Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
Dan McMahill wrote: > > By far the worst shock I've ever received was 23 years ago working on a > Fender Bassman that was unplugged. I will *never* forget to discharge > caps again. Especially ones charged up to 500 volts. Thats one of > those mistakes you won't make twice. Yep, that's a bad day, but you lived to talk about it, and pass on the warning. My worst shock came when I was working on a plasma etching machine. Had to stick my head inside to take some voltage readings, found the voltage, with my pinky finger, rather than the meter probe. That was bad, but,,, trying to get away from that, I hit my head on the 440vac contactor which was over my head. That HURT, and I was wearing a hat! Told my boss he had choice, I was going outside and having a smoke, and he could have the design engineer work on the problem, or, I was going to find the blankety blank engineer, and pound him into the floor. The engineer showed up, and after we got things working, he decided it wasn't a good idea to put the 440 contactor on the roof of the cabinet, and he moved it to one of the side walls. I'm partly at fault here, I was taught in tech. school that usually the shock won't hurt you, but getting away from it will. To prove the point, the teacher made the lecture while holding a live suicide cord. I still find it amazing how old timers can predict the future. -- Darryl Gibson N2DIY Ubuntu, free software for everybody. (TM) RLU X 182668/379552 “Arms are the only true badges of liberty. The possession of arms is the distinction of a free man from a slave.” -- Andrew Fletcher, A Discourse of Government with relation to Militias (1698) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Dec 21, 2007, at 2:16 PM, Peter Clifton wrote: > > On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 16:06 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: >>> http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/sony_be3d.pdf >>> >>> I found myself wondering.. could you make a schematic / layout >>> like this >>> with gEDA? >> >> I suppose. How is that form better than what we have? >> >> The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already >> does. > > I also found myself wondering... do military engineers use the term > "exploded diagram" on their drawings? (So perhaps my comments / > thoughts aren't that useful at the moment!) Don't know, but once a defense lab asked me for a preview of my parts selection, ahead of the schematic release, so they could get going on procurement. I said, "OK, I'll send you a BOM". Consternation resulted! True story. > > -- > Peter Clifton > > Electrical Engineering Division, > Engineering Department, > University of Cambridge, > 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, > Cambridge > CB3 0FA > > Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) > > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user John Doty Noqsi Aerospace, Ltd. http://www.noqsi.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
Peter Clifton wrote: > On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 15:26 -0500, Darryl Gibson wrote: >> Ian Chapman wrote: >>> The last time I fixed a TV I resoldered all the joints on the nec board. >>> That's the round thing on the end of the tube. I found it by wiggling >>> wires. Try moving the wires on the horizontal deflection coils looking at >>> the screen with a mirror. Do not worry about the high voltages if it was >>> not dangerous it would not be fun. After all it's only a TV not an X-ray >>> machine or a WWII radar. >> Umm, it is an X-ray machine, or they used to be. I haven't been inside a >> TV in years, but don't the still carry X-ray warnings inside the chassis? >> >> A TV can hurt you, be safe, and watch out for that large red wire hooked >> to the picture tube. It will "jump" out and say hello to you. > > I _nearly_ learnt that the hard way once, removing an anode cap. > Something told me to ground it just as I was starting to peel back the > rubber. I pulled an inch long spark off it ;) > > I've fixed TVs and CRTs in the past.. just wasn't sure how to think this > one through to a likely part to prod. (I don't have a scope where I am > here). By far the worst shock I've ever received was 23 years ago working on a Fender Bassman that was unplugged. I will *never* forget to discharge caps again. Especially ones charged up to 500 volts. Thats one of those mistakes you won't make twice. -Dan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
Ben Jackson wrote: > On Fri, Dec 21, 2007 at 04:06:55PM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: >> The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already does. > > I would like to see better assembly diagrams. The actual silkscreen has > to stay off the pads (and out from under chips, if you want to see it). > The assembly drawing could easily center the refdes or value over the > footprint and scale it up large enough to fill the area. > I completely agree with this. When I used Accel EDA for some boards several years back, my impression at the time was "good tool", "easy to learn", and "lack of good assembly drawings make it not suitable for serious use in larger company". Anymore, you don't really have to even try to end up with a board where you simply can't get the refdes silk in there with 0402's being commonplace. Too many things to do, not enough time -Dan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Fri, Dec 