Re: release?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

My understanding is that the happy and long-awaited release announcement
was done on Christmas out of tradition of announcing Perl releases on
Christmas, that it means that the specification of the language is now
declared as (fairly) stable, but the implementation is a different matter.

In practical terms, the Rakudo implementation works for me -
http://rakudo.org/how-to-get-rakudo/

I use the "rakudobrew" installation tool (on Fedora).

Easier-to-install installation packages for various operating systems will
probably come in the future.


--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

2015-12-27 21:33 GMT+02:00 webmind :

> Hiya,
>
> I'm a bit confused, there is a major release for Perl 6, but I know
> wonder if this is the 6.0.0 release or when this will be?
>
> Thanks
>
> web
>
> --
> GPG Key: https://u2m.nl/data/webmind.asc
> GPG Fingerprint: 0506976E 234653B4 A628EC33 E23D16EE FCF154AE
> XMPP webm...@puscii.nl:  D79970A8 7EC43E29 186D86BA 590F20F6 4C7930B8
> XMPP webm...@laglab.org: 11E91112 091881F7 53EF6108 63C48543 C74D035C
> u2m.nl (exp: 08/04/2016) SHA256:
>
> C2:40:67:22:25:52:29:AF:DF:50:4E:2A:6B:32:6D:BC:5B:1E:CA:7D:52:3B:4C:4A:21:5D:C8:E5:AE:7D:1A:09
> Puscii (exp: 04/03/2016) SHA256:
>
> F9:C7:B1:B7:90:6B:17:BF:84:93:93:7C:0F:B4:FD:BE:E3:C0:71:9D:83:01:ED:3A:96:FE:FC:82:9D:30:51:C9
>
>

Re: Logo considerations

[Amir E. Aharoni]

2009/3/24 Larry Wall :
> http://www.wall.org/~larry/camelia.pdf
>

Intended or not, the smiley is a nice tribute to Audrey and her lovely
style of presentations.

-- 
Amir Elisha Aharoni

heb: http://haharoni.wordpress.com | eng: http://aharoni.wordpress.com
cat: http://aprenent.wordpress.com | rus: http://amire80.livejournal.com

"We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace." - T. Moore

[perl #64032] perl6.exe not functioning on Cygwin

[Amir E. Aharoni (via RT)]

# New Ticket Created by  Amir E. Aharoni 
# Please include the string:  [perl #64032]
# in the subject line of all future correspondence about this issue. 
# http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=64032 >


`cat build/PARROT_REVISION' :
37414

`./perl6 -v' :
This is Rakudo Perl 6, revision 37562 built on parrot 1.0.0-devel
for cygwin-thread-multi-64int.

This is Cygwin on XP.

Parrot from SVN compiled nicely and `make test' was successful.

I put Rakudo from git under parrot/languages/rakudo . It compiled
nicely and `../../parrot perl6.pbc' did the right thing, but `make
test' didn't work.

Moritz suggested on IRC that i try perl6.exe, which didn't do anything
and just went back to the prompt. So jnthn suggested copying
libparrot.dll from the parrot dir. There's libparrot.dll, but copying
cygparrot1_0_0.dll to the Rakudo dir helped - perl6.exe now works and
`make test' passes.

filing a ticket

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Hi,

I wanted to file a couple of tickets about Rakudo. Unfortunately, i
couldn't find instructions for doing it anywhere at www.rakudo.org or
dev.perl.org/perl6/ .

So how do i do it?

-- 
Amir Elisha Aharoni

heb: http://haharoni.wordpress.com | eng: http://aharoni.wordpress.com
cat: http://aprenent.wordpress.com | rus: http://amire80.livejournal.com

"We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace." - T. Moore

rakudo on cygwin

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Is there a rakudo package for cygwin?

There's parrot and parrot-languages, but none of them seems to include
anything that looks like "rakudo" or "perl6".

Do i have to build it myself to try it? Or didn't i look well enough?

Thanks in advance.

