Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Ted Ozolins]

Condon Thomas A KPWA wrote:


Net Llama!  typed thusly on Monday, January
20, 2003 9:18 AM:

 

Nature manages itself just fine.  All of the screwed up
weather is occuring because of the greenhouse effect,
which didn't get started by a few bears pooping in the
woods. 
   


Actually, there is strong evidence <-- where? All I've read so far are theories that are or might be 

while the other side is sporting their theories which seems to go 
arround in an endless circle.  Before you start theorizing that 
"hot-house gases" might be our salvation, you should check out NASA and 
their theories on pre-colonization-heating of Mars. Its funny how that 
would heat mars but not earth, right!

that if we didn't have global warming
we'd be in an ice age right now. [Do a search for Maunder Minimum on the web
for a lot more information, or read the appropriate chapter in "A Step
Further Out" by Jerry Pournell.]  We just need to learn how to hit the
center of the target climate, not overshoot.  'Til then, Skippy, it is
freezing your buns or toasting your toes.


In Harmony's Way, and In A Chord,

Tom  :-})

Thomas A. Condon
Barbershop Bass Singer
Registered Linux User #154358
A Jester Unemployed
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--
Ted Ozolins (VE7TVO)
Westbank, B. C.

Powered by Slackware 8.1, sent with Mozilla


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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[ronnie gauthier]

On Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:23:44 -0800 - Condon Thomas A KPWA
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote the following
Re: RE: Oz cops it again, fire!

>Actually, there is strong evidence that if we didn't have global warming
>we'd be in an ice age right now. [Do a search for Maunder Minimum on the web
>for a lot more information, or read the appropriate chapter in "A Step
>Further Out" by Jerry Pournell.]  We just need to learn how to hit the
>center of the target climate, not overshoot.  'Til then, Skippy, it is
>freezing your buns or toasting your toes.

We need to what???
We need to learn to keep nature out of *our* ~control process~ and let her do
her shit as she sees fit. If that means letting her burn your home because you
built like an asshole then so be it. She owns the forests, we have no right to
interfere in her management or to alter her methods. What is happening globally
is the result of human activity  and intervention in natures way of doing
things.
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RE: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Condon Thomas A KPWA]

Net Llama!  typed thusly on Monday, January
20, 2003 9:18 AM:

> Nature manages itself just fine.  All of the screwed up
> weather is occuring because of the greenhouse effect,
> which didn't get started by a few bears pooping in the
> woods. 

Actually, there is strong evidence that if we didn't have global warming
we'd be in an ice age right now. [Do a search for Maunder Minimum on the web
for a lot more information, or read the appropriate chapter in "A Step
Further Out" by Jerry Pournell.]  We just need to learn how to hit the
center of the target climate, not overshoot.  'Til then, Skippy, it is
freezing your buns or toasting your toes.


In Harmony's Way, and In A Chord,

Tom  :-})

Thomas A. Condon
Barbershop Bass Singer
Registered Linux User #154358
A Jester Unemployed
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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[m.w.chang]

same thing could happen to those fire fighters when the arial command 
center crashed... :)

>> Renmber the movie "Blackhawk Down"? wonder whether they can use
helicopters to plot ground troops' retreat given all the heat, wind and
smoke...


Yea, that's the movie where 2 copters crashed, and many people died.
wonderful role model.



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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Kevin O'Gorman]

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003, Net Llama! wrote:

> On Mon, 20 Jan 2003, stayler wrote:
> > On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:49:07 +1000, Keith Antoine wrote:
> >
> > > Greenies are being blamed for stopping of fire hazzard
> > >reduction and clearing of trees.
> > >Mind you people love to build houses nowadays in rural tree filled area
> >
> > The same things are being said in thge US.  I tend to agree, the
> > Greenies are way to intolerant of any ideas on how to manage the land,
> > other than leaving it completely alone.  And we can all see how nature
> > manages itself...
> 
> Nature manages itself just fine.  All of the screwed up weather is
> occuring because of the greenhouse effect, which didn't get started by a
> few bears pooping in the woods.

