Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
For whose's interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colors_of_noise What about: TECH MD NSE CHR (rx noise character) WHT (white) // PNK (pink) ? ;-) 73' Paul PD0PSB -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2732639.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
Thank you Paul - the Wiki entry was new to me and very interesting. It demonstrated well to a non-expert such as myself the less aggressive nature of pink noise compared with white. The red/brown noise sounded even better to my ears but maybe its spectrum is not as suitable for voice communication. Anyone care to comment? 73 to all Geoff G3UCK - Original Message - From: pd0psb p.s.bijp...@gmail.com For whose's interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colors_of_noise What about: TECH MD NSE CHR (rx noise character) WHT (white) // PNK (pink) ? ;-) 73' Paul PD0PSB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
Geoff, Pink tends to sound most flat to our ears. That's why it's widely used to calibrate audio equipment. Red/brown may sound nice as well, but are relatively dark Funny thing about white is that it keeps that agressive nature in a restricted bandwidth, because the high flank will grab the most attention of our ears. I think that may be a reason to cause ear fatigue in the long run. In analog DIY radio's I've allways tried to maintain a pinkish character with a gentle low slope and a steep high. 73' Paul PD0PSB Geoffrey Downs-2 wrote: Thank you Paul - the Wiki entry was new to me and very interesting. It demonstrated well to a non-expert such as myself the less aggressive nature of pink noise compared with white. The red/brown noise sounded even better to my ears but maybe its spectrum is not as suitable for voice communication. Anyone care to comment? 73 to all Geoff G3UCK - Original Message - From: pd0psb p.s.bijp...@gmail.com For whose's interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colors_of_noise What about: TECH MD NSE CHR (rx noise character) WHT (white) // PNK (pink) ? ;-) 73' Paul PD0PSB __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2733381.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
It's important to note that the spectrum of the noise each of us hears is *not* the spectrum presented by the source. Everything we hear is filtered by our ears. In the past youngster's ears were considered rather 'flat' from perhaps 20 Hz up to above 16 kHz. That changes as we get older and experience loud noises. Typically we develop holes in our hearing where we cannot hear anything at specific frequencies. Also, our overall frequency response is damaged. The nerve attachments in our ears for the higher frequencies seem to be the most delicate and are the first damaged by repeatedly hearing loud sounds. Even so, the overdone thudding base of many sound systems can destroy sensitivity in the low registers too. That's why people today, even young people in their teens, typically have hearing no better than those of a octogenarian of half a century ago. A desire for loud music has created what experts in the USA call a generation of functionally deaf people. My hearing is full of holes punctuated by chronic ringing (tinnitus) and my upper register is gone, thanks to long-term exposure to firearms and explosives in the Army. As a result, I like a lot of high frequency emphasis because it provides the most natural sounding audio after it passes through *my* banged-up ears. It's no wonder there are as many opinions about the sound of a rig as there are people listening... Ron AC7AC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
All true Ron! Fact remains that by law of physics / psycho-acoustics pink is perceived by average human ears as flat. Therfore (I think) it would be nice to start off with a flat noise character, and adjust that per individual by the RX EQ. You will also notice that the range of the EQ by ear will become larger if it's fed with pink. So it will still be possible to counter-adjust your personal curve. 73' Paul PD0PSB It's important to note that the spectrum of the noise each of us hears is *not* the spectrum presented by the source. Everything we hear is filtered by our ears. In the past youngster's ears were considered rather 'flat' from perhaps 20 Hz up to above 16 kHz. It's no wonder there are as many opinions about the sound of a rig as there are people listening... Ron AC7AC -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2734300.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
Also true Steve! The K3 is the most silent I've ever experienced. Pull the antenna out and you're virtually left with nothing. That's why I think the hiss complaints are caused by its noise character... 73' Paul PD0PSB One thing I look for is audio stage hiss. Disconnect the antenna, turn down the AF gain to minimum and listen using hi-fi headphones. You should not hear anything. The K3 is dead silent. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2734973.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
BTW gentlemen, shall we put the lid on? We've been occupying quite some (pink) bandwidth! Thanks for the discussion! Paul PD0PSB Also true Steve! The K3 is the most silent I've ever experienced. Pull the antenna out and you're virtually left with nothing. That's why I think the hiss complaints are caused by its noise character... 73' Paul PD0PSB Steve Ellington wrote: One thing I look for is audio stage hiss. Disconnect the antenna, turn down the AF gain to minimum and listen using hi-fi headphones. You should not hear anything. The K3 is dead silent. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2735044.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
pd0psb wrote: -K3 in pink mode sounds round,smooth and balanced out. RX EQ now works correctly and is able to really shape the sound to many different flavours. I've been playing with the K3 RX EQ and watching the audio passband response on a spectrum analyzer. It's not very difficult to configure RX EQ settings to provide 3dB/octave rolloff if that's what you want. Using a 3.2Khz ssb bandwidth and 1.45Khz center freq, the following RX EQ settings did a good job of approximating the 3dB/octave rolloff on my K3 in USB, although results will vary somewhat depending on your roofing filters: RX EQ settings for rolloff above 200hz: 0 +8 +2 -3 -5 -10 -16 -16 RX EQ settings for rolloff above 500hz: 0 +8 +2 0 -3 -4 -7 -10 N2BC's K3_EZ software makes it easy to manipulate and save RX EQ settings: http://home.roadrunner.com/~n2bc/SW.htm 73, Barry N1EU -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2707344.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
pd0psb wrote: -K3 in pink mode sounds round,smooth and balanced out. RX EQ now works correctly and is able to really shape the sound to many different flavours. I've been playing and listening some more. I have to admit to at first being somewhat dismissive of Paul's suggestions, but not any longer. I think many listeners will prefer a downward sloping passband response. I've posted some results and preferences at http://n1eu.com/K3/K3_notes.htm (scroll down to RX EQ Settings - Pink Noise Rolloff). 73, Barry N1EU -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2708587.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
Thanks Barry! It's indeed possible to approach the -3db/oct roll of with the RX EQ, but it's not very accurate.(I tried this as well) In the audioworld it is very uncommon the make such drastic correction with EQ to make a source sound flat To have an accurate straight slope of -3db/oct (or a bit less) before the RX EQ and than make (small) EQ corrections to personal taste I'm sure will sound VERY good to everybody and make the K3's audio really shapable for the ear. 73' Paul PD0PSB I've been playing and listening some more. I have to admit to at first being somewhat dismissive of Paul's suggestions, but not any longer. I think many listeners will prefer a downward sloping passband response. I've posted some results and preferences at http://n1eu.com/K3/K3_notes.htm (scroll down to RX EQ Settings - Pink Noise Rolloff). 73, Barry N1EU -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2709258.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
What about: TECH MD NSE CHR (rx noise character) WHT (white) // PNK (pink) ? ;-) 73' Paul PD0PSB -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2709451.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [K3] K3 RX audio on voice modes oh no here we go again
IMD LPF and countersloping combined will make K3 the best sounding radio up to now, trust me. Let's make music ;-) 73' Paul PD0PSB You're right, Paul -- I skimmed right past the pink idea (oops) and interpreted the poster's concern as a more common one that customers have brought up, namely that they can hear higher-order products (above the nominal communications passband). Sloping the response is a very simple thing to do, and we've added that to the list. But we're also pursuing the high-order product issue. Interesting discussion! 73, Wayne N6KR -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/K3-RX-audio-on-voice-modes-%3Coh-no-here-we-go-again%3E-tp2699273p2710513.html Sent from the [K3] mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
