Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
Stefan Salewski wrote: > On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 14:26 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: >>> ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ls src/hid/batch/ >>> batch.c batch_lists.h >>> ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ >>> >>> There is no hid.conf >> Then you have an incomplete source tree. That hid.conf was added in >> May 2006 when the batch HID was added. >> > > Indeed, in the git tree I see > > src/hid/batch/hid.conf containing this line: > >1 type=gui > > But in the 20081128 latest PCB snapshot it is missing. > > In config.log it is mentioned. > > 2006-05-14 20:54 djdelorie > > * src/: Makefile.am, Makefile.in, hid/batch/batch.c, > hid/batch/hid.conf: Add batch-mode HID. > > Such files do exist in the snapshot tree, but only in other directories. > > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ grep type=gui */*/*/* > src/hid/gtk/hid.conf:type=gui > src/hid/lesstif/hid.conf:type=gui > > So the latest snapshot made by > > http://www.seul.org/pipermail/geda-announce/2008-November/thread.html > > is broken. thats because when that file was added it didn't get added to the list of files which go into the distribution file. I fixed it in git this afternoon and although I didn't fix my release procedure I left a big note in the procedure stating what needs fixing up to catch errors like this in the future. -Dan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 14:26 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ls src/hid/batch/ > > batch.c batch_lists.h > > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ > > > > There is no hid.conf > > Then you have an incomplete source tree. That hid.conf was added in > May 2006 when the batch HID was added. > Indeed, in the git tree I see src/hid/batch/hid.conf containing this line: 1 type=gui But in the 20081128 latest PCB snapshot it is missing. In config.log it is mentioned. 2006-05-14 20:54 djdelorie * src/: Makefile.am, Makefile.in, hid/batch/batch.c, hid/batch/hid.conf: Add batch-mode HID. Such files do exist in the snapshot tree, but only in other directories. ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ grep type=gui */*/*/* src/hid/gtk/hid.conf:type=gui src/hid/lesstif/hid.conf:type=gui So the latest snapshot made by http://www.seul.org/pipermail/geda-announce/2008-November/thread.html is broken. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: pcb segmentation fault
Could you send me a board that triggers this? ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: pcb segmentation fault
Ok, Id did some investigation on this. src/hid/png/png.c:1093 I found that when gdImageCreate(r,r) is called with r=0, it'll not create anything and will returm NULL. It is confirmed by the documetation. Since the gc->brush is null, it will cause the segfault when gdImageColorAllocate(null,...) called. Patch attached. I'm not sure if it is the right thing, but it works for me And I don't know why r gets 0. Levente On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:32:33 +0100 Levente Kovacs wrote: > Hi, > > > If I do > > pcb -x png --format PNG --dpi 600 --photo-mode --outfile af_cs.png > af.pcb > > I get: > > ... > gd warning: one parameter to a memory allocation multiplication is > negative or zero, failing operation gr acefully > > Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault. > [Switching to Thread 0x7f452e7956e0 (LWP 10735)] > 0x7f452c0737e0 in gdImageColorAllocateAlpha () > from /usr/lib/libgd.so.2 (gdb) where > #0 0x7f452c0737e0 in gdImageColorAllocateAlpha () > #from /usr/lib/libgd.so.2 1 0x0049e676 in use_gc > #(gc=0x21c66c0) at hid/png/png.c:1098 2 0x0049ec19 in > #png_draw_arc (gc=0x0, cx=364075, cy=90157, width=5905, height=5905, > start_angle=255, delta_angle=0) at hid/png/png.c:1269 > #3 0x0043a37d in hole_callback (b=0x22444f8, cl= #optimized out>) at draw.c:1121 4 0x004765a8 in __r_search > #(node=0x22451d0, query=0x7fff367b0990, arg=0x7fff367b0850) > at rtree.c:539 > #5 0x004765bf in __r_search (node=, > #query=0x7fff367b0990, > arg=0x7fff367b0850) at rtree.c:589 > #6 0x004765bf in __r_search (node=, > #query=0x7fff367b0990, > arg=0x7fff367b0850) at rtree.c:589 > #7 0x004765bf in __r_search (node=, > #query=0x7fff367b0990, > arg=0x7fff367b0850) at rtree.c:589 > #8 0x00476636 in r_search (rtree=, > #query=0xff, > check_region=, found_rectangle=0xff, cl=0x0) > at rtree.c:625 > #9 0x0043e51f in hid_expose_callback (hid= #out>, region=0x7fff367b0990, > item=) at draw.c:465 > #10 0x0049fb95 in png_hid_export_to_file (the_file= #optimized out>, options=0x6f3880) > at hid/png/png.c:355 > #11 0x004a019a in png_do_export (options=0x6f3880) at > #hid/png/png.c:624 12 0x00451611 in main (argc=2, > #argv=0x7fff367b0cf0) at main.c:971 > > This is on ubuntu, and with a git version of PCB. It fails with all > of my layouts. > > uname -a > Linux jive 2.6.27-11-generic #1 SMP Thu Jan 29 19:28:32 UTC 2009 > x86_64 GNU/Linux > > Cheers, > Levente > > -- > Levente Kovacs > http://logonex.eu > > > > ___ > geda-user mailing list > geda-user@moria.seul.org > http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user > -- Levente Kovacs http://logonex.eu png.c_diff Description: Binary data ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 14:26 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ls src/hid/batch/ > > batch.c batch_lists.h > > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ > > > > There is no hid.conf > > Then you have an incomplete source tree. That hid.conf was added in > May 2006 when the batch HID was added. > Seems that the file from http://geda.seul.org/dist/pcb-20081128.tar.gz is not identical with your tree! The archive which is currently mirrored and used by Gentoo is identical to that what I downloaded a week ago -- and now again. There is no src/hid/batch/hid.conf This is from the file downloaded a week abo: ste...@amd64-x2 ~ $ tar -tf pcb-20081128.tar |grep hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/bom/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/lesstif/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/nelma/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/gtk/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/lpr/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/gerber/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/ps/hid.conf pcb-20081128/src/hid/png/hid.conf ste...@amd64-x2 ~ $ tar -tf pcb-20081128.tar |grep batch pcb-20081128/src/hid/batch/ pcb-20081128/src/hid/batch/batch_lists.h pcb-20081128/src/hid/batch/batch.c ste...@amd64-x2 ~ $ And this from a fresh download: ste...@amd64-x2 ~/Desktop $ gunzip pcb-20081128.tar.gz ste...@amd64-x2 ~/Desktop $ tar -xf pcb-20081128.tar ste...@amd64-x2 ~/Desktop $ ls pcb-20081128/src/hid/batch/ batch.c batch_lists.h ste...@amd64-x2 ~/Desktop $ ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 14:26 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > Then you have an incomplete source tree. That hid.conf was added in > May 2006 when the batch HID was added. > > Thanks, I will verify this. It really surprises me. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
> ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ls src/hid/batch/ > batch.c batch_lists.h > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ > > There is no hid.conf Then you have an incomplete source tree. That hid.conf was added in May 2006 when the batch HID was added. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 14:06 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > > So, look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf: > > > > > > type=gui > > Did you look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf ? > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ls src/hid/batch/ batch.c batch_lists.h ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ There is no hid.conf > > Did you see a "checking ./src/hid/batch/hid.conf" ? > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ./configure --with-gui=batch |grep batch checking for which gui to use... batch configure: error: batch is not a valid gui ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ Can not see a "checking ./src/hid/batch/hid.conf" > > > Currently this is done with --without-gui argument for ./configure. > > That should *not* work, I'm surprised that it does. > Sorry, my message was unclear: The --without-gui is currently used to try to install PCB without GUI -- I think the Gentoo maintainers have used this because it is mentioned in the INSTALL file: ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ grep without-gui INSTALL --without-gui = specifies that no GUI will be built. This ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ The maintainers can not test all possible installs -- this is why i currently do some testing to improve the Gentoo install scripts (ebuilds). ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
