Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
>http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html > >Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or >somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy >to use etch, I might be a bit biased... Well, he doesn't seem to have much of a clue about the Mozilla issues. He wrote: "But, OK, while this will mean that Debian's Mozilla programs will forever more be not as up to date as all other distributions' versions," Actually, part of the reason for the change was that Mozilla was demanding prior review of all changes including backported security fixes. Debian's Mozilla programs will probably be more up to date than all other distributions' versions, apart from the usual "Debian stable is really old" thing. -- Nathanael Nerode <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Read it and weep. http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Text_of_Gore_speech_0116.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Andreas Tille <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [...]
> The only thing I wanted to say is: We should not ignore a text for
> the only reason that the author is a troll. It might happen that
> even trolls find something we can enhance. [...]
That was first posted in reply to me, yet I never suggested that we
should ignore it because the author is a troll. Just be aware who
wrote that article and that they aren't realistic.
Don't ignore the troll, challenge them. We should *DISMISS* poor
articles that sift forums and repeat already-debunked articles by the
same author. It's hit-and-run journalism, so put SJVN on
reporter-trial and be ready to send his work to article-gaol.
The headline to that article really should be "SJVN flames debian
again... does anyone care?" and the answer should be no, because the
flame contains nothing useful. Look at what it contains:
- IceWeasel - many people are already acutely aware of the result of
Mozilla's attempts to stop their browser being free software (and GNU
also have a fork underway);
- CONFIG_IP_ROUTE_MULTIPATH_CACHED was grepped from slashdot and
wasn't popular enough for anyone to ask for it to block the release.
If it had blocked the release, would SJVN be flaming debian for
delaying etch for an obscure/unpopular fringe feature? I suspect so;
- The X comments were also grepped from slashdot and SJVN doesn't seem
to understand what X is anyway ("the X.org windows manager");
- the organisational worries may have some merit, but his source for
"as a direct result of that dispute other developers slowed down their
work on Etch" (Andreas Barth) already commented about SJVN's spin in
http://blogs.turmzimmer.net/2006/12/18#20061211
Nevertheless, it gets reposted by SJVN as if it were true.
Don't ignore it because of past trolling. Ignore it because it's daft.
Hope that explains,
--
MJ Ray - see/vidu http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html
Experienced webmaster-developers for hire http://www.ttllp.co.uk/
Also: statistician, sysadmin, online shop builder, workers co-op.
Writing on koha, debian, sat TV, Kewstoke http://mjr.towers.org.uk/
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Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Sun, Apr 15, 2007 at 09:30:13PM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote: > On Sun, 15 Apr 2007, David Nusinow wrote: > > >Vaughan-Nichols is a troll, pure and simple, and we have vastly more > >positive things to do for ourselves, for our users, and for the community > >at large than listen to his puffed up sense of entitlement. > > OK, I try it once more: There was a valid point in his text and > that was reflected in our BTS (the kernel issue). True; but at the point he put out his article, that issue had already been reported by other people. I'm quite sure that's where he found out, rather than that he installed Debian and found out for himself. > I did not said > that the points he said about X were valid. > > The only thing I wanted to say is: We should not ignore a text for > the only reason that the author is a troll. That's true, if the text brings something new. Here, that wasn't the case: * The author did not do any research himself, other than going to slashdot and read some comments. I'm sure I don't have to tell you what the technical background of the average slashdotter is. * The author looked at Debian, ignored whatever we have accomplished since etch, looked very hard to find something that wasn't optimal (he found only two such things, of which only one really is a bug; the other is a case of "we're not there yet"), and then started to tell people how bad this Debian thing is. Telling people that Debian is a very very bad distribution because (insert two random issues with the .0 release here) isn't quality journalism, IMO. > It might happen that even trolls find something we can enhance. That's true, but the author of this particular article did *not* find something we can enhance. He merely copied something which *other* people found that we could enhance. It's no big deal if some minor issues are found with a Debian release the day it gets released. We've had that in the past, and we've dealt with it. Yet the author wants to make people believe it is a big deal. That's trolling. > If we find out that certain aspects of their writing reflect their > usual trollish behaviour so we do not need to discuss this here, Well, I think that is the case here. -- Fun will now commence -- Seven Of Nine, "Ashes to Ashes", stardate 53679.4 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Sun, 15 Apr 2007, David Nusinow wrote: Vaughan-Nichols is a troll, pure and simple, and we have vastly more positive things to do for ourselves, for our users, and for the community at large than listen to his puffed up sense of entitlement. OK, I