-- 
Amir Elisha Aharoni

heb: http://haharoni.wordpress.com | eng: http://aharoni.wordpress.com
cat: http://aprenent.wordpress.com | rus: http://amire80.livejournal.com

"We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace." - T. Moore

Re: pluralization idea that keeps bugging me

[Amir E. Aharoni]

On 26/01/2008, Larry Wall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> After a recent exchange on PerlMonks about join, I've been thinking
> about the problem of pluralization in interpolated strings, where we
> get things like:
>
> say "Received $m message{ 1==$m ?? '' !! 's' }."
>
> ...
>
> Any other cute ideas?

No matter what you do it will remain too English-centric. It might
work for Catalan, too. But it will remain totally useless for Arabic
or Chinese.

In any case, i don't understand why should this be in the core language at all.

-- 
Amir Elisha Aharoni

English -  http://aharoni.wordpress.com
Hebrew  - http://haharoni.wordpress.com

"We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace." - T. Moore

Re: Multiline comments in Perl6

[Amir E. Aharoni]

On 30/12/2007, Jonathan Lang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The only wart
> is that '#( ... )' cannot begin at the very start of a line; but it's
> easy enough to get around that restriction - say, with some leading
> whitespace.

Thanks for the reply - can you please what is the problem with having
it in the beginning of the line?

Perl 6 presentation in Russian

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Hi, all,

If you speak Russian, check out http://www.perl6.ru (in case you
haven't already).

Andrey Shitov works at the famous Art. Lebedev studio in Moscow. He's
the programming guy in a bunch of designers.

His blog about Perl 6 is rarely updated, but when it is, it has a very
interesting info.

Recently he uploaded a nice presentation in PDF format.

If you haven't delved deeply into Perl 6, then this is your chance
(too bad it's only in Russian...)

If you've been following Perl 6 development and saw Larry's and
Audrey's presentations, then you won't see a lot of new things there,
but the presentation is well-done.

It reminds a little of Audrey's style of transforming Perl 5 code to
Perl 6. While not as entertaining, it is very easy to understand.
-- 
Amir Elisha Aharoni
my band: http://www.myspace.com/tzabari/
my blog: http://aharoni.wordpress.com/

Re: Project Idea: Perl 6 Syntax Explainer

[Amir E. Aharoni]

  * Anything else that should go into the requirements?


It would be even cooler if the command

$ p6explain 'some_user_defined_sub'

would display prettily-formatted pod for that sub and would work
transparently, regardless of whether this sub is defined in the Perl
standard library, CPAN module, or user's own code. And if there are
several modules that have a sub with this name - print a list of
modules (sorted by relevance to context or alphabetically) and let the
user select what he wants. An overloaded operator should be the same
thing as a sub for this matter.

Rationale: Perl 5's perldoc displays the pod for every properly
installed and documented module just as if they were perl* manpages
and it is transparent to the user. That's one feature of Perl 5 that i
absolutely admire. Why not enhance it to smaller units, like subs? And
it doesn't break the "different things should look different"
philosophy, as these look different enough to me:

$ p6explain 'some_user_defined_sub' # sub
$ p6explain Date::Hebrew # an imaginary module
$ p6explain := # operator
$ p6explain any # builtin
$ p6explain perlrules # an imaginary P6 manpage that will replace perlre


  * Is it useful at all?


Very much so, yes.

That's what makes Redmond's development tools so attractive - you can
put the cursor on any word, press F1 and get all the help. It doesn't
work so well with operators, and with user-defined functions it just
fails; but for user-defined functions it has the "reference" feature,
which takes the user to the place where the functions is defined (if
he's lucky enough to have the code). Actually i see no reason why this
couldn't be combined with the help - for me the function's code and
its documentation in a human language are usually equally important.

Integrate that tool with Emacs, and you've got a self-documenting Perl 6 IDE ;)


* Is it possible to implement it satisfactory without building a p6
  compiler?


