Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
On 12/5/05, Han-Wen Nienhuys <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Erik Sandberg wrote: > > On Sunday 04 December 2005 18.32, Raphael Manfredi wrote: > > > >>What is the technical reason for repeats to not be automatically "played" > >>(i.e. unfolded) as many times as necessary in the MIDI output? > >> > >>The "\unfoldRepeats" is a crude hack, and I fail to see the justification > >>behind this feature. Surely, lilypond knows how to iterate over repeats > >>to be able to process "\unfoldRepeats" so surely it should not have any > >>problem generating correct MIDI output without this directive. > >> > >>Why isn't this behaviour "fixed" to behave normally, i.e have MIDI output > >>reflect the music as written? > > > > > > Currently, MIDI is mainly intended mainly for prooflistening purposes, and > > it's not very relevant to listen to repeats when prooflistening. > > > > There are also technical reasons: The interpretation of "volta", "unfold" > > etc. > > is not done by the midi/layout backends, but by music iterators. And music > > iterators don't know whether midi or layout output is being produced. > > > I'm planning to restructure the syntax of \score, \book and \midi in the > 2.9 cycle so this will no longer be an issue. It would be interesting to hear more about the syntactic changes, maybe as we get closer to 2.9.x. -- Trevor Bača [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
Quoting Erik Sandberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> from ml.lilypond.users: :Look for "MIDI rewrite" here: :http://lilypond-design.com/sponsor/open-features.html Sounds (sic!) really interesting. How much is sought for this feature? I can contribute about 50 EUR for it. Any other user would like to team up with me to meet the price tag? I'd also offer 50 EUR, perhaps more, but later. Greetlings from Lake Constance --- fiëé visuëlle Henning Hraban Ramm http://www.fiee.net http://angerweit.tikon.ch/lieder/ http://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer) ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
Quoting Erik Sandberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> from ml.lilypond.users: :Look for "MIDI rewrite" here: :http://lilypond-design.com/sponsor/open-features.html Sounds (sic!) really interesting. How much is sought for this feature? I can contribute about 50 EUR for it. Any other user would like to team up with me to meet the price tag? Raphael ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
Erik Sandberg wrote: On Sunday 04 December 2005 18.32, Raphael Manfredi wrote: What is the technical reason for repeats to not be automatically "played" (i.e. unfolded) as many times as necessary in the MIDI output? The "\unfoldRepeats" is a crude hack, and I fail to see the justification behind this feature. Surely, lilypond knows how to iterate over repeats to be able to process "\unfoldRepeats" so surely it should not have any problem generating correct MIDI output without this directive. Why isn't this behaviour "fixed" to behave normally, i.e have MIDI output reflect the music as written? Currently, MIDI is mainly intended mainly for prooflistening purposes, and it's not very relevant to listen to repeats when prooflistening. There are also technical reasons: The interpretation of "volta", "unfold" etc. is not done by the midi/layout backends, but by music iterators. And music iterators don't know whether midi or layout output is being produced. I'm planning to restructure the syntax of \score, \book and \midi in the 2.9 cycle so this will no longer be an issue. -- Han-Wen Nienhuys - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
One reason is that the MIDI output, at least initially, only was intended for proof listening a score, not to produce any musically pleasing output. In such a situation, you clearly don't want to listen to the repeats. Regarding realizations of pralls, trills and so on, I hope you realize that there is no single "correct" realization of each such ornament. So, I would judge it extremely hard to implement something that produces a MIDI output that is pleasing to listen to, especially considering all the treatises from the baroque era that describes how all playing and ornamentation should be done according to the "good taste". /Mats Raphael Manfredi wrote: What is the technical reason for repeats to not be automatically "played" (i.e. unfolded) as many times as necessary in the MIDI output? The "\unfoldRepeats" is a crude hack, and I fail to see the justification behind this feature. Surely, lilypond knows how to iterate over repeats to be able to process "\unfoldRepeats" so surely it should not have any problem generating correct MIDI output without this directive. Why isn't this behaviour "fixed" to behave normally, i.e have MIDI output reflect the music as written? Raphael P.S: Why aren't pralls, trills, arpeggios not automatically realized during MIDI output? When playing baroque music, the lack of realization of those ornaments really changes the way it sounds. And typesetting the realization in the score is cumbersome and messes the visual quality of the score. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user -- = Mats Bengtsson Signal Processing Signals, Sensors and Systems Royal Institute of Technology SE-100 44 STOCKHOLM Sweden Phone: (+46) 8 790 8463 Fax: (+46) 8 790 7260 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] WWW: http://www.s3.kth.se/~mabe = ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
On Sunday 04 December 2005 18.32, Raphael Manfredi wrote: > What is the technical reason for repeats to not be automatically "played" > (i.e. unfolded) as many times as necessary in the MIDI output? > > The "\unfoldRepeats" is a crude hack, and I fail to see the justification > behind this feature. Surely, lilypond knows how to iterate over repeats > to be able to process "\unfoldRepeats" so surely it should not have any > problem generating correct MIDI output without this directive. > > Why isn't this behaviour "fixed" to behave normally, i.e have MIDI output > reflect the music as written? Currently, MIDI is mainly intended mainly for prooflistening purposes, and it's not very relevant to listen to repeats when prooflistening. There are also technical reasons: The interpretation of "volta", "unfold" etc. is not done by the midi/layout backends, but by music iterators. And music iterators don't know whether midi or layout output is being produced. > P.S: Why aren't pralls, trills, arpeggios not automatically realized > during MIDI output? When playing baroque music, the lack of realization > of those ornaments really changes the way it sounds. And typesetting > the realization in the score is cumbersome and messes the visual quality > of the score. Look for "MIDI rewrite" here: http://lilypond-design.com/sponsor/open-features.html -- Erik ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Why aren't repeats unfolded automatically in MIDI?
What is the technical reason for repeats to not be automatically "played" (i.e. unfolded) as many times as necessary in the MIDI output? The "\unfoldRepeats" is a crude hack, and I fail to see the justification behind this feature. Surely, lilypond knows how to iterate over repeats to be able to process "\unfoldRepeats" so surely it should not have any problem generating correct MIDI output without this directive. Why isn't this behaviour "fixed" to behave normally, i.e have MIDI output reflect the music as written? Raphael P.S: Why aren't pralls, trills, arpeggios not automatically realized during MIDI output? When playing baroque music, the lack of realization of those ornaments really changes the way it sounds. And typesetting the realization in the score is cumbersome and messes the visual quality of the score. ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