try it once more: There was a valid point in his text and that was reflected in our BTS (the kernel issue). I did not said that the points he said about X were valid. The only thing I wanted to say is: We should not ignore a text for the only reason that the author is a troll. It might happen that even trolls find something we can enhance. If we find out that certain aspects of their writing reflect their usual trollish behaviour so we do not need to discuss this here, but it is just not acceptable to simply ignore complete texts for the only reason that they are written by a person that has trolled in the past. Kind regards Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Wed, Apr 11, 2007 at 09:13:39PM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote: > On Tue, 10 Apr 2007, Steve Langasek wrote: > > >If you find some facts in there, > > Well, it was just mentioned that others turned the facts into > bug reports and I do not really want to reply to double rhetorics. > > >feel free to summarize them for the benefit > >of the list so that we don't have to wade through more of that troll's > >screed. > > I just wanted to mention that even trolls might have a point and > that ignoring valid points because they are brought up by trolls > is the wrong way to go. He spends half his article talking about my slashdot comment[0] where I lay out the XSF accomplishments for etch and hint at my plans for lenny. Then he acts pissed off that I haven't fixed what is a *major* problem for *every* linux distribution out there[1] in the etch timeframe. Vaughan-Nichols is a troll, pure and simple, and we have vastly more positive things to do for ourselves, for our users, and for the community at large than listen to his puffed up sense of entitlement. - David Nusinow [0] An unattributed comment by the way. I'm a little unnerved that he figured out it was me. Given that his site is part of eweek, which also publishes the linux slander articles by Maureen O'Gara and friends, it reeks a little bit of the journalistic slime that's attacking PJ at groklaw. [1] This work, currently focused on randr 1.2, is taking a ton of effort at X.org to get working correctly right now, because Xorg autoconfiguration simply doesn't work right, no matter how each distro decides to smooth it over -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Sat, Apr 14, 2007 at 09:56:52AM -0400, David Nusinow wrote: > On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 08:19:03AM +0200, Adrian von Bidder wrote: > > Yo! > > > > http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html > > > > Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or > > somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy > > to use etch, I might be a bit biased... > > > > (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release > > announcement, there are some that are very positive, but I think where we > > learn is how people *don't* like the release, that's why I'm posting this > > here. Note that this is not an attack against the kernel or X people, I > > know they did a huge job.) > > Wow. The last thing I expected to see when I wrote that comment was that my > name would show up in an article somewhere. What I was actually going for > was to get our actual users excited about what we're doing, not provide > troll-fodder. I'm no fan of Vaughn-Nichols, and generally consider him a > total hack. The most notable evidence for this is that our X install stuff > is almomst identical to Ubuntu's and yet he falls all over himself to talk > about how great Ubuntu is, but then denigrates us for the exact same X > setup. Way to do your research. > (sorry, I don't know wtf happened with vim, this line got cut) I'm not sure how we can make people think of Debian as more "Debian" and less > "The Father Of Ubuntu", but I do know that we won't be able to avoid these > types of articles if we can't figure it out and make it happen. > > Anyway, I think we've done a lot of great work for etch, and we can do more > for lenny. I know I've got my plans for the X stuff, and from the TeX and > Postgres announcements on -devel-announce, it's clear that others also have > big plans. None of the stuff I've got in mind will resolve this problem, > but I'm open to suggestions. - David Nusinow -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 08:19:03AM +0200, Adrian von Bidder wrote: > Yo! > > http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html > > Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or > somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy > to use etch, I might be a bit biased... > > (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release > announcement, there are some that are very positive, but I think where we > learn is how people *don't* like the release, that's why I'm posting this > here. Note that this is not an attack against the kernel or X people, I > know they did a huge job.) Wow. The last thing I expected to see when I wrote that comment was that my name would show up in an article somewhere. What I was actually going for was to get our actual users excited about what we're doing, not provide troll-fodder. I'm no fan of Vaughn-Nichols, and generally consider him a total hack. The most notable evidence for this is that our X install stuff is almomst identical to Ubuntu's and yet he falls all over himself to talk about how great Ubuntu is, but then denigrates us for the exact same X setup. Way to do your research. "The Father Of Ubuntu", but I do know that we won't be able to avoid these types of articles if we can't figure it out and make it happen. Anyway, I think we've done a lot of great work for etch, and we can do more for lenny. I know I've got my plans for the X stuff, and from the TeX and Postgres announcements on -devel-announce, it's clear that others also have big plans. None of the stuff I've got in mind will resolve this problem, but I'm open to suggestions. - David Nusinow -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
