Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread ncarver

Well I will post a dissenting view of the OP's linked site.  Yes there
are plenty of wacky "audiophiles" around, but there are probably even
more "everything measures perfect so it must sound perfect" types, and
they are just as deluded.  I think this Dan guy comes mighty close to
qualifying as one of the latter.  How many of you remember the loads
and loads of Stereo Review "reviews" of $500 receivers where they
basically said the equipment measured so well that of course it sounded
just fine.  All audio electronics was so close to perfection that the
key to getting great hi-fi was to have lots of buttons and lights on
your equipment.  Well, I believed that line of thought for years, but
what an absolute load of horse crap it turned out to be!  Yes there are
excesses in the audiophile press, but thanks to them, I have a system
that makes wonderful music--that sounds like real acoustic instruments
are playing in my room.  If I had listened to the people like Stereo
Review (and Dan?), I might have great "hi-fi sound" but nothing that
really remotely resembles real instruments.  So, you can chuckle all
you want and feel superior, but in the end, unless you adopt some of
the audiophile way of thinking (that some audio equipment can actually
sound more realistic) you are doomed to what I would now consider crap
sound.  I remember having a music lover friend over one time and when
he heard my system he was just blown away, going on and one about how
it sounded like real instruments were playing in the room.  My
response: well that is the goal of hi-end audio.  His response:  I
never even considered that could be a goal for a hi-fi.  That pretty
much sums it up, in my opinion.  Pick your system by measurement if you
want, but I will stick with my ears.

Incidentally, I am a PhD research scientist/professor, so know more
about experiment design and scientifically valid methodology than most
people.  Audiophile listening tests are hardly the only listening tests
that have serious methodological flaws--so do many "scientific"
listening tests.  Furthermore, virtually all of the descriptions I read
about how audiophiles do listening tests represent no more than straw
men, as nobody with half a brain does things as described.  "Wow, I
swapped in the $2000 Wondercable and was just blown away by how
holographic my system now sounded, so I immediately bought it."  Oh,
rubbish.  Never run into a single person that even remotely fits that
stereotype.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread Phil Leigh

adamdea;574113 Wrote: 
> OK finally
> I can confirm that 24/48 crashes too. Does this suggest that the touch
> clock can't  cope with 48kHz multiples?

Yes. Sorry.


-- 
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend
Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect
cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

OK finally
I can confirm that 24/48 crashes too. Does this suggest that the touch
clock can't  cope with 48kHz multiples?


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

Under Flac 
I have Flac native 
MP3 disabled 
PCM disabled
Under WAV I have 
FLACsox
MP3 lame
PCM native
Is this likely to cause a problem?


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread michael123

interesting read..

Interview with the founder of MIT.
http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=793
http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=794


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

Sorry my point was a bit more basic that: i wanted to put all the file
types options to back where they were at the beginning. I can't
remember what I might have changed.
Is there a way of doing that short of uninstalling squeezeserver and
reinstalling.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Touch: Upsampling with sox?

2010-09-03 Thread michael123

Converting to lossless AIFF shall be ok in theory (as it also PCM and
supported natively by Squeezebox/Transporter), but in practice - nada


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 + Power amp problem

2010-09-03 Thread Phil Leigh

The next thing you need to do is to put some attenuation between the SB
and your amp. You need to keep the SB volume above 75 at ALL TIMES.
Adjust between 75-100 for normal listening. Usually something like
15-20dB of attenuation will be fine. Get some Rothwells or make your
own.


-- 
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend
Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect
cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 + Power amp problem

2010-09-03 Thread Phil Leigh

azaz44;574066 Wrote: 
> I made shorting plugs and tried this way. Shorting plugs to the '-', and
> signal to the '+'. And all of the sudden, it works fine! Tried several
> times - the amp starts fine and plays music directly from the SB3.
> 
> There must be some difference between XLR pins and RCA inputs. On the
> picture there are some capacitors (I think) connected in between.
> 
> Interesting, this means I was listening to it wrong way all from the
> beginning... Maybe now I will not love this sound anymore :)
> 
> I don't know how it sounds now yet (my home is too noisy today), except
> that it plays music.
> 
> As it comes to the volume and safety, I did go to 85/100 in SB3 - it
> was really loud, but I think still safe for the speakers. The lowest
> level (1) could be too loud sometimes in the evening, for background
> music. I think I saw some option in player settins to lower the volume
> by some constant number. This could help, although I still would be a
> little bit afraid of some sudden configuration reset or anything.
> 
> I wonder now how Transporter would be, and think how nice it would be
> if Transporter had additional analog inputs and input switching, so it
> would be a complete preamp...

