Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Matthias Julius]

"Roberto C. Sanchez" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 03:33:15PM +, Steve Kemp wrote:
>> 
>>   The suggestion wasn't to remove the addresses, but to "mask" them.
>>  That would still allow you to lookup the sender addresses if you
>>  wished.  eg "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -> "foo at com.example".
>> 
>>   I'd strongly second the proposal myself, as well as updating some
>>  of our other email-based-systems.  For example listing emails in the
>>  qa pages, in Debian changelog entries on packages.debian.org, etc.
>> 
> Except that it ends up mangling things which are not email addresses and
> which legitimately need to have the @ symbol.

And each automatically mangled address can be automatically unmangled
as well.  The benefit would be very limited.

To be effective the addresses would need to be mangled in many
different ways - an what a mess would that be!

Matthias


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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Roberto C. Sanchez]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 03:33:15PM +, Steve Kemp wrote:
> 
>   The suggestion wasn't to remove the addresses, but to "mask" them.
>  That would still allow you to lookup the sender addresses if you
>  wished.  eg "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -> "foo at com.example".
> 
>   I'd strongly second the proposal myself, as well as updating some
>  of our other email-based-systems.  For example listing emails in the
>  qa pages, in Debian changelog entries on packages.debian.org, etc.
> 
Except that it ends up mangling things which are not email addresses and
which legitimately need to have the @ symbol.

Regards,

-Roberto

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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Steve Kemp]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 07:49:56PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:

> >   (I'm deliberately ignoring smtp-time checks..)
> 
> I don't think you should be. According to my recent stats, I
>  only accept about 25% of the mail thrown at my server (half of the
>  rest is rejected as Spam, the other half is grey-listed. Of the
>  quarter that I do accept, there is still some Spam, but I prefer to
>  be conservative.  I have not seen a Spam in the last two weeks or so.

  Badly phrased on my point.  I meant that in *addition* to SMTP-time
 checks of various kinds I still have to run the other tools and still
 end up with 400+ spam mails a day hitting my spam folder.

  70% of that is addressed to [EMAIL PROTECTED], 30% is to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

  Greylisting I'm on the point of abandoning, it isn't helping as much
 as it used to do.

Steve
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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 18:21:23 +, Steve Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

> On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 12:00:36PM -0300, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote:
>> Recently we had this thread about public emails in Debian
>> lists/BTS:
>> 
>> http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/08/msg00123.html

>   Thanks for the link.

>> If you agree, consider using bogofilter, I've used it (client-side)
>> with almost 100% of efficiency against spams - great performance,
>> also.
>> 

>   I already use pyzor, razor, spambayes, and many custom procmail
>  rules.  I resent having to waste my CPU to do filtering, but to be
>  honest that is irrelevant.  By the time you've accepted the mails
>  your bandwidth has been wasted/abused.

>   (I'm deliberately ignoring smtp-time checks..)

I don't think you should be. According to my recent stats, I
 only accept about 25% of the mail thrown at my server (half of the
 rest is rejected as Spam, the other half is grey-listed. Of the
 quarter that I do accept, there is still some Spam, but I prefer to
 be conservative.  I have not seen a Spam in the last two weeks or so.

manoj
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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Steve Kemp]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 12:00:36PM -0300, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote:

> Recently we had this thread about public emails in Debian lists/BTS:
> 
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/08/msg00123.html

  Thanks for the link.

> If you agree, consider using bogofilter, I've used it (client-side) with 
> almost 100% of efficiency against spams - great performance, also.
> 

  I already use pyzor, razor, spambayes, and many custom procmail
 rules.  I resent having to waste my CPU to do filtering, but to
 be honest that is irrelevant.  By the time you've accepted the
 mails your bandwidth has been wasted/abused.

  Some people pay for incoming traffic the solution to spam
 is not an arms race of filtering .. by the time you've accepted
 the mail you've already lost.

  (I'm deliberately ignoring smtp-time checks..)

Steve
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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Tiago Bortoletto Vaz]

Hi Steve,

On Sun, 3 Dec 2006 15:33:15 +
Steve Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

[...]

>   The suggestion wasn't to remove the addresses, but to "mask" them.
>  That would still allow you to lookup the sender addresses if you
>  wished.  eg "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -> "foo at com.example".

Recently we had this thread about public emails in Debian lists/BTS:

http://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2006/08/msg00123.html

and Paul sent this article as a suggestion to understand why we don't have to 
mask them:

http://www.interhack.net/pubs/munging-harmful

If you agree, consider using bogofilter, I've used it (client-side) with almost 
100% of efficiency against spams - great performance, also.

