Re: gEDA-user: Cambridge coding weekend
On Monday 25 August 2008 07:10:56 Dave McGuire wrote: >What's the rationale for ditching Guile? I'm not arguing against > it, I'm just curious. I've used Guile as an embedded scripting > language in a project of my own and didn't have any trouble with it. > Some releases are a pain to build on non-Linux platforms, but other > than that my results were positive. More on this on the dev list later today. Peter -- Peter Brett Electronic Systems Engineer Integral Informatics Ltd signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Cambridge coding weekend
On Aug 21, 2008, at 6:29 PM, Peter TB Brett wrote: > 3. (The big one). Embedding TinyScheme into libgeda, and then > ripping out > Guile. If all goes as planned, this should result in gschem, > gnetlist etc > working identically from the users point of view. This stuff will > be in a > branch, obviously! Check out my 'die-guile-die' branch if you want > to see the > progress so far [http://repo.or.cz/w/geda-gaf/peter-b.git]. What's the rationale for ditching Guile? I'm not arguing against it, I'm just curious. I've used Guile as an embedded scripting language in a project of my own and didn't have any trouble with it. Some releases are a pain to build on non-Linux platforms, but other than that my results were positive. I will have to take a peek at TinyScheme. > 3a. Add a bare-bones Scheme REPL / batch processing app somewhere, > aimed at > people who want to e.g. do weird and wonderful things to schematics > from > Makefiles. (If I have time after 3). Now THAT will be neat. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Need opinion on O-scope
On Aug 24, 2008, at 6:02 PM, Robert Butts wrote: > I found an oscilloscope on ebay that the asuction ends tonight. At > the risk of gettting someone else interested in it it's at this link: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-7854-400-Mhz-Digital-Analog- > Oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ170253977697QQcmdZViewItem? > hash=item170253977697&_trkparms=72%3A552%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65% > 3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 > > It's been years so I'm asking everyones input on this scope. I see the auction has already ended. :-( That would've been a truly fantastic scope. I'd love to have grabbed that myself! It even had the waveform calc module. I'm drooling here! -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
On Aug 24, 2008, at 6:26 PM, Peter Clifton wrote: >>> Does anyone have a good source, other than ebay, for cheap >>> (possibly used or refurbished) oscilloscopes? >> >>eBay. ;) >> >>Seriously. You can avoid it on some sort of moral grounds or >> something like that, if you're willing to screw yourself. > > I would avoid eBay / Paypal like the plague. Too many sharks, and > if you > get bitten, both of the above companies are _completely_ useless at > doing anything constructive about it. No doubt. However, since 1999, I've purchased exactly 1,811 items on eBay, ranging from capacitors to supercomputers to cars. I've sold nearly 400 items, spanning the same range of stuff. In that time, I've gotten screwed precisely three times. I've saved untold tens (if not hundreds) of thousands of dollars, and have obtained things that would have otherwise been simply unobtainable at any price. (parts for 40-year-old minicomputers, for example) eBay's management are a bunch of slimeballs, to be sure. Their rules, fees, and web app code all get worse with each passing year. However, it's still a HUGE net win with easily manageable risk. If you know what you are doing, and are VERY careful, you can do very well. And, in the USA at least (I notice that you're in the UK and Mouse is in Canuckistan) dealing with "hyperprofiteering" retail stores can be even more treacherous than the worst sharks on eBay. Wal*Mart, a gigantic lower-class retail chain that is forcing nearly every other retail store out of business all over this country, is peddling huge volumes of Chinese-made garbage to every drooling moron in the USA. Most people don't seem to care about the fact that the "same merchandise" are often seconds, slightly different (cheaper) but seemingly identical models of things like vacuum cleaners that one magically cannot buy parts for if it is within a serial number range that went to Wal*Mart, rotten beef injected with color enhancers, etc etc etc...they just care that it's a few pennies cheaper in the short term, and they don't think about why they have to replace it the following year. And yet people still flock to these stores, because here, in the land of obedient consumer sheep, cheaper is better...even when it isn't. A few sharks on eBay are nothing compared to that. So, in my not-so-humble opinion, speaking from the standpoint of some experience with these matters: Use eBay to your advantage. Watch your back, read the fine print, know what you are buying, pay very close attention to sellers' feedback ratings and comments, and...get that new oscilloscope for a fraction of what a dealer would charge. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Need opinion on O-scope