Depends on your standards for "just fine".  Nature has no problem with
widespread death, or even extinction.  People in general have a different,
less dispassionate view.  Nature's arranged that the entire planet will
be sterilized eventually, but I expect people to complain at least and
perhaps vacate the premises.  And so on

++ kevin


-- 
Kevin O'Gorman, PhD  (805) 650-6274  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Permanent e-mail forwarder: mailto:Kevin.O'[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Tom Condon]

Skippie,

> Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400
> homes gone, 200 serious burn victims. The hospital system
> in Canberra is overwhelmed, as is the emergency services.
> Similar situation has ocurred in the Snowy Mountains area
> of NSW threatening villages and hamlets, vast areas of
> forest have been devastated. Whilst Melbourne had 46C
> toaday and also has big fires burning, but in forested
> areas, however a group of 10 fires has joined into one huge
> fire with a 75 km front.
>
> The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living
> memory. I must admit that I am very gald to be in
> Queensland, but with the way the drought has provided fuel
> for fires we are not are not immune as 75% of the state is
> tinder dry.

Stay safe, man.  Maybe we should send a few of our AmerIndians 
down for rain dances.  [Any PC replies should be sent 
privately, not to the list.]


In Harmony's Way and In A Chord,

Tom  ;-})

Tom Condon
Glad to live in the rain capital of the US -- Puget Sound

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Net Llama!]

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003, stayler wrote:
> On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:49:07 +1000, Keith Antoine wrote:
>
> > Greenies are being blamed for stopping of fire hazzard
> >reduction and clearing of trees.
> >Mind you people love to build houses nowadays in rural tree filled area
>
> The same things are being said in thge US.  I tend to agree, the
> Greenies are way to intolerant of any ideas on how to manage the land,
> other than leaving it completely alone.  And we can all see how nature
> manages itself...

Nature manages itself just fine.  All of the screwed up weather is
occuring because of the greenhouse effect, which didn't get started by a
few bears pooping in the woods.

-- 
~~
Lonni J Friedman[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux Step-by-step & TyGeMo  http://netllama.ipfox.com
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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[stayler]

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:49:07 +1000, Keith Antoine wrote:

> Greenies are being blamed for stopping of fire hazzard 
>reduction and clearing of trees.
>Mind you people love to build houses nowadays in rural tree filled area

The same things are being said in thge US.  I tend to agree, the
Greenies are way to intolerant of any ideas on how to manage the land,
other than leaving it completely alone.  And we can all see how nature
manages itself...  

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Net Llama!]

On Mon, 20 Jan 2003, m.w.chang wrote:
> they might have beeen too fast, but ran in the wrong direction.
> even trained professionals might make a bad decions when trapped in the
> center of a hill/bush fire.
>
> remenmber the movie "Blackhawk Down"? wonder whether they can use
> helicopters to plot ground troops' retreat given all the heat, wind and
> smoke...

Yea, that's the movie where 2 copters crashed, and many people died.
wonderful role model.

-- 
~~
Lonni J Friedman[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux Step-by-step & TyGeMo  http://netllama.ipfox.com
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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[m.w.chang]

may be bombing (real explosives) is a faster solution. :)


An American crew of a giant water bombing copter is on record as saying
, they had never seen
worse conditions and a bigger firestorm.

The forcast for tonight and tomorrow is worse than it was on Saturday, we 
are all fingers crossed.

Keith Antoine


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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Keith Antoine]

At 09:49 AM 20/01/2003 +0800, you wrote:

I guess it's time to mobilize those C130 for fire-fighting.


The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. I must admit 
that I am very gald to be in Queensland, but with the way the drought has 
provided fuel for fires we are not are not immune as 75% of the state is 
tinder dry.

As an update: In Canberra we lost the Mt Stromlo international observatory 
a big
loss to astronomers. In Victoria the total lost over the weekend was 
100,000 Hectares
and the fires are forcats to be with them for the next 5 weeks. NSW fireies 
are overwhelmed
and some helper Firies  lost all there belongings when they were fighting 
in another area, cars cash
clothes the lot.  Greenies are being blamed for stopping of fire hazzard 
reduction and clearing of trees.
Mind you people love to build houses nowadays in rural tree filled areas.

An American crew of a giant water bombing copter is on record as saying
, they had never seen
worse conditions and a bigger firestorm.

The forcast for tonight and tomorrow is worse than it was on Saturday, we 
are all fingers crossed.

Keith Antoine

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[m.w.chang]

they might have beeen too fast, but ran in the wrong direction.
even trained professionals might make a bad decions when trapped in the 
center of a hill/bush fire.

remenmber the movie "Blackhawk Down"? wonder whether they can use 
helicopters to plot ground troops' retreat given all the heat, wind and 
smoke...

