Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread NoRoDa

magiccarpetride wrote: 
> We live in a free society

Yup. With angels & trolls and everything.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread NoRoDa

lake_eleven wrote: 
> Did you make any changes on the system running LMS, like running
> Fidelizer?

I believe that the server is running Fidelizer, but I'm not shure.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Multichannel streaming, anyone? 'Transporter Ultimate' fantasy :-)

2012-04-17 Thread Mnyb

a hdmi only squeezebox reciever for 100$ no other output :)

(8*spdif would be interesting to me but very few people other than
meridian owners could benefit from it )



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Multichannel streaming, anyone? 'Transporter Ultimate' fantasy :-)

2012-04-17 Thread TheOctavist

Yep! foobar does this wonderfully!



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread lake_eleven

NoRoDa wrote: 
> The tests:
> 
> WLAN SBT factory w/Teddy VS WIRED SBT/HW/TT3.0/TEDDY
> - SBT factory preferred in all repetitions
> 
> WLAN SBT factory w/Teddy VS WLAN SBT factory + HW w/Teddy
> - Not possible to hear a difference
> 
> Toshiba HD DVD digital output VS WLAN SBT factory w/Teddy
> - We believe we heard a small difference, but it was not clear enough to
> be able to point out what we listened to. --> Not possible to hear a
> clear difference
> 
> WLAN SBT factory w/Teddy VS WLAN SBT factory Woriginal PSU.
> - Clear difference. 
> Comment: Some may actually enjoy the original PSU with it's
> "dynamic'n'fresh" sound, more noise and more "energy". But after several
> repetitions the preferred while listening blind was the Teddy. Both
> calmer and with a greater sense of dynamic range. 
> Regards
> Rolf

Did you make any changes on the system running LMS, like running
Fidelizer?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread MediaCenter

cliveb wrote: 
> And you can also go Airport Express > NAD, and use the NAD's remote to
> select the appropriate digital input - job done.
> 
> It strikes me that if you do go this route, you can think about selling
> the Transporter (whose DAC and I/O flexibility you won't be using) and
> replace it with a Touch. Of course, you need to audition the NAD before
> you do this, to make sure you like the sound of its DAC and power amp.

Some argue that better choice would be HK-990 better features but class
A/B. I don't know if C390DD would be able to drive Magnepans 1.7. My
current NAD C272 struggles on lower frequencies. They are extremely
inefficient speakers. I have two C272 and had them bridged, which sounds
much better but they are not 4 ohm stable when bridged. NAD is also
overpriced, I can get DEQX-E with Emotiva XPA-2 and still beat NAD on
price, feature and performance.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread garym

magiccarpetride wrote: 
> That's yet another myth promulgated by the haters. I have both SBT and
> Duet feeding into the same DAC, and there is no, nor could ever be any
> difference in the osund quality between these two digital transports.

I didn't say there was a difference...just that many people here have
asserted a difference.  But I'm a bit surprised at your response as
you've previously reported massive improvements from TT2.0/3.0 mods on
your TOUCH, which is entirely inconsistent with your statement above.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread magiccarpetride

garym wrote: 
> I didn't say there was a difference...just that many people here have
> asserted a difference.  But I'm a bit surprised at your response as
> you've previously reported massive improvements from TT2.0/3.0 mods on
> your TOUCH, which is entirely inconsistent with your statement above.

We live in a free society where a person has every right to change his
opinion under the weight of amassed evidence, no?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread magiccarpetride

garym wrote: 
> Also consider the question of how digital feeding a DAC from a duet may
> not be as good as from a Touch.