On Aug 24, 2008, at 8:09 PM, Dan McMahill wrote: >>> I found an oscilloscope on ebay that the asuction ends tonight. >>> At the risk >>> of gettting someone else interested in it it's at this link: >>> >>> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-7854-400-Mhz-Digital-Analog- >>> Oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ170253977697QQcmdZViewItem? >>> hash=item170253977697&_trkparms=72%3A552%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65% >>> 3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 >>> >>> It's been years so I'm asking everyones input on this scope. >> >> I have the Tek 7903, so some things related to it will apply to the >> 7854. These are 20+ year old oscilloscopes. Expect to have to >> occasionally do a repair. Mine has needed it 3 times. Two were failed >> (shorted) tantalum caps and the other was a connector that was >> corroded. There are some Tektronix proprietary parts in these scopes >> that you will only be able to get from a parts scope. Other than all >> that the Tektronix 7000 series are very nice oscilloscopes. Whenever >> mine dies and can't be fixed, I am not quite sure if I will get >> another or go for a digital scope. > > I'll second what Darrell said. I don't have that exact one, but > the 7k > scopes were quality units. There are a lot of plugins on the market > which can offer you some nice features. For example the 7A22 plugins > will get you down to 10 uV (yes, that 'u' as in 'micro') per division > which can be pretty nice for some things. > > Really I only have 2 complaints about mine. > > 1) I only have about a 100 MHz one and I wish it were faster. > > 2) It is heavy and my tolerance for heavy things has gone down > significantly over the years. I've owned a 7704 and a 7904, and currently have an R7603 (hosting a 7CT1 curve tracer) and have found them all to be great units. The 7000 series dates back to the early 1970s, and the fact that there are so many of them still out there working everyday in labs says a lot about their quality and utility. They are maintainable and readily available. There are plug-ins to suit pretty much every oscilloscope application, and even plug-ins to turn it into a curve tracer or a spectrum analyzer. Documentation (both user and service manuals) are readily available, and user support is excellent...there are even quite a few mailing lists and forums that are frequented even by some of the guys who DESIGNED those scopes. (Yahoo's TekScopes list comes to mind) You can't get support that good with current-model equipment. Really worried about it breaking and not being easily fixable? Buy two, they're cheap. A loaded one goes for ~$200...a thin one goes for half that, even less if you don't have to pay for shipping. These are scopes that cost more than cars in 1971. > I drool when I see these lunchbox sized scopes that weigh about 5 lbs! Yeah, but the nice small ones are always digital oscilloscopes...completely different instrument, as you know. I've got a Tektronix TDS3012 lunchbox-sized digital scope that I love, but when things get dicey on the bench, out comes the Tek 2465A analog scope. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
> I would avoid eBay / Paypal like the plague. Same here. Last I heard (it's been a while since I checked, but nothing I've heard indicates they've gotten better) their user agreement was multiple dozens of pages. They also required agreeing to foreign legal jurisdiction. Either of those alone would have been enough to keep me away. But then add to it all the horror stories I've heard about how they don't enforce even what rules they have, and it's not even worth checking periodically; if they change drastically enough for me to become interested, I'm sure I'll hear about it. Stopping running an unregulated bank would be a good first step. (Yes, I consider them a bank. They quack like a bank, they waddle like a bank) /~\ The ASCII der Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTML[EMAIL PROTECTED] / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Need opinion on O-scope
Darrell Harmon wrote: > On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Robert Butts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I found an oscilloscope on ebay that the asuction ends tonight. At the risk >> of gettting someone else interested in it it's at this link: >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-7854-400-Mhz-Digital-Analog-Oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ170253977697QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170253977697&_trkparms=72%3A552%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 >> >> It's been years so I'm asking everyones input on this scope. >> >> Thanks! >> >> >> ___ >> geda-user mailing list >> geda-user@moria.seul.org >> http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user >> >> > > I have the Tek 7903, so some things related to it will apply to the > 7854. These are 20+ year old oscilloscopes. Expect to have to > occasionally do a repair. Mine has needed it 3 times. Two were failed > (shorted) tantalum caps and the other was a connector that was > corroded. There are some Tektronix proprietary parts in these scopes > that you will only be able to get from a parts scope. Other than all > that the Tektronix 7000 series are very nice oscilloscopes. Whenever > mine dies and can't be fixed, I am not quite sure if I will get > another or go for a digital scope. > > Darrell Harmon I'll second what Darrell said. I don't have that exact one, but the 7k scopes were quality units. There are a lot of plugins on the market which can offer you some nice features. For example the 7A22 plugins will get you down to 10 uV (yes, that 'u' as in 'micro') per division which can be pretty nice for some things. Really I only have 2 complaints about mine. 1) I only have about a 100 MHz one and I wish it were faster. 2) It is heavy and my tolerance for heavy things has gone down significantly over the years. I drool when I see these lunchbox sized scopes that weigh about 5 lbs! -Dan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:26:30 +0100, Peter Clifton wrote: > I would avoid eBay / Paypal like the plague. Too many sharks, and if you > get bitten, both of the above companies are _completely_ useless at > doing anything constructive about it. My reasoning: I got my test and measurement gadgets from ebay at 2/3 to half the price compared to traditional refurbished dealers. (Hameg 1570, HP 33120A, Rhode&Schwarz SMG, Tek 495P + TR503, fast scope probes, Avvantest wavemeter) If one out of four were completely lost to a shark, I'd still win. However, everything came as described, or better (keeps fingers crossed). ---<(kaimartin)>--- -- Kai-Martin Knaak http://lilalaser.de/blog ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
