ROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 10:54 AM
To: Kowalsky
Cc: [313]
Subject: Re: (313) juan and kraftwerk (was Re: (313) 313 - T)
it's not an if. it's a statement of fact. juan atkins was making techno
before he heard kraftwerk. he said it, he put it in writing, it's a fact.
real.org
Subject: Re: (313) juan and kraftwerk (was Re: (313) 313 - T)
But Juan Atkins said numerous times that he was listenning to the
'Electrifying Mojo' radio show right ? Way before starting recording
'Clear' or 'Alleys Of Your Mind'...
Not only Juan, Derrick, Ke
Dick Hymen is also a great pr0nstar name
Rob Taylor
VT Librarian
x8599
Hatch Desk x1088
VT Library Users' Guide
-Original Message-
From: Fred Heutte [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 02 June 2008 21:48
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) juan and kraftwerk (was Re: (313) 31
The moment has passed...
-Original Message-
From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 7:13 PM
To: Kowalsky; Fred Heutte
Cc: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: Re: (313) juan and kraftwerk (was Re: (313) 313 - T)
co-signed. I see techno as an extension of disco and kw/td
A couple of years ago I learnt that the Fairlight synth, early
sampler, was created in Sydney (Fairlight is a suburb) so maybe
Sydney is the spiritual home of much of today's contemporary music
(scary!)
On 03/06/2008, at 3:52 AM, Kowalsky wrote:
Frank, i'm sorry to disagree with you again
t;
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 4:41 PM
Subject: Re: (313) juan and kraftwerk (was Re: (313) 313 - T)
That's exactly what i was saying to Frank. I didn't understand what
you're asking.
But, i agree with you. This argument is pointless. And more pointless is
to imagine a world whe
"Clarence! Clarence! Help us, Clarence! Get us back! Get us back, We don't
care what happens to us! Get us back to our Computer World and Pocket
Calculator! Help us Clarence, please! Please! We wanna bike again. We wanna
be showroom dummies again. Please, God, let us compute again!"
MEK
Kowalsky
That's exactly what i was saying to Frank. I didn't understand what
you're asking.
But, i agree with you. This argument is pointless. And more pointless
is to imagine a world where techno exists and kraftwerk doesn't.
The kraftwerk sound signature can be heard, clearly, in many detroit
tune
The whole argument is pointless. Trans Europe Express and
Autobahn were huge hits on black radio. I know because I heard
them a lot on the major DC stations (WOL and WOOK) at the
time. Same in Detroit I'm sure. Whether Juan was influenced
directly or not is for him to say. "Influence" could mea
Most techno artists / musicians would regard "Computer World" as more
influential than "Autobahn".
The progression from Autobahn to CW was a great one and made it closer
to dance music which was the incubation phase for techno. I think of
Autobahn being closer to Neu / Can with synthesizers
But Juan Atkins said numerous times that he was listenning to the 'Electrifying
Mojo' radio show right ? Way before starting recording 'Clear' or 'Alleys Of
Your Mind'...
Not only Juan, Derrick, Kevin, Jeff, Alan, all a generation listenned to him.
Mojo played a lot of Kraftwerk music ... It's sa
Oh please let's not argue this over again.
Just because Juan heard "Numbers" after he started making tracks means
nothing. "Numbers" was on "Computer World", which was released in
1982. "Computer World" was KW's 7th LP. "Autobahn" had been a hit in
the US in 1974. It isn't likely that Juan Atki
It's not hard to understand. Nevertheless i still see kraftwerk in
detroit techno. Juan got the Kraftwerk in second hand through other
styles, like electro.
I mean no offense, but what is really hard to understand, and
pointless, is this:
"it proves that Detroit
techno would have existed e
Frank Glazer wrote:
all i'm saying, and all i've ever said, is that juan atkins was making
techno before he heard kraftwerk. why is that so hard to understand?
It isn't.
What makes it illogical is the notion that he somehow escaped the
influence, whether or not he had heard the band.
Frank Glazer wrote:
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 1:01 PM, Thor Teague <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
To play devil's advocate, that doesn't prove that if Kraftwerk had
never existed, Detroit techno would not have existed.
That was exactly my point. If you ask me, it proves that Detroit
techno would hav
all i'm saying, and all i've ever said, is that juan atkins was making
techno before he heard kraftwerk. why is that so hard to understand?
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Kowalsky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So, the fact you claim to be true is: Kraftwerk has nothing to do with the
> creation o
So, the fact you claim to be true is: Kraftwerk has nothing to do
with the creation of the detroit techno. Right?
On 02/06/2008, at 14:54, Frank Glazer wrote:
it's not an if. it's a statement of fact. juan atkins was making
techno before he heard kraftwerk. he said it, he put it in writing
it's not an if. it's a statement of fact. juan atkins was making
techno before he heard kraftwerk. he said it, he put it in writing,
it's a fact.
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 1:52 PM, Kowalsky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Frank, i'm sorry to disagree with you again, but there is no logic in saying
>
Frank, i'm sorry to disagree with you again, but there is no logic in
saying something would be this way if...
You can say that kraftwerk had no influence, or that they influenced
but not as much as people say or that they did influenced a lot.
These 3 cases should lead us to a real debate. T
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 1:01 PM, Thor Teague <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> To play devil's advocate, that doesn't prove that if Kraftwerk had
> never existed, Detroit techno would not have existed.
That was exactly my point. If you ask me, it proves that Detroit
techno