Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Jeff07971 wrote: > LMFAO ! > > > Absolutely > > In the review it says it can be setup as a squeezebox protocol to be an > endpoint for ROON though. I did not find that , my bad did not read well enough . Then it can also be an endpoint for LMS . Did they implement Squeezelite ? What kind of licensing are we talking about again ? Then the other question can it be a server for other endpoints ? The price of the x-server hard to gauge what you get if it's a computer mother board of some sort a large SSD and a DAC and a board with digital outs in expensive milled aluminium case ? Expensive yes . But LOL expensive ? Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub. Bedroom/Office: Boom Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4 Misc use: Radio (with battery) iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad (spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller ) server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
edwardthern wrote: > Here is an excerpt from a review which compares 3 dacs made by the same > company in question "Audiogd". Notice the reviewer mentions the > different sound signatures from the different dacs which all share the > same topology and analogue stage but use a different dac chip. > > *\"THE SABRE32 CHIP RANGE OF DAC'S PROVIDE THE SAME LEVEL OF SOUND > QUALITY WITH A DIFFERENT SOUND SIGNATURE THAN THE PCM1704UK OR WOLFSON > WITH A MORE ENERGETIC, DYNAMIC AND EXCITING SOUND WHICH MAY SUIT A LOT > OF PEOPLE BETTER THAN THE DARKER MORE LAID BACK SOUND OF ITS WOLFSON OR > PCM1704 RIVALS.\"* > > http://www.head-fi.org/t/572385/review-audio-gd-nfb-7 But that's a sighted review ( with no measurements either ) a typical end user testimonial ? It's does not provide any information , because the flawed method of testing without catering for normal human perceptive biaseses ? Was it even level matching ( a basicrequirement ). And is this choice of implementations the best one for these 2 DAC and what is the Cyrus equipped with ? And reading audio gd homepage about the products is full of audiophile jargon and weird design decisions ? Makes me wonder . http://audio-gd.com/Pro/dac/NFB732/NFB7.32EN_Tech.htm And actually no measurement does this guys really do measurements to verify design depictions ? It looks like cargo cult tech to me ? So in this case maybe there was an audible difference ? But we can't know based on a sighted testimony. No of these DAC chips are bad real differences if the implementation if correctly done would be far beyond us like more than -110 dB below output . But I still wonder . But is the audio gd product a good example ? I'm still wondering? This kind of "review" makes me wonder a lot . Please note that quoting of sighted testimonials does not really prove your point . . A sighted testing is just a story about what the tester "heard" and experienced while using the products ,can be interesting on its own . What he's really testing is his own biases . In this test it was clear that he had read up about the stuff and had clear expectations about what he was about to hear . You can't test for subtle things this way where the influences of any kind of bias is magnitudes larger that what's tested . A final thought what do ESS themself thinks is the current reference design using thier chips ? Do they have an example/reference implementation ? That's how they usually do it as you can't gauge the all the chip performance quirks without having it in circuit so they usually build a DAC themselfs to test thier own chip and implementation is big so it's a factor how hard it is to use for a product designer . And this is actually a general case . If things have flat frequency response and noise and distortion is down by -110 your are not going to hear differences with correct testing methods . It can be a DAC and op amp a anything , the character and source of distortion does not matter as it so unimaginable small levels of it in a good design . Is not the audiolab DAC series a good representation of what you do with an ESS chip . Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub. Bedroom/Office: Boom Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4 Misc use: Radio (with battery) iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad (spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller ) server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