On Sun, 2008-08-24 at 17:20 -0400, Dave McGuire wrote: > On Aug 24, 2008, at 4:34 PM, Robert Butts wrote: > > Does anyone have a good source, other than ebay, for cheap > > (possibly used or refurbished) oscilloscopes? > >eBay. ;) > >Seriously. You can avoid it on some sort of moral grounds or > something like that, if you're willing to screw yourself. I would avoid eBay / Paypal like the plague. Too many sharks, and if you get bitten, both of the above companies are _completely_ useless at doing anything constructive about it. -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Need opinion on O-scope
On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Robert Butts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I found an oscilloscope on ebay that the asuction ends tonight. At the risk > of gettting someone else interested in it it's at this link: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-7854-400-Mhz-Digital-Analog-Oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ170253977697QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170253977697&_trkparms=72%3A552%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 > > It's been years so I'm asking everyones input on this scope. > > Thanks! > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user > > I have the Tek 7903, so some things related to it will apply to the 7854. These are 20+ year old oscilloscopes. Expect to have to occasionally do a repair. Mine has needed it 3 times. Two were failed (shorted) tantalum caps and the other was a connector that was corroded. There are some Tektronix proprietary parts in these scopes that you will only be able to get from a parts scope. Other than all that the Tektronix 7000 series are very nice oscilloscopes. Whenever mine dies and can't be fixed, I am not quite sure if I will get another or go for a digital scope. Darrell Harmon ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Need opinion on O-scope
I found an oscilloscope on ebay that the asuction ends tonight. At the risk of gettting someone else interested in it it's at this link: http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronix-7854-400-Mhz-Digital-Analog-Oscilloscope_W0QQitemZ170253977697QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170253977697&_trkparms=72%3A552%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 It's been years so I'm asking everyones input on this scope. Thanks! ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
On Aug 24, 2008, at 4:34 PM, Robert Butts wrote: > Does anyone have a good source, other than ebay, for cheap > (possibly used or refurbished) oscilloscopes? eBay. ;) Seriously. You can avoid it on some sort of moral grounds or something like that, if you're willing to screw yourself. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: Poor man's O-scope?
Does anyone have a good source, other than ebay, for cheap (possibly used or refurbished) oscilloscopes? ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: home-made pcb
> What type of paper do you print on? Is it necessary to use a laser > printer or can I use an inkjet photo-printer? Can I use an iron > instead of a laminator? I use specially coated paper and a laser printer (inkjet won't work, it's the toner itself that's the mask), but you can use certain types of glossy paper, even from magazines. For more information on TT see: http://www.pulsarprofx.com/PCB/a_Pages/1_Menu/overview.html You can also get "press-n-peel blue" paper, which combines the toner transfer and sealant in a single step. For photofilm you really need an inkjet; toner isn't uv-opaque enough to make a good mask. I use an Epson R280 with coated transparencies from Jetstar. The coating makes the ink dry immediately, avoiding smears and puddling. You can use an iron, but you have to experiment and practice more to get consistent results. Check out the Homebrew_PCBs Yahoo! group for details; they cover that stuff pretty extensively. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: home-made pcb
> What type of paper do you print on? Is it necessary to use a laser > printer > or can I use an inkjet photo-printer? Can I use an iron instead of a > laminator? There are different processes. You need to do a little research and see which one you want to take on. The laser printer toner process has a strong following and gives decent results if you're patient. I've done laser-printer toner transfers using injet paper (with 'clay' surface). You print the stuff backwards and iron it onto bare copper clad boards. After ironing soak the boards in warm water to get the paper to partially dissolve and abandon the toner on the surface. Then etch in ammonium persulfate. I found it to be not so easy and seemed to always have to hand paint resist. A hot etch bath and agitation with a small paintbrush or cotton swab makes the etch go faster and more predictably. phil ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: home-made pcb
