Re: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
There's some stuff on the early music policy/nights at the Hacienda written down in the '24hr party people - Tony H. Wilson' book... It's quite fun to read about the student nights at the Hac going off like a rocket on cheap lager and indie music and the nights that Pickering was playing it was dead quiet with only 10 peeps around or so untill he picked up some records suchs as "no way back" and it slowley turned around.. The rest is history... Martijn (who's never been to the Hacienda or Manchester but did a project for school on the Madchester scene,,,hey, i was young:-) - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <313@hyperreal.org> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2004 2:03 PM Subject: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart > I have it on good authority that the first record of this nature to land in > Manchester was Chip E "Like This". > That was late '86. 4 copies apparently. > > The first 'house' record to blow the whole thing up in Manchester was > Adonis "No Way Back". > Apparently that's the one that kicked everything off. There were 6 copies > in Manchester at first and it took nearly 4 weeks to get some more, after > that they did around 300 copies out of one shop (on the black label press > fact fans)! > This was in '87. > > Apparently at this time they were still pretty much playing loads of > different stuff down there, the house music was interspersed with alot of > other stuff. Hip Hop etc. Mike Pickering started his 'new'night (didn't ask > if that was hot or nude or whatever) in '87 at some point. > > Also the kids wanting the house music early on were the Black kids > apparently. In search of a different sound more than anything I'm told, to > play with the other stuff big on that scene at the time. Think this came > from them all dancing down the Gallery and Legends... Predominantly Black > music clubs I'm told. > > I presume Greg Wilson was the dj at these joints. But don't know > > Also it's worth noting that alot of the original Chi stuff never really got > here. Persona stuff etc in particular. Don't know if anywhere in > London/Brum/Sheffield/Glasgow or anywhere like that was getting them. > > Back to my hideyhole. > > Alex > _ > > - End of message text > > This e-mail is sent by the above named in their > individual, non-business capacity and is not on > behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. > > PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming > e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and > telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you > give your consent to such monitoring > > >
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
Try a Garage night :) Sheffield has a massive scene and the mix is pretty even, just duck if something goes bang. The scene here is closing all the clubs down - seven shootings this year, very sad. Madness aint it, go for a night out, get shot at - egos need to kept in check at some of these events. ... I don't really get out much nowadays but for cultural diversity in Leeds try one of the SubDub (Ital Rockers/Simon Scott) nights. Digital Rootical Dub. They're at the West Indian Centre and there's been one in conjuction with Superconductor. Sheffield has a massive Blues club scene, some of them are almost legal they've been around that long. Great for chilling, chicken and playing dominos' - last one I went to had a wet t-shirt competition - a "pointy titty comp" as it said on the poster. Stop it, Im cracking up here. No mention of 'Batty Rider Shorts' and 'Pun Pun Pants' Re Blues : Same in Leeds tho not been to any for years and years. Last time I went to a Blues it Roots and not Ragga. Rav.