alfista wrote: > The point is that rating the chips in isolation is for the most part not > meaningful, the environment you place the chip in often has more impact > on the result. > There may be virtually no differences between two chips under ideal > conditions, while two different implementations with the same chip may > display a big difference. Neither of the differences is necessarily > audible, but if the design is sufficiently bad it might be. Here is an excerpt from a review of 3 dacs made by the same company in question "Audiogd". Notice the reviewer mentions the different sound signatures from the different dacs which all share the same topology and analogue stage but use a different dac chip. *\"I HAVE NOTICED THAT THE NFB-7 IS NO LONGER LISTED ON THE AUDIO-GD WEBSITE, IN FACT NO SABRE32 CHIP DAC'S ARE CURRENTLY LISTED. IF THIS IS A PERMANENT DECISION THEN IT IS IMO A VERY DISAPPOINTING DEVELOPMENT. THE SABRE32 CHIP RANGE OF DAC'S PROVIDE THE SAME LEVEL OF SOUND QUALITY WITH A DIFFERENT SOUND SIGNATURE THAN THE PCM1704UK OR WOLFSON WITH A MORE ENERGETIC, DYNAMIC AND EXCITING SOUND WHICH MAY SUIT A LOT OF PEOPLE BETTER THAN THE DARKER MORE LAID BACK SOUND OF ITS WOLFSON OR PCM1704 RIVALS.\"* http://www.head-fi.org/t/572385/review-audio-gd-nfb-7 edwardthern's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=66099 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote: > Does anyone know how much it costs? If it was really, really cheap > maybe, just maybe .. Well the XServer costs something like $1600 edwardthern's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=66099 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
alfista wrote: > The point is that rating the chips in isolation is for the most part not > meaningful, the environment you place the chip in often has more impact > on the result. > There may be virtually no differences between two chips under ideal > conditions, while two different implementations with the same chip may > display a big difference. Neither of the differences is necessarily > audible, but if the design is sufficiently bad it might be. Yes I've heard that theory beforebits-r-bits etc. However take two DACs that have the same output stage, etc say the audiogd ref7 and the nfb7. One uses the PCM1704 chip and the other uses a Sabre chip. News flash... They sound different! How about that, who would have guessed? edwardthern's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=66099 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Does anyone know how much it costs? If it was really, really cheap maybe, just maybe .. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote:
> ("You Phoney"?)
LMFAO !
> Sounds like a terrible idea to me. Also totes itself as an audiophile
> product then offers "gapless mp3 playback".
Absolutely
In the review it says it can be setup as a squeezebox protocol to be an
endpoint for ROON though.
*Players:* SliMP3,Squeezebox3 x3,Receiver,SqueezePlayer,PiCorePlayer
x3,Wandboard
*Server:* LMS Version: 7.9.0 - 1475786002 on Centos 7 VM on ESXi 6 on
Dell T320
*Plugins:* AutoRescan/BBCiPlayer/PowerSave/PowerSwitchIII/Squeezecloud
*Remotes:* iPeng8/Orangesqueeze/PC/Jivelite
*Music:* 383GB,1269 albums 17756 songs 4381 artists mostly FLACs
*Want a webapp ?* See
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?104305-Webapp-for-LMS
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
arnyk wrote: > Smoke and mirrors - all of it. > > The classic configuration of a PC with a quality internal or USB audio > interface suffices for the ultimate in real-world quality audio. > > The only jitter filtering that matters is in the DAC. This idea of > using servers as jitter reducers is so far into overkill. > > It is a testimonial to the fact that in 2016 we outinely build servers > that are smaller than a matchbook and cost $1.98 more or less. Yes it does that's why i wonder if if they offer something else if it's only play music from a computer but "better" ,I chalk them off as snake oil . A good soundcard should do it as you say and suitable software and drivers ( that's a whole topic on its own setting up the machine to do what your want . There some caveats and that's why I like the squeezebox solution ) . Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub. Bedroom/Office: Boom Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4 Misc use: Radio (with battery) iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad (spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller ) server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
The point is that rating the chips in isolation is for the most part not meaningful, the environment you place the chip in often has more impact on the result. There may be virtually no differences between two chips under ideal conditions, while two different implementations with the same chip may display a big difference. Neither of the differences is necessarily audible, but if the design is sufficiently bad it might be. alfista's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=32396 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