Excellent news - congratulations!


-- 
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend
Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect
cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 + Power amp problem

2010-09-03 Thread azaz44

I forgot. Thank you for all the answers! I think I wouldn't even figure
out the amp has RCA inputs, I was so sure it has balanced only :)


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] SB3 + Power amp problem

2010-09-03 Thread azaz44

I made shorting plugs and tried this way. Shorting plugs to the '-', and
signal to the '+'. And all of the sudden, it works fine! Tried several
times - the amp starts fine and plays music directly from the SB3.

There must be some difference between XLR pins and RCA inputs. On the
picture there are some capacitors (I think) connected in between.

Interesting, this means I was listening to it wrong way all from the
beginning... Maybe now I will not love this sound anymore :)

I don't know how it sounds now yet (my home is too noisy today), except
that it plays music.

As it comes to the volume and safety, I did go to 85/100 in SB3 - it
was really loud, but I think still safe for the speakers. The lowest
level (1) could be too loud sometimes in the evening, for background
music. I think I saw some option in player settins to lower the volume
by some constant number. This could help, although I still would be a
little bit afraid of some sudden configuration reset or anything.

I wonder now how Transporter would be, and think how nice it would be
if Transporter had additional analog inputs and input switching, so it
would be a complete preamp...


-- 
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread Phil Leigh

adamdea;574024 Wrote: 
> I only have one touch, I'm afraid. It would be useful to try another one
> to compare
> The diagnostic nightmare is that I am not sure when the problem set in
> as it doesn't apply to 24/88 and I thought at first it was a glitch
> with one file i had bought from HD tracks. . 
> Can you help with the question of how to reset all the file conversion
> settings in squeeze server. If it isn't some dumb setting I have put in
> then I suspect that it probably is the replacement clock.

Have you ever edited convert.conf or custom_convert.conf? - if not,
there's nothing to reset. If you have, just delete them and reinstall
the same version of SBS.


-- 
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend
Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect
cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

I only have one touch, I'm afraid. It would be useful to try another one
to compare
The diagnostic nightmare is that I am not sure when the problem set in
as it doesn't apply to 24/88 and I thought at first it was a glitch
with one file i had bought from HD tracks. . 
Can you help with the question of how to reset all the file conversion
settings in squeeze server. If it isn't some dumb setting I have put in
then I suspect that it probably is the replacement clock.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread andyg

Does it happen on an unmodified Touch? If not, I think you know what the
problem is.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

I hope that is not the problem here, but I did begin to worry.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread Mnyb

adamdea;573972 Wrote: 
> YI have also had a new clock put in the touch by audio upgrades
> incidentally. It seems very odd that the lock is lost when I try to
> play the files and that i have to reboot the touch to get it back. 

New clock in the Touch ?

Boulder did some SB3 and duet "mods" where the clock was swapped but
the 48k crystal was removed ? so all multiples of 44.1 (88.2 ,176,4 )
was ok as downsampling will give you that but not 48k multiples .


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Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 and assorted amps
SiriuS, Classe' Primare and Dynadio speakers, Contour 4 Contour Center,
and Contour 1.3SE for the rear ch. Rel Stadium 3 sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
control this

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

Thanks again
I should perhaps clarify that he reboot restores the touch and enables
the DAC to get a lock: it doesn't fix it in the sense of allowing me to
play the 24/48 file


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Touch: Upsampling with sox?

2010-09-03 Thread michael123

I ran myself sox in command line but without 'rate' effect and without
sample size change, and the resulting file matches source.

Actually, if we do upsampling and still sending headless raw, how the
SC will detect proper rate, sample size, byte order?