No none of the victims are firefighters, just ordinary people who did not 
move fast enough
a couple were police, 4 deaths, 5 very serious burns which had to be air 
lifted to Sydney.

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Keith Antoine]

At 09:51 AM 20/01/2003 +0800, you wrote:

and on the bright side, there will less fire for the next few years. :)

are the 200 victims all fire fighters?


Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400 homes gone, 
200 serious burn victims. The hospital system in Canberra is overwhelmed, 
as is the emergency services. Similar situation has ocurred in the Snowy 
Mountains

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No none of the victims are firefighters, just ordinary people who did not 
move fast enough
a couple were police, 4 deaths, 5 very serious burns which had to be air 
lifted to Sydney.

Keith Antoine

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[m.w.chang]

and on the bright side, there will less fire for the next few years. :)

are the 200 victims all fire fighters?


Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400 homes gone, 200 
serious burn victims. The hospital system in Canberra is overwhelmed, as is 
the emergency services. Similar situation has ocurred in the Snowy Mountains 

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[m.w.chang]

I guess it's time to mobilize those C130 for fire-fighting.


The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. I must admit that 
I am very gald to be in Queensland, but with the way the drought has provided 
fuel for fires we are not are not immune as 75% of the state is tinder dry.


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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[stayler]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:41:01 +1000, Keith Antoine wrote:

>The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. I must admit that 
>I am very gald to be in Queensland, but with the way the drought has provided 
>fuel for fires we are not are not immune as 75% of the state is tinder dry.

Keep ypour garden wet there Keith!  

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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Rick Sivernell]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:41:01 +1000
Keith Antoine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400 homes gone,
> 200 serious burn victims. The hospital system in Canberra is
> overwhelmed, as is the emergency services. Similar situation has
> ocurred in the Snowy Mountains area of NSW threatening villages and
> hamlets, vast areas of forest have been devastated. Whilst Melbourne
> had 46C toaday and also has big fires burning, but in forested areas,
> however a group of 10 fires has joined into one huge fire with a 75 km
> front.
> 
> The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. I must
> admit that I am very gald to be in Queensland, but with the way the
> drought has provided fuel for fires we are not are not immune as 75%
> of the state is tinder dry.
> 
> -- 
> Keith Antoine (GANDALF) aka 'skippy'
> 18 Arkana St, The Gap, Queensland 4061 Australia PH:61733002161
> Retired Geriatric, Sometime Electronics Engineer, Knowall, Brain in
> storage
> 
> 
> 
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Keith

Our prayers are with all of our Aussie brothers and sisters.
Keep safe.
-- 
Rick Sivernell
Dallas, Texas  75287
972 306-2296
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1.1
Registered Linux User

   .~.
  / v \
 /( _ )\
   ^ ^
In Linux we trust!
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Re: Oz cops it again, fire!

[Collins]

On Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:41:01 +1000
Keith Antoine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400 homes gone,
> 200 serious burn victims. The hospital system in Canberra is
> overwhelmed ... Snowy Mountains area of NSW ... Melbourne ...
>  big fires burning ...
> 
> The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. 
> 

Our deepest sympathies for all you Aussies, Keith.  My company
(StorageTek) has a several employees in Canberra, so I hope they
have not suffered.

What you are experiencing now, we had last summer in Colorado, although
it didn't reach as far into the plains as Denver/Aurora (extreme SW
suburbs and outlying communities were affected). We're in a multi-year
drouth cycle, and it's dry as dust this winter, so the killer fires will
surely come back again in the summer.

-- 
Collins Richey - Denver Area
gentoo 1.4 system
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Oz cops it again, fire!

[Keith Antoine]

Well we have 33% of the national capital burnt out and 400 homes gone, 200 
serious burn victims. The hospital system in Canberra is overwhelmed, as is 
the emergency services. Similar situation has ocurred in the Snowy Mountains 
area of NSW threatening villages and hamlets, vast areas of forest have been 
devastated. Whilst Melbourne had 46C toaday and also has big fires burning,
but in forested areas, however a group of 10 fires has joined into one huge 
fire with a 75 km front.

The devastation we are seeing is the worst in living memory. I must admit that 
I am very gald to be in Queensland, but with the way the drought has provided 
fuel for fires we are not are not immune as 75% of the state is tinder dry.

-- 
Keith Antoine (GANDALF) aka 'skippy'
18 Arkana St, The Gap, Queensland 4061 Australia PH:61733002161
Retired Geriatric, Sometime Electronics Engineer, Knowall, Brain in storage



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