Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
atrocity;306583 Wrote: > I moved everything over to a less powerful box running the latest > Ubuntu. Big difference! I've managed to setup SqueezeCenter inside a CoLinux install, running Ubuntu. There are actually two instances running on my machine, the native Windows version and the one inside CoLinux. Typically the Windows native version will need around ~150M of resident memory. The ENTIRE CoLinux installation, while running SqueezeCenter, takes less than 25M of memory. (it would be less than 20 if I only wanted to have one virtual network adapter) And it's accessing the same music library via the virtual file system and seems to be much more responsive. Rescanning the entire library takes a little more than half the time under Windows. I think the main issue here is that perl under Windows is just not the superhero it is in Linux. -- EFP EFP's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=6651 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
tyler_durden;306396 Wrote: > If you want a system that works reliably with minimal maintenance, get a > Mac or run a PC with linux. The performance of SqueezeCenter will be > better (faster serving of web pages, etc.) and you won't have to do > nearly as much maintenance as with a windows machine. Indeed. I started out running SqueezeCenter on an XP Home machine with less than wonderful results. After a few weeks, I moved everything over to a less powerful box running the latest Ubuntu. Big difference! To be fair to Windows, I was running a lot of stuff on that machine. SqueezeCenter was just one of several things I [re]moved. The Windows box is happier, SqueezeCenter (and the two Squeezeboxes) are happier, and I'm happier. -- atrocity atrocity's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16009 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
1) KMixer can be problematic if you're looking for bitperfect or low latency output, it can be useful in other situations (which I won't go into). However it's easily avoidable using ASIO. I use a Windows box in my music (production) rig and get very low latency, multi-channel, bit perfect audio just fine. But as has been correctly stated, KMixer is irrelevant if you're not actually an audio device to the OS. 2) My Macs take more of my time (and are more frequently rebooted) than my XP server, which was last restarted to install SP3 a couple of weeks ago. Co-incidentally the Macs got 10.5.3 last night (another reboot). Regardless, if you're updating an OS in the middle of a party you need to get your priorities straight :) 3) I've heard that SC runs faster on Linux, and I'm happy to believe it, but it runs fine on XP for me. As for OSX, I've seen what seem to be a disproportionate number of OSX/SC issues around the forum recently - it wouldn't be my first choice for that reason, although I'm sure it runs fine in most cases. Short answer - pick whichever OS you like, SC runs fine on all of them. -- radish radish's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=77 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
The OS can make a difference, but not in the way that the audio dealer suggests. If you have a PC that runs any form of Windows, you already know about the antivirus, antispyware, security updates and accompanying frequent reboots windows requires just to continue to run. If windows is updating and rebooting in the middle of a party or while you are showing off the system to friends, it could be very embarrassing. Antispyware and antivirus programs also require frequent updates and sometimes reboots. If you want a system that works reliably with minimal maintenance, get a Mac or run a PC with linux. The performance of SqueezeCenter will be better (faster serving of web pages, etc.) and you won't have to do nearly as much maintenance as with a windows machine. Any OS will provide the exact bits required for reconstruction of the audio and barring total interruptions of service due to some of the less reliable OS's, the bits will sound the same. TD -- tyler_durden tyler_durden's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2701 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
kimballhouse;306385 Wrote: > Thanks all. It would appear from your unanimous comments that the > dealer in Summit NJ is ignorant, and as suggested I will steer clear of > him. > > Curiously he has sold several Transporter and understood that they > transfered a digital file and did not use the sound card from the > computer. > > I will try the experiment with the Transporter. A couple of years ago, this thread would've turned into a flame war. Glad to see how much progress this community has made - and maybe it's a sign of the audiophile community at large. -- ezkcdude There are 10 kind of people in the world - those who understand binary and those who don't. SHINYMETAL '*Site*' (http://www.ezdiyaudio.com)| '*RSS*' (http://www2.kumc.edu/students/ezamir/rss/ezdiyaudio.xml) |'*Forum*' (http://ezdiyaudio.informe.com) ezkcdude's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2545 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