edwardthern wrote: > So um what's your point? > > All DAC chips sound the same and 1534s sound bad? No. Most DAC chips can be made to sound the same (audibly transparent) if used properly. Some older designs require care, and some tend to be used in ways that cause audible coloration. > To you > > Well you obviously don't have golden ears. I read that as implying you believe you do hear a difference. Expectation bias and the placebo effect can be very powerful and convincing, so unless you have taken proper measures to ensure they can't affect the result, it is very easy to convince oneself that there are audible changes. This is (again in absence of appropriate test procedures) by far the most likely cause of any perceived difference. "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Mnyb wrote: > Can we get back to the original show ? This Euphony audio server . > Anyone fished up some more info . > > As discussed, a drawback is that you are supposed to playback from the > same machine ? There seems to be no remote endpionts in thier > architecture ( which then removes all audio quality demands from the > server ) and as consequence multiroom how is that suposed to work ? Smoke and mirrors - all of it. The classic configuration of a PC with a quality internal or USB audio interface suffices for the ultimate in real-world quality audio. The only jitter filtering that matters is in the DAC. This idea of using servers as jitter reducers is so far into overkill. It is a testimonial to the fact that in 2016 we outinely build servers that are smaller than a matchbook and cost $1.98 more or less. arnyk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=64365 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Jeff07971 wrote:
> From what I gehter from the review the Server is both player and source,
> looks like you'd need a server at each location to be a player. How that
> works is anyones guess !
Looks like the idea is you have a music library elsewhere, you buy the
Euphony ("You Phoney"?) drive, reboot your PC with it and it copies
music from your library into its own area. That's your player. One
device, one player, with a local copy of your music library. Multi-room
in the sense that you can carry the thing from room to room and boot it
on another PC, that sort of thing. As long as it's got wired ethernet,
they don't like wifi. (Which is mainly a device to prevent people
attempting to boot a laptop with it.)
Sounds like a terrible idea to me. Also totes itself as an audiophile
product then offers "gapless -mp3 -playback".
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
arnyk wrote: > Most of the above is about how identical sounding hardware can be > perceived as sounding different and ranked by someone who will not hold > to the relevant Science (is he ignorant of it or just plain willfull?) > which says that they are sonically indistinguishable. > > In the case of TDA 1534 and a few others the claim lacks necessary > details. They are extra susceptible to being intentionally incorrectly > implemented and actually sounding different, in *some* (but not all) > configurations. They are the SETs of the DAC world - a retro product > intentionally implemented to function as tone controls, and not as good > amplifiers or DACs. So um what's your point? All DAC chips sound the same and 1534s sound bad? To you Well you obviously don't have golden ears. edwardthern's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=66099 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Chips
edwardthern wrote: > I've had quite a few Dacs over the years, as many people probably had > too. > > I've heard different implementations of the Sabre chip, from mellow with > the Wadia Dac to slightly on the hard side. I've heard a few Dacs with > AD chips, they tend to sound very lively and very good extension almost > on the wild side. BB also makes some nice evenly toned Dac chips and of > course the TDA1543 Dac chips used in many NOS Dacslove um. WM Dac > chips seem to have a real fullness and lushness about them. But my > favorite is the PCM1704UK. > > Rank: > PCM1704 > TDA1543 - I'd almost rank this #1 due to its character alone but the > PCM1704 beats it. > Sabre > WM > AD > others Most of the above is about how identical sounding hardware can be perceived as sounding different and ranked by someone who will not hold to the relevant Science (is he ignorant of it or just plain willfull?) which says that they are sonically indistinguishable. In the case of TDA 1534 and a few others the claim lacks necessary details. They are extra susceptible to being intentionally incorrectly implemented and actually sounding different, in *some* (but not all) configurations. They are the SETs of the DAC world - a retro product intentionally implemented to function as tone controls, and not as good amplifiers or DACs. arnyk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=64365 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106575 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
drmatt wrote: > Believe me, I've been an escalation point for an outsourced technical > organisation... Ouch! You have my sympathies. And point taken... "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