That's yet another myth promulgated by the haters. I have both SBT and
Duet feeding into the same DAC, and there is no, nor could ever be any
difference in the osund quality between these two digital transports.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Multichannel streaming, anyone? 'Transporter Ultimate' fantasy :-)

2012-04-17 Thread Mike Sargent

Archimago wrote: 
> Over the years of building my digital music server, I've been adding
> 5.1/5.0/4.0 FLAC's along the way as I rip DVD-A and SACD's (haven't done
> any Blu-Ray yet). They're either 24/96 or 24/88.
> 
> I looked at the directory today and see that I already have about 100
> albums at this point of multichannel material.
> 
> I'm curious, is anyone doing any multichannel streaming out there? I
> assume the most likely way to do this currently would be a PC/Mac -->
> HDMI receiver. I would certainly love to be able to integrate this
> collection into my LMS library as a single point of access some day!
> 
> If something like the following exists, I suspect I'd be set for life
> :-):
> - Decodes 16/24-bit, 44/48/88/96/176/192 kHz stereo
> - Decodes 16/24-bit, 44/48/88/96 kHz 5.1 multichannel
> - Analogue Output: RCA and balanced with quality close to the
> Transporter (quite hard to beat based on measurements)
> - Digital inputs: gigabit Ethernet, TosLink, coaxial, HDMI, USB, WiFi
> 802.11ac (coming later this year I think)
> - Digital outputs: TosLink & coaxial downmix, HDMI passthru for
> multichannel to outboard DAC 
> - A good screen that's dimmable / switch off - like the Touch, maybe
> higher res and larger, no need for touch screen function
> - A few buttons would be nice like on the current Transporter (no need
> for the feedback wheel despite the coolness!)
> 
> - Integrates into the LMS server!
> 
> Price: ~$3000 seems fair...

Why not just use a $400 laptop (with HDMI out) and foobar2000 to drive
it?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread magiccarpetride

TheOctavist wrote: 
> PSUs make no difference. 
> 
> another tweak that comes up empty. 
> 
> the PSU in the touch is more than fit for purpose.

Time to downgrade my PSU. I really don't need something in my system
that is more than fit for the purpose. I want everything to be just fit
for the purpose.

Anyone wants to buy a stock SBT PSU off me? I'll cut you a deal.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Is this a good way to go?

2012-04-17 Thread magiccarpetride

pippin wrote: 
> So
> a) you are comparing different devices. The network connection
> characteristic could be different. How is the Logi App behaving on your
> iPhone? There are really only two possible reasons for a long latency:
> 1. iPeng was quit in the background
> 2. The network connection takes time to establish
> Network connection behavior is different between iPhone and iPad because
> iPad has a mch bigger battery to play around with so is not as
> nitpicking with conserving power.
> 
> b) Also, you are using an outdated version of iPeng. Please try 1.5.1,
> it's got a newer memory management because it doesn't have to support
> iOS 3 anymore which can help to keep it from being completely shut down
> in the background.
> 
> 
> You can download iPeng for iPhone on the iPad for free but if you want
> to use the iPad version you'd have to pay again. You will get a discount
> for the playback (on both devices) if you own both Apps, though. If you
> have already purchased playback you can use it on the iPad, too (for
> free), but you'd have to activate it in the iPhone App (on the iPad)
> because on the App Store you can not share the same In-App-Purchase
> between two Apps.
> Just always use the green "Restore Previous Purchase" button instead of
> the red "Purchase Playback" button to be on the safe side.
> Here are the details:
> http://penguinlovesmusic.de/2011/03/18/new-ipeng-versions-update-playback-change-discount-model/

Thanks for the clarifications and for the instructions. Mucho
appreciated. I would love to get iPeng at near-zero latency levels,
because that's the only less than stellar aspect of that app. Everything
else about it is brilliant!



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] There is life after the Soundcheck TT mods..

2012-04-17 Thread rgro

When the inquiry is in response to someone else's claim, I would mostly,
but not totally, agree.  Sometimes a claim, even if it may sound odd or
spurious, can stimulate someone to a path of inquiry that ultimately
ends in new discovery.  And, as I know has been brought up previoiusly,
to blanket-apply an arbritrary rule that says, essentially, if you don't
meet whatever I (or somebody else) define as the "burden of proof", we
will all deem your idea as moronic and unworthy would seem, at least in
a historical context, to have precluded some of the great scientific
lines of inquiry.  But I certainly see your point.