21, 2007 at 04:06:55PM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already does. I would like to see better assembly diagrams. The actual silkscreen has to stay off the pads (and out from under chips, if you want to see it). The assembly drawing could easily center the refdes or value over the footprint and scale it up large enough to fill the area. -- Ben Jackson AD7GD <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.ben.com/ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 16:06 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/sony_be3d.pdf > > > > I found myself wondering.. could you make a schematic / layout like this > > with gEDA? > > I suppose. How is that form better than what we have? > > The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already does. I also found myself wondering... do military engineers use the term "exploded diagram" on their drawings? (So perhaps my comments / thoughts aren't that useful at the moment!) -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 16:06 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/sony_be3d.pdf > > > > I found myself wondering.. could you make a schematic / layout like this > > with gEDA? > > I suppose. How is that form better than what we have? > > The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already does. I didn't say it was better, but I expect there are certain styles of labels, annotations, silk screen text etc.. which we'd struggle to achieve. -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
> http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/sony_be3d.pdf > > I found myself wondering.. could you make a schematic / layout like this > with gEDA? I suppose. How is that form better than what we have? The PCB overlays could be the "assembly" prints that PCB already does. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 15:26 -0500, Darryl Gibson wrote: > Ian Chapman wrote: > > The last time I fixed a TV I resoldered all the joints on the nec board. > > That's the round thing on the end of the tube. I found it by wiggling > > wires. Try moving the wires on the horizontal deflection coils looking at > > the screen with a mirror. Do not worry about the high voltages if it was > > not dangerous it would not be fun. After all it's only a TV not an X-ray > > machine or a WWII radar. > > Umm, it is an X-ray machine, or they used to be. I haven't been inside a > TV in years, but don't the still carry X-ray warnings inside the chassis? > > A TV can hurt you, be safe, and watch out for that large red wire hooked > to the picture tube. It will "jump" out and say hello to you. I _nearly_ learnt that the hard way once, removing an anode cap. Something told me to ground it just as I was starting to peel back the rubber. I pulled an inch long spark off it ;) I've fixed TVs and CRTs in the past.. just wasn't sure how to think this one through to a likely part to prod. (I don't have a scope where I am here). -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 15:17 -0500, Darryl Gibson wrote: > This is a very weird set of problems. > > RGB lines indicate a failure of the vertical amp, which the shrinking > picture also indicates. > > Check the coupling capacitor between the vertical amp, and the yoke? Thanks, will do when I've got the set open again. It doesn't seem to be AC coupled. Do you mean the supply cap to the vert. amplifier? This set uses an electronic H. STAT convergence control (according to the diagram, a 110M pot between a RCV pin on the neck, and GND. There are various other magnetic gubbins: "VM" control, which controls some sort of electromagnetic coil around the neck, powered off B+ and a 9V rail, a rotation amplifier and coil (+15 from the flyback transformer, regulated down to 9V). I've got hold of a schematic: http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~pcjc2/sony_be3d.pdf I found myself wondering.. could you make a schematic / layout like this with gEDA? -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
Ian Chapman wrote: > The last time I fixed a TV I resoldered all the joints on the nec board. > That's the round thing on the end of the tube. I found it by wiggling > wires. Try moving the wires on the horizontal deflection coils looking at > the screen with a mirror. Do not worry about the high voltages if it was > not dangerous it would not be fun. After all it's only a TV not an X-ray > machine or a WWII radar. Umm, it is an X-ray machine, or they used to be. I haven't been inside a TV in years, but don't the still carry X-ray warnings inside the chassis? A TV can hurt you, be safe, and watch out for that large red wire hooked to the picture tube. It will "jump" out and say hello to you. -- Darryl Gibson N2DIY Ubuntu, free software for everybody. (TM) RLU X 182668/379552 “Arms are the only true badges of liberty. The possession of arms is the distinction of a free man from a slave.” -- Andrew Fletcher, A Discourse of Government with relation to Militias (1698) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