Syntax highlighters work even with code that doesn't necessarily
compile, so probably the answer is yes.

But if this tool could peek into the compiler's syntax tree and see
all the namespaces that the compiler knows as an easy-to-navigate data
structure, then implementing my wish from above - generically getting
help for every token wherever it is defined - would probably be
easier.

(Too bad i don't really know much about implementing compilers.)


  * Do you have a good idea for a project name?


I really wish that such project just DIDN'T have a name, at least not
at the end-user level. If it will have a name, there's a chance that
it will join the army of Free Software programs with awful names such
as YELP.

It can just be a part of perldoc - that's one good name.

Named captures (was: **{x,y} quantifier)

[Amir E. Aharoni]

On 01/07/07, Luke Palmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

On 7/1/07, Amir E. Aharoni <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > please correct me if
> > > i say something stupid or if this has already been discussed before.)
>
> > Another important loss if we were to go with <1..3> would be the
> > ability to have runtime-dependent ranges; e.g.:
> >
> > / ($ntimes) x**{$ntimes} /
>
> That's exactly what i meant by "something stupid".

That's quite alright, because both interpretations of that sentence
were valid :-).  I meant:

/ $ntimes := (\d+) x**{$ntimes} /

Luke



Funny - how did it make sense to me the first time around? :)

This prompted me to re-read the parts about Subpattern captures and
Aliasing in S05, and i've got to say that it's *extreme* TMTOWTDI. I'm
happy about it, 'cause i've been wishing for named captures for a long
time, but i'm not sure that i understand it in your example
completely.

The examples of := usage in S05 seem to have notation such as this:
$ := (\d+) 

Is $ntimes supposed to be a predefined scalar variable (my $ntimes)?
Or a regex variable?

I'm getting confused ...

Re: **{x,y} quantifier

[Amir E. Aharoni]

> please correct me if
> i say something stupid or if this has already been discussed before.)



Another important loss if we were to go with <1..3> would be the
ability to have runtime-dependent ranges; e.g.:

/ ($ntimes) x**{$ntimes} /


That's exactly what i meant by "something stupid".

Thanks - my bad.

**{x,y} quantifier

[Amir E. Aharoni]

(I'm just studying the intricacies of Perl 6, so please correct me if
i say something stupid or if this has already been discussed before.)

I was looking for the Perl 6 equivalent of

"aaa" =~ /a{1,3}/

and finally found that it's

"aaa" ~~ /a**{1 .. 3}/

This looked rather weird, so i asked on IRC what is the mnemonic for it:
http://moritz.faui2k3.org/irclog/out.pl?channel=perl6;date=2007-06-29#id_l602

I got the reply that it is similar to exponentiation of variables in math:

a ** 5 == a * a * a * a * a == a

It makes sense after it is explained and i do like the rationalization
of the range as a list-like range, instead of the comma, but the **
syntax is rather ugly to my taste. Seeing that the ** quantifier is
not yet implemented anyway, I thought what could replace it, and the
best i could find was <1 .. 3>.

My rationale is this:

* It looks clean.

* It the chapter about Extensible metasyntax (<...>) in S05 most
paragraphs begin by "A leading X means yadda yadda", where X can be:

   * whitespace
   * alphabetic character (not alphanumeric!)
   * ? $ :: @ % { & [ + - . ! ~~

... so numbers are not covered.

* As a side effect, * is a shortcut for <0 .. Inf>, + is a shortcut
for <1 .. Inf>, ? * is a shortcut for <0 .. 1>.

* The ? of non-greediness can come before the closing > - <1 .. 3 ?>

Any comments?

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni
my band: http://www.myspace.com/tzabari/
my blog: http://aharoni.wordpress.com/

Re: Web development I: Web::Toolkit

[Amir E. Aharoni]

17/09/06, Juerd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> skribis:

This is a very strict language, though, as it is based on XML.
A document is either valid and unambiguous, or completely invalid.


