all made from material formed in a
> Star. Pretty cool.
>
> > don't read my column this week...you'll really be disappointed in
> >me.
>
> I suggest you avoid mine as well :-)
>
>
> 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Jack Pitzer]

He's a racist. End of story. He should be banned from the board for that 
reason, and that 
reason only.

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "justifiedright" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon  
> wrote:
> >
> >That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was 
> >in Iraq. 
> 
> Black assed?  What's wrong with you?  You need to stop that.  Pete 
> could chuck you from the board for that.
>






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[AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
>That black assed pansy wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was 
>in Iraq. 

Black assed?  What's wrong with you?  You need to stop that.  Pete 
could chuck you from the board for that.




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[AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> YEah. Now that is one thing that Obama will bring to the picture. 
>Legalized pot! He loves the stuff, but what brother doesn't. I be 
>rollin a blunt right now!


Whoa whoa whoa - that's gotta be a terms of service violation.  Even 
if it isn't, we don't do racism around here.




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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> well yes, they are.  and for some reason americans seem to love this
> superbowl mentality of our elections. and instead of questioning how
> two parties, even if they were distinct, could possibly represent the
> diversity of this amazing country they pick a team and cheer
> unquestioningly.  its really pretty weird.  

Actually, it makes perfect sense.

America is a representative form of government, not Athenian Democary 
where the citizens vote on every issue through the year.

The candidate that wins votes the issue, not you.

Since I won't be there to vote each issue, and I can't know what 
issues will arrive, the best I can do is try to elect a candidate that 
thinks like me and shares my values.

Thats the only way I can be sure my interests on each issue will be 
protected.

That's why political parties are so good.  At least I know people like 
me gravtitate to the same party as me, so even if I don't have time to 
fully assess the candidate, I at least have something to go on. 




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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I don't want any woman who makes her 17 yo daughter marry a redneck
> because she was incapable of teaching her daughter to respect her
> sexuality to be president. or vice. honestly. this is where
> republicans crack me the *&^% up.  
> 
> you have to imagine..any many writers out there have, what the
> republicans would do if one of the obama girls were pregnant at 17.
> 
> i ache for that poor girl.
>


Why do you assume Bristol is being forced to marry that young man?

I'm sure if the child of a Democrat were having a problem, the 
Republican wouldn't touch it.

The things I've heard said about Bristol in the media is sickening. 
I'm calling it the "Bristol Stomp."

She's a minor.  Minor children of candidates are supposed to be 
hands off.






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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> i know...i am sure it is hard as hell to be a parent.  but would you
> make your kid marry someone at 17 because it would look better for
> your campaign?
>

I want my daughter to married now so someone else has to deal with her 
bs.

But as she said, she'll always be mine.

told her fine, but someone else could carry the freight. Better yet, 
told her she should do well enough to carry her own




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[justifiedright]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> and i don't think it is possible to point the blame for the mess in
> any one place, of course it feels good when we can find evidence 
>that
> its the other teams fault, but thats all ego and nonsense. the
> responsibility is all of ours. and we'll all be reasonably
> ok..especially if we are here participating in this forum...though 

I understand the need for all to take responsibility and blame is 
unhelpful.  

I just don't understand then when people claim the lack of 
regulation of Fannie and Freddie was a Republican problem when the 
video of the congressional hearing shows the opposite, as does 
McCain's 2005 bill he proposed to regulate them (remember I'm no 
McCain fan; just telling the facts).

I've always thought that Presidents generally don't affect the 
economy, rather they ride or crash the cyclical wave the are lucky 
enough/unlucky enough to meet.

I'm pretty sure two Presidents directly affected the economy, one a 
Dem the other an R - FD Roosevelt and Reagan.  I wish we could talk 
to them both right now.


> love the physics/god stuff.  i am a big fan of the physics as God
> idea. the first thing that blew my mind was listening to a 
>physicist
> describe how everything is mostly space, including us..and energy
> connects all of us.  we are not separate sacs of skin and bones. 
>our
> seeming division is not real.

You, your neighbor, your dog, that flower you are smelling and the 
computer you are typing on are all made from material formed in a 
Star.  Pretty cool.

> don't read my column this week...you'll really be disappointed in 
>me.

I suggest you avoid mine as well :-)





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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[oakdorf]

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
>  wrote:
> >
>

One last thing or two on parenting (since I'm so good at it...)

1. When I was around 17, my girfriend wanted to take a ride down to 
the boardwalk... we parked by CH and she told me the news... so I've 
been there. She tracked me down not that long ago and showed me 
pictures of the 4 kids, dogs and cats. If there was a 5th kid in that 
picture, I'd be paying college bills and trying to explain it. Things 
happen, regardless of what parents tell you..

2. The other morning, I walk downstairs past my sons room, then back 
past his room again. Just turned 15. As I walked past, I see this 
cute littel blond pull the covers over her head. Didn't say a word, 
let my wife do the talking to him. Some 16 year old girl slept 
over...in his room. Find out later his buddy slept over in the other 
room with another girl...

At least we were home.




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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Gabrielle Obre]

i know...i am sure it is hard as hell to be a parent.  but would you
make your kid marry someone at 17 because it would look better for
your campaign? 