I agree with joy's reply. Additionally... I understand the reason why it was done, and it would certainly be great if the Mozilla foundation had a sane Trademark license, but in the mean time I would very much like if people remembered the G in DFSG a bit more often. AFAIK the first problem is not the trademark policy, but the logos license. I consider Mozilla reasonable to require that its trademarked names be only used with the corresponding trademarked logos, but not reasonable to not license the logos under a DFSG-free license. It surprises me that a Debian contributor treats this topic after the release. This is not a difficult to catch bug. We knew that Etch would release like that, and we expected some reviews to mention it. The time to do something avoid it was before the issue entered stable. Anyway, if you still want to do something about it, be more helpful than the story writer, don't just mention an issue we already know, and start a poll/GR to add an exception to the DFSG to copyright licensing of logos, or something. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Fri, Apr 13, 2007 at 11:08:44AM +0200, Adrian von Bidder wrote: > We're telling people that they can/should use Debian, and 5 minutes later > I have to explain [...] I sense a bit of frustration in here :) but it's not really necessary. I mean, you also have to explain people why we e.g. don't have Excel on Debian, and we actually *don't* have it. There are numerous things to have to explain, and a simple s/Firefox/Iceweasel/ rename is perhaps one of the most trivial of them all. Some people like to obsess over trivialities, such is life, let's move on. -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Friday 13 April 2007 09:54, Philippe Cloutier wrote: [paraphrasing the article I linked to] > It's stupid that Debian renames Mozilla applications. Yes, it is. > Sure, let's drop the DFSG for lenny. Seriously: it is very stupid that the licensing/trademark situation lead Debian to rebrand the Mozilla applications. We're telling people that they can/should use Debian, and 5 minutes later I have to explain why we don't have mozilla - not a good first user impression, and anybody who is not interested in legal issues won't understand our reasons. I understand the reason why it was done, and it would certainly be great if the Mozilla foundation had a sane Trademark license, but in the mean time I would very much like if people remembered the G in DFSG a bit more often. EOD from my side for now on this issue, it's been killed at least 5 tmes already a long time ago. cheers -- vbi -- Could this mail be a fake? (Answer: No! - http://fortytwo.ch/gpg/intro) pgp5OCknBJRCQ.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or somebody who has a realistic view of the world? The former. Summarizing: It's stupid that Debian renames Mozilla applications. Sure, let's drop the DFSG for lenny. There's an important bug in Linux. Wow. Try reporting it in time next time. X.org * "the state of the X Window System installer" No idea what this means. * only one developer made it from one release to another If I look at http://packages.qa.debian.org/x/xfree86.html I see 3 people and 2 became Canonical employees. Bad boys. "openSUSE and Fedora are the community Linuxes of the future." Nobody could have smelled that coming. It's not realistic to use 3 applications rebrandings and a new important bug to try dismissing Debian's fastest release since 2000. There are many people who care about Debian 4.0. The author should be worried about whether people will care about his next "story". -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Plenty of people complain that our Etch kernel is outdated, It's not, and I see nobody complaining it is. I've seen 1 Gentoo guy tell me that we were late (before he checked and realized he had nothing better than 2.6.19) and don't remember other complaints. but we don't tell them that a quality enterprise-grade kernel _requires_ long stabilisation and testing. (One of our direct competitor distributions, RHEL 5, released two weeks before us and also bases their kernel on 2.6.18.) I'm not sure what you're suggesting. If you're suggesting that the release announcement talks specifically about Linux, I disagree. Linux wasn't frozen longer than base (and actually, it got an unusual freeze exception during base's freeze). If you're suggesting to explain why base packages are older, I doubt I'd agree - we could have done that with Sarge, but Etch's software is not particularly old. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Alexander Schmehl wrote: > * Adrian von Bidder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [070410 08:19]: > >> (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release=20 >> announcement, > > But also note, that lazy journalists might falsify your positive > statistics ;) (Please take this as enhancement bug, not a flame) Debian press releases need a more positive PR spin, as most journalists are too lazy/busy/uninformed to research facts for themselves. As an example: Plenty of people complain that our Etch kernel is outdated, but we don't tell them that a quality enterprise-grade kernel _requires_ long stabilisation and testing. (One of our direct competitor distributions, RHEL 5, released two weeks before us and also bases their kernel on 2.6.18.) Cheers, Moritz -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Hi! * Adrian von Bidder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [070410 08:19]: > (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release > announcement, Actually it's often considered to be a good sign if your announcement is quoted in a news