Re: [perl #36818] [PATCH] to make mod_parrot-0.3 work

[chromatic]

On Sat, 2005-08-06 at 05:03 -0700, Lambeck wrote:

> in order to make mod_parrot-0.3 work with parrot-0.2.3 there need to be some
> additions to src/call_list.txt . These statements are included in the patch.
> 
> This patch is important because otherwise the users need to patch and
> recompile parrot in order to make it work with mod_parrot.

Thanks, applied.

-- c

Re: The meaning of "returns"

[Autrijus Tang]

On Thu, Jul 28, 2005 at 03:52:41PM +0200, "TSa (Thomas Sandla�)" wrote:
> >And this is a natural extension to guide the inferencer so it won't be
> >totally giving up on polymorphic functions such as &id.  C) and D) can
> >be taken together, resulting to a powerful soft typed language.
> 
> This is my preference. The only known issue with parametric typing is
> the proliferation of params as soon as you want to stay away from
> unpecificity.

On #perl6, chip reported that during the design team meeting, the two
forms below are introduced to carry full inferential soft typing
information:

sub negate (Num $x --> Num) { ... }
our Num sub negate (Num $x) { ... }

> >However, if we take the view that type annotation are merely storage
> >allocation hints and runtime coercers, then A) is probably the way to go.
> 
> Please no. Or at least not exclusively. I see your "storage allocation
> hints" as a data environment needed to implement the type.

The old "returns" form would become a type annotation for the &return
inside it, but does not propagate outwards.  From the outside, that
function can return anything it likes.

sub negate (Num $x) returns Num { ... }

I think --> could be right-associative, so we can write things like:

# Function application combinator
sub infix:<$> ( &f:(::A --> ::B) --> A $x --> B ) {
return { f($^x) }
}

However, as these are only transcripts from IRC, I can't vouch for
their accuracy before @Larry confirms it.

Thanks,
/Autrijus/


pgpcOxWgPwlV6.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: [perl #36823] [BUG] fresh checkout of r8844 fails to build

[Jonathan Worthington]

"Patrick R.Michaud (via RT)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Attempting to build parrot r8844 from a fresh subversion checkout
results in an error on my system (FC4):

$ perl Configure.pl; make
...
/usr/bin/perl build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl --mini > \
   src/null_config.c
src/null_config.c
c++ -o ./miniparrot -L/usr/local/lib -Wl,-E   imcc/main.o \
   blib/lib/libparrot.a  -lresolv -lnsl -ldl -lm -lcrypt -lutil -lpthread  
-lrt -lgmp src/null_config.o

/usr/bin/perl build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl > \
   src/parrot_config.c
Can't read 'runtime/parrot/include/config.fpmc': No such file or directory 
at build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl line 55.

make: *** [src/parrot_config.c] Error 2

I tracked down that the problem was introduced in revision 8841, which 
removed generation of config.fpmc from the makefile.  The problem only shows 
up after a make realclean.  Chip has confirmed this check-in was what broke 
the build, and will revert it shortly.


Thanks,

Jonathan 

Re: [pirate] OSCON slides

[Michal Wallace]

On Fri, 5 Aug 2005, Leopold Toetsch wrote:


There are still issues e.g. with namespaces. I've put out numberless
mails on p6i where I invited HLL folks to discuss it and make some
proposals. Guess how many answers these mails got.


Zero? I don't think p6i is the right place for that.
We should have a low-traffic "compiler" list.

Like... this one here for pirate, which is all
about generic compiler issues. :)



And there is: http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/docs/req/model_users.pod


I like that!

Sincerely,

Michal J Wallace
Sabren Enterprises, Inc.
-
contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
hosting: http://www.cornerhost.com/
my site: http://www.withoutane.com/
-

Re: Modules::Starter question

[Robert]

Thanks for the answers.

Robert

Re: Modules::Starter question

[Dave Cross]

On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 11:32:45AM -0400, Robert wrote:
> I am creating my first module (finally) and I was told a while ago to
> use Module::Starter. Which I did. I am fine there. When I look at the
> code generated I see that all the POD stuff is inline while I prefer
> to see POD stuff at the end. Is the inline POD the current preferred
> way? If it is, I am fine with that and will continue to chug along. If
> not, I will move it to the end and I would make a request to the M::S
> author to have a command line switch added to indicate which POD style
> to use (defaulting to whatever the auther wishes of course).