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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I don't want any woman who makes her 17 yo daughter marry a redneck
> because she was incapable of teaching her daughter to respect her
> sexuality to be president. 

YOu can teach your kids right and wrong all day.

Nothing like watching them laying next to the toilet puking 
cause "they now their limits..."

or taking the car out when they're 15 for a quick ride cause you 
taught them to drive when they were two, but telling them if they 
ever did, you'll kill them...

I woke up at 3 am thinking about outsorucing something I want to get 
done. Then my daughter sent me a text about the same time.

I thought maybe we should just outsource parenting - it's done now, 
but most people don't call it that. You could just have the kids born 
in India and watch them grow up over the Internet.

Lots of families (even single parent families) have to do it now. 
Drop the kid off somewhere and check in on them via the net... 
amazing how we were able to survive as kids. Lsots of kids have 
access to it all, I spent hours and hours trying to hack the first 
cable boxes to playboy on tv.




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[AsburyPark] Re: Is the beachfront finished yet as promised? ........

[oakdorf]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
good summary.

And there was plenty plenty of parking in asbury last night. 

the beach itself is finished. It always has been. Even when the 
boardwalk was dead for years, the beach and the ocean were there.

The women who showed me apartments in NYC the other day said she used 
to come to AP back in the day... "what was the name of the hotel I 
stayed...oh, the Monterey.." She was orginally from Teaneck. 

I invited her down for drinks. She was an interesting one.

Married to a lawyer. 

For four years. 

Said he was boring but fell in love with the long hair and 
pinstripes. 






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[AsburyPark] Re: What a strange place

[Jack Pitzer]

Here's a perfect example of your fair and balanced BS Fox news:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTkqosRiyYo

Watch that and then let's here you explain how that's fair and balanced.
Good luck.



--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Mike Hemeon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> It is all left winged media excpet for Fox. I spend my life involved with it 
> and has always 
been that way. Is that why when McCain went to Iraq the media didn't send a 
crew but 
when Obama went all of them had to broadcast their nightly newscasts from  Iraq.
> There is dumbing down alright.
> 
> --- On Tue, 9/30/08, sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> From: sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: What a strange place
> To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 6:19 PM
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The "left winged media" you rant about is owned by Clear Channel and
> Rupert Murdoch, to "dumb down" America! There IS no left winged
> media. They're ALL YOUR Republican, right-winged friends!
> 
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "justifiedright"
>  wrote:
> >
> > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > > as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> > > american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me.
> > 
> > Rovian tribal bs? - but I thought you celebrate diversity. If so, 
> > what's wrong with recognizing tribes?
> > 
> > 
> > >i have two
> > > family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ 
> > >war.
> > 
> > For which side?
> > 
> > > we have become
> > > soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. 
> > 
> > There are two shores and two borders I can show you. Tap into your 
> > inner Marco Polo and go in search of a people you like.
> > 
> > >we need to move
> > > to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it. 
> > 
> > Never. NEVER I'm America centric and staying that way.
> > 
> > 
> > > paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. 
> > 
> > Blame the left wing media.
> > 
> > >football
> > > players make more money than teachers. 
> > 
> > They should, because they earn their employers more money than 
> > teachers earn their employers.
> > 
> > 
> > >there is an ad in the TCN for a
> > > "G-Spot shot". 
> > 
> > I don't know what that is and please don't anyone tell me.
> > 
> > 
> > >WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
> > 
> > YOU can speak for yourself.
> > 
> > >i even suggested we all hang out.
> > 
> > Speaking of, I didn't see you in Twisted Tree when I went there last 
> > week. Anyone catch the Johnny Cash show there last night?
> > 
> > > i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> > > crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> > > standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> > > clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> > > tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
> > 
> > 
> > See, now this part, right here, is why you're still my favorite 
> > writer in TCN. What imagery!
> >
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>






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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: What a strange place

[Mike Hemeon]

It is all left winged media excpet for Fox. I spend my life involved with it 
and has always been that way. Is that why when McCain went to Iraq the media 
didn't send a crew but when Obama went all of them had to broadcast their 
nightly newscasts from  Iraq.
There is dumbing down alright.

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: What a strange place
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 6:19 PM






The "left winged media" you rant about is owned by Clear Channel and
Rupert Murdoch, to "dumb down" America! There IS no left winged
media. They're ALL YOUR Republican, right-winged friends!

