Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
A few responses to the various comments: - It's no co-incidence that this message came at the same time that Macs are banging on about the same issue :-) - I'm not convinced that leaflets are the right place for this. - I agree with Matthew that this isn't the right "offensive message". I'd intended this as a "pre-canned response" to anyone who is concerned about Crapware, or who (rightly) points out that the cost of a Dell PC with Vista is the SAME as a Dell PC with Ubuntu... we are going to get questioned about why Linux isn't cheaper, given that the Linux community has been going on about "how you save money" and using words like "Microsoft tax". The reason I was bringing it up was that so we had a way to REPLY to these criticisms, as and when they come. Where I disagree with Matthew is that I think most people DON'T think these things cost money on Microsoft. They think that they can get them free "off a mate" :-) Software copying has become the social equivalent of doing 80mph on a motorway! M. PS - I refuse to say "Software piracy" - I cannot accept that using a piece of software without licence is the moral equivalent of murder, arson and rape, though in this post-Disney world, maybe most people think that software pirates are Johnny Depp :-) -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
Quoting Mark Harrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Yup - boys and girls - it's unpalatable but it needs addressing. > > Manufacturers like Dell now receive as much money in subsidies and fees > from companies like AOL and McAfee for installing crapware on your new > Vista machine as they have to pay to Microsoft for the Vista licence. > > I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" > thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running > Windows: Personally, I don't think this is the right way to go. I understand the reasoning behind the above, and a few years ago, I would have been 100% behind it, however recently I have found that if I start saying "Linux does this but Windows doesn't", or "Windows is rubbish - use Linux", people think that there is something wrong with Linux. I now adopt the tatic "Look - Office is free on Linux - so is antivirus software and the updates for it!" - most people know that these things cost money on Windows, slagging Windows off in order to promote Linux doesn't seem like the most tactical way of solving this situation. We should be promoting Linux on it's individual merits, not the fact that windows is crap. My £.02, Matt (donning flame-proof jacket as we speak...). -- Matthew Macdonald-Wallace Group Co-Ordinator Thanet Linux User Group http://www.thanet.lug.org.uk/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG KEY: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xFEA1BC16 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
Alec Wright wrote: On Sat, 2007-06-30 at 13:11 +0100, Mark Harrison wrote: I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running Windows I expect people will start making crapware for ubuntu soon, with ads on the desktop. Or maybe a seperate crapware submenu in the apps menu :) Or: Make the smallest windows installation possible on the hard drive, and completely fill it with crapware. Make ubuntu reformat that partition to swap on first boot up :) Don't be cynical now John -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
On Sat, 2007-06-30 at 13:11 +0100, Mark Harrison wrote: > I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" > thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running > Windows I expect people will start making crapware for ubuntu soon, with ads on the desktop. Or maybe a seperate crapware submenu in the apps menu :) Or: Make the smallest windows installation possible on the hard drive, and completely fill it with crapware. Make ubuntu reformat that partition to swap on first boot up :) -- Alec Wright -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
Mark Harrison wrote: > Yup - boys and girls - it's unpalatable but it needs addressing. > > Manufacturers like Dell now receive as much money in subsidies and fees > from companies like AOL and McAfee for installing crapware on your new > Vista machine as they have to pay to Microsoft for the Vista licence. > > I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" > thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running > Windows: > > - Did you know... *snip* Beautifully written! Sean -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
On Sat, 2007-06-30 at 13:51 +0100, Chris Rowson wrote: > > I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" > > thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running > > Windows: By a strange conincidence, as I was reading Chris' message on my ISP's webmail page, a Mac advert appeared on the page with a very, very fat David Mitchell acting as a PC and a very lean someone else as a Mac, making an issue of this very matter. Keith. -- Keith Bowerman, Prestwood, south Staffordshire, England. Using Ubuntu 7.04 on a Linux only machine. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
Fair points Mark, If you get a minute, pop this stuff onto the wiki - it'd be helpful to add these ideas to the leaflet concept. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/Leaflets Cheers Chris On 30/06/07, Mark Harrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yup - boys and girls - it's unpalatable but it needs addressing. > > Manufacturers like Dell now receive as much money in subsidies and fees > from companies like AOL and McAfee for installing crapware on your new > Vista machine as they have to pay to Microsoft for the Vista licence. > > I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" > thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running > Windows: > > - Did you know that a new typical Vista PC only includes the initial 3 > month trial? After that it costs £75 per year to remain protected. > Ubuntu comes with anti-virus security for life as standard. > > - Did you know that a typical new Vista PC only comes with a 30 day > trial of graphics software? After that, it costs an extra £50 to carry > on editing your photos. Ubuntu comes with full-featured graphics > software as standard. > > - Did you know that a typical new Vista PC comes with a limited office > suite called Works that doesn't read your work files properly? Upgrading > to the full version of Office costs an extra £300. Ubuntu comes with a > full Office Suite as standard. > > M. > > > > I refuse to purchase any more hardware with Windows installed. It is easy to > > avoid on desktops - simply build your own or buy with FreeDOS or Linux > > installed - but laptops are much more difficult. My last two came with XP > > which I wiped as soon as I got them. > > > > Mark > > > > > > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/ > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] Windows makes PCs cheaper to buy! ... we need to respond [Dell crapware]
Yup - boys and girls - it's unpalatable but it needs addressing. Manufacturers like Dell now receive as much money in subsidies and fees from companies like AOL and McAfee for installing crapware on your new Vista machine as they have to pay to Microsoft for the Vista licence. I think we ought to be making a far bigger play of the whole "Crapware" thing, which has done a great job of introducing hidden costs to running Windows: - Did you know that a new typical Vista PC only includes the initial 3 month trial? After that it costs £75 per year to remain protected. Ubuntu comes with anti-virus security for life as standard. - Did you know that a typical new Vista PC only comes with a 30 day trial of graphics software? After that, it costs an extra £50 to carry on editing your photos. Ubuntu comes with full-featured graphics software as standard. - Did you know that a typical new Vista PC comes with a limited office suite called Works that doesn't read your work files properly? Upgrading to the full version of Office costs an extra £300. Ubuntu comes with a full Office Suite as standard. M. > I refuse to purchase any more hardware with Windows installed. It is easy to > avoid on desktops - simply build your own or buy with FreeDOS or Linux > installed - but laptops are much more difficult. My last two came with XP > which I wiped as soon as I got them. > > Mark > > -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