Indeed, science does not require one to follow all leads---vetting what
one believes is reasonable, vs. what is not, is appropriate---if for
nothing else but time management.  But, the *original* (which is what I
really should have emphasized, in my first reply) researcher, working in
his/her lab, isn't necessarily responding to someone else's need to
convince him that something is or is not "worthwhile" to pursue, nor is
he attempting to prove or disprove someone else's theory(s).  So, in
that case, the burden of proof is not in the decision as to whether or
not to pursue the inquiry, but in the proving of the results of the
inquiry, itself.  At that point, it most certainly is matter of others
verifying and replicating your results.  But--again, at the origin of an
idea, to simply not try an experiment because you have an unfounded
expectation that it won't work does, potentially, cut off what might
otherwise have been a productive line of inquiry.


Soulkeeper wrote: 
> I'm not a scientist, but I like to think that I know a thing or two
> about the process and standards of science, so here goes:
> 
> Some homeopaths seem to demand that genuine medicine researchers spend
> all their time trying to support the homeopaths claims about homeopathy.
> But the vast majority of medicine researchers are not interested in
> doing that, because they feel homeopathy has had its chance, and failed,
> and they've got better things to spend their time on. 
> 
> Is it reasonable to say that this means that the vast majority of
> medicine researchers are being unscientific? I don't think so.
> Scientific inquiry doesn't require you to follow all leads. Only those
> who seem worthwhile. 
> 
> What seems worthwhile to me may not seem worthwhile to you, and vice
> versa. But if *you* think it is worthwhile, then it's up to *you* to
> come up with some objective studies that can convince *me* to use *my*
> time to confirm or refute your findings. Unsubstantiated claims like
> "this quantum pebble placed on my speakers magically made the sound 1000
> times better" are simply not convincing. (I won't go into details about
> the reasons why it is not convincing, that is, unless you insist.) 
> 
> Not being convinced by specious claims is simply not unscientific, and I
> think claiming the opposite represents a straw man version of the
> standards of science.
> 
> 
> 
> Not unless a convincingly executed double blind tests says there is a
> difference. Then it would be inconsistent to refuse to (provisionally)
> accept the results without conducting your own double blind test of
> equal or better quality. 
> 
> But -if the original claim is not backed up by a double blind test to
> begin with, refusing to spend time on doing your own double blind test
> would not be inconsistent-. And if you think it is, you should probably
> read up on the concept of 'burden of proof'
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophic_burden_of_proof). (The
> Wikipedia article is short, but the 'Internet is big'
> (https://www.google.com/search?q=burden+of+proof).)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread Mnyb

cliveb wrote: 
> And you can also go Airport Express > NAD, and use the NAD's remote to
> select the appropriate digital input - job done.
> 
> It strikes me that if you do go this route, you can think about selling
> the Transporter (whose DAC and I/O flexibility you won't be using) and
> replace it with a Touch. Of course, you need to audition the NAD before
> you do this, to make sure you like the sound of its DAC and power amp.

That would be the winner if the NAD C390DD is as good as it is claimed
to be , it has unusually good spec for a switchmode amp and for an amp
of any kind ,it has highish output impedance in the treble (sine
reconstruction filter ) but counter that with a setting for speaker
impedance that rectifies some of the deviation because of that.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] There is life after the Soundcheck TT mods..

2012-04-17 Thread Soulkeeper

rgro wrote: 
> But the notion that, because you don't expect something to elicit a
> change---good or bad, you refuse to try it, runs contrary to scientific
> inquiry.
I'm not a scientist, but I like to think that I know a thing or two
about the process and standards of science, so here goes:

Some homeopaths seem to demand that genuine medicine researchers spend
all their time trying to support the homeopaths claims about homeopathy.
But the vast majority of medicine researchers are not interested in
doing that, because they feel homeopathy has had its chance, and failed,
and they've got better things to spend their time on. 

Is it reasonable to say that this means that the vast majority of
medicine researchers are being unscientific? I don't think so.
Scientific inquiry doesn't require you to follow all leads. Only those
who seem worthwhile. 