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "justifiedright"
 wrote:
>
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "Gabrielle Obre" 
>  wrote:
> 
> > as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> > american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me.
> 
> Rovian tribal bs? - but I thought you celebrate diversity. If so, 
> what's wrong with recognizing tribes?
> 
> 
> >i have two
> > family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ 
> >war.
> 
> For which side?
> 
> > we have become
> > soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. 
> 
> There are two shores and two borders I can show you. Tap into your 
> inner Marco Polo and go in search of a people you like.
> 
> >we need to move
> > to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it. 
> 
> Never. NEVER I'm America centric and staying that way.
> 
> 
> > paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. 
> 
> Blame the left wing media.
> 
> >football
> > players make more money than teachers. 
> 
> They should, because they earn their employers more money than 
> teachers earn their employers.
> 
> 
> >there is an ad in the TCN for a
> > "G-Spot shot". 
> 
> I don't know what that is and please don't anyone tell me.
> 
> 
> >WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
> 
> YOU can speak for yourself.
> 
> >i even suggested we all hang out.
> 
> Speaking of, I didn't see you in Twisted Tree when I went there last 
> week. Anyone catch the Johnny Cash show there last night?
> 
> > i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> > crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> > standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> > clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> > tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
> 
> 
> See, now this part, right here, is why you're still my favorite 
> writer in TCN. What imagery!
>

 














  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story

[Mike Hemeon]

Neither have the experience to be President of the United States. The 
difference is Obama hate the US and Palin doesn't. That black assed pansy 
wouldn't even vist wounded troop whe he was in Iraq. He will demand a lot of 
respect from the military if he is elected. Probably worse than Clinton.

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Full Rolling Stone Story
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 6:25 PM






I just read this in another political group, I'm in. Good read about
how "stupid" some Americans are, when they buy this line of schitt! 
At least Obama graduated from Harvard! Palin has NO creditials
comparable to Barack Obama. My 2 cents!

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] .> wrote:
>
> http://www.alternet .org/module/ printversion/ 100551
>

 














  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Mike Hemeon]

Sharon is right! THey are both equally incompetent!

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: sharon_b283 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 6:46 PM






NO, she isn't!

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "Paul Vail" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Palin may or may not be qualified to be Vice President of the United 
> States. What should be of concern to most Americans is that she is 
> more qualified than Obama on either side of the ticket.
>

 














  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[Mike Hemeon]

Electing a candidate with no experience that is more left than Hillary Clinton 
is pushing the country in the right direction? He refuses to be seen with the 
American flag why is that? 
He refuses to visit wounded soldiers why is that? YOu have no answers and it is 
perfectly alright with Dems. He is a mamma's boy but it isn't his fault. He 
father took off on him when he was young and had a few more kids he deserted. 
It' a black thing you wouldn't understand.
  

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, Jack Pitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Jack Pitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 8:16 PM






Sorry, but there are plenty of things that America can't be proud of these days.
Blind patriotism is lame. The most patriotic thing a person could do is speak 
about
when our country heads in the wrong direction.

And now for a moment of humor, for you Fox News lovers out there;

http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=KTkqosRiyYo

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote:
>
> I am so sick of hearing people decry our country.
> Patriotism and the practice thereof became a silent issue not too long ago.
> Maybe for good reasons, there were a whole lot of flags flying.
> But this other extreme, this amplification of Michelle Obama's statement that 
> she was 
FINALLY proud to be an American is sickening.
> If your not proud to be an American the door swings both ways.
> We welcome the sick and oppressed and the tired and the poor and we will 
> gladly slam 
the door on the butts of the spoiled rotten who are blinded by the light that 
is America.
> 
> 
> tommi boy and gabbi wrote"Posted by: "Gabrielle Obre" gabrielleobre@ ... 
> gabrielleobre
> Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:24 am (PDT)
> 
> 
> > 
> > You said this:
> > 
> > "As Americans we are
> > constantly distracted by the superficial, disconnected from our
> > communities, we avoid genuine involvement with our local governments
> > and we provide wealth to the companies that screw us in the end. We
> > are intellectually lazy and narcissistic. We care only how we look,
> > what we drive and how that compares to others.
> > 
> > I blame American anti intellectualism for a big chunk of that and am
> > amazed that "elite" could be considered a derogatory remark."
> > 
> > 
> > So you made a sweeping generalization about a group to which I 
> > belong. You even anticipagted our counter-arguement (elitism) in 
> > your post.
> > 
> > Did you really expect me, as part of the group you criticized, to not 
> > respond?
> > 
> > You posted something not too long ago about fascism stopping speech. 
> > Yet here in practice, on this board, you try the same.
> >
> 
> as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me. i have two
> family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ war.
> they did not fight for what this country has become. we have become
> soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. not stupid. we need to move
> to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it. 
> 
> paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. football
> players make more money than teachers. there is an ad in the TCN for a
> "G-Spot shot". WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
> 
> throw the elite label at me all you want, i won't go into the many
> reasons why its absurd to throw it my way. and you didn't prove i said
> i was smarter than everyone else and now you also have to prove i have
> tried to quash anyone from posting. i have been begging for
> discussion. i even suggested we all hang out.
> 
> i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
>

 














  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Is the beachfront finished yet as promised? ........

[Gabrielle Obre]

I don't think anyone answered this q from Newbee. And I know it will
please the local only folks...well at least in acceptable subject matter.

No, the beachfront is not "finished". We are having a delightful time
in the middle of construction (or at least I am).  Your comment sounds
like you haven't been here, maybe you were being snarky, which i could
never hold against anyone.