If you install Module::Starter::PBP then Module::Starter will create
new modules using all of the recommendations from "Perl Best Practices",
including putting all of the Pod at the end.

Dave...

-- 
  If you miss an opportunity to see him perform... you're a total asshole.
  David Cross rocks my world.
-- Jack Black

[perl #36823] [BUG] fresh checkout of r8844 fails to build

[via RT]

# New Ticket Created by  Patrick R. Michaud 
# Please include the string:  [perl #36823]
# in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. 
# https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=36823 >


---
osname= linux
osvers= 2.4.21-27.0.2.elsmp
arch=   i386-linux-thread-multi
cc= gcc 4.0.0 20050516 (Red Hat 4.0.0-6)
---
Flags:
category=core
severity=high
ack=no
---
Attempting to build parrot r8844 from a fresh subversion checkout
results in an error on my system (FC4):

$ perl Configure.pl; make
...
/usr/bin/perl build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl --mini > \
src/null_config.c
src/null_config.c
c++ -o ./miniparrot -L/usr/local/lib -Wl,-E   imcc/main.o \
blib/lib/libparrot.a  -lresolv -lnsl -ldl -lm -lcrypt -lutil -lpthread -lrt 
-lgmp src/null_config.o
/usr/bin/perl build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl > \
src/parrot_config.c
Can't read 'runtime/parrot/include/config.fpmc': No such file or directory at 
build_tools/parrot_config_c.pl line 55.
make: *** [src/parrot_config.c] Error 2

Pm

---
Summary of my parrot 0.2.3 (r8844) configuration:
  configdate='Sat Aug  6 02:53:10 2005'
  Platform:
osname=linux, archname=i386-linux-thread-multi
jitcapable=1, jitarchname=i386-linux,
jitosname=LINUX, jitcpuarch=i386
execcapable=1
perl=/usr/bin/perl
  Compiler:
cc='gcc', ccflags='-D_REENTRANT -D_GNU_SOURCE -DDEBUGGING  -pipe 
-I/usr/local/include -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64 
-I/usr/include/gdbm',
  Linker and Libraries:
ld='gcc', ldflags=' -L/usr/local/lib',
cc_ldflags='',
libs='-lresolv -lnsl -ldl -lm -lcrypt -lutil -lpthread -lrt -lgmp'
  Dynamic Linking:
share_ext='.so', ld_share_flags='-shared -L/usr/local/lib -fPIC',
load_ext='.so', ld_load_flags='-shared -L/usr/local/lib -fPIC'
  Types:
iv=long, intvalsize=4, intsize=4, opcode_t=long, opcode_t_size=4,
ptrsize=4, ptr_alignment=1 byteorder=1234, 
nv=double, numvalsize=8, doublesize=8

---
Environment:
HOMELANGLANGUAGELD_LIBRARY_PATHLOGDIRPATHSHELL

Re: [perl #36812] Compiling Pugs against Parrot

[Adrian Lambeck]

> Fixed (r8839 / r8840).
>
> $ perl Configure.pl --prefix=/home/lt/src/p-0.2.3
> $ make && make install
> $ cd ~/src/p-0.2.3
> $ bin/parrot parrot-config.imc prefix
> /home/lt/src/p-0.2.3
>
> leo

Hi Leo,

maybe you are right but I can`t test it because:

1. jrieks got a conflict in the current svn (8843) that is not resolved so 
Configure does not run (config/auto/perldoc.pl)

2. I made patches agains r8818 for the files that changed  to apply to 
parrot-0.2.3 but these did not work out the way I though - maybe I am missing 
something. I patched parrot-config and config/gen/makefiles/root.in . Since 
the other changes are about tcl I didn`t worry about that.

3. Hope I fixed the problem in config/auto/perldoc but now I get a seg. fault 
during compilation :-(

Adrian

Re: failure notice

[Robert]

I just saw that this morning. I have no idea where that email address came
from as that is a real old address. I will have to check my settings when I
get back to work.