Julf wrote: > I think it is a great idea, but I doubt it will help. The reason some of > us old farts have been exposed to that same "innocent ignorance" for a > very long time. If you try the soft approach for 10 years, and see it > doesn't work, you realize that you will never change the mind of the > true believers, all you can do is show those who are undecided that not > everybody agrees with the accepted dogma of the believers. I don't think it's a case of trying to change the minds of the "true believers", it's more a case of bashing moles; there's new moles to be bashed. Such is life. You can't provide one great lesson one day in 1992 and expect everyone, everywhere to have learned from it. Believe me, I've been an escalation point for an outsourced technical organisation.. There's new moles to be bashed on a regular basis. It gets annoying, but ranting doesn't help. And the in-jokes and sarcastic comments don't even help to educate those who are idle observers, they just show that people can be a bit unpleasant. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
rkrug wrote: > Julf writes: > > > drmatt wrote: > >> This I shall investigate (post rip checkers, certainly. Particularly > if > >> I can script it.). Thanks for the pointer. > > > > If you are on linux, and want scriptable stuff, beets is hard to > beat. > > Wow - this looks brilliant. Will look into this! > > Thanks. > I have to agree, this looks awesome. Basically, I think I wrote this in another life. :) drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt writes: > Shame. You should have said "yes". I would have believed you! :) My ignorance - I am not used to the complex social codes and communication rituals in this group :)) Rainer > > > > > > drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 > View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 > > ___ > audiophiles mailing list > audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com > http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles -- Rainer M. Krug email: Rainerkrugsde PGP: 0x0F52F982 signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
drmatt wrote: > Make it part of the FAQ. A sticky thread at the top of the forum. > Whatever. I think it is a great idea, but I doubt it will help. The reason some of us old farts have been exposed to that same "innocent ignorance" for a very long time. If you try the soft approach for 10 years, and see it doesn't work, you realize that you will never change the mind of the true believers, all you can do is show those who are undecided that not everybody agrees with the accepted dogma of the believers. "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Mnyb wrote: > Can we get back to the original show ? This Euphony audio server . > Anyone fished up some more info . > > As discussed, a drawback is that you are suposed to playback from the > same machine ? There seems to be no remote endpionts in thier > architecture ( which then removes all audio quality demands from the > server ) and as consequence multiroom how is that suposed to work ? >From what I gehter from the review the Server is both player and source, looks like you'd need a server at each location to be a player. How that works is anyones guess ! *Players:* SliMP3,Squeezebox3 x3,Receiver,SqueezePlayer,PiCorePlayer x3,Wandboard *Server:* LMS Version: 7.9.0 - 1475786002 on Centos 7 VM on ESXi 6 on Dell T320 *Plugins:* AutoRescan/BBCiPlayer/PowerSave/PowerSwitchIII/Squeezecloud *Remotes:* iPeng8/Orangesqueeze/PC/Jivelite *Music:* 383GB,1269 albums 17756 songs 4381 artists mostly FLACs *Want a webapp ?* See http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?104305-Webapp-for-LMS Jeff07971's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=49290 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Can we get back to the original show ? This Euphony audio server . Anyone fished up some more info . As discussed, a drawback is that you are suposed to playback from the same machine ? There seems to be no remote endpionts in thier architecture ( which then removes all audio quality demands from the server ) and as consequence multiroom how is that suposed to work ? Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub. Bedroom/Office: Boom Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4 Misc use: Radio (with battery) iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad (spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller ) server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Shame. You should have said "yes". I would have believed you! :) drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Julf writes: > drmatt wrote: >> This I shall investigate (post rip checkers, certainly. Particularly if >> I can script it.). Thanks for the pointer. > > If you are on linux, and want scriptable stuff, beets is hard to beat. Wow - this looks brilliant. Will look into this! Thanks. > > > > "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this > fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt > edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 > > Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 > View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 > > ___ > audiophiles mailing list > audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com > http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles -- Rainer M. Krug email: Rainerkrugsde PGP: 0x0F52F982 signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote: > Pun intended? Accidental, as I think beets is named after the plant, not beat(s). "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
