Re: Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[Tina K.]

On 2012/02/01 12:42, Christopher Satterfield so eloquently wrote:

The G4 won't run too well with flash, but using TenFourFox and the Youtube
HTML5 player it might not be so bad. I use a G5 2.0 DP with TenFourFox and
Youtube HTML5 and it runs fairly well.


Good point. I don't have Flash installed in my Mac Pro, instead I use Chromium for 
when I need Flash compatibility. Lately though I've been needing Chromium less and 
less for YouTube, about 80% of them play without Flash.


Good riddance to bad code.


Tina

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Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[MJH Raichyk]

Thank you, all.  That was an eye opener and I'll be thinking I should  
just hang on to this lil thing that has served us well for a dozen  
years, and just be patient with youtube, maybe hunt down those other  
software ideas.  At least now I know what the scoop is on parallel  
processing and have added some new jargon to things that make sense  
to me.  amazing stuff right inside this lil box.  maybe I'll replace  
the screen to get the energy use down so I can run off wind (vaut)  
and batteries, more later once I get the anemometer data, since micro- 
climate stuff may be more potent than the mainframe-type average wind  
data shows and I'm suspecting that our electric sources for our cool  
tools in these boxes is going down the tubes.  at least faster than  
we can fix up the messes around us.   ttyl

mj raichyk

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Re: Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[Christopher Satterfield]

The G4 won't run too well with flash, but using TenFourFox and the Youtube
HTML5 player it might not be so bad. I use a G5 2.0 DP with TenFourFox and
Youtube HTML5 and it runs fairly well.

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Re: Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[John Carmonne]

On Feb 1, 2012, at 8:31 AM, MJH Raichyk wrote:


  CPU Type: PowerPC G4  (2.9)
  Number Of CPUs:   2
  CPU Speed:450 MHz
  L2 Cache (per CPU):   1 MB
  Memory:   896 MB

This is what my profiler says and I'm running Tiger 10.4.11 so how  
do I plan my moves, like the iMac as well, this has always seemed  
confusing with that 'dual core' idea.  Does that dual stuff double  
my speed maybe, and/or mean my ram is really double.   I was just  
happy with my system as is, then this 'word' went around that now  
even my 10 was going to be history.  Took a while to transition to  
the 10 from the 9 etc.  I do mostly research for simulations (math  
or logic models) and writing reports, and now so many articles are  
pointing to youtube (which before was not appealing), but now those  
now sometimes are universally user friendly... cancel anything with  
much Flash.  Hope this is adequate to figure out the dual, upgrade  
scheme for this machine.

ttyl
mj raichyk


That machine is best to stay with Tiger it's way too slow to run  
Leopard or play Youtube  and to upgrade it would be a waste of money  
compared to the cost of a used Intel iMac even a fast PPC Mac has a  
hard time playing Youtube smoothly. My fastest PPC is a G5 Dual 2.7  
and youtube is just barley watchable IMHO. If you use OS9 then you  
have to stay with a PPC with Tiger to run it in Classic mode If you  
boot OS9 then the fastest machine is a G4 MDD dual 1.25 F/W 400 model.



JOHN CARMONNE
Yorba Linda CA
92886 USA
From TiBook 867




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Re: Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[Bruce Johnson]

On Feb 1, 2012, at 9:31 AM, MJH Raichyk wrote:

>   CPU Type:   PowerPC G4  (2.9)
>   Number Of CPUs: 2
>   CPU Speed:  450 MHz
>   L2 Cache (per CPU): 1 MB
>   Memory: 896 MB
> 
> This is what my profiler says and I'm running Tiger 10.4.11 so how do I plan 
> my moves, like the iMac as well, this has always seemed confusing with that 
> 'dual core' idea.  Does that dual stuff double my speed maybe, and/or mean my 
> ram is really double.   I was just happy with my system as is, then this 
> 'word' went around that now even my 10 was going to be history.  Took a while 
> to transition to the 10 from the 9 etc.  I do mostly research for simulations 
> (math or logic models) and writing reports, and now so many articles are 
> pointing to youtube (which before was not appealing), but now those now 
> sometimes are universally user friendly... cancel anything with much Flash.  
> Hope this is adequate to figure out the dual, upgrade scheme for this machine.

Ok, there's a few confusing terms going around.

The "Core 2 Duo" and "Core Duo" systems being talked about here are Intel CPU's 
with two processing cores on the same silicon die, it's one cpu inthat it is 
one chip; but it acts like dual CPU systems because there are two (or more in 
later iterations of this cpu design).

Your mac has two separate G4 CPU chips on the processor card.

Neither will 'double your speed'. 