Robert


On 8/6/05 6:03 AM, in article [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Tels"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> 
> Moin,
> 
> robert, you need to work on your reply-to address :)
> 
> - --  Forwarded Message  --
> 
> Subject: failure notice
> Date: Saturday 06 August 2005 11:38
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Hi. This is the qmail-send program at relay03.pair.com.
> I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following
>  addresses. This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't
>  work out.
> 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> 64.62.181.91 does not like recipient.
> Remote host said: 550 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: inactive user
> Giving up on 64.62.181.91.
> 
> - --- Below this line is a copy of the message.
> 
> [snip]
> 
> - -- 
>  Signed on Sat Aug  6 12:02:45 2005 with key 0x93B84C15.
>  Visit my photo gallery at http://bloodgate.com/photos/
>  PGP key on http://bloodgate.com/tels.asc or per email.
> 
>  "Sundials don't work, the one I've had in my basement hasn't changed
>  time since I installed it." grub (11606) on 2004-12-03 on /.
> 
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)
> 
> iQEVAwUBQvSK+3cLPEOTuEwVAQHbuAf+Lkf1oN0JqsqWrwGj0LVF9n0xP45yWpF4
> Lr1UMFlj6iXbj0Zqw2qM/dM0XE8MNgPPgjvd8emMyrdSVCVBld5Tp/XDP8ZkzjzX
> W+771gDiAGB+rb/MOfoUi22OYWgVuc0x3lxcQ+eJKpJK+2gqAOjvU4MwCxNgI5R9
> YCwhkrP7Ute8Faxgjr/8+3qwzxP1/kxjPrLRUNQ/eubfDaTT6ZG6aCOCisJngarX
> bfTe2XC9FMloSguoa7woYjcWpuTeOsvnRrwPqXmJ2mpX2BgKL6YF5usKoOsc6l65
> Mxt9E6oVYMw14cssHe/5VqprQA/tVKzMXdO2L5RRnwkdwRis2fa0SA==
> =Ufij
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-

[perl #36818] [PATCH] to make mod_parrot-0.3 work

[via RT]

# New Ticket Created by  Lambeck 
# Please include the string:  [perl #36818]
# in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. 
# https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=36818 >


Hi all,
in order to make mod_parrot-0.3 work with parrot-0.2.3 there need to be some
additions to src/call_list.txt . These statements are included in the patch.

This patch is important because otherwise the users need to patch and
recompile parrot in order to make it work with mod_parrot.

Adrian Lambeck
--- src/call_list.txt	2005-07-12 15:08:57.0 +0200
+++ src/call_list.txt.new	2005-08-06 13:26:32.0 +0200
@@ -285,6 +285,19 @@
 i	tp
 v	tiiiptt
 i	Pip
+p   J
+t   J
+t   Jp
+p   Jp
+t   Jpt
+i   Jp
+i   Jpi
+i   JPip
+v   ptt
+v   pit
+i   Jpii
+i   ip
+
 
 # PyBuiltins
 P	JOPP

Re: Container model - pictures and questions

[Nathan Gray]

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 12:55:53AM +0800, Autrijus Tang wrote:
> Hm, I'm afraid there are not much material on this beyond the Synopses,
> so I'll try to describe that picture a bit.
> 
...
> 
> That's about it. :-) Hopefully my two questions will make more sense
> to you now...

Very nice description.  Thank you.  I understand the diagram much better
now.

-kolibrie

Re: Container model - pictures and questions

[Autrijus Tang]

On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 12:43:13PM -0400, Matt Fowles wrote:
> The pictures are pretty and the compilation one makes a great deal of
> sense, but I must admit to being enitrely confused by the container
> one.  I think part of the problem is that I don't have a good footing
> from which to understand it.  Is there somewhere I can look for a
> gentle explanation of the whole container/tied/untied thing?

Hm, I'm afraid there are not much material on this beyond the Synopses,
so I'll try to describe that picture a bit.

First off, all the lines you see are "has-a" relationships.  To wit:

Pad has-a Scalar Container that you can look up with "$name".

my $name;

The Container either has-a mutable cell, or has-a constant cell.

my $mut = 3;
my $con := 3;

Use ":=" to change the cell inside a container:

my $x = 3;
my $y = 4;
my $z = 5;
$x := $y;   # $x and $y now contain the same cell
$x := $z;   # not anymore; $x now shares the cell with $z

Each cell has a Id.  Use "=:=" to check whether two containers have
cells of the same Id:

$x =:= $y;  # false
$x =:= $z;  # true

Mutable cells has-a mutable scalar value.  Use "=" to change its value:

$mut = 5;   # works

Constant cells has-a immutable scalar value.  You cannot change it:

$con = 6;   # error

Each cell is declared to be "is Tieable" or not tiable when it was
allocated; you cannot change tieableness at runtime.

my $nvar;
my $tvar is Tieable;

Tieable cells may be tied or untied.  Use "tie" to tie a tieable cell:

tie($tvar, SomeClass, some_param => 1);

Non-tieable cells may not be tied.  However, "untie" always works:

untie($tvar); # works
untie($nvar); # no-op

That's about it. :-) Hopefully my two questions will make more sense
to you now...