I have no idea what was promised and i don't really care.  I loved the
BW 4 years ago.  Now other people can love it because they need what
MM is bringing, and it is pretty fun.  great bars and places to eat. 
nice staff.  little hike in prices, but you can find a little bargain
and bring your own sandwiches.  or you can splurg and have a great
nibble somewhere (throw out your TV..no cable bill) beautifully
diverse and friendly.

old C-8 was replaced with a shorter version.  i like to refer to it as
Asbury's Erectile Dysfunction. Or Deperanza. people like to moan and
groan about it, but we do like to moan and groan.  MM (i think it was
them) put up these budget version shops made out of shipping
containers.  i thought it was pretty creative and frugal. the design
snobs freaked out. it was funny.

the carousel building was open for a time and it was fun to ride my
bike through it.  then there was a showing of Hair which i am
disappointed i missed, i love naked bodies. the building looks beautiful.

all around me on a regular basis i heard comments like "I can't
believe i am in Asbury Park". In my more adolescent days i would have
rolled my eyes and been annoyed at the takeover of a cool and desolate
place, but it was sweet, heartwarming and the love was genuine.

The beach bar has to be one of the greatest places to have a drink (i
wish MM would do something about the radios..no one wants to hear that
when they are out chillin with a cocktail..i understand the need to
communicate between staff but..uggghh. still won't me from going..just
a thought). that building is dreamy to me. 

so no.  unfinished. pretty much like life itself. if you haven't been
you are missing out.




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Re: [AsburyPark] it's getting better all the time

[Mike Hemeon]

I thought you never watched Fox?

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [AsburyPark] it's getting better all the time
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 8:59 PM

Hannity: You spent two years of this five-and-a-half-year period in  
solitary confinement. What does that do to a person, to spend that  
much time in solitary confinement?

McCain: I think it makes you a better person. Obviously, it makes you  
love America. I really didn¢t love America until I was deprived of  
her company, but probably the most important thing about it, Sean, is  
that I was privileged to have the opportunity to serve in the company  
of heroes.

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=952

On Sep 30, 2008, at 8:07 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I am so sick of hearing people decry our country.
> Patriotism and the practice thereof became a silent issue not too  
> long ago.
> Maybe for good reasons, there were a whole lot of flags flying.
> But this other extreme, this amplification of Michelle Obama's  
> statement that she was FINALLY proud to be an American is sickening.
> If your not proud to be an American the door swings both ways.
> We welcome the sick and oppressed and the tired and the poor and we  
> will gladly slam the door on the butts of the spoiled rotten who  
> are blinded by the light that is America.
>
> tommi boy and gabbi wrote"Posted by: "Gabrielle Obre"  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:24 am (PDT)
>
> >
> > You said this:
> >
> > "As Americans we are
> > constantly distracted by the superficial, disconnected from our
> > communities, we avoid genuine involvement with our local governments
> > and we provide wealth to the companies that screw us in the end. We
> > are intellectually lazy and narcissistic. We care only how we look,
> > what we drive and how that compares to others.
> >
> > I blame American anti intellectualism for a big chunk of that and am
> > amazed that "elite" could be considered a derogatory
remark."
> >
> >
> > So you made a sweeping generalization about a group to which I
> > belong. You even anticipagted our counter-arguement (elitism) in
> > your post.
> >
> > Did you really expect me, as part of the group you criticized, to  
> not
> > respond?
> >
> > You posted something not too long ago about fascism stopping speech.
> > Yet here in practice, on this board, you try the same.
> >
>
> as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me. i have two
> family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ war.
> they did not fight for what this country has become. we have become
> soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. not stupid. we need to move
> to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it.
>
> paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. football
> players make more money than teachers. there is an ad in the TCN for a
> "G-Spot shot". WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
>
> throw the elite label at me all you want, i won't go into the many
> reasons why its absurd to throw it my way. and you didn't prove i said
> i was smarter than everyone else and now you also have to prove i have
> tried to quash anyone from posting. i have been begging for
> discussion. i even suggested we all hang out.
>
> i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
>
> 



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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[Mike Hemeon]

Bush, Greenspan brought up the Fannie and Freddie problem years ago. Barney 
Frank insisted that there were no problems.  
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgctSIL8Lhs

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, justifiedright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: justifiedright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 10:45 PM






--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "dfsavgny" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] .> wrote:

> But this is the mess you get with LESS REGULATION.

Regulation of Fanny and Freddy? Really?

Watch this. 8.5 minutes. Watch the whole thing to the end. Let me 
know what you folks think.

http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

 














  

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Re: [AsburyPark] Eminent Vacation & Anti EDA Tour - and a woof!

[Mike Hemeon]

Too bad you left you will miss all of the tax increases.

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, Kevin Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Kevin Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Eminent Vacation & Anti EDA Tour - and a woof!
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 10:55 PM






Hello Asbury Park! I thought someone on the board would be 
interested in hearing an update from me. First me and my three 
mastiffs are fine and well and traveling the mid and south west.

Stopped in Bonner Springs, Kansas to see the new NASCAR track they 
built there. Visited with my grand daughters and headed down into 
Texas to do a few dog shows. I am in Houston after weekend in 
Lubbock. Helping out the storm victims... There is always some thing 
to do no matter where one finds themselves.