Re: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
On 23 Sep 2004, at 15:57, Mann, Ravinder wrote: But as a music that is African in its roots theres not many African decendants listening to it. Go to a techno night and look around. It's clear to see. Technically that isn't true tho is it. ++ I thought Id see more diversity. Its certainly less diverse to the times I was reffering to. Try a Garage night :) Sheffield has a massive scene and the mix is pretty even, just duck if something goes bang. The scene here is closing all the clubs down - seven shootings this year, very sad. The Warehouse, a club with then a wide music policy started to incoorparate these new sounds and it simply blew up. But these inner city possees moved away from the very scene they developed. But why ??? Here's my take.. Well it became cheese, overcommercial, uncool, piano house and divas, songs like 'Id rather Jack than Fleetwood Mac'. Thing is, you can't force people to like something, regardless of their colour. +++ Aye. But you can 'program' them by making them want to associate. :) Stupidity should be painful don't you think Rav *LOL* The whole point of Techno at the start was being faceless - that was the part of the point/coda and probably why most people didn't get it. +++ I think a lot of people got it early on. But the image changed. And techno instead of defending it's ground when underground. I'm not sure it went over-ground really - most people still don't know what Techno is... I'd guess the reason there aren't many black people in clubs is because they don't want to go but then again I never see any one legged, leper lesbian's with blonde hair at clubs either - wonder where they all hang? +++ Im sure they go to clubs, but I would say *tendancy* is soul and r+b clubs as compared to Dance clubs. There is also a greater emphasis on local blues and local parties cos many Taxis will not come to Chapletown after 12.00. Which I find bizzare. Same here, but it's always been that way and it's probably because of a few idiots or people just doing a runner...Sheffield has a massive Blues club scene, some of them are almost legal they've been around that long. Great for chilling, chicken and playing dominos' - last one I went to had a wet t-shirt competition - a "pointy titty comp" as it said on the poster. One of the great powers of Techno in the early days was that it brought people together regardless of colour and class. +++ I agree 100%. The story of the White man coming in and FIU is as old as the hills. I'll be brave and tell you exactly what FIU - Greed, that knows no colour. +++Its not colour. Hip Hop - who FIU, who stole the soul. The Man can be of any colour. Dat man is Mr. Greed or is it Mr. Ego... Martin
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
> But as a music that is African in its roots theres not many African > decendants > listening to it. Go to a techno night and look around. It's clear to see. Technically that isn't true tho is it. ++ I thought Id see more diversity. Its certainly less diverse to the times I was reffering to. > The Warehouse, a club with then a wide music policy started to > incoorparate > these new sounds and it simply blew up. > > But these inner city possees moved away from the very scene they > developed. > > But why ??? Here's my take.. > > Well it became cheese, overcommercial, uncool, piano house and divas, > songs > like 'Id rather Jack than Fleetwood Mac'. > Thing is, you can't force people to like something, regardless of their colour. +++ Aye. But you can 'program' them by making them want to associate. The whole point of Techno at the start was being faceless - that was the part of the point/coda and probably why most people didn't get it. +++ I think a lot of people got it early on. But the image changed. And techno instead of defending it's ground when underground. I'd guess the reason there aren't many black people in clubs is because they don't want to go but then again I never see any one legged, leper lesbian's with blonde hair at clubs either - wonder where they all hang? +++ Im sure they go to clubs, but I would say *tendancy* is soul and r+b clubs as compared to Dance clubs. There is also a greater emphasis on local blues and local parties cos many Taxis will not come to Chapletown after 12.00. Which I find bizzare. One of the great powers of Techno in the early days was that it brought people together regardless of colour and class. +++ I agree 100%. The story of the White man coming in and FIU is as old as the hills. I'll be brave and tell you exactly what FIU - Greed, that knows no colour. +++Its not colour. Hip Hop - who FIU, who stole the soul. The Man can be of any colour. Rav
Re: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