[]'s

--
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http://tiagovaz.org

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 é preciso ter a coragem de dizer."

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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Bastian Blank]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 03:33:15PM +, Steve Kemp wrote:
>   The suggestion wasn't to remove the addresses, but to "mask" them.
>  That would still allow you to lookup the sender addresses if you
>  wished.  eg "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -> "foo at com.example".

As humans can read this, computers can read this also, and they already
convert such masked email addresses back.

Bastian

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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Steve Kemp]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 04:11:41PM +0100, Marc Haber wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 03:31:44PM +0100, Javier Candeira wrote:
> > Regardless of past disclaimers and policies, would it be possible in the
> > future to do some masking of email addresses in online archives?
> 
> I strongly oppose this suggestion. It is frequently needed to e-mail
> the author of a mailing list message that has been posted a long time
> ago, and a chance of doing so is worth it.

  The suggestion wasn't to remove the addresses, but to "mask" them.
 That would still allow you to lookup the sender addresses if you
 wished.  eg "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" -> "foo at com.example".

  I'd strongly second the proposal myself, as well as updating some
 of our other email-based-systems.  For example listing emails in the
 qa pages, in Debian changelog entries on packages.debian.org, etc.

  95% of my incoming spam is sent to my @debian.org address - and
 whilst making a change now is probably too late to fix the problem
 it might help others in the future.

Steve
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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Marc Haber]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 03:31:44PM +0100, Javier Candeira wrote:
> Regardless of past disclaimers and policies, would it be possible in the
> future to do some masking of email addresses in online archives?

I strongly oppose this suggestion. It is frequently needed to e-mail
the author of a mailing list message that has been posted a long time
ago, and a chance of doing so is worth it.

Additionally, again, Martin already said that Debian mailing lists are
publicly archived on the web in a truckload of places. And, again,
additionally, nothing keeps the spammers from subscribing to the
mailing lists themselves.

Greetings
Marc

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Mannheim, Germany  |  lose things."Winona Ryder | Fon: *49 621 72739834
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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Javier Candeira]

Martin Zobel-Helas wrote:
> Hi Pierre!
> 
> On Sun Dec 03, 2006 at 01:45:36 +0100, pierrero wrote:
>> I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
>> email address and I start to receive spam.
>> It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
>> the spam robots :-(
> 
> The Debian-Listarchives-Policy is to NOT remove or alter any postings 
> if they are published.
> 
> Even if we would, it wouldn't help, as our lists are archived
> elsewhere, so once an email has been accepted it is out in the wild
> with its entire content and addresses and theres no way to get it back.
> 
> Please see http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#disclaimer and
> http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/disclaimer

I think the source of his complaint is that his email address was not
masked, and was easily syphoned off by spammers.

Regardless of past disclaimers and policies, would it be possible in the
future to do some masking of email addresses in online archives?

Thanks for your work keeping Debian lists running!

-- javier


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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Martin Zobel-Helas]

Hi Pierre!

On Sun Dec 03, 2006 at 01:45:36 +0100, pierrero wrote:
> I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
> email address and I start to receive spam.
> It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
> the spam robots :-(

The Debian-Listarchives-Policy is to NOT remove or alter any postings 
if they are published.

Even if we would, it wouldn't help, as our lists are archived
elsewhere, so once an email has been accepted it is out in the wild
with its entire content and addresses and theres no way to get it back.

Please see http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#disclaimer and
http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/disclaimer

Greetings
Martin, Debian Listmaster of the Day

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No manual entry for real-life


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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[Osamu Aoki]

On Sun, Dec 03, 2006 at 01:45:36AM +0100, pierrero wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
> email address and I start to receive spam.
> It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
> the spam robots :-(
> 
> The only site which proposes my address email is yours,
> so I am about sure that it comes from these messages:
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html
> http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html
> 
> Could you please delete these messages as fast as possible ?
> That "would save me" ;-)
> 
> My email address is: pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr
> 
> Thank you for your comprehension.
> Pierre ROLLAND

I do not know how ML admin handles you but here is the rule if you do
not know it.

http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/disclaimer

| Disclaimer for the Debian mailing lists
| 
| Our mailing lists are public forums, and our mailing list archives are
| public.
...(snip)...
| Debian does not generally monitor its mailing lists for inappropriate
| postings, and does not undertake editorial control of postings. We do,
| however, reserve the right to prevent posting to mailing lists in the
| event of failure to comply with the mailing list code of conduct.
| 
| Some spam and virus filtering is applied to every message that goes
| through Debian lists. Roughly 1 in 400 messages that are sent to the
| list actually make it through; the rest are discarded as spam.