> > So, look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf: > > > > type=gui Did you look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf ? > On my test box GTK is installed. Doesn't matter. > ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ./configure --with-gui=batch > > gives > > checking ./src/hid/ps/hid.conf Did you see a "checking ./src/hid/batch/hid.conf" ? > If a Gentoo user has installed GTK or Motif/Lesstif he shall be still > able to build PCB without a GUI. Gentoo is irrelevent; the control is within the pcb sources, and it should work. > Currently this is done with --without-gui argument for ./configure. That should *not* work, I'm surprised that it does. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 13:31 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > HIDs are auto-detected: > > for hid in `cd $srcdir/src/hid; echo *`; do > F=$srcdir/src/hid/$hid/hid.conf > if test -f $F > then > echo checking $F > . $F > case $type in > gui ) hid_guis="$hid_guis $hid" ;; > printer ) hid_printers="$hid_printers $hid" ;; > export ) hid_exporters="$hid_exporters $hid" ;; > always ) hid_always="$hid_always $hid" ;; > esac > fi > done > > So, look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf: > > type=gui > Sorry, this does not really help me. On my test box GTK is installed. ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ./configure --with-gui=batch gives checking ./src/hid/ps/hid.conf checking for which gui to use... batch configure: error: batch is not a valid gui ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ So above switch does not work for PCB 20081128. For Gentoo we try to to not use autodetection but let user choices. If a Gentoo user has installed GTK or Motif/Lesstif he shall be still able to build PCB without a GUI. Currently this is done with --without-gui argument for ./configure. But I still have to test if this really works. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
HIDs are auto-detected: for hid in `cd $srcdir/src/hid; echo *`; do F=$srcdir/src/hid/$hid/hid.conf if test -f $F then echo checking $F . $F case $type in gui ) hid_guis="$hid_guis $hid" ;; printer ) hid_printers="$hid_printers $hid" ;; export ) hid_exporters="$hid_exporters $hid" ;; always ) hid_always="$hid_always $hid" ;; esac fi done So, look in src/hid/batch/hid.conf: type=gui ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 12:45 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > >checking for which gui to use... batch > > >configure: error: batch is not a valid gui > > That works just fine for me, using the git head. > For PCB 20081128: >From configure.ac >AC_MSG_CHECKING([for which gui to use]) >AC_ARG_WITH([gui], >[ --with-gui=Specify the GUI to use: batch gtk lesstif >[[default=gtk]]], >[], >[with_gui=gtk] >) >AC_MSG_RESULT([$with_gui]) >case " $hid_guis no none " in > *\ $with_gui\ * ) HIDLIST="$with_gui" ;; > * ) AC_MSG_ERROR([$with_gui is not a valid gui]) ;; >esac > >if test x"$with_gui" = x"none" -o x"$with_gui" = x"no" >then >HIDLIST= >fi I do not really understand these autotools stuff, but at least there is no "batch" mentioned. Compiles fine with --with-gui=none AMD64-X2 geda-pcb # ldd /var/tmp/portage/sci-electronics/geda-pcb-20081128/image/usr/bin/pcb linux-vdso.so.1 => (0x7fffccffe000) libdl.so.2 => /lib/libdl.so.2 (0x7fbcc4a0) libm.so.6 => /lib/libm.so.6 (0x7fbcc477f000) libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x7fbcc4437000) /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 (0x7fbcc4c04000) AMD64-X2 geda-pcb # ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
> >checking for which gui to use... batch > >configure: error: batch is not a valid gui That works just fine for me, using the git head. ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 17:34 +, Peter Clifton wrote: > On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 18:26 +0100, Stefan Salewski wrote: > > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 14:42 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > > > A related question: > > > > Is --enable-dbus only valid in conjunction with a GUI (GTK/Motif) or can > > dbus be used if PCB is compiled without GUI (we have a bug related to > > this in Gentoo bugzilla database). > > The dbus support relies on about 4 hooks provided by the HID interface > which are only implemented in the GTK and Lesstif HIDs. > > They relate to timers and file-watches (for IO). These allow the DBus > library to integrate with the main-loop of the running GUI. It won't > work without them, so I guess the easy answer is.. no, the Batch