I am also taking the opportunity to show my mastiffs in dog shows en 
route on my journey. The case for the Broadway Building is still in 
Appealate and we shall see how that turns out. I have had a few 
opportunities to speak out against EDA in different places where laws 
are being considered to remove private property owners from their 
property for development. The American people are extremely 
concerned about eminent domain for private development gain!

The Presidential campaign better pick it up and a candidate needs to 
take a positive position for property rights and protection from the 
abuses we have seen in New Jersey.

I got to tell you, America is laughing at us for allowing it. I of 
course miss home, however, this is what happens when government is 
allowed to pass laws that harm the good people under them.

I posted some new pictures I hope you are all well and enjoying your 
lives. It is just too short to moan and groan too often.

God Bless The Jersey Shore.

Rev. Kevin Brown

 














  

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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Jersey Shore John]

What's so hysterical is if Palin were the Democratic nominee (which  
she never would be) you would be lambasting her seven ways to Sunday.  
Watching you defending her is just amazing. And sexist, I might add.

PS: Palin went to 5 colleges in an attempt to graduate from somewhere.


On Oct 1, 2008, at 11:32 PM, justifiedright wrote:

> --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "fancypaaantz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > Obama worked his way through college and became a commuity
> >organizer
> > to help the poor (for about 4 years).
>
> Community organizer is relevant experience to be president? Asbury
> Park has over 80 non-profits. Are all of them building relevant
> exerpience to be president?
>
> >Then, he attended the best law
> > school in the country, granduating magna cum laude. At that law
> > school, he became editor in chief of the Law Review, the best
> > scholarly legal journal in the country- a major accomplishment.
> > After law school, Obama became an associate with a small civil
> > rights firm (and he could have had his pick of ANY job in the
> > country).
>
> Is being an attorney relevant experience for the Presidency? If so,
> am I qualified? I've tried hundreds of cases of a variety of
> stripes. My understanding is he's never tried even one.
>
> >He also soon became a professor of constitutional law...
>
> Con law professor is experience for the presidency? I was a teacher
> longer than he was. Again, does that qualify me for presidency?
>
> > a state senator. Then a US senator.
>
> This is government experience, although not executive.
>
> > Palin went to a bunch of colleges and then became a sports caster,
> > right?
>
> She went to 3, but spent 3 years U of Idaho where she graduated.
> I wnet to 2. What's your point.
>
> >Then she was a mom
>
> Are you being snarky? Most important job she ever had.
>
> >then a member of the PTA,
>
> As in community organizer.
>
> > on town
> > council,
>
> She certainly started from the bottom and came up through the ranks,
> didn't she? That's usually scene as a plus.
>
> >then mayor,
>
> More coming up through the ranks. She was councilmember/mayor for 10
> years. Negotiating, doing budgets, supplying services, serving the
> public - for a decade. Nothing on Obama's record comes close.
>
> > then somehow became the Governor of Alaska
>
> Wow did you leave out a big one (sorry for Wiki but I'm being lazy):
>
> "Governor Murkowski appointed Palin to the Alaska Oil and Gas
> Conservation Commission. She chaired the Commission beginning in
> 2003, and served as Ethics Supervisor.[58] Palin resigned in January
> 2004, protesting what she called the "lack of ethics" of fellow
> Republican members.[59][60][61]
>
> After resigning, Palin filed a formal complaint against Oil and Gas
> Conservation Commissioner Randy Ruedrich, also the chair of the state
> Republican Party,[62] accusing him of doing work for the party on
> public time and of working closely with a company he was supposed to
> be regulating. She also filed a complaint against Gregg Renkes, a
> former Alaska Attorney General,[63] accusing him of having a
> financial conflict of interest in negotiating a coal exporting trade
> agreement,[64] while Renkes was the subject of investigation and
> after records suggesting a possible conflict of interest had been
> released to the public.[65] Ruedrich and Renkes both resigned and
> Ruedrich paid a record $12,000 fine.[58][66]"
>
> So Sara Palin rooting out corruption in her own party gets NO props
> from you whatsoever? Is that fair?
>
> Now for Palin being Governor.
>
> In the 20th Century, 8 Presidents were Governor first. Being
> Governor has always been the standard bearer of Presidential
> experience.
>
> The 5 Presients that were Senators first had to overcome the fact
> that they weren't Governors and therefore had no executive experience.
>
> No honest broker of Presidential history could downplay the
> importance of Palin being a Governor.
>
> > Drill baby drill, even though it would not result in any better
> >oil
> > domestic production for many years while destroying the
> >environment.
>
> Wrong on both counts. Technology today has taken most of the risk out
> of oil spills. Contrary to what some of the dopes on TV are saying,
> the Industry says they can get oil out of the ground in 18 months.
>
> > She has no foreign policy experience and thinks Putin is rearing
> >is
> > head??? Can you imagine her negotiating with any foreign power?
>
> Most people who became President had no foreign policy experience.
> They were Governors. Governor Reagan had none. Governor Clinton had
> none, etc. Obama has none.
>
> Care to tell me what foreign policy experience is necessary before
> becoming President? Give me a real answer without platitudes - give
> me your actual standard.
>
> I'll tell you my answer: All I require of a President negotiating
> for America is that they love America and always want her to win.
> With that on your mind and ou

Re: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[Mike Hemeon]

What war were you in Jack? Racism? Much of the racism in this country isn't by 
white people. It gets old hearing about it it is time for people to take 
responsibility for their own actions. 
 