Just like any programming language should be. And the XHTML rules are
quite reasonable. In practice *all* browsers effectively encourage
developers not to follow the strict standard, by allowing invalid
HTML. I usually browse the web with Firefox and HTML-Tidy extension,
and see very few sites that conform to any w3c standard.


Because of this, XHTML needs to be a conscious choice, and never the
default.


WordPress is an example of a webserver software tool that does try to
produce standard XHTML. It does it by default and very few bloggers
who use it care about it or, for that matter, notice it.
FuturisticPerl6WebPackage.pm should be like that too. I see no reason
that autogenerated code won't conform to standard XHTML. Every
deviation from standards and XML well-formedness should produce a
warning.

Wishful thinking: FuturisticPerl6WebPackage.pm could have
functionality that will output XHTML that adheres to both the
w3c-standard and the defacto-standard (warning about tags that only
works in certain browsers etc.) It might make it easier for developers
to test their sites on several browsers and platforms.

Re: the CGI.pm in Perl 6

[Amir E. Aharoni]

> Thomas Wittek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> An other acceptable solution would be to create a backwards
>> compatible P6 CGI.pm and create a new Web.pm with an all new
>> interface, like Mark suggested.


My 0.02 ₪: CGI.pm will be better off redesigned and cleaned up, and
for those wanting compatibility a module called CGI5.pm can be
written.

It will probably be very popular, like p5 regexes ...

Re: Stubborn coworkers

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Since I came to programming after the days of Forth and Lisp being
prominent languages, I can't dispute nor concur with her statement.  How
would you respond?


First, a bit of advice that convinced me to go with Perl 6 not only
philosophically, but practically too.

Go here:
http://www.artlebedev.ru/tools/typograf/webservice/

This page is in Russian, but you just need the links with names of
programming languages at the bottom.

This is the website of Art. Lebedev studio, famous internationally for
the (yet-unreleased) Optimus keyboard and famous in Russia for
designing ace websites. On their website they also have a tool called
"Typograf" for improving the typesetting of plain text and HTML. And
they offer a webservice for it too. The links at the bottom of the
page show examples of code  for accessing the webservice in different
programming languages.

I was pleasantly surprised to see both Perl and Perl 6 there. When i
compared the two pieces of code, i was just stunned.

This code is practical. Hey, it's webservices!  For those vanilla
webservices the Perl 6 code was perfectly readable and cleaner than
its Perl 5 counterpart. And what's most important, *it was still
Perl*. Just cleaner and updated for 2006.

So there. Show that to your stubborn coworkers. The first sentence in
the Camel book can stay the same: Perl 6 is still a language to get
your job done and i believe that most of the time their job will be to
program webservices and not lazy-evaluated arrays or thread-safe
hyper-junctions. And when they will want to do that, they will be able
to.

Now about some philosophy ... I mostly second Fagyal - and please see below ...

On 29/08/06, Fagyal Csongor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Perl5 is hard to read, and so will Perl6 be. That (mostly) comes form
the gazillion tons of syntax sugar we have, and from the lots of
DWIMmery.


Syntactic sugar and DWIMmery is good, when it's done well.

In Perl 5 it is done quite well. In Perl 6 it is potentially even better.

No one *has* to use, or for that matter, learn about the
hyper-fatarrow (see
http://aharoni.blogspot.com/2006_08_01_archive.html#post-7389599670533029862
).

It would be clever on behalf of documentation writers (i am gradually
trying to become one) to update perlop and perlsyn in such a way that
all the new and smart operators won't scare people away.

And the Perl 6 edition of the Llama book doesn't even have to mention
them until some very late chapter, if at all.


So yes, your coworkers are partially right, at least IMHO:
Perl6 syntax is way overloaded, and that can give you some headache. I
do not like the unicode operators, either, for example.


Read Larry's talk about Perl 5 and Perl 6 in Israeli OSDC 2006 ( see
http://wiki.osdc.org.il/index.php/Talks/Larry/PCFP ).