aweitzner;306390 Wrote: > The K-mixer story sounded familiar. I found it here on Benchmark's > website: > > http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/computer_audio/advanced_usb_audio.html > > They claim this issue arises when the DAC-1 is connected to a PC via > USB > > Andy I wonder if his dealer is a Benchmark dealer? The issue is that when using the USB port the file seems to already be converted to audio. In the audio state using the USB port, MicroSuck makes all audio go through the K-mixer. Again, as if MicroSuck knows best. >From Benchmark: "Windows® 2000 and XP operating systems have a digital mixer known as 'Kmixer'. All audio streams must go through the Windows® Kmixer to reach native USB audio devices. The performance of Kmixer is critical to any native USB audio solution, so we tested it extensively. We found that Kmixer can perform with full or near full bit-transparency under the right conditions. But, under the wrong conditions, Kmixer can do a great deal of damage. Kmixer's sample-rate-conversion is of very poor quality (under XP and 2000) and must be avoided. Benchmark's Advance USB Audio solution allows Kmixer to default to a transparent mode of operation that avoids sample rate conversion." Back to the real world of Network Audio Players (Slim Devices) that transcode digtal files and do not use a USB cable as their input source (which a Benchmark USB does). The K-mixer is not an issue for ANY Slim Devices product, because their devices transcode digital files and output either analog audio or standard digital signal. They do not use USB Digial Audio out as their source. -- iPhone iPhone Last.FM http://www.lastfm.com/user/mePhone Media Room: Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono Blocks, Vandersteen Quatro, VeraStarr 6.4SE 6-channel Amp, VCC-5 Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Runco RS 900 CineWide AutoScope 2.35:1 Living Room: Duet, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1 Bedroom: SB3, NAD C370, Thiel 2.3 Home Office: SB3, Parasound Vamp v.3, VSM-1 Sigs iPhone's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13622 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
The K-mixer story sounded familiar. I found it here on Benchmark's website: http://www.benchmarkmedia.com/computer_audio/advanced_usb_audio.html They claim this issue arises when the DAC-1 is connected to a PC via USB Andy -- aweitzner aweitzner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12298 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
Thanks all. It would appear from your unanimous comments that the dealer in Summit NJ is ignorant, and as suggested I will steer clear of him. Curiously he has sold several Transporter and understood that they transfered a digital file and did not use the sound card from the computer. I will try the experiment with the Transporter. -- kimballhouse Chan Duet > Cary SLP 50B Mod > Cary CAD 808 > QED Biwire > Ruark Prologue II kimballhouse's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=15215 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
Anne;306337 Wrote: > Dealers, and manufacturers are still frantically trying to sell the > obsolete cd player, and soon we will have the reason why cd players are > still in use, "Its so cozy to load a cd", and this brings us back to the > great vinyl discussion > With the Duet, or SB3 you need a good dac, or a good cheap dac like the > Beresford 7510, then you are in business., you will never regret > it. > A tip for a very very good dac : > http://www.pacificvalve.us/LTDAC38.html Yup, I bought my dad a SB3 a while back, setup a server with an automatic insert/rip/eject script. I even loaded about half of his CDs into the server to get him going. He unplugged it and hasn't used it ever. He would rather go swap CDs. -- SuperQ SuperQ's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2139 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
Dealers, and manufacturers are still frantically trying to sell the obsolete cd player, and soon we will have the reason why cd players are still in use, "Its so cozy to load a cd", and this brings us back to the great vinyl discussion With the Duet, or SB3 you need a good dac, or a good cheap dac like the Beresford 7510, then you are in business., you will never regret it. A tip for a very very good dac : http://www.pacificvalve.us/LTDAC38.html -- Anne Squeezebox 3 > Stereovox XV2 > Bryston B100-DA SST > Carlsson OA50.2 > Sennheiser HD580 Precision Anne's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
>an audio dealer who assured me that the computer system has a huge effect on the sound quality coming from a Transporter< Forget buying audio and ask if he can cut you in on what he's smoking! -- amcluesent amcluesent's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10286 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
To further stress this point, some here run the Server on machines that does not even have audio hardware or proper software drivers for it, read NAS boxes etc. I'm running a small server with ClarkConnect Linux , i think the sound drivers are broken/not installed, but it doesn't matter. -- Mnyb Mnyb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4143 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > I am still trying to resolve whether I can switch from CDs to a > computer-based music system. Why not both? Besides in time, it is entirely possible that it will end up being the only way to acquire new music. kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > The Controller is a terrific navigating device. The convenience > features and ability to use playlists and to find music has really > changed the way I enjoy music. The access to Internet only radio > streams has sold me on the device. I live in a location with terrible > over-the-air radio, and this solves the problem. Here here, I have to completely agree. This should make the choice easier. kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > The sound is decidedly not as good as my CD player, a 10-year-old Rega > Planet on its last legs. I'm considering upgrading to a Transporter, > which is a simple enough experiment. Alternatively I may buy a better > CD player and use the Duet for radio. I would think that the Rega Planet and the Duet would be close with maybe a slight edge going to the Planet. Don't own one so I can't say. Can you borrow a DAC from your local dealer to put with the Duet? Bet that is a Planet beater! Moving up to the Transporter in my opinion will be a huge improvement. kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > In the course of sorting this out I spoke to an audio dealer who assured > me that the computer system has a huge effect on the sound quality > coming from a Transporter.. Is this nonsense? Absolute nonsense! Computer hardware and operating system have no effects whatsoever on the file or the way the Duet or Transporter handle