Obama doesn't hav enough experience and when things don't go his way he cries 
racism but that is alright. Let's hope whe there is an emergency he has time 
to rehearse a response. I hope that Biden is sleeping next to him if the phone 
rings at 3AM. 

--- On Tue, 9/30/08, Jack Pitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Jack Pitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, September 30, 2008, 11:22 PM






Here's a few things that you didn't notice:
Torture.
A war based on lies.
Our greed effecting the entire world.
Racism.
We're fat as hell.
Religion and it's effect on our countries policies.
We stare at boxes (i.e. TV, internet, cell phones)
Ball players make more then teachers.
Get sick and spend the rest of your life paying for it.
Stupid people buying houses they can't afford, and lenders making jokes about 
our 
stupidity.
Conspicuous consumption.
Britney Spears was headline news.
Our music sucks.
We invented the crawl at the bottom of the screen, and we now use tiny little 
sound bytes 
to think that we actually know what's going on in the world.
We have a candidate for VP that thinks being close to Russia is foreign policy 
experience.
We "elected" GW Bush to be our president, and during his 8 years in 
office...blah blah blah.
So yeah, we're just fine. Great. Greatest country on the planet. Slightly more 
then 200 
years old, and we've got it all figured out. And we have true blue American's 
like 
traderdube to cheer us along.
Right.

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote:
>
> I am so sick of hearing people decry our country.
> Patriotism and the practice thereof became a silent issue not too long ago.
> Maybe for good reasons, there were a whole lot of flags flying.
> But this other extreme, this amplification of Michelle Obama's statement that 
> she was 
FINALLY proud to be an American is sickening.
> If your not proud to be an American the door swings both ways.
> We welcome the sick and oppressed and the tired and the poor and we will 
> gladly slam 
the door on the butts of the spoiled rotten who are blinded by the light that 
is America.
> 
> 
> tommi boy and gabbi wrote"Posted by: "Gabrielle Obre" gabrielleobre@ ... 
> gabrielleobre
> Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:24 am (PDT)
> 
> 
> > 
> > You said this:
> > 
> > "As Americans we are
> > constantly distracted by the superficial, disconnected from our
> > communities, we avoid genuine involvement with our local governments
> > and we provide wealth to the companies that screw us in the end. We
> > are intellectually lazy and narcissistic. We care only how we look,
> > what we drive and how that compares to others.
> > 
> > I blame American anti intellectualism for a big chunk of that and am
> > amazed that "elite" could be considered a derogatory remark."
> > 
> > 
> > So you made a sweeping generalization about a group to which I 
> > belong. You even anticipagted our counter-arguement (elitism) in 
> > your post.
> > 
> > Did you really expect me, as part of the group you criticized, to not 
> > respond?
> > 
> > You posted something not too long ago about fascism stopping speech. 
> > Yet here in practice, on this board, you try the same.
> >
> 
> as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me. i have two
> family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ war.
> they did not fight for what this country has become. we have become
> soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. not stupid. we need to move
> to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it. 
> 
> paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. football
> players make more money than teachers. there is an ad in the TCN for a
> "G-Spot shot". WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
> 
> throw the elite label at me all you want, i won't go into the many
> reasons why its absurd to throw it my way. and you didn't prove i said
> i was smarter than everyone else and now you also have to prove i have
> tried to quash anyone from posting. i have been begging for
> discussion. i even suggested we all hang out.
> 
> i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
>

 














  

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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[Mike Hemeon]

YEah. Now that is one thing that Obama will bring to the picture. Legalized 
pot! He loves the stuff, but what brother doesn't. I be rollin a blunt right 
now!

--- On Wed, 10/1/08, Gabrielle Obre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Gabrielle Obre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 12:09 AM






i have NO idea what you mean or where you stand. all i know is that i
want to know...are you a trader who smokes pot? but i love the tommi
boy and gabbi thing.