Try to listen to it too. He talks about Unicode in the part about
hyper-operators and tries to avoid the inevitable question - "how do
you type it". His explanation is simple, but just right. The world
moves on, why shouldn't Perl?


However, a par excellence programmer, who actually *writes* code, might
never experience issues like this. I mean you do not have to use what
you do not need to use.


You have the ability to be expressive. You don't have if you don't
want to. There's always C to go back to.


How many here know, for example, the exact
syntax in Perl5 regex for, say, "zero-width look behind assertion" do that
without looking it up in the man pages? :)


(?<=)

I didn't cheat. I actually used it yesterday.

And it changes in P6, although i'm not so sure to what exactly. Is it  ?


Perl5 is like three languages
combined into one. Perl6 is like 5 languages combined.


Yet again, i'll quote Larry: All your paradigms are belong to us.
And i'll add: But you can still write one-liners.

And you can still get your job done.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

Re: Latest $1,000 Wiki for Perl 6 proposal/offer.

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Yes. (Or endorsement by @Larry.) My guess is that something like this is
necessary to overcome the past reluctance of others to use *any* of the
previously suggested, currently existing wikis.


Right on.

Currently the Parrot PDD's say that the docs that must be written in
POD, even though XML (or HTML for that matter) has its advantages (see
parrot/trunk/docs/pdds/pdd00_pdd.pod ). It also welcomes contributions
and even says "Think of them as Wiki pages, but without the HTML" (see
parrot/trunk/docs/pdds/README ; it was written in 2001). I already
started submitting patches to it, which is indeed almost-wiki, but
well-done deployment in a nicely-designed wiki site with Web2.0-style
eye-candy, can do a lot of good publicity and make the synopses
develop faster - instead of making people go through the hoops of
installing SVN, submitting patches through RT etc.

Of course some people can say that those hoops are a good anti-vandal
measure ...

And by the way - *maybe i am missing something*, but is there a plan
for the final outline of Perl 6 documentation which will (?) come with
the default installation? The current Perl 6 "Synopsis \d{1,2}" name
format carries no information about the contents. I like the Perl 5
style - perlperl, perlrun, perlfaq\d, perlfunc etc. It may seem a
little weird to beginners, but is easy once they get used to it; plus
it's a good tradition.

junctions and autothreading

[Amir E. Aharoni]

My study of Perl 6 has been rather sporadic until now, but i'm
starting to catch up.

Here's a question:

I've seen the matter of "autothreading" mentioned in various places,
usually together with junctions. It seems like a neat idea, thread
safety concerns notwithstanding. Searching the mailing lists archives,
i found that there were heated debates about it months ago on
perl6-language ( http://xrl.us/e77x ).

What is its status now? Is it/Will it be implemented? Will it be the
default? Is it still hotly debated?

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

rt problem

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Hello,

Yesterday i sent my first patch to parrotbug {at} parrotcode.org
according to the instructions in docs/submissions.pod .

I wanted to check if it actually arrived anywhere, so i tried to look
at rt.perl.org , created a bitcard account, and attempted to fetch
some tickets, but i can see none.

If i go to the Parrot todo list ( http://www.parrotcode.org/todo.html
) and click on a ticket there, i get an error: "RT error - No
permission to view ticket". But if i log out and then try to view a
ticket as an anonymous user, i can see its contents.

Is there some problem with the rt server, or am i doing something wrong?
(I apologize if it's a silly newbie question.)

P.S. The file docs/submissions.pod says that to commit patches one
needs an account at  https://auth.perl.org/auth/account , and
rt.perl.org login page says that aut.perl.org are no longer required.

Thanks,

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

RE: wiki

[Amir E. Aharoni]

2006/8/3, Matt Todd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

I'll be honest, I was willing to put in some effort for something
substantial and original, but I'm not too keen on just remaking or
porting an old solution.

M.T.


Just in case i am misunderstood - i'm not talking about the platform,
i'm talking about content. If there is content, it can be later
converted to any great Perl 6 CMS - that's what we have Perl for in
the first place.