Peter Clifton wrote: > On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 01:32 +, Peter Clifton wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I'm fixing (or trying to) a TV for a friend, and wondered if anyone had >> any wisdom relating to the following symptom. >> >> This is a Sony BE-3D chassis, and exhibits an intermittent fault. When >> its doing it, the picture is still visible, but collapsed (jitteringly) >> upwards towards the top of the screen. It doesn't stay collapsed for >> particularly long. The sections of image which collapsed upwards also >> narrowed horizontally, leading to a tapered looking screen >> --- >> |\ /| >> | \ / | >> | \___/ | >> | | >> --- > > Thinking out loud a little.. > > collapsing towards the centre could indicate raised EHT, but this > doesn't really explain why its only happening towards the bottom of the > image. The image didn't seem to get any dimmer / brighter, so beam > current is presumably not going crazy. > > The vertical problem is asymmetric, so might indicate a glitch in either > the + or - 15V supply to the vertical drive amp. Those are derived > straight off the flyback, so either not enough energy is getting into > the circuit (dying B+?), or something is shorting it down > intermittently? > > What kind of symptoms would a bad yoke coil contact give (either H or > V?) > > Any guru style know-how / deduction would be much appreciated. > This is a very weird set of problems. RGB lines indicate a failure of the vertical amp, which the shrinking picture also indicates. Check the coupling capacitor between the vertical amp, and the yoke? -- Darryl Gibson N2DIY Ubuntu, free software for everybody. (TM) RLU X 182668/379552 “Arms are the only true badges of liberty. The possession of arms is the distinction of a free man from a slave.” -- Andrew Fletcher, A Discourse of Government with relation to Militias (1698) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Any TV repair gurus lurking?
The last time I fixed a TV I resoldered all the joints on the nec board. That's the round thing on the end of the tube. I found it by wiggling wires. Try moving the wires on the horizontal deflection coils looking at the screen with a mirror. Do not worry about the high voltages if it was not dangerous it would not be fun. After all it's only a TV not an X-ray machine or a WWII radar. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Parts Data deffinitions
Yep, a lot of our designs here start with this is what it has to do and this is where it has to fit. Physical size limitations are imposed. On Fri, 2007-12-21 at 10:44 -0600, John Griessen wrote: > Steve Meier wrote: > Project matters of course, and is a good place to define different DRCs. > > > 3) If the project is a circuitboard then before then before the netlist > > can be generated at least the package has to be selected (passive) and > > often the device (active). > > A device complete with package and required values, manufacturor is > > called a "component"? If the project is a circuit either asic or fpga > > then generic types are probably going to be translated into standard > > logic cells? > > I just decided to trash a part I thought was "nifty" for assembly difficulty > reasons. > pcb parts have constraints such as placement courtyard in a 2D sense, > but package height is a big deal too, > and the 3D zone it needs to reserve during assembly > maybe deserves its own data type such as: > > * placement keepout volume > * placement robot keepout > * placement no-fly zone > * placement skyprint > * placement collision volume > * placement canyon > * placement wall > > Wall seems the most compact terminology (in English) to refer to this by. > > John Griessen > > Ecosensory Austin TX > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Parts Data deffinitions
Steve Meier wrote: Project matters of course, and is a good place to define different DRCs. > 3) If the project is a circuitboard then before then before the netlist > can be generated at least the package has to be selected (passive) and > often the device (active). > A device complete with package and required values, manufacturor is > called a "component"? If the project is a circuit either asic or fpga > then generic types are probably going to be translated into standard > logic cells? I just decided to trash a part I thought was "nifty" for assembly difficulty reasons. pcb parts have constraints such as placement courtyard in a 2D sense, but package height is a big deal too, and the 3D zone it needs to reserve during assembly maybe deserves its own data type such as: * placement keepout volume * placement robot keepout * placement no-fly zone * placement skyprint * placement collision volume * placement canyon * placement wall Wall seems the most compact terminology (in English) to refer to this by. John Griessen Ecosensory Austin TX ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: could not connect nets gschem/gsch2pcb/pcb
>>Having multiple netnames should not be a problem and work "sometimes". >> >> > >Methinks that having multiple netnames for the same net should ALWAYS >trigger a DRC error. > > > For connecting different nets there must be a schematic which connects the nets. Why should manual connecting nets be an error? I often have vcc, 5volts, analog voltages and maybe others which I must connect. Changing the schematics which I use more then in one design is not a solution. Sometimes vcc goes to +5V, sometimes to +3.3V, sometimes analog voltage for an opamp is the +5volts and vcc, sometimes I have a seperate 12V net. This is simply wired on a extra schematic. This is the only solution I know. If connecting nets should be an error, what is your (the list members) prefered solution for this kind of workflow? Bye Klaus ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: youngest user?