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. wrote:
>
> I am so sick of hearing people decry our country.
> Patriotism and the practice thereof became a silent issue not too
long ago.
> Maybe for good reasons, there were a whole lot of flags flying.
> But this other extreme, this amplification of Michelle Obama's
statement that she was FINALLY proud to be an American is sickening.
> If your not proud to be an American the door swings both ways.
> We welcome the sick and oppressed and the tired and the poor and we
will gladly slam the door on the butts of the spoiled rotten who are
blinded by the light that is America.
> 
> 
> tommi boy and gabbi wrote"Posted by: "Gabrielle Obre"
gabrielleobre@ ... gabrielleobre
> Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:24 am (PDT)
> 
> 
> > 
> > You said this:
> > 
> > "As Americans we are
> > constantly distracted by the superficial, disconnected from our
> > communities, we avoid genuine involvement with our local governments
> > and we provide wealth to the companies that screw us in the end. We
> > are intellectually lazy and narcissistic. We care only how we look,
> > what we drive and how that compares to others.
> > 
> > I blame American anti intellectualism for a big chunk of that and am
> > amazed that "elite" could be considered a derogatory remark."
> > 
> > 
> > So you made a sweeping generalization about a group to which I 
> > belong. You even anticipagted our counter-arguement (elitism) in 
> > your post.
> > 
> > Did you really expect me, as part of the group you criticized, to not 
> > respond?
> > 
> > You posted something not too long ago about fascism stopping speech. 
> > Yet here in practice, on this board, you try the same.
> >
> 
> as you can clearly see, i included myself in that group. i am an
> american tommy so don't throw that rovian tribal bs at me. i have two
> family members that fought in the am rev and a couple in the civ war.
> they did not fight for what this country has become. we have become
> soulless, narcissistic and yes.. ignorant. not stupid. we need to move
> to a world centric perspective or we are not going to make it. 
> 
> paris hilton gets more media play than any elected official. football
> players make more money than teachers. there is an ad in the TCN for a
> "G-Spot shot". WE are pathetic, and WE can be so much more.
> 
> throw the elite label at me all you want, i won't go into the many
> reasons why its absurd to throw it my way. and you didn't prove i said
> i was smarter than everyone else and now you also have to prove i have
> tried to quash anyone from posting. i have been begging for
> discussion. i even suggested we all hang out.
> 
> i know its rough and all with the white christian male pedestal
> crumbling. i have a picture in my mind...this old angry white guy
> standing on a rock. limp and shadow boxing. clinging, clinging,
> clinging (thats the same as wanting wanting wanting). come on down
> tommy, it'll be ok and its going to be so much more FUN!
>

 














  

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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Mike Hemeon]

Vote for Obambi. Endorsed by Putin and A-Dad. He will increase taxes and we 
will all get to see what a depression looks like. BTW he isn't talking about a 
middle class tax cut anymore. 

--- On Wed, 10/1/08, Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Jersey Shore John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 11:22 AM






Vote for Caribou Barbie! She will send us into another cold war with 
the entire world and bomb every country she can pronounce. She will 
clean up this mess with tax cuts for the rich and capital gains tax 
cuts for the Wall Street CEOs in the Hamptons who have already looted 
the country! And then she will never have to think again, not that 
she ever started.

On Oct 1, 2008, at 7:15 AM, Rock Musician wrote:

> Vote for Obambi ! I mean obama . He will send us into ethnic 
> cleansing and cleanup this mess. He vows to take over the usa . He 
> will clean up this mess so well that we will not even think about 
> it ever again.
> Now let the wars begin!!! ! !
>
> - Original Message 
> From: wernerapnj <[EMAIL PROTECTED] com>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:27:48 PM
> Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama
>
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] ups.com, "asburycouple" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > Here we go folks... Get ready for three days of off-topic back and
> > forth.
> >
> > Paul, why start this debate up?
> >
>  = = = =
>
> Why do people take the bait time after time 
> Trolls on the group plant the seed ...ignore them
>
> Go to;
>
> groups.yahoo. com/asburypoliti cs
>
> www.groups.yahoo. com/asburypoliti cs
>
> http://groups. yahoo.com/ asburypolitics
>
> http://www.groups. yahoo.com/ asburypolitics
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 














  

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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Mike Hemeon]

If one of the Obama girls got pregnant, they would most certainly have an 
abortion. If it came out alive and squirming on the table Obama would want it 
killed.  I'm sure the father that abandoned him would feel the same way about 
him.

--- On Thu, 10/2/08, Gabrielle Obre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: Gabrielle Obre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, October 2, 2008, 8:15 AM






I don't want any woman who makes her 17 yo daughter marry a redneck
because she was incapable of teaching her daughter to respect her
sexuality to be president. or vice. honestly. this is where
republicans crack me the *&^% up. 

you have to imagine..any many writers out there have, what the
republicans would do if one of the obama girls were pregnant at 17.

i ache for that poor girl.

 














  

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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Gabrielle Obre]

> 
> A duopoly?  Perhaps the left and right wings of the same bird of prey?


well yes, they are.  and for some reason americans seem to love this
superbowl mentality of our elections. and instead of questioning how
two parties, even if they were distinct, could possibly represent the
diversity of this amazing country they pick a team and cheer
unquestioningly.  its really pretty weird.   We need Instant Runnoff
VOting or some other system to get beyond this joke.  thankfully it is
amusing from time to time.








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Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Mike Hemeon]

Vultures

--- On Thu, 10/2/08, theshortsalepro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

From: theshortsalepro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama
To: AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, October 2, 2008, 8:13 AM






"though there is a bill lurking that proves dems to be just as
hawkish...you have to be to serve corporate interests. and both
parties do..."\

A duopoly? Perhaps the left and right wings of the same bird of prey?

 














  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Gabrielle Obre]

I don't want any woman who makes her 17 yo daughter marry a redneck
because she was incapable of teaching her daughter to respect her
sexuality to be president. or vice. honestly. this is where
republicans crack me the *&^% up.  

you have to imagine..any many writers out there have, what the
republicans would do if one of the obama girls were pregnant at 17.

i ache for that poor girl.







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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[theshortsalepro]

"though there is a bill lurking that proves dems to be just as
hawkish...you have to be to serve corporate interests. and both
parties do..."\

A duopoly?  Perhaps the left and right wings of the same bird of prey?