I just think that the Exegeses and the Synopses can grow much faster in a wiki,
even if the platform is not too cool initially.
(MediaWiki is good enough for me.)

I'd gladly write documentation for Perl 6, but unfortunately i don't
know it (yet) half as well as Perl 5. If there was a functioning wiki,
i'd make at least small contributions, though 

wiki

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Hi,

There was so much talk about perl6 wiki, that i couldn't follow it anymore.

Is there a currently working wiki where actual perl6 documentation can
be read/written?

Is it http://perl.net.au/wiki/ ? It doesn't seem to be very full of info ...

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

Re: Minimum modules for Production?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

However, as has been pointed out regarding MS Word, most users only
use a very tiny subset of its functionality.  The problem is that the users
are using different subsets.  I've done huge amounts of HTML parsing and
can't recall having used GDBM_File.


It all comes to *different* subsets 

I wrote a lot of Perl for Unix, VMS and Windows system management,
text files processing and connectivity to databases (Oracle and LDAP).
I never used an HTML parser and only used LWP once.

So for me a stripped down version of Perl with reasonable I/O
capabilities (print, open, close, ) would be just enough and i can
settle for an easy-to-install connectivity bundle.

Then again, i only represent myself.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

Re: Minimum modules for Production?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

On 5/30/06, Michael Mathews <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
...

I suggest that a
> Perl 6 distribution that includes as many modules as feasible be
> maintained as a strictly separate project. But the P5ish emphasis
> on core modules has to go.


In that case only the compiler and the most basic I/O functionality
needs to be in and i agree that it's not a bad idea.

There should be easy-to-install bundles of modules though -
connectivity bundle, DB bundle, webserver bundle, algorithms bundle,
Unix sysadmin bundle, Win32 bundle, Math bundle etc. Stuff like
DateTime can go to some kind of a Utils bundle.


I happen to agree with Aristotle about keeping the core skinny, and
giving people the option to make their own installs fat in whatever
way they prefer. Seems like Ruby can have Rails, and they're
comfortably two different things.


I haven't tried Rails, but i just hope that if such a killer app
emerges for Perl6, it won't be like Zope or BitTorrent which bundle
their tailored Python interpreter and libs in the default
installation.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

Minimum modules for Production?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

BEEP-BEEP - for some reason, every time i hit "Reply" my reply is sent
to the poster and not to the list. Is the bug in my mailer (GMail), my
head, or the list server?

See replies below.

On 5/30/06, Darren Duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

At 10:56 AM +0300 5/30/06, Amir E. Aharoni wrote:
>but as my 2 cents, i'd like to point out that i was always pissed off
>to read about fine modules in the Perl Cookbook and Damian's Best
>Practices only to find out that i have to download them from CPAN.

...

>Rule of thumb: If a module is good enough to be recommended
>by an important Perl book, then it should be considered for standard
>distribution too.


...


As I recall, it is Larry's wish that the standard distribution for
Perl 6 be quite small, so that people are encouraged to use CPAN.
And I agree.

...

Part of this is accomplished by rolling a lot of the functionality of
those modules into Perl 6 itself, rather than being extensions.  Eg,
the functionality of modules like 'Readonly' would be built-in.


... Which is great. I wasn't talking just about Readonly. A lot of the
fine functionality of modules discussed in the animal books will
indeed be built-in (or irrelevant!) in Perl 6, but by Perl 6.2
wonderful new ones will arise which will be recommended by wonderful
future editions of the animal books.

Also, mind that i'm presenting a user perspective, which is what this
list is supposed to be.


Particularly, anything complicated and/or in an open-ended domain
should be separate on CPAN.  Modules for talking to databases (DBI),
web servers (CGI, LWP),


As a user who also happens to be a perl advocate i think that a
built-in-and-robust-but-not-too-big "connectivity bundle" - HTTP,
LDAP, SNMP, SSH, DBI - will be great for telling people what a great
glue Perl is. As a mere user i think that it will be quite useful too.