On Dec 21, 2007, at 1:22 AM, Steve Meier wrote: > I have always claimed, I can go further on a gallon of beer and a > bicycle then a gallon of gas and a car. Now that gallon of beer is > cheaper then the gallon of gas. Is this a green house gas reduction? > That I won't promise. It certainly wouldn't be with the way MY digestive system handles beer. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL Farewell Ophelia, 9/22/1991 - 7/25/2007 ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: [OT] Beer and bicycles
If you flooded your carberator with a gallon of gas you wouldn't get 100 metres either. Trick is to spread that consumption out a bit. David SMITH wrote: > On Thu, Dec 20, 2007 at 10:22:20PM -0800, Steve Meier wrote: > >> I have always claimed, I can go further on a gallon of beer and a >> bicycle then a gallon of gas and a car. >> > > Well, I know for sure that if I drunk a gallon of beer, I'd be lucky to > go 100 metres on my bike... > > ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: youngest user?
On Thu, 2007-12-20 at 20:02 -0800, Steve Meier wrote: > Ok so from an Australian point of view. Or any other location on earth. > You arn't spinning, its the rest of the universe. > > Steve M. > Er. That would be a Queenslander (aka banana-bender). Me? I'm from the Southern Island (Taswegian - also notoriously two-headed). We stick it up the mainlanders a fair bit 'cause Tasmania has been left 'off the map' in a couple of past notable ad campaigns. One was the 1988 bi-centennial celebration (of anglo-saxon settlement) logo. -- Greg > Larry Doolittle wrote: > > On Thu, Dec 20, 2007 at 05:41:09PM -0800, Steve Meier wrote: > > > >> Actualy the point of perspective is solar north > >> > > > > That wasn't part of the question. > > > > > >> so the australians are spinning counter clockwise too > >> > > > > Depends on your point of view. > > > >- Larry > > > > > > ___ > > geda-user mailing list > > geda-user@moria.seul.org > > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user > > > > > > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user -- Greg Cunningham mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: youngest user?
On Thu, Dec 20, 2007 at 11:42:42AM -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > Great, does she know Ohm's law yet? > > "The colors mean numbers. It's like a secret code. You're grey years > old!" ITYM "black grey black years old"... -- David Smith| Tel: +44 (0)1454 462380Home: +44 (0)1454 616963 STMicroelectronics | Fax: +44 (0)1454 462305 Mobile: +44 (0)7932 642724 1000 Aztec West| TINA: 065 2380 GPG Key: 0xF13192F2 Almondsbury| Work Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] BRISTOL, BS32 4SQ | Home Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: [OT] Beer and bicycles (was: Re: youngest user?)
On Thu, Dec 20, 2007 at 10:22:20PM -0800, Steve Meier wrote: > I have always claimed, I can go further on a gallon of beer and a > bicycle then a gallon of gas and a car. Well, I know for sure that if I drunk a gallon of beer, I'd be lucky to go 100 metres on my bike... -- David Smith| Tel: +44 (0)1454 462380Home: +44 (0)1454 616963 STMicroelectronics | Fax: +44 (0)1454 462305 Mobile: +44 (0)7932 642724 1000 Aztec West| TINA: 065 2380 GPG Key: 0xF13192F2 Almondsbury| Work Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] BRISTOL, BS32 4SQ | Home Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