I don't see any of that, I see ignorance (in the innocent, non derogatory sense), followed by snidey in jokes and comments implying the OP is thick, which causes automatic defensive mode, which causes the perception that people don't want to listenand escalation to flame war. If the first comment was something like "hi, welcome to the forum. Please note that a lot of people are of the opinion that the difference you perceive are mostly the result of completely normal human perceptual biases, and there is a lot of scientific research that backs this up. There are a number of places you can look for more information about this, such as: blah blah blah." .. then we would not be having these problems. But no, that's not what happens, and so; flame war. Make it part of the FAQ. A sticky thread at the top of the forum. Whatever. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Julf wrote: > If you are on linux, and want scriptable stuff, beets is hard to beat. Pun intended? drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
drmatt wrote: > So there you go, misunderstandings everywhere... ;) > > Calm down and educate instead of berating. I really shouldn't come down here. I always get wound up by at least one thread featuring either Arrogant Stupidity or Stupid Arrogancy - one of the two. End. *Vortexbox LMS 7.9 music on QNAP TS419p via NFS* iThingys/iPeng/Tablets *Living Room* - SB3 -> Onkyo TS606 - > Celestion Ditton F20s - Zone 2 -> Sony TA FE 320 -> Sennheiser RS 130 & B&W P7 *Office* - RPi -> Sony TA FE320 -> Celestion F10s / SB3 -> Onkyo CRN 755 -> Wharfedale Modus Cubes *Dining Room* -> SB Boom *Kitchen* -> UE Radio (upgraded to SB Radio) *Bedroom (Bedside)* - SB Touch -> Topping TP21 -> AKG Headphones *Bedroom (TV)* - Amazon Fire TV (SB Player) -> Topping TP20 -> Wharfedale Modus Cubes d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote: > This I shall investigate (post rip checkers, certainly. Particularly if > I can script it.). Thanks for the pointer. If you are on linux, and want scriptable stuff, beets is hard to beat. "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Julf wrote: > There are non-windows rippers that consult accuraterip, as well as > post-rip checkers. This I shall investigate (post rip checkers, certainly. Particularly if I can script it.). Thanks for the pointer. But I am not really concerned that my rips are broken, apart from the (very) occasional truncated file I've never noticed any difference. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
So there you go, misunderstandings everywhere... ;) Calm down and educate instead of berating. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
drmatt wrote: > The point that was missed here was simple: *why* were we talking about > how an SBT performs with LMS stopped while it drains its buffer. That is > nothing to do with ignorance, wilful or otherwise, that is > straightforward misreading. I didn't misread it. You (collectively) were responding to a hypothesis that jitter could be introduced at (digital) source. A BeagleBone vs an i7 was mentioned as evidence. The majority suggested that the transport methodology (TCP/IP) was incapable of doing so and simply delivered the requisite number of 1s and 0s into the buffer of the SB player - about 30 seconds worth. *Vortexbox LMS 7.9 music on QNAP TS419p via NFS* iThingys/iPeng/Tablets *Living Room* - SB3 -> Onkyo TS606 - > Celestion Ditton F20s - Zone 2 -> Sony TA FE 320 -> Sennheiser RS 130 & B&W P7 *Office* - RPi -> Sony TA FE320 -> Celestion F10s / SB3 -> Onkyo CRN 755 -> Wharfedale Modus Cubes *Dining Room* -> SB Boom *Kitchen* -> UE Radio (upgraded to SB Radio) *Bedroom (Bedside)* - SB Touch -> Topping TP21 -> AKG Headphones *Bedroom (TV)* - Amazon Fire TV (SB Player) -> Topping TP20 -> Wharfedale Modus Cubes d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote: > I'm using cdparanoia. Windows doesn't touch my audio data. There are non-windows rippers that consult accuraterip, as well as post-rip checkers. "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
Julf wrote: > What deeper meaning is there in misinformation based on ignorance? The point that was missed here was simple: *why* were we talking about how an SBT performs with LMS stopped while it drains its buffer. That is nothing to do with ignorance, wilful or otherwise, that is straightforward misreading. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