item (not extensive reviews), because that means that a) your announcement covered something they thought to be worth to be covered and b) your text fitted their needs quite good. But also note, that lazy journalists might falsify your positive statistics ;) Yours sincerely, Alexander signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, 10 Apr 2007, Steve Langasek wrote: If you find some facts in there, Well, it was just mentioned that others turned the facts into bug reports and I do not really want to reply to double rhetorics. feel free to summarize them for the benefit of the list so that we don't have to wade through more of that troll's screed. I just wanted to mention that even trolls might have a point and that ignoring valid points because they are brought up by trolls is the wrong way to go. Kind regards Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 10:39:22AM +0300, Riku Voipio wrote: > 1) there is a bug in etch kernel. (#418344 seems) > > While the bug was mentioned in some forums, it was not reported in > time to BTS. Clearly there are users who find using BTS daunting, and > thus we don't get bugreports in timely fashion. And now that there is a bug, a fix has been committed and should get uploaded to s-p-u soon. -- dann frazier -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 01:23:11PM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote: > On Tue, 10 Apr 2007, MJ Ray wrote: > >The subject should be: SJVN flames debian again... does anyone care? > Yes - as long there are some pure facts we should care. If you find some facts in there, feel free to summarize them for the benefit of the list so that we don't have to wade through more of that troll's screed. Cheers, -- Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.debian.org/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Hello Nico and *, Am 2007-04-10 14:41:03, schrieb Nico Golde: > No especially not if I get: > Configuration file `/etc/subversion/config' > ==> Modified (by you or by a script) since installation. > ==> Package distributor has shipped an updated version. >What would you like to do about it ? Your options are: > Y or I : install the package maintainer's version > N or O : keep your currently-installed version > D : show the differences between the versions > Z : background this process to examine the situation > The default action is to keep your current version. > *** config (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N] ? Y > Installing new version of config file /etc/subversion/config ... > dpkg: error processing subversion (--configure): > unable to install updated status of `subversion': No such file or directory > *** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (!prev): 0x08135de8 *** > Aborted I had this error in the rcS.d script which do the fsck! My Intranet server is working since over 2 Month under Etch without ANY problems up to Sunday! I am Off.Line and had updated it to the lates Etch-Packages and... ...was burned! Nothing was working anymore... nfs-kernel-server (could not export), courier (certs do not more worke) apache (not found my 280 VServer configs), php5 permission probs... On my Workststion I have found a Bug in /etc/X11/wdm/Xsession wher the second line contain only a singel "!". Change this to "! foo!" and ~/.xession will be read. I was workin on Monday over 6 Hours on my FileServer and then I have considered to REINSTALL from scratch (!!!) wich was working perfectly! > When updating to etch ;) :-) Thanks, Greetings and nice Day Michelle Konzack Systemadministrator Tamay Dogan Network Debian GNU/Linux Consultant -- Linux-User #280138 with the Linux Counter, http://counter.li.org/ # Debian GNU/Linux Consultant # Michelle Konzack Apt. 917 ICQ #328449886 50, rue de Soultz MSN LinuxMichi 0033/6/6192519367100 Strasbourg/France IRC #Debian (irc.icq.com) signature.pgp Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Hi, * Philippe Cloutier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-04-10 16:27]: > If someone is not satisfied with a problem in Etch, I strongly > suggest to report the problem and get it listed in errata if > appropriate. Sure if it would be reproducable and I could get a bit more useful information I would do this ;) > Mailing lists are for discussion, not to be a > release. There were specific issues about the release, this was just another. Kind regards Nico -- Nico Golde - http://ngolde.de - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - GPG: 0x73647CFF For security reasons, all text in this mail is double-rot13 encrypted. pgpELlwtRswaB.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
If someone is not satisfied with a problem in Etch, I strongly suggest to report the problem and get it listed in errata if appropriate. Mailing lists are for discussion, not to be a release. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Hi, * Andreas Tille <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-04-10 13:22]: > On Tue, 10 Apr 2007, MJ Ray wrote: > > >The subject should be: SJVN flames debian again... does anyone > >care? > > Yes - as long there are some pure facts we should care. > I don't come to the same conclusion of the article author but > not to > care is the wrong reaction only because the author is known to > flame > Debian. We had lots of "thanks for the great release" which has > definitely reasons but we should not simply ignore critics. No especially not if I get: Configuration file `/etc/subversion/config' ==> Modified (by you or by a script) since installation. ==> Package distributor has shipped an updated version. What would you like to do about it ? Your options are: Y or I : install the package maintainer's version N or O : keep your currently-installed version D : show the differences between the versions Z : background this process to examine the situation The default action is to keep your current version. *** config (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N] ? Y Installing new version of config file /etc/subversion/config ... dpkg: error processing subversion (--configure): unable to install updated status of `subversion': No such file or directory *** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (!prev): 0x08135de8 *** Aborted When updating to etch ;) Kind regards Nico -- Nico Golde - http://ngolde.de - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - GPG: 0x73647CFF For security reasons, all text in this mail is double-rot13 encrypted. pgpgdzA7qQDPh.