As for CGI, it's really becoming less important with all the modern
content management systems and can retire to CPAN.


processing complex things like dates and
times (DateTime), and various other external things should remain
separate.


Actually i'd love to see something like Perl5's Date::PCalc in the std
distribution.

In fact, i thought about trying to translate it to Perl6 as an
exercise and was going to ask the list whether it would be a good idea
(good mainly means "not redundant").


--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
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Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
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--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html

Fwd: Minimum modules for Production?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

On 30/05/06, Ovid <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Since it looks like we're really going to have Perl6 within a year or so,
what are the "must have" modules folks will want before they can
consider using Perl6 in production?


I wouldn't say that it's the minimum for the first production version,
but as my 2 cents, i'd like to point out that i was always pissed off
to read about fine modules in the Perl Cookbook and Damian's Best
Practices only to find out that i have to download them from CPAN. My
previous workplace was very anal about installing software from the
web - they hardly let me install ActivePerl - and i'm sure that it's
not the only one. I'm talking about modules such as Tie::IxHash or
Readonly. Rule of thumb: If a module is good enough to be recommended
by an important Perl book, then it should be considered for standard
distribution too.

Re: $1,000 prize for Perl 6 Wiki written in Perl 6

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Beep beep. I, for example, hate the verbosity of html, but i use it
nevertheless. The popularity of Wikipedia made Media-Wiki syntax the
de-facto standard. It's not perfect, but please don't reinvent the
wheel (even though it's a PHP wheel).

It's funny - i was the first one who proposed the wiki idea and i
didn't think that it will go so far (1000$$$). If you ask me, this
wiki should be done ASAP in Media-Wiki. Reusing current Perl wikis
(Australian, whatever) is even better. Perl6 currently needs
documentation, community and advocacy - not a Yet Another Content
Management System written in itself. It is unlikely that it will
become Perl6's killer app with such a strong competition.

As for CamelCase - it's long dead. Now, writing a Perl6 app to find
and exterminate [[random links]] would be neat (although it would
probably be a one-liner).

On 5/28/06, A. Pagaltzis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

* Juerd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-05-28 19:35]:
> - MediaWiki-compatible syntax

I hate the Mediawiki syntax. Can we have something that
understands blocks, like Markdown? Just add [[foo]] as intrawiki
link syntax.

>   - Most \W characters can be safely used

Yeah, that is true for Markdown.

>   - Package names (CamelCase) can be used without them being
> transformed into links

I find CamelCaseLinking annoying as well. However, I do like how
it seems to gently guide people into picking NounsAsPageNames,
whereas random contributors tend [[to make really stupid]]
choices when given free-form links only. Good tools (page
renaming etc.) can help steer against that, but CamelCaseLinking
makes it less necessary to take corrective action in the first
place. However, it's also just plain damn ugly. :-/

Regards,
--
Aristotle Pagaltzis // 




--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
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Re: Where can I find a Perl 6 langauge reference?

[Amir E. Aharoni]

Is there a perl6-user-doc wiki?

It might be a great way to write documentation.

Free collaborative documentation for a free collaborative language -
what could be better?

Let alone Wikipedia - Wikis can be even greater than you think. For
example, check out this site:
http://wiki.osdc.org.il/index.php/Larry_Wall_-_Present_Continuous%2C_Future_Perfect

It is a transcript of a talk given by Larry at a conference. All of
transcription work was done by volunteers.

On 5/19/06, A. Pagaltzis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

* Steffen Schwigon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-05-19 09:10]:
> As your email address looks german,

Thomas is a fellow cologne.pm'er. :-)

> http://dresden-pm.org/cgi-bin/twiki/view/PM/PugsFirstBlood

Nice work.

Regards,
--
Aristotle Pagaltzis // 




--
Amir Elisha Aharoni, http://aharoni.blogspot.com/
"We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace." - Thurston Moore
__
Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments
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