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread Phil Leigh

adamdea;573972 Wrote: 
> Yes the mods were by audiocom (and incidentally thanks for your advice
> on that). I have also had a new clock put in the touch by audio
> upgrades incidentally. It seems very odd that the lock is lost when I
> try to play the files and that i have to reboot the touch to get it
> back. The touch does not show any error message.
> I am running squeezeserver 7.5.2 on a Qnap Ts 239 via wifi. 
> 
> I am not at home so can't check all the audioconversion settings. Will
> find them and post them tonight. is there any way of resetting them to
> the original factory settings without uninstalling squeezeserver.
> 
> I spose my next step might be to try and see if I can play the 24/96
> files off a usb drive.
> I am not sure whether i have any 24/48 files but will have a look.

Well, all we can say at this stage is that the problem lies within the
Touch, not the DAC.

A 48K file would be very helpful, as IF this is a Touch clocking issue
(my guess at the moment) obviously the 96 is a multiple of the 48k
crystal and I'd expect it to have the same problem. The really odd
thing is that a factory reset fixes it!

There was a recent change to firmware that MAY pertain to this, but I'm
sure that was in 7.6 only...

see here: http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16146

This is a very long shot...

You can easily make a 48k file from another file.


-- 
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Pekin Tuner, Townsend
Supertweeters, Blue Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect
cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio, Harmony One remote for everything.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread Robin Bowes
On 03/09/10 15:19, earwaxer9 wrote:
> 
> Robin Bowes;573934 Wrote: 
>> On 03/09/10 03:19, earwaxer9 wrote:[color=blue]
>>>
>>>
>> What a load of bollocks!
>>
>> R.
>> -- 
>> "Feed that ego and you starve the soul" - Colonel J.D. Wilkes
>> http://www.theshackshakers.com/
> 
> Whats a bollock? Is that a Brit thing?

Heh. I actually lol'd at that.

R.

PS. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bollocks
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread earwaxer9

Robin Bowes;573934 Wrote: 
> On 03/09/10 03:19, earwaxer9 wrote:[color=blue]
> > 
> > 
> What a load of bollocks!
> 
> R.
> -- 
> "Feed that ego and you starve the soul" - Colonel J.D. Wilkes
> http://www.theshackshakers.com/

Whats a bollock? Is that a Brit thing?


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread Wombat

Mnyb;573911 Wrote: 
> 
> Long runs of very thin speaker wire can be measured for shure in some
> cases.
> with some speaker, but thats speaker wires and the remedy still cost
> only a couple of dollars.
> 
Not sure if there is a real sense in measuring LS cables but a while
back some reviews measured series impedance for 3 meters. It is in the
mOhm territory. Some truth must be there...


+---+
|Filename: Unbenannt.jpg|
|Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10555|
+---+

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread earwaxer9

BTW Mnyb - I love that frog with the peace sign!


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] 24/96 conundrum

2010-09-03 Thread adamdea

Yes the mods were by audiocom (and incidentally thanks for your advice
on that). I have also had a new clock put in the touch by audio
upgrades incidentally. It seems very odd that the lock is lost when I
try to play the files and that i have to reboot the touch to get it
back. The touch does not show any error message.
I am running squeezeserver 7.5.2 on a Qnap Ts 239 via wifi. 

I am not at home so can't check all the audioconversion settings. Will
find them and post them tonight. is there any way of resetting them to
the original factory settings without uninstalling squeezeserver.

I spose my next step might be to try and see if I can play the 24/96
files off a usb drive.
I am not sure whether i have any 24/48 files but will have a look.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] What outboard DAC do you use with Squeezebox?

2010-09-03 Thread Mosheopod

Specifically, how do you use the OPPO as a transport sending digital to
the DAC?  I assume it is the latest firmware for the OPPO Bluray you
are talking about.  Do you have to use a Media Smart server to do this,
through the Network option on the OPPO?

thestewman;490981 Wrote: 
> I have the Weiss Minerva. A Media Smart server feeds 176k FLAC and WAV
> files to a Transporter via hardware, then from the Transporter to the
> Minerva over AES/EBU. The Minerva output is balanced analog. Best sound
> I have ever had.
> I can also use my OPPO as a transport sending digital to the Minerva.


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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Sound quality between wav and flac

2010-09-03 Thread lrossouw

JohnSwenson;573932 Wrote: 
> I have a little bit of time this weekend, I'm going to try and come up
> with a method so that wav and flac show up exactly the same on the
> screen. 
> 
> I like the concept of a playlist pointing at the two files, it makes it
> simple. 
> 
> John S.