If you have above cable or similar you need to read this. http://www.klinktbeter.be/index.php/specials/highend-switch SB Touch to Yamaha A-S501, Boston Acoustics A26. SB 3 to Audio Pro T3. SB BOOM SB Radio ReadyNAS 202 iPeng bernt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1342 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
http://www.analogueseduction.net/ethernet-and-streaming-cables/aqvox-high-end-ethernet-10m-network-cable-cat-7.html 21645 +---+ |Filename: AQETHERNET.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=21645| +---+ SB Touch to Yamaha A-S501, Boston Acoustics A26. SB 3 to Audio Pro T3. SB BOOM SB Radio ReadyNAS 202 iPeng bernt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1342 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Mnyb wrote: > Edit: if you use accurip you beat all high end CD drives. I'm using cdparanoia. Windows doesn't touch my audio data. drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Julf wrote: > I think Arny stated it pretty clearly: > > One could argue it is harmless - but I would disagree. Acceptance of all > the BS, foo and pseudoscience is why we have to deal with a world where > people can't tell true from false any more. > > Having a different opinion is of course totally OK - spreading total > misinformation isn't. So, my take on what I've seen here is not "hey this is the gospel truth, come follow me and give me all your gourds", it's "I think it sounds different but can't explain it, let's talk about that". But as usual the "it's ignorant BS" comes through loud and clear from the first comment, rather than any legit conversation. Seriously, you guys *suck* as teachers.. your pupils would either be gibbering wrecks or burning down the classroom by the end of the day. ;) drmatt's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=59498 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
Further off topic . With the act of ripping CD's you beat almost all old fashioned hign end CD drive or id at par with the best ( some use reread functions like a computer ). With some samsung or TSST 20$ rom drive . The separate CD drive what a scam that was , rip out the DAC and analog stage and charge more... i know i've owned a couple . The most hilarius hellspawn here must be belt driven CD drives ( the exist ) because belt driven analog TT is so good :D Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub. Bedroom/Office: Boom Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4 Misc use: Radio (with battery) iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad (spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller ) server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Analogue or Digital?
drmatt wrote: > misunderstanding the deeper meaning that is not fully communicated on > the page. What deeper meaning is there in misinformation based on ignorance? "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106583 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
edwardthern wrote: > Yes RIP's can and do sound different. Only if your rip isn't error-free. > You should use a very high quality DVD drive with the best software you > can find. Actually, old-fashioned CD drives tend to read CD's better than DVD drives do. But it really doesn't matter as long as you use ripping software that verifies the results (using accurip and other methods), guaranteeing that you get a perfect copy. And perfect is perfect - a error-free copy of the bits on the CD. "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Euphony Audio
drmatt wrote: > Redbook can't be treated like a hard drive though. Yes almost every rip > should be identical, even on a cheap drive, but when you get into > re-read territory it's a bit hit and miss because there is no such thing > as a sector-accurate seek on Redbook. > > Most rippers are good enough to deal with this these days by over > reading and realigning the data they received from the drive. Indeed. And if you use the additional step of accurip verification, you know the read was successful. > But why all the anger people? I think Arny stated it pretty clearly: arnyk wrote: > I can't believe the ignorant BS that certain golden ears are spewing > here just lately. One could argue it is harmless - but I would disagree. Acceptance of all the BS, foo and pseudoscience is why we have to deal with a world where people can't tell true from false any more. 21644 +---+ |Filename: nq161206.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=21644| +---+ "To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953 Julf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=42050 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=106578 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/audiophiles