What seems worthwhile to me may not seem worthwhile to you, and vice
versa. But if *you* think it is worthwhile, then it's up to *you* to
come up with some objective studies that can convince *me* to use *my*
time to confirm or refute your findings. Unsubstantiated claims like
"this quantum pebble placed on my speakers magically made the sound 1000
times better" are simply not convincing. (I won't go into details about
the reasons why it is not convincing, that is, unless you insist.) 

Not being convinced by specious claims is simply not unscientific, and I
think claiming the opposite represents a straw man version of the
standards of science.

rgro wrote: 
> The audiophile/phool demanding that a :"scientific" double double blind
> test be the gold standard of accepting as to whether a change is heard
> and then refusing to conduct the same "scientific" test simply because
> he/she doesn't *expect* anything to happen is, to put it mildy, just a
> little inconsistent.

Not unless a convincingly executed double blind tests says there is a
difference. Then it would be inconcistent to refuse to (provisionally)
accept the results without conducting your own double blind test of
equal or better quality. 

But -if the original claim is not backed up by a double blind test to
begin with, refusing to spend time on doing your own double blind test
would not be inconcistent-. And if you think it is, you should probably
read up on the concept of 'burden of proof'
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophic_burden_of_proof).



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Win 7 Optimisations

2012-04-17 Thread rgro

TheOctavist wrote: 
> oddly enough my forum language settings have changed to french. 
> 
> 
> now when I go to post, or confront someone in the forum, the page runs
> away and surrenders. 
> 
> Odd behavior.

U.this is in pretty poor taste/offensive.  If I were you, I'd
quietly delete.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] There is life after the Soundcheck TT mods..

2012-04-17 Thread rgro

Well, on that point, you'll get no argument! 

But the notion that, because you don't expect something to elicit a
change---good or bad, you refuse to try it, runs contrary to scientific
inquiry.  The audiophile/phool demanding that a :"scientific" double
double blind test be the gold standard of accepting as to whether a
change is heard and then refusing to conduct the same "scientific" test
simply because he/she doesn't *expect* anything to happen is, to put it
mildy, just a little inconsistent.

Soulkeeper wrote: 
> Audiophilia can be many things, but science it is not. You rarely see
> 'acoustic engineers'
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acoustical_engineering) bothering to call
> themselves audiophiles, and you can't honestly call the majority of
> audiophools acoustic engineers. 
> 
> Conflating audiophilia with science is like conflating homeopathy or
> cryptozoology with science ... wait a minute, I saw 'a great comic
> today' (http://www.treelobsters.com/2012/04/365-accomplishment.html) by
> the way, 'via'
> (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2012/04/16/tree-lobsters-accomplishment/)
> 'Phil Plait's blog'
> (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2005/05/09/science-fare/).
> One should give credit where credit is due.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread cliveb

MediaCenter wrote: 
> If am using NAD C390DD, I'll just go TP > NAD and wouldn't buy DEQ. I'll
> use the parametric in NAD to fix the room modes.
And you can also go Airport Express > NAD, and use the NAD's remote to
select the appropriate digital input - job done.

It strikes me that if you do go this route, you can think about selling
the Transporter (whose DAC and I/O flexibility you won't be using) and
replace it with a Touch. Of course, you need to audition the NAD before
you do this, to make sure you like the sound of its DAC and power amp.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread MediaCenter

Mnyb wrote: 
> If you plan to use the NAD C390DD why do you need the loop ?the DEQ2496
> does it not have digital in and out .
> 
> Then , transporter -digital- DEQ -digital -NAD would be the obvius
> connection . can the DEC be input switch ? or you could place one there
> .
> (in this config a transporter may be overkill as it's dac is no longer
> needed,but yoy already have one )

If am using NAD C390DD, I'll just go TP > NAD and wouldn't buy DEQ. I'll
use the parametric in NAD to fix the room modes.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread adamdea

Mnyb wrote: 
> If you plan to use the NAD C390DD why do you need the loop ?the DEQ2496
> does it not have digital in and out .
> 
> Then , transporter -digital- DEQ -digital -NAD would be the obvius
> connection . can the DEC be input switch ? or you could place one there
> .
> (in this config a transporter may be overkill as it's dac is no longer
> needed,but yoy already have one )

Actually i think the NAD may have its own DRC (at least in the bass) so
the DEQ may not be necessary (as well as the loop)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread Mnyb

If you plan to use the NAD C390DD why do you need the loop ?the DEQ2496
does it not have digital in and out .