Thanks,
/Autrijus/


pgp49c9iDshl5.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Container model - pictures and questions

[Matt Fowles]

Autrijus~

On 8/6/05, Autrijus Tang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> (Cc'ing p6l, but this feels like a p6c thread...)
> 
> Greetings.  As I'm moving forward with the new PIL runcore,
> I'm now trying to document my understanding as visual diagrams.
> 
> The first one is about the compilation cycle:
> 
> http://pugscode.org/images/simple-compilation.png
> 
> The second one is about the container model:
> 
> http://pugscode.org/images/container.png
> 

The pictures are pretty and the compilation one makes a great deal of
sense, but I must admit to being enitrely confused by the container
one.  I think part of the problem is that I don't have a good footing
from which to understand it.  Is there somewhere I can look for a
gentle explanation of the whole container/tied/untied thing?

Thanks,
Matt
-- 
"Computer Science is merely the post-Turing Decline of Formal Systems Theory."
-Stan Kelly-Bootle, The Devil's DP Dictionary

Container model - pictures and questions

[Autrijus Tang]

(Cc'ing p6l, but this feels like a p6c thread...)

Greetings.  As I'm moving forward with the new PIL runcore,
I'm now trying to document my understanding as visual diagrams.

The first one is about the compilation cycle:

http://pugscode.org/images/simple-compilation.png

The second one is about the container model:

http://pugscode.org/images/container.png

Under this container model, there are two consequences that I'm
not very sure about.  One is that everything is rebindable:

my $a is constant;
my $b = 123;
$a := $b;
$a = 456;   # succeeds

Another is that the "is IType" form is always untieable:

my $a is SomehowTiedScalar;
untie($a); # succeeds

If I'm mistaken, please let me know, preferably by suggesting
new arrangements on the diagram. :-)

Thanks,
/Autrijus/


pgpGNMrooYm0D.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Testing if an HTML is w3 standard

[Bjoern Hoehrmann]

* Shlomi Fish wrote:
>It's nice, but I recall that with the same input file, it did not catch some 
>problems that the W3C Validator then yelled at. (I don't recall what file it 
>was, sorry).

Yes, Tidy won't report many errors, in particular such errors that are
easy to fix or different in HTML/XHTML, for example,  is
good in HTML but bad in XHTML, Tidy will silently add the quote marks
but not report it even if the input is XHTML. We have open feature re-
quests to improve that but Tidy's current architecture is not well-
suited for this ... 
-- 
Björn Höhrmann · mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] · http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de
Weinh. Str. 22 · Telefon: +49(0)621/4309674 · http://www.bjoernsworld.de
68309 Mannheim · PGP Pub. KeyID: 0xA4357E78 · http://www.websitedev.de/ 

Re: Testing if an HTML is w3 standard

[Shlomi Fish]

On Saturday 06 August 2005 13:41, Bjoern Hoehrmann wrote:
> * Gábor Szabó wrote:
> >Reading the blog of Geoff about the OSCON session
> >http://www.onlamp.com/pub/wlg/7523
> >I just remembered an open issue for me.
> >
> >How do you test if an HTML page is in one of the w3 standards ?
> >There is the w3 validator online at http://validator.w3.org/ but I cannot
> > use that for my ongoing tests. I need something command line or better
> > yet somthing like Test::W3 ?
>
> Well, the W3C Markup Validator is just a "thin" wrapper around the
> OpenSP SGML processor (the onsgmls command line too to be precise),
> it just does some character encoding detection and deals with mime
> types and doctypes, other than that it's just a HTML formatter. With
> my (experimental) HTML::Encoding, HTML::Doctype, SGML::Parser::OpenSP
> and the (experimental, only in CVS) OpenSP version 1.5.2 you could
> write a command line tool for that in < 100 lines, see e.g. the script
> at .

Interesting. In any case, there's also html-tidy which is more self-contained:

http://tidy.sourceforge.net/

It has a Perl interface on CPAN:

http://search.cpan.org/dist/HTML-Tidy/

(there seems to be more related modules in the search).