it. One can even use only a headless file server if one so chooses. We are not using the computers sound card, a media sound program, or the PCs operating system to play music (other then providing a place to run SqueezeCenter). The PC is just a file server running a server program (either SS or SC) feeding digital files to the device. Are some computers and operating systems better interfaces? Yes some are but this does not affect the quality of the sound unless the PC is not up to the job and is causing dropouts. Better computer hardware and Operating Systems just tend to make the interface faster and more enjoyable. Tell your dealer to stick to iPods or do some serious research into network media players not playing music "from or on" a computer. Network Media Players do not play music from a computer, they take digital files from a computer and transcode them into analog music in the device or output them in standard digital format to an external DAC. Again if you like the Rega Planet, IMHO you will enjoy the Transporter or Duet with a nice DAC. -- iPhone iPhone Last.FM http://www.lastfm.com/user/mePhone Media Room: Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono Blocks, Vandersteen Quatro, VeraStarr 6.4SE 6-channel Amp, VCC-5 Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Runco RS 900 CineWide AutoScope 2.35:1 Living Room: Duet, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1 Bedroom: SB3, NAD C370, Thiel 2.3 Home Office: SB3, Parasound Vamp v.3, VSM-1 Sigs iPhone's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13622 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > > In the course of sorting this out I spoke to an audio dealer who > assured me that the computer system has a huge effect on the sound > quality coming from a Transporter. This sounds like a canard and I > would welcome the input of the forum. His statment was that the > 'K-Mixer' in Windows XP wrecks the sound, even if the digital file is > transfered to a wireless player and stored there. He further > maintained that the sound quality from the Transporter would depend on > the choice of computer system, with Mac better than Vista, better than > Windows XP, even if all were storing and sending the same uncompressed > music file. Is this nonsense? The audio dealer has no clue what he is talking about. Ie, that would be true if you were using the PC's sound card and the myriad of layers of software... But you're not. Does he believe that if you download a song from iTunes Music Store on a Mac, it will sound better than the same song downloaded to a PC? At the core level, the various music players basically do: "GET /something" from SqueezeCenter, using HTTP which is exactly how iTunes downloads work... So, really, this dealer is arguing that if you want to use an iPod, you will get better sound quality on a Mac than on Windows. The analogy above is exactly what he is arguing. He is nuts or, perhaps, he has a vested interest in something else and wants you to buy that and is either a fool that can not see reality or he is a liar that doesn't care about reality, only the sale. I wouldn't buy anything from him ever. -- snarlydwarf snarlydwarf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1179 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
I am still trying to resolve whether I can switch from CDs to a computer-based music system. I bought a Duet and am transfering much of the library to FLAC and exploring the internet radio possibilities. A couple of observations then a question. The Controller is a terrific navigating device. The convenience features and ability to use playlists and to find music has really changed the way I enjoy music. The access to internet only radio streams has sold me on the device. I live in a location with terrible over-the-air radio, and this solves the problem. The sound is decidedly not as good as my CD player, a 10 year old Rega Planet on its last legs. I'm considering upgrading to a Tranporter, which is a simple enough experiment. Alternatively I may buy a better CD player and use the Duet for radio. In the course of sorting this out I spoke to an audio dealer who assured me that the computer system has a huge effect on the sound quality coming from a Transporter. This sounds like a canard and I would welcome the input of the forum. His statment was that the 'K-Mixer' in Windows XP wrecks the sound, even if the digital file is transfered to a wireless player and stored there. He further maintained that the sound quality from the Transporter would depend on the choice of computer system, with Mac better than Vista, better than Windows XP, even if all were storing and sending the same uncompressed music file. Is this nonsense? -- kimballhouse Chan Duet > Cary SLP 50B Mod > Cary CAD 808 > QED Biwire > Ruark Prologue II kimballhouse's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=15215 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Does computer influence Sound from Transporter?
kimballhouse;306217 Wrote: > In the course of sorting this out I spoke to an audio dealer who assured > me that the computer system has a huge effect on the sound quality > coming from a Transporter. This sounds like a canard and I would > welcome the input of the forum. His statment was that the 'K-Mixer' in > Windows XP wrecks the sound, even if the digital file is transfered to a > wireless player and stored there. He further maintained that the sound > quality from the Transporter would depend on the choice of computer > system, with Mac better than Vista, better than Windows XP, even if all > were storing and sending the same uncompressed music file. Is this > nonsense? Yes, complete garbage. Provided it actually works, the computer itself has no affect on the SQ whatsoever (excepting the rip process where things like choice of drive & ripper can make a difference). -- radish radish's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=77 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=48214 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