Then , transporter -digital- DEQ -digital -NAD would be the obvius
connection . can the DEC be input switch ? or you could place one there
.
(in this config a transporter may be overkill as it's dac is no longer
needed,but yoy already have one )



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] There is life after the Soundcheck TT mods..

2012-04-17 Thread Soulkeeper

rgro wrote: 
> I wholeheartedly disagree, sir.  Science of all kinds, including the
> empiricism we all adore here, would be in sad shape if this was one of
> its core principles.

Audiophilia can be many things, but science it is not.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] There is life after the Soundcheck TT mods..

2012-04-17 Thread NoRoDa

magiccarpetride wrote: 
> I know. But theoretically there is no chance that making changes on SBT
> could result in measurably audible differences. Or let me put it this
> way: we haven't seen any metrics that would corroborate such a
> hypothesis. So you claiming to be able to hear those differences can
> only raise eyebrows. Even if it's raised eyebrows with closed eyes.

You have to read more ;)
Phil Leigh has already shown that TT3.0 "all-out" does change the output
measureably.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread NoRoDa

TheOctavist wrote: 
> PSUs make no difference. 
> 
> another tweak that comes up empty. 
> 
> the PSU in the touch is more than fit for purpose. 
> 
> Buy more music. fix your room acoustics(actually room acoustics make a
> bigger difference than ANY component ever could)

and this you know from listening tests? 
Close your eyes and open your mind. It's not what you believe that
matters, it's what you hear. ;)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread NoRoDa

baardbaard wrote: 
> Hi
> I can perform a listening test this evening. Since this blind test was
> done over my setup and I'm one of very few here that actually have 2
> Touch, one vanilla and one clock upgraded. It will not be a blind test
> tough. Rolf lives in another town and is not here to assist me :-)
> 
> Baard

If you decide to try this blind, please be careful.
Wouldn't like to se you get injured from walking around in your living
room blindfolded! :D

Regards



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Blind listening - TT3.0, HWmods and Teddy Pardo PSU

2012-04-17 Thread baardbaard

NoRoDa wrote: 
> Hi John
> 
> No, I haven't. I guess, and hope, that the HW modded Touch is
> measureably better than the stock Touch.
> Our findings is only that in the system we listened, it was not audibly
> different using the digital out.
> 
> Regards

JohnSwenson wrote: 
> Hi Rolf,
> have you tried listening to the analog outs of the two Touchs? My
> experience with putting lower jitter clocks in SB boxes is that it does
> affect the analog outs. I haven't measured the clock mod that was done,
> but I HOPE that anyone who is making a 3rd party clock board is going to
> be producing one that is much lower jitter than the factory oscillators.
> 
> 
> John S.

Hi
I can perform a listening test this evening. Since this blind test was
done over my setup and I'm one of very few here that actually have 2
Touch, one vanilla and one clock upgraded. It will not be a blind test
tough. Rolf lives in another town and is not here to assist me :-)

Baard



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Transporter Digital-In with DEQ2496 in loop

2012-04-17 Thread cliveb

MediaCenter wrote: 
> What I was hoping for is if someone can connect their DEQ2496 in a
> digital loop and connect any digital source to TP to see if switching
> digital input keeps the loop intact. You have clarified quite a few
> things, but as you said they are not factual. Do you see any hope here?
> may be a firmware update request?
I'm afraid I am out of ideas. You clearly understand the issues
involved. Now it's a matter of finding the device(s) that will do the
job for you - and as I said earlier, I haven't tried doing any of this.

One thing I am 99.9% certain of is that you won't see a TP firmware
upgrade to support this. The TP is end-of-life and I doubt there will be
any more firmware versions unless someone discovers a serious bug that
has to be fixed.



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