It's nice, but I recall that with the same input file, it did not catch some 
problems that the W3C Validator then yelled at. (I don't recall what file it 
was, sorry).

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

-
Shlomi Fish  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Homepage:http://www.shlomifish.org/

Tcl is LISP on drugs. Using strings instead of S-expressions for closures
is Evil with one of those gigantic E's you can find at the beginning of 
paragraphs.

Re: Inline POD vs not (was Re: Modules::Starter question)

[Ivan Tubert-Brohman]

Michael G Schwern wrote:

On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 11:32:45AM -0400, Robert wrote:

Is the inline POD the current preferred way? 



That really depends on who you ask.  Me?  I prefer it.  Its totally a matter 
of style.


Pros:
* Keeps the docs close to the code so you're more likely to keep the docs up 
  to date.

* Docs take the place of comments explaining what the routine does avoiding
  duplication.
* Makes you more likely to read and use the documentation causing it to get
  more maintenance attention.
* Makes it easier to see that each routine has documentation.
* Private docs (=begin/end private) allow you to document private and public
  functions using the same style.

I'll let someone else in the other camp write the cons.


I've tried both approaches and I'm not a complete fanatic of either, 
although recently I've been leaning more towards "comments after 
__END__". I'd say that the cons of the inline approach are:


* The code gets "lost" among the documentation, as often you have more 
documentation than code. Syntax highlighting reduces the problem, but 
the POD still takes half the screen if you have short subs.


* The code has to be in the same order as the documentation, which 
sometimes is a hindrance.


Curiously, I've found that I like the inline approach on my modules, 
because of "Keeps the docs close to the code so you're more likely to 
keep the docs up to date", but I hate the inline POD when I'm trying to 
figure out how someone else's code works, because the POD just gets in 
the way. That's why now I'm putting the POD at the bottom: "Do unto 
others as you would have them do unto you".


Another option would be to dust the code folding features of my editor 
and see if they work for hiding inline POD temporarily.


Ivan

[perl #36820] PGE glob escapes

[via RT]

# New Ticket Created by  Will Coleda 
# Please include the string:  [perl #36820]
# in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. 
# https://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=36820 >


PGE globbing doesn't seem to be accepting backslash as an escape: so,  
there's no way (e.g.) to glob for a literal *, as the attached test  
shows.

This is causing about 10 test failures in the tcl test suite at the  
moment. (and would cause more if I had more of the language  
implemented. Globbing is used in a few places.)




pge_glob_escape.pir
Description: Binary data

Re: [perl #36812] Compiling Pugs against Parrot

[Leopold Toetsch]

Adrian Lambeck wrote:

So the question is: is that file installed properly to your --prefix
directory structure?
Maybe you are querying the wrong parrot too (the config paths and
settings gets compiled into the executable of parrot)?


It is installed properly and I am not querying  but the pugs config is doing 
it (correctly). First it does a chdir and then uses ./parrot (...). So I 
think this is correct.


Fixed (r8839 / r8840).

$ perl Configure.pl --prefix=/home/lt/src/p-0.2.3
$ make && make install
$ cd ~/src/p-0.2.3
$ bin/parrot parrot-config.imc prefix
/home/lt/src/p-0.2.3

leo

Re: Module::Starter question

[Andy Lester]

On Aug 5, 2005, at 10:32 AM, Robert wrote:


 Is the inline POD the current preferred way?


It is for me, which is why I wrote it that way.

Damian Conway, in the new book "Perl Best Practices," advocates  
against it for a number of reasons, mainly because he doesn't want  
order of subs in code to dictate order of subs in the documentation.


And since Module::Starter handles plug-ins, thanks to the tireless  
work of Ricardo Signes, Damian wrote Module::Starter::PBP to crank  
out POD in the way he recommends in the book.  And you can write your  
own plug-ins as well.


xoxo,
Andy

Re: Testing if an HTML is w3 standard

[Bjoern Hoehrmann]

* Gábor Szabó wrote:
>Reading the blog of Geoff about the OSCON session
>http://www.onlamp.com/pub/wlg/7523
>I just remembered an open issue for me.
>
>How do you test if an HTML page is in one of the w3 standards ?
>There is the w3 validator online at http://validator.w3.org/ but I cannot use
>that for my ongoing tests. I need something command line or better
>yet somthing like Test::W3 ?