What DOES happen is that computing tasks that can be split among two processors 
will be done in (0.5 + overhead)*the time it would take a single processor of 
the same speed. That 'overhead coefficient is wildly variable and depends on 
the OS and CPU's involved.

The Core Duo and Core 2 Duo (and later iterations like the i5 and i7)  
multi-core cpu designs have a much tighter hardware coupling to this behavior, 
and so your speed is closer to 1/n * core # speed, or even better.

This, for example, is the equivalent info from my system (which just over a 
year old, it was made in October 2010 enter your serial number here 
 to find out when yours was 
made):

Model Name: iMac
  Model Identifier: iMac11,3
  Processor Name:   Intel Core i7
  Processor Speed:  2.93 GHz
  Number Of Processors: 1
  Total Number Of Cores:4
  L2 Cache (per core):  256 KB
  L3 Cache: 8 MB
  Memory:   8 GB

I've got the Core i7 4-core system. Due to the design of the iN series of 
processors, each core can run two processes (called threads) in parallel, so my 
system is behaving as if it has 8 CPU's.

Aside from splitting computationally intensive tasks for true parallel 
processing, multiple cpu or multi-core systems also offer the ability to simply 
do more things at once: Word could be running on one CPU and Firefox on the 
other, which will speed up overall performance.

What this means in practice is:

If your process is heavily CPU bound (things like rendering video, rendering 3D 
images, encoding music, anything involving lots and lots of sequential 
calculations) you will approach (but never reach) a true 2x speedup.

If your OS is properly written (and starting with 10.4 OS X was) many things in 
the OS will take advantage of the multi-core abilities to do more than one 
thing at a time, giving you a performance boot in everyday use.

The CPU manufacturers have tacitly ended the 'gigahertz' wars because they're 
not getting the leaps in cpu speed that they used to do; increases of CPU speed 
in modern electronics means that they're runne=ing headlong into quantum and 
other effects that only happen in very small distances and at very high 
frequencies. So they've gone the same route used for increasing processing 
power since the early 80's: packing more than one CPU into the box...in this 
case packing more into the CPU package. Hence the multicore series of 
processors noe current in all the major CPU platforms. Even the iPhone now has 
a dual-core cpu.

The improvement gained by using multiple CPUs has been overshadowed in recent 
years by the increasing use of the extremely powerful and fast processors in 
video cards to offload some of the CPU load onto the GPU (Graphics processing 
unit). These chips have a much more limited number of things they do (they make 
bad general CPU's for this reason) but some things they do very very well; 
things that can be heavily parallelized work amazingly well on modern GPU's 
which may have the equivalent of 32, 64 or even 128 'processors') 

When an os can offload computationally-intensive tasks onto the GPU the 
performance gains can be on the order of a couple magnitudes different.

OS X, starting with 10.5 (and the Core series of API's, Core Video, Core 
Graphics, etc) makes use of this tactic, so it's really not a 2 CPU == 2x 1CPU 
calculation anymore. 

Dragging it back to YOUR case, the best upgrade you could get would be to an 
Intel-based Mac, provided you're not limited to PPC-only code. 

A modern iMac or Mac Mini,

Another Tiger/upgrade question -- on dual core something'

[MJH Raichyk]

  CPU Type: PowerPC G4  (2.9)
  Number Of CPUs:   2
  CPU Speed:450 MHz
  L2 Cache (per CPU):   1 MB
  Memory:   896 MB

This is what my profiler says and I'm running Tiger 10.4.11 so how do  
I plan my moves, like the iMac as well, this has always seemed  
confusing with that 'dual core' idea.  Does that dual stuff double my  
speed maybe, and/or mean my ram is really double.   I was just happy  
with my system as is, then this 'word' went around that now even my  
10 was going to be history.  Took a while to transition to the 10  
from the 9 etc.  I do mostly research for simulations (math or logic  
models) and writing reports, and now so many articles are pointing to  
youtube (which before was not appealing), but now those now sometimes  
are universally user friendly... cancel anything with much Flash.   
Hope this is adequate to figure out the dual, upgrade scheme for this  
machine.

ttyl
mj raichyk

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Re: Needed - Head phone jack for iMac G3 slot loader

[D. Fabel]

I'm there and here, fingers crossed, waiting...
Doug


On Jan 31, 2012, at 10:40 PM, Tina K. wrote:

> On 2012/01/31 09:20, D. Fabel so eloquently wrote:
> 
> Try the LEM Swap list.
> 
> 
> Tina

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File Associations

[Amanda Ward]

I do a lot of microprocessor programming with a program called BST that saves 
files with the extension of .spin.