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[AsburyPark] Re: Palin / Obama

[Gabrielle Obre]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, Rock Musician <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>    Vote for Obambi ! I mean obama . He will send us into ethnic
cleansing and cleanup this mess. He vows to take over the usa . He
will clean up this mess so well that we will not even think about it
ever again. 
> Now let the wars begin!

As my nephew would say "What the...".  I think it was McCain who sang
Bomb BombBomb...bomb bomb iran...

though there is a bill lurking that proves dems to be just as
hawkish...you have to be to serve corporate interests. and both
parties do...




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[AsburyPark] Re: it's getting better all the time

[Gabrielle Obre]

nice discussion, thanks.
i won't say i am proud to be american, but i am extremely grateful. i
also know that my life and the comparable ease that i have comes in
some part at the expense of others in other countries. cheap clothes,
cheap energy, security etc.. so i feel a sense of responsibility.

i don't have the drives and fears that many americans seem to
have...no nagging urge to own property, get married or spawn. i dont
care if i don't have a lot of money, don't care if i am never
"successful" in the eyes of others. i dig my life, i love my freedom.
i truly believe we are here primarily to grow in love and
consciousness. to move from egocentric to ethnocentric to worldcentric
and beyond.

there is a lot about this country that i feel the urge to rail
against. and matt taibi and Jack have done it pretty well.

blind patriotism is simply delusional but a great thing for fascists.
 hitler did a lot of damage with the "my country right or wrong" people. 




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[AsburyPark] Re: The Virginia Plan

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "sandpiper15" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Going 'Green' would be the decission of the building owner, 
> certainly it is technically 
> > possible. (again moot since it is to be torn down)
> 
> Obviously I haven't pored through the city's building codes, but 
> leaving that up to the owner sounds a little 1992. We're not talking 
> spotted owls here. It's a health issue. Has the city discussed 
> instituting some requirements in this regard for both building rehab 
> and new construction?
> 
=

There are no local 'Green" ordinances. The only green activities evident are 
the removal of 
shade trees and planting of flowering ornamentals by of all things ... The 
Shade Tree Commission.

Werner




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[AsburyPark] Re: The Virginia Plan

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "sandpiper15" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Well, this whole thread spun off from the Fastlane thread by pointing 
> out the illicit drug sales going on in the building and wondering 
> what could be done about it. Does the redevelopment deal prevent the 
> owners from enforcing the law within their own buildings? Kicking out 
> residents who are convicted of even a drug misdemeanor? If not, and 
> they just don't feel like doing anything about it, can't the zoning 
> authority and/or police department exert some muscle there?
> 


Yes, the owner can evict problematic tenants.
Zoning cant even keep people from 'stealing' public property for business use.
Police can produce a log of the number of calls/incidents etc
Code seems more concerned with prosecuting City critics.

Werner




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[AsburyPark] Re: Why should the people bail out Wall Street?

[Gabrielle Obre]

sorry Tommy...did you read the lyrics? "Mr Nothings got a lot, hes got
alot to say"  it just reminded me of TS Eliots poem Hollow Men and
that is pretty much what I think of most in politics as the moment.
Local and National. Hollow Men...and the women who sleep with them. or
men.

i was being a little flip, it goes to non-serious enough here so...

and i don't think it is possible to point the blame for the mess in
any one place, of course it feels good when we can find evidence that
its the other teams fault, but thats all ego and nonsense. the
responsibility is all of ours. and we'll all be reasonably
ok..especially if we are here participating in this forum...though i
can't speak for the lurkers. or the anonymous ninnies.  can we call
them peeping toms? 

love the physics/god stuff.  i am a big fan of the physics as God
idea. the first thing that blew my mind was listening to a physicist
describe how everything is mostly space, including us..and energy
connects all of us.  we are not separate sacs of skin and bones. our
seeming division is not real.

don't read my column this week...you'll really be disappointed in me.




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[AsburyPark] Re: The Virginia Plan

[wernerapnj]

--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, "sandpiper15" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Beyond that, hasn't Partners reneged on the redevelopment deal time 
> and time again by missing several deadlines? What is keeping the city 
> from saying "You broke your end of the deal. It's off. Time to go 
> back to the table." Was there some fine print in there that said 
> party A could waver on some of the details but party B had to 
> strictly adhere to ever line in the plan?
>
===

A very poor deal was entered into. Look in the files section.

(excerpt)

"PENALTIES FOR NON-PERFORMANCE
III. An improved approach to dispute resolution. Default and
remedies section of the 2001 Redevelopment Agreement became
ineffective. The requirement to formally default a party before
getting to arbitration created an environment where both parties
were reluctant to utilize the process. This resulted in an
environment where issues were addressed on an ad hoc basis with
no real ability to document or enforce a negotiated resolution to an
issue. Alternately, an issue was not resolved and lingered and an
unproductive environment was created. Each party became
frustrated with the efforts of the other party. This Agreement
provides a dispute resolution mechanism that has a softer trigger
and a more certain process so that legitimate disputes can be
resolved with a degree of certainty."

Werner




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