Well, the W3C Markup Validator is just a "thin" wrapper around the
OpenSP SGML processor (the onsgmls command line too to be precise),
it just does some character encoding detection and deals with mime
types and doctypes, other than that it's just a HTML formatter. With
my (experimental) HTML::Encoding, HTML::Doctype, SGML::Parser::OpenSP
and the (experimental, only in CVS) OpenSP version 1.5.2 you could
write a command line tool for that in < 100 lines, see e.g. the script
at .
-- 
Björn Höhrmann · mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] · http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de
Weinh. Str. 22 · Telefon: +49(0)621/4309674 · http://www.bjoernsworld.de
68309 Mannheim · PGP Pub. KeyID: 0xA4357E78 · http://www.websitedev.de/ 

Testing if an HTML is w3 standard

[Gábor Szabó]

Reading the blog of Geoff about the OSCON session
http://www.onlamp.com/pub/wlg/7523
I just remembered an open issue for me.

How do you test if an HTML page is in one of the w3 standards ?
There is the w3 validator online at http://validator.w3.org/ but I cannot use
that for my ongoing tests. I need something command line or better
yet somthing like Test::W3 ?
IIUC The validator and the DTDs can be downloaded from the w3 site.

So is there such a sulotion I just missed or noone bothered to put one
together yet?

Gabor

Fwd: failure notice

[Tels]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-

Moin,

robert, you need to work on your reply-to address :)

- --  Forwarded Message  --

Subject: failure notice
Date: Saturday 06 August 2005 11:38
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hi. This is the qmail-send program at relay03.pair.com.
I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following
 addresses. This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't
 work out.

<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
64.62.181.91 does not like recipient.
Remote host said: 550 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: inactive user
Giving up on 64.62.181.91.

- --- Below this line is a copy of the message.

[snip]

- -- 
 Signed on Sat Aug  6 12:02:45 2005 with key 0x93B84C15.
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Re: Modules::Starter question

[Tels]

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Moin,

On Friday 05 August 2005 17:32, Robert wrote:
> I am creating my first module (finally) and I was told a while ago to
> use Module::Starter. Which I did. I am fine there. When I look at the
> code generated I see that all the POD stuff is inline while I prefer to
> see POD stuff at the end. Is the inline POD the current preferred way?

Some do it that way, others not. Personal preference I would say. Each has 
advantages, and you should use the one you are more comfortable with. 
Technically, it doesn't matter much.

> If it is, I am fine with that and will continue to chug along. If not,
> I will move it to the end and I would make a request to the M::S author
> to have a command line switch added to indicate which POD style to use
> (defaulting to whatever the auther wishes of course).

Which would be a good idea, nonetheless :)

Best wishes,

Tels

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Re[2]: Whitespace

[Andrew Shitov]

>> : so why not 'print($x)' == 'print ($x)' ;-)

> Plus we got rid of Perl-5's no-op unary +, so instead we're using
> whitespace to force it to be a list operator.

Thanks! I've got the idea.

I'd better refuse parenthesis than a space here. I think I'll never
drop space in a function call if it can be overcome :-)

--
___
Andrew, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
___

Inline POD vs not (was Re: Modules::Starter question)

[Michael G Schwern]

On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 11:32:45AM -0400, Robert wrote:
> Is the inline POD the current preferred way? 

That really depends on who you ask.  Me?  I prefer it.  Its totally a matter 
of style.

Pros:
* Keeps the docs close to the code so you're more likely to keep the docs up 
  to date.
* Docs take the place of comments explaining what the routine does avoiding
  duplication.
* Makes you more likely to read and use the documentation causing it to get
  more maintenance attention.
* Makes it easier to see that each routine has documentation.
* Private docs (=begin/end private) allow you to document private and public
  functions using the same style.

I'll let someone else in the other camp write the cons.

The most common misconception about inline POD is that it slows 
compilation or takes more memory.  This is not true as perl can detect
POD as simply (or simpler) than it can a comment.  And you don't worry about
your comments slowing down code.  Extensive benchmarking has borne this out.
POD is not stored by perl any more than a comment is so it adds no extra 
memory bloat.


-- 
Michael G Schwern [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pobox.com/~schwern
'All anyone gets in a mirror is themselves,' she said. 'But what you
gets in a good gumbo is everything.'
-- "Witches Abroad" by Terry Prachett