HID > does not support DBus. > > If anyone had a use-case for a DBus enabled batch HID, then either the > hooks could be implemented (along with a home-brew main-loop), or more > sensibly, make the batch HID dependent on GLib and its main-loop, then > take the hook code straight from the GTK HID. > Thanks for this detailed anwer, this saves me some testing. My guess (from grep output) is that something like --with-gui=none or --with-gui=no will suppress the GUI. Indeed makes more sense to me as --with-gui=batch mentioned in ./configure -- help output. Best wishes Stefan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 18:26 +0100, Stefan Salewski wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 14:42 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > A related question: > > Is --enable-dbus only valid in conjunction with a GUI (GTK/Motif) or can > dbus be used if PCB is compiled without GUI (we have a bug related to > this in Gentoo bugzilla database). The dbus support relies on about 4 hooks provided by the HID interface which are only implemented in the GTK and Lesstif HIDs. They relate to timers and file-watches (for IO). These allow the DBus library to integrate with the main-loop of the running GUI. It won't work without them, so I guess the easy answer is.. no, the Batch HID does not support DBus. If anyone had a use-case for a DBus enabled batch HID, then either the hooks could be implemented (along with a home-brew main-loop), or more sensibly, make the batch HID dependent on GLib and its main-loop, then take the hook code straight from the GTK HID. -- Peter Clifton Electrical Engineering Division, Engineering Department, University of Cambridge, 9, JJ Thomson Avenue, Cambridge CB3 0FA Tel: +44 (0)7729 980173 - (No signal in the lab!) ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
gEDA-user: PCB, configure: error: batch is not a valid gui
On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 14:42 -0500, DJ Delorie wrote: > It is recognized by configure still. You get a pcb with no gui at > all, which is only useful if you want to use the exporters. However, > these days, it's better to configure with the "batch" gui, as you get > fewer warning messages when running pcb. I have just tested a PCB install without GUI for Gentoo. Seems that --with-gui=batch does not really work, I got >checking for which gui to use... batch >configure: error: batch is not a valid gui So instructions from configure are not sufficient? ste...@amd64-x2 ~/geda/pcb-20081128 $ ./configure --help |grep gui --with-gui= Specify the GUI to use: batch gtk lesstif [default=gtk] Seems that --with-gui=batch even in conjunction with --without-gui does not work. A related question: Is --enable-dbus only valid in conjunction with a GUI (GTK/Motif) or can dbus be used if PCB is compiled without GUI (we have a bug related to this in Gentoo bugzilla database). Thanks Stefan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: single-sided boards
On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 5:25 AM, David SMITH wrote: > On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 07:05:05PM +, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote: >> On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 16:47:28 +, David SMITH wrote: >> >> > From a user's point-of-view, it makes life much easier because they no >> > longer have the hassle of generating Gerbers (e.g. getting the correct >> > version of RS274, putting in the right number of decimal places, >> > including a readme file to indicate which layer is which, etc...) >> >> There are no such options in the gerber export dialog of pcb. > > Maybe not, but it's there in other packages, though, so this info still > needs to be communicated to the fab somehow (as it doesn't go in the > Gerber file itself), or you rely on them making correct assumptions. > > Just looking at the FAQs on many of the PCB fab websites, it is clear > that people make all types of mistakes generating Gerbers (layer order > wrong, drill file mistakes, etc...). Being able to put this process > in the hands of the "professionals" who are doing it all the time just > means that errors are likely to be eliminated. I would rather submit boards in the gerber format that is common to all vendors rather than rely on "professionals" to properly translate multiple CAD formats to their process. The PCB gerber plots work well. I have done 30 - 40 designs and have not had an issue. I always check the gerber plots with gerbv to confirm the plots. I set the PCB color scheme and the gerbv color scheme to the same values for easier comparison. I would rather do the panelization and plots myself, with scripts, rather than rely on the vendor. It is easier for me to check the resulting plots. (* jcl *) -- You can't create open hardware with closed EDA tools. http://www.luciani.org ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: single-sided boards