What type of paper do you print on? Is it necessary to use a laser printer or can I use an inkjet photo-printer? Can I use an iron instead of a laminator? On Sun, Aug 24, 2008 at 1:50 PM, DJ Delorie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > What gerber files do I have print to make a home-made card? Is > > there a tutorial somewhere? > > Depending on how you make them, you either want postscript or PNG > exports from PCB. I use postscript for TT because my laser printer > knows postscript, and PNG for photofilm because the inkjet gets its > prints from the Gimp. > > In general, you want the top and bottom copper prints, and maybe the > two silkscreens. The FAB drawing helps with manual drilling. If you > make your own paste stencil, you need the paste layer too. > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user > ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: home-made pcb
> What gerber files do I have print to make a home-made card? Is > there a tutorial somewhere? Depending on how you make them, you either want postscript or PNG exports from PCB. I use postscript for TT because my laser printer knows postscript, and PNG for photofilm because the inkjet gets its prints from the Gimp. In general, you want the top and bottom copper prints, and maybe the two silkscreens. The FAB drawing helps with manual drilling. If you make your own paste stencil, you need the paste layer too. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: home-made pcb
What gerber files do I have print to make a home-made card? Is there a tutorial somewhere? ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: sparkfun 4 layer boards To: gEDA
John Doty says: > Nope. Quantum efficiency of silicon detectors drops like a rock just > beyond 1 ?m wavelength: the radiation just goes right through without > interacting. Indeed, Si wafers make excellent entrance windows for > for thermal IR detectors. v > A 350 K blackbody emits ~271 ?W/mm2 of thermal radiation, but only > ~4.4 fW/mm2 of that is short of 1 ?m. With very fast optics, > cryogenic temperatures, a state of the art scientific CCD, the > extremely low noise video chains I design for astronomy, and rigorous > exclusion of every optical photon, you might be able to see > something. With commercial/industrial technology, not a chance. > > On the other hand, a 350 K component is pretty easy to find with your > finger... So how do they do this (answer in the last URL)? http://www.x20.org/thermal/ http://www.temperatures.com/tivendors.html http://www.opticsplanet.net/heat-seekers-termal-imagers.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermography John Perry ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: gschem 1.4.0 crashing while editing symbol attributes
On Sun, 2008-08-24 at 16:45 +0100, Peter Clifton wrote: > On Sat, 2008-08-23 at 12:49 +0100, Peter Clifton wrote: > > On Sat, 2008-08-23 at 13:39 +0200, Christoph Lechner wrote: > > > > > > > > Just found out that it's even easier to crash it. > > > > > > Just place a resistor, delete the contents of the value field in the > > > "Edit Attributes" window (just as above). Then with the text field still > > > having the focus click some other window on the screen (for exampe a > > > shell window) > > > > Yep ;) > > > > I checked the validator on resistor too. > > Ok, my analysis was wrong - the validator is working, that was a bug in > the git HEAD branch. I see the Gtk-Warning too on my box, but in > versions prior to GTK2.10, this is followed by an assertion which aborts > the program. I'll see if we can avoid tripping over it. This could be rather complex to fix. The problem is that we run the validation dialog box from the focus-out event of the cell renderer. That spins a mainloop, and the timeout which blinks the caeret in the renderer gets called. (Which is where the assertion failure is - the box has lost focus, and it is checking to see that the focus-out handler was appropriately called, and the timeout removed). I "vote" for changing behaviour to match the GtkEntry as used in the "name" column. Observe there, if you're editing and loose focus, all edits are dropped on the floor. Doing this means we can skip the validation step, and we don't ever try opening a dialog whilst the editor widget is in the middle of loosing focus. -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: gschem 1.4.0 crashing while editing symbol attributes
On Sat, 2008-08-23 at 12:49 +0100, Peter Clifton wrote: > On Sat, 2008-08-23 at 13:39 +0200, Christoph Lechner wrote: > > > > > Just found out that it's even easier to crash it. > > > > Just place a resistor, delete the contents of the value field in the > > "Edit Attributes" window (just as above). Then with the text field still > > having the focus click some other window on the screen (for exampe a > > shell window) > > Yep ;) > > I checked the validator on resistor too. Ok, my analysis was wrong - the validator is working, that was a bug in the git HEAD branch. I see the Gtk-Warning too on my box, but in versions prior to GTK2.10, this is followed by an assertion which aborts the program. I'll see if we can avoid tripping over it. -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: footprint request: mini-fit 4P
On Sat, 23 Aug 2008 09:22:26 +0200 (CEST) Igor2 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > does anyone have PCB footprint for mini-fit 4P connector? Well... mini-fit 8P. It should be straight forward to generate a 4 pin version. http://logonex.eu/cgi-bin/viewvc/viewvc.cgi/levalib/mini_fit_8.fp?view=log Cheers, Levente -- Levente Kovacs http://logonex.eu ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