When I upgraded to Lion, the OS decided that all my source files (600+) were 
"Spin Reports" and the new default program to open them is Console. This is a 
real pain since I normally open a project folder, double click on a file and 
BST opens it. Now Console opens several windows with tons of information I have 
no need for.

I can go to each file, open Get Info and change the file association 
individually. No… "Change All" doesn't work and it even changes the file I just 
changed to open with BST back to opening with Console.

I tried selecting multiple files and I either get a "Get Info" window for each 
file or a "Multiple Item Info" . The multiple windows will let me change the 
file associations individually, but with over 500 of them left it's a lot of 
work.

The "Multiple" window is strange… I can select BST as the default program and 
click "Change All" and it works… for a second. The icons for the spin files 
change to BST and the "Kind" changes from "Spin Report"  to "Spin Document". 
Great! Except something in the bowels of the OS decides "Wait! You can't do 
that!" and changes everything back to Console again.

Last neat thing before I beg for help… I can change the spin files to open with 
anything, anything at all… except BST. I changed them all to Word documents and 
then tried to change to BST. Nope! Back to Console files. Tried Textedit, 
Xcode, Photoshop… nada.

Sorry this is long and complicated, but I'm hoping someone has a suggestion. 
I'm not looking forward to spending hours and hours dealing with this. :-|

Thanks for any guidance!

Amanda Ward  

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Re: upgrade from tiger to???

[kelly logsdon]

How would I go about "update to Leopard" and how would I "upgrade the ram to at 
least 2GB", and how do I get "10.7 Lion"?  Thank you for your time. -Kelly
 
If you always do, what you have always done, you don't get to complain about 
the results you always get. Change is the 'wings' you give yourself.


>
> From: Jonas Ulrich 
>To: imaclist@googlegroups.com 
>Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 10:28 AM
>Subject: Re: upgrade from tiger to???
> 
>
>I would be willing to bet that the problem is viewing video on the web. Thats 
>because Tiger is too old now, and doesn't support the latest Flash Player. You 
>could safely update to Leopard without upgrading the ram, but you would soon 
>need to upgrade that as well, because Leopard is on it's way out.
>
>I would definitely upgrade the ram to at least 2GB, and update the OS to the 
>newest, 10.7 Lion.
>
>You've got a great computer there, just an old OS.
>
>-Jonas
>
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>
>
>

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Re: upgrade from tiger to???

[Brian Christmas]

On 01/02/2012, at 5:54 AM, Jonas Ulrich wrote:

You're right John, what I meant was that Leopard is becoming less and less 
useful to an average user.

And yes, I completely forgot about Snow Leopard, that would also work.

-Jonas



Kelly, this might help  you understand about the memory limitations of your 
iMac.

Whilst it can accept up to 4GB ram, the recommended amount is 3 GB, and you 
could simply pull one 512MB stick and insert a 2GB module for 2 1/2 GB

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/imac/faq_cd/imac-intel-how-to-upgrade-memory.html


Regards

Santa



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Re: upgrade from tiger to???

[Brian Christmas]

On 01/02/2012, at 5:54 AM, Jonas Ulrich wrote:

You're right John, what I meant was that Leopard is becoming less and less 
useful to an average user.

And yes, I completely forgot about Snow Leopard, that would also work.

-Jonas



G'day Kelly

As I see it, you need three things.

1. a backup system

2. More memory

3. An updated OS, with perian, flip4mac, & latest Flash driver.


Addressing 1.  If you can afford it, I would buy one of these…

http://www.newertech.com/products/ministack.php

Unfortunately the older model seems to have been discontinued, and the new one 
not yet released. The benefit of them is they are quietly fan cooled (heating 
can cause a problem in many external cases, as I've found to my detriment), and 
they automatically turn on and off when your Mac does. Use the Firewire 400 
connection. If you shop around you might get an older case, preferably fit it 
with at least a hard disk as large as your iMac drive, or larger. If you want 
to upgrade to Lion in the future, and use Time Machine instead of CCC, you 
should get a drive at least one and a half times larger. Use the free Carbon 
Copy Cloner, http://www.bombich.com/download.html   to back up as frequently as 
you like. I suggest daily. Personally I've got three ministacks, with 
TimeMachine hourly backup, and CCC daily and weekly backup.  Don't use Western 
Digital hard drives in the cases; I suggest Seagate or Samsung. 


Addressing 2. Looks like you'll have to take out at least one of the 512MB 
sticks, and preferably replace it with a 2 GB stick. I'm in Oz, but I buy my 
ram from OWC in the States.


Addressing 3. You can still  buy Snow Leopard from Apple, 
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC573Z/A  and provided you've got a fast 
enough internet link, update to Lion electronically. Do this after you've 
backed up your old system.



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