That's great John.  Can you just do them in sets of 3 as described
using playlists.  This seems to be the preferred method by the
Hydrogenaudio people.  This is A = flac B = pcm and X = unknown. And
you need to identify if X = flac or X = pcm.  I think this should help
you as you can listen to the unknown side by side with a flac and pcm
version.

They seem to do it with the same music but I can't see why it won't
work with different music either. 

You could have a playlist of A, B, X1 , A, B, X2 or just one with the
unknowns and be able to swap between that and a known flac version and
a known pcm version.  

You are allowed to switch between A,B and X as much as you like.


-- 
lrossouw

Louis
'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/lrossouw)

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread Mnyb

robin bowes;573934 Wrote: 
> on 03/09/10 03:19, earwaxer9 wrote:
> > 
> > nonreality;573176 wrote: 
> >> dan is a very fine skeptic and his site that i stumbled upon years
> ago
> >> has always delighted me.  He runs 2 sites, dans data and how to spot
> a
> >> psycopath and they are both fun and informative.  Way too smart for
> me
> >> btw. But you know those aussies.
> > 
> > i'm not sure it is a question of being "smart" vs. Being perceptive.
> > 
> > "audiophiles" are, in general, a rebellious and "unstable" lot. Not
> > always "smart" in the ways of the world. "unstable" - in the sense
> that
> > they are not consistent in the accepted ways of the world. "unstable"
> in
> > the productive nature of society. The status quo has never been
> > expressed through music. Music is about the fringe of thought. The
> > edges of "reality". It's about what can be, and what should be. It's
> > not about what is "there". "there" does not need to be put to music.
> > it's just "there". The status quo, in need of change.
> 
> what a load of bollocks!
> 
> R.
> -- 
> "feed that ego and you starve the soul" - colonel j.d. Wilkes
> http://www.theshackshakers.com/


-- 
Mnyb


Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 and assorted amps
SiriuS, Classe' Primare and Dynadio speakers, Contour 4 Contour Center,
and Contour 1.3SE for the rear ch. Rel Stadium 3 sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
control this

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Interesting post.

2010-09-03 Thread Robin Bowes
On 03/09/10 03:19, earwaxer9 wrote:
> 
> Nonreality;573176 Wrote: 
>> Dan is a very fine skeptic and his site that I stumbled upon years ago
>> has always delighted me.  He runs 2 sites, dans data and how to spot a
>> psycopath and they are both fun and informative.  Way too smart for me
>> btw. but you know those aussies.
> 
> I'm not sure it is a question of being "smart" vs. being perceptive.
> 
> "Audiophiles" are, in general, a rebellious and "unstable" lot. Not
> always "smart" in the ways of the world. "Unstable" - in the sense that
> they are not consistent in the accepted ways of the world. "Unstable" in
> the productive nature of society. The status quo has never been
> expressed through music. Music is about the fringe of thought. The
> edges of "reality". It's about what can be, and what should be. It's
> not about what is "there". "There" does not need to be put to music.
> It's just "there". The status quo, in need of change.

What a load of bollocks!

R.
-- 
"Feed that ego and you starve the soul" - Colonel J.D. Wilkes
http://www.theshackshakers.com/
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Linear PSU for Squeezebox Touch

2010-09-03 Thread m1abrams

andynormancx;573925 Wrote: 
> One of the tests, that showed no measurable difference, used a battery
> rather than a PSU. It is hard to imagine a cleaner PSU than a
> battery...
> 
> If you don't get a measurable difference with a battery as the PSU,
> then you aren't going to get a measurable difference with any fancy
> PSU.

While I do not think a PSU upgrade is a good idea for the touch.  I
will say that a good PSU CAN operate better than a battery.  Batteries
tend to have very high internal resistance, much higher than the output
impedance of a good PSU.


-- 
m1abrams

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Sound quality between wav and flac

2010-09-03 Thread JohnSwenson

I have a little bit of time this weekend, I'm going to try and come up
with a method so that wav and flac show up exactly the same on the
screen. 

I like the concept of a playlist pointing at the two files, it makes it
simple. 

John S.


-- 
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