David SMITH wrote: > On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 07:05:05PM +, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote: >> On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 16:47:28 +, David SMITH wrote: >> >>> From a user's point-of-view, it makes life much easier because they no >>> longer have the hassle of generating Gerbers (e.g. getting the correct >>> version of RS274, putting in the right number of decimal places, >>> including a readme file to indicate which layer is which, etc...) >> There are no such options in the gerber export dialog of pcb. > > Maybe not, but it's there in other packages, though, so this info still > needs to be communicated to the fab somehow (as it doesn't go in the > Gerber file itself), or you rely on them making correct assumptions. FAB houses have lots of experience in dealing with the confusing and broken output from a whole slew of EDA tools. Note that some of this information is in fact there. For example, the leading/trailing zero bit and # of digits is *supposed* to go in the headers (at least for the drill files) but some tools give you flexibility to go outside of the specs and also generate garbage headers. > > Just looking at the FAQs on many of the PCB fab websites, it is clear > that people make all types of mistakes generating Gerbers (layer order > wrong, drill file mistakes, etc...). Being able to put this process > in the hands of the "professionals" who are doing it all the time just > means that errors are likely to be eliminated. > but now they need to deal with countless versions of countless different tools. And while it is not a big deal for pcb, it becomes a big deal if they are having to buy high dollar EDA tools and there is plenty of room for a "professional" to screw up generation of gerbers. Actually, I cringe at the idea of someone else generating gerbers for a board of mine without me reviewing the result with something like gerbv. There is a newer file format available that is supposed to address many of the shortcomings of the now-ancient RS274-X but the information I've been given by the one or two vendors I asked is that they still prefer RS274-X and haven't had a solid migration to the newer format(s). -Dan ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: single-sided boards
On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 07:05:05PM +, Kai-Martin Knaak wrote: > On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 16:47:28 +, David SMITH wrote: > > > From a user's point-of-view, it makes life much easier because they no > > longer have the hassle of generating Gerbers (e.g. getting the correct > > version of RS274, putting in the right number of decimal places, > > including a readme file to indicate which layer is which, etc...) > > There are no such options in the gerber export dialog of pcb. Maybe not, but it's there in other packages, though, so this info still needs to be communicated to the fab somehow (as it doesn't go in the Gerber file itself), or you rely on them making correct assumptions. Just looking at the FAQs on many of the PCB fab websites, it is clear that people make all types of mistakes generating Gerbers (layer order wrong, drill file mistakes, etc...). Being able to put this process in the hands of the "professionals" who are doing it all the time just means that errors are likely to be eliminated. -- David SmithWork Email: dave.sm...@st.com STMicroelectronics Home Email: david.sm...@ds-electronics.co.uk Bristol, England GPG Key: 0xF13192F2 ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
Re: gEDA-user: single-sided boards
On Thu, 05 Mar 2009 10:30:29 +0300, Ineiev wrote: > It now contains --merge-drills option to output all drills into single > "unplated" file; probably this can be useful for producing > "single-sided" boards. I'd prefer an option "single sided". This should produce gerbers suitable to send to the fab for production as a single sided layout. ---<(kaimartin)>--- ___ geda-user mailing list geda-user@moria.seul.org http://www.seul.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/geda-user