Osamu


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Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[pierrero]

From: paul-debian A.T. home.paulcager.org


You may also want to try contacting the debian-www list;
they might be able to do it.

Regards,
Paul


---

Hello,

I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
email address and I start to receive spam.
It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
the spam robots :-(

The only site which proposes my address email is yours,
so I am about sure that it comes from these messages:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html
http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Could you please delete these messages as fast as possible ?
That "would save me" ;-)

My email address is: pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr

Thank you for your comprehension.
Pierre ROLLAND


--

Bonjour,

J'ai posté un message dans une de vos listes Debian à partir de mon
adresse professionnelle et je commence à recevoir du spam.
C'est très génant pour moi puisque j'avais réussi à la préservée de 
toute indexation par les robots de spams :-(


Le seul site qui propose mon adresse mail en clair étant le votre,
je suis à peu près sûr que cela vient de ces messages :
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html
http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Si vous pouviez effacer ces messages au plus vite,
cela "me sauverait" ;-)

L'adresse mail en question est :
pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr

Merci de votre compréhension.
Pierre ROLLAND


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Re: Delete my message on one Debian List Please (one More)

[Kevin Mark]

On Sat, Dec 02, 2006 at 01:27:04AM +0100, pierrero wrote:
> 
> And also this one please
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html
> 
> 
> ---
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
> email address and I start to receive spam.
> It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
> the spam robots :-(
> The only site which proposes my address email is yours, so I am about
> sure that it comes from these messages:
Hi Pierre,

As a Debian user I think Debian has a policy of having open email lists
that do not require you to subscribe to any list and of not altering the
email address to hide it from spam makers. Its very open and public just
like the internet, that never forgets anything you send.  Some person in
Debian can delete your post but it will not stop the spam, since they
already have your email address. Be sure in the future to use an email
address that will enable you to filter it or use some method to check
your email for spam. That is all anyone can do these days :-)
Debian does not spam. In fact, they remove thousands of spam a day from
entering the many email lists that you and I recieve, thank goodness!
Cheers,
Kev
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| : :' :  The  Universal | debian.home.pipeline.com |
| `. `'  Operating System| go to counter.li.org and |
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Delete my message on one Debian List Please

[pierrero]

Hello,

I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business 
email address and I start to receive spam.
It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by 
the spam robots :-(
The only site which proposes my address email is yours, so I am about 
sure that it comes from these messages: 
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html 
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html

http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Could you please delete these messages as fast as possible ? That “would 
save me” ;-) ;-)


My address email is: pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr
Thank you for your comprehension.
Pierre ROLLAND


--


Bonjour,

J'ai posté un message dans une de vos listes Debian à partir de mon 
adresse professionnelle et je commence à recevoir du spam. C'est très 
génant pour moi puisque j'avais réussi à la préservée de toute 
indexation par les robots de spams. :-(


Le seul site qui propose mon adresse mail en clair étant le votre, je 
suis à peu près sûr que cela vient de ces messages :

http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Si vous pouviez effacer ces messages au plus vite cela "me sauverait". ;-)

L'adresse mail en question est :
pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr

Merci de votre compréhension.
Pierre ROLLAND



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Delete my message on one Debian List Please (one More)

[pierrero]

And also this one please
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html


---

Hello,

I've posted messages in one of your Debian lists from from my business
email address and I start to receive spam.
It is very sad since I had succeeded with preserving of any indexing by
the spam robots :-(
The only site which proposes my address email is yours, so I am about
sure that it comes from these messages:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Could you please delete these messages as fast as possible ? That “would
save me” ;-) ;-)

My address email is: pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr
Thank you for your comprehension.
Pierre ROLLAND


--

Et celui ci aussi s'il vous plait:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00182.html

---

Bonjour,

J'ai posté un message dans une de vos listes Debian à partir de mon
adresse professionnelle et je commence à recevoir du spam. C'est très
génant pour moi puisque j'avais réussi à la préservée de toute
indexation par les robots de spams. :-(

Le seul site qui propose mon adresse mail en clair étant le votre, je
suis à peu près sûr que cela vient de ces messages :
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00240.html
http://lists.debian.org/debian-l10n-french/2006/11/msg00241.html
http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20061117.082730.43237201.en.html

Si vous pouviez effacer ces messages au plus vite cela "me sauverait". ;-)

L'adresse mail en question est :
pierre.rolland--AT--ibs.fr

Merci de votre compréhension.
Pierre ROLLAND




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