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, 10 Apr 2007, MJ Ray wrote: The subject should be: SJVN flames debian again... does anyone care? Yes - as long there are some pure facts we should care. I don't come to the same conclusion of the article author but not to care is the wrong reaction only because the author is known to flame Debian. We had lots of "thanks for the great release" which has definitely reasons but we should not simply ignore critics. Kind regards Andreas. -- http://fam-tille.de -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Adrian von Bidder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html > Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or > somebody who has a realistic view of the world? [...] No, somebody who likes to troll debian almost every chance they get. I could tell it was an SJVN article long before I reached the sig. I've even seen him sneaking debian-digs into unrelated articles like the Linux Foundation's new board http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5306151939.html Read more debian attacks by the same author at http://www.linux-watch.com/cgi-bin/news_view.cgi?sk=debian+Vaughan-Nichols&st=all&ss=newest&view=Search The subject should be: SJVN flames debian again... does anyone care? Regards, -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only: see http://people.debian.org/~mjr/ Please follow http://www.uk.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Adrian von Bidder wrote: > http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html http://www.acc.umu.se/technical/statistics/ftp/monitordata/index.html -- see shy jo signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
On Tue, Apr 10, 2007 at 08:19:03AM +0200, Adrian von Bidder wrote: > http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html > Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or > somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy > to use etch, I might be a bit biased... It does not seem the "reporter" even tested debian, he's just citing comments from /. The real problems behind this clickbait article seem to be: 1) there is a bug in etch kernel. (#418344 seems) While the bug was mentioned in some forums, it was not reported in time to BTS. Clearly there are users who find using BTS daunting, and thus we don't get bugreports in timely fashion. 2) X is still hard to setup. This one is harder to figure out. The alternative is that this writer is talking about yast and/or graphical installer. His sentences don't really sense to me. Anyway I think it't not necessarily a good idea to put much effort into graphical setup tools. Much better alternative is *Automatic* setup tools. We have achieved much of this in d-i. D-I is text-mode in it's heart, but it is automatic, so it's actually very easy to use. For an example, we should not work on a distro-specific setup GUI, which has a checkbox "enable 3d acceleration" (like SUSE has). Instead installation should automatically setup 3d acceleration if it is available _AND_ bug-free. > (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release > announcement, there are some that are very positive, but I think where we > learn is how people *don't* like the release, This is a very good point. -- "rm -rf" only sounds scary if you don't have backups signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Many congratulations to the Debian Project Team members. It is a great effort. I am continuously watching this release since six month back. I daily see the page http://bugs.debian.org/release-critical/ in hope that number of release critical bugs will ultimately be zero. It has almost reached the zero point (around 60 are left). Now it has reached 81 probably because number of users reporting bugs have now increased after the "etch" release. Good work team. Congratulations again. Cheers, Pankaj On 4/10/07, Adrian von Bidder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Yo! http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy to use etch, I might be a bit biased... (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release announcement, there are some that are very positive, but I think where we learn is how people *don't* like the release, that's why I'm posting this here. Note that this is not an attack against the kernel or X people, I know they did a huge job.) cheers -- vbi -- featured product: Debian GNU/Linux - http://debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Debian 4.0 finally arrives... does anyone care?
Yo! http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS5673962628.html Merely somebody who likes Fedora and (Open)SuSE better than Debian, or somebody who has a realistic view of the world? While I'm personally happy to use etch, I might be a bit biased... (There are many news items more or less just quoting the release announcement, there are some that are very positive, but I think where we learn is how people *don't* like the release, that's why I'm posting this here. Note that this is not an attack against the kernel or X people, I know they did a huge job.) cheers -- vbi -- featured product: Debian GNU/Linux - http://debian.org pgp43jnov9j4Y.pgp Description: PGP signature