On 23 Sep 2004, at 14:47, Mann, Ravinder wrote: No I wouldn't say its 100%. I mean I still like techno : ) But as a music that is African in its roots theres not many African decendants listening to it. Go to a techno night and look around. It's clear to see. Technically that isn't true tho is it. As an example, my group of friends at the time 87 was made up of some White, Afro-Carribean, Mixed Race/Heritage, Indian, a Brazilian, a typical inner city bunch from Chapeltown Leeds. We used party to Rare Groove, Funk, Reggae, Hip Hop. There many other such possees from other part of Leeds eg Woodhouse. Then came this early house out of Chicago playing in a couple of mid week clubs, we didn't even know how to dance to it !!. What is Jackin' The Warehouse, a club with then a wide music policy started to incoorparate these new sounds and it simply blew up. But these inner city possees moved away from the very scene they developed. But why ??? Here's my take.. Well it became cheese, overcommercial, uncool, piano house and divas, songs like 'Id rather Jack than Fleetwood Mac'. Thing is, you can't force people to like something, regardless of their colour. The whole point of Techno at the start was being faceless - that was the part of the point/coda and probably why most people didn't get it. I'd guess the reason there aren't many black people in clubs is because they don't want to go but then again I never see any one legged, leper lesbian's with blonde hair at clubs either - wonder where they all hang? One of the great powers of Techno in the early days was that it brought people together regardless of colour and class. The story of the White man coming in and FIU is as old as the hills. I'll be brave and tell you exactly what FIU - Greed, that knows no colour. Martin
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
No I wouldn't say its 100%. I mean I still like techno : ) But as a music that is African in its roots theres not many African decendants listening to it. Go to a techno night and look around. It's clear to see. As an example, my group of friends at the time 87 was made up of some White, Afro-Carribean, Mixed Race/Heritage, Indian, a Brazilian, a typical inner city bunch from Chapeltown Leeds. We used party to Rare Groove, Funk, Reggae, Hip Hop. There many other such possees from other part of Leeds eg Woodhouse. Then came this early house out of Chicago playing in a couple of mid week clubs, we didn't even know how to dance to it !!. What is Jackin' The Warehouse, a club with then a wide music policy started to incoorparate these new sounds and it simply blew up. But these inner city possees moved away from the very scene they developed. But why ??? Here's my take.. Well it became cheese, overcommercial, uncool, piano house and divas, songs like 'Id rather Jack than Fleetwood Mac'. Yea there there was still good house and techno to be found but people just dissassociated with it and quickly moved on, comments like 'that's what white people dance to' 'drug music'. I cant help thinking if some of the original artists had photos of themselves on album sleeves how much different things might have been. (See Hip Hop) Must get back to work... Rav -Original Message- From: Ken Odeluga [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 23 September 2004 14:05 To: Mann, Ravinder; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart >Up Periscope. > >Records I recall being played in Leeds at that time .. > >Corina - T Coy >Too Far Gone - Adonis >The Dance - DM >Like This - Chip E >We Rocking Down the House - >House Nation - House Master >Voodoo Ray - AGCG >Pacific State - 808 >Lets get Brutal - >Ma Foom Bay - Cultural Vibe >Take Some Time Out - Classic Classic Arnold Jarvis Track. >Cant Get Enough - Lizz Torres >Rock to the Beat - Master Reese ? >and of Course B I G F U N !! > >This is before the 'Summer Of Love'. > >Then came acid and piano house and the media and the inner city kids moved >on to the hip hop and RnB scenes. I feel its remained pretty >much the same >since. It's a shameas these scenes could and should imo co exist in >Clubland. > >Hate to bring up the race thing as it's a can of worms but as white >people got into house the black crowd moved out. This is simply an >observation, but that's way it was. > >Rav > >Down Periscope It certainly looks that way. Of course, it's not 100% that way however, evidently. On the whole however, what you've observed is the age old problem of prejuidice, percieved or actual - this can play itself out in ways which are obvious enough. Sometimes it really is there, sometimes it isn't. Not everyone's as enlightened as they ought to be, not everyone can tell the difference. And that works both ways too! Also, most people are conservative in deed if not in mind, they stick with what they know and surface appearances are everything, as is going along with the crowd. The ironic thing is, of course, the African-American roots of a lot of this music, including so-called hard techno! So you have a situation in which people of colour in the UK and Europe are rejecting a music in which people of colour in the US, played a large part (and still do). And this applied even when the music was relatively new and therefore still more easily traceable to those roots. k
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
Of course your email got through Alex, its a well trodden path from your work to the 313 list, the email isnt going to get lost is it ;-)) --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > p.s. my email is going all funny, I presume my post > got through, I've taken > this from an email from Ken. > _ > > - End of message text > > > This e-mail is sent by the above named in their > individual, non-business capacity and is not on > behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. > > PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and > incoming > e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail > and > telecommunications systems. By replying to this > e-mail you > give your consent to such monitoring > >
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
>as these scenes could and should imo co exist in Clubland. Totally agreed. and there won't be any 'good' clubs again really till they do. p.s. my email is going all funny, I presume my post got through, I've taken this from an email from Ken. _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
>Up Periscope. > >Records I recall being played in Leeds at that time .. > >Corina - T Coy >Too Far Gone - Adonis >The Dance - DM >Like This - Chip E >We Rocking Down the House - >House Nation - House Master >Voodoo Ray - AGCG >Pacific State - 808 >Lets get Brutal - >Ma Foom Bay - Cultural Vibe >Take Some Time Out - Classic Classic Arnold Jarvis Track. >Cant Get Enough - Lizz Torres >Rock to the Beat - Master Reese ? >and of Course B I G F U N !! > >This is before the 'Summer Of Love'. > >Then came acid and piano house and the media and the inner city kids moved >on to the hip hop and RnB scenes. I feel its remained pretty >much the same >since. It's a shameas these scenes could and should imo co exist in >Clubland. > >Hate to bring up the race thing as it's a can of worms but as white people >got into house the black crowd moved out. This is simply an >observation, but >that's way it was. > >Rav > >Down Periscope It certainly looks that way. Of course, it's not 100% that way however, evidently. On the whole however, what you've observed is the age old problem of prejuidice, percieved or actual - this can play itself out in ways which are obvious enough. Sometimes it really is there, sometimes it isn't. Not everyone's as enlightened as they ought to be, not everyone can tell the difference. And that works both ways too! Also, most people are conservative in deed if not in mind, they stick with what they know and surface appearances are everything, as is going along with the crowd. The ironic thing is, of course, the African-American roots of a lot of this music, including so-called hard techno! So you have a situation in which people of colour in the UK and Europe are rejecting a music in which people of colour in the US, played a large part (and still do). And this applied even when the music was relatively new and therefore still more easily traceable to those roots. k
RE: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart
Up Periscope. Records I recall being played in Leeds at that time .. Corina - T Coy Too Far Gone - Adonis The Dance - DM Like This - Chip E We Rocking Down the House - House Nation - House Master Voodoo Ray - AGCG Pacific State - 808 Lets get Brutal - Ma Foom Bay - Cultural Vibe Take Some Time Out - Classic Classic Arnold Jarvis Track. Cant Get Enough - Lizz Torres Rock to the Beat - Master Reese ? and of Course B I G F U N !! This is before the 'Summer Of Love'. Then came acid and piano house and the media and the inner city kids moved on to the hip hop and RnB scenes. I feel its remained pretty much the same since. It's a shameas these scenes could and should imo co exist in Clubland. Hate to bring up the race thing as it's a can of worms but as white people got into house the black crowd moved out. This is simply an observation, but that's way it was. Rav Down Periscope -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 23 September 2004 13:03 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) bit more Hacienda info for Stewart I have it on good authority that the first record of this nature to land in Manchester was Chip E "Like This". That was late '86. 4 copies apparently. The first 'house' record to blow the whole thing up in Manchester was Adonis "No Way Back". Apparently that's the one that kicked everything off. There were 6 copies in Manchester at first and it took nearly 4 weeks to get some more, after that they did around 300 copies out of one shop (on the black label press fact fans)! This was in '87. Apparently at this time they were still pretty much playing loads of different stuff down there, the house music was interspersed with alot of other stuff. Hip Hop etc. Mike Pickering started his 'new'night (didn't ask if that was hot or nude or whatever) in '87 at some point. Also the kids wanting the house music early on were the Black kids apparently. In search of a different sound more than anything I'm told, to play with the other stuff big on that scene at the time. Think this came from them all dancing down the Gallery and Legends... Predominantly Black music clubs I'm told. I presume Greg Wilson was the dj at these joints. But don't know Also it's worth noting that alot of the original Chi stuff never really got here. Persona stuff etc in particular. Don't know if anywhere in London/Brum/Sheffield/Glasgow or anywhere like that was getting them. Back to my hideyhole. Alex _ - End of message text This e-mail is sent by the above named in their individual, non-business capacity and is not on behalf of PricewaterhouseCoopers. PricewaterhouseCoopers may monitor outgoing and incoming e-mails and other telecommunications on its e-mail and telecommunications systems. By replying to this e-mail you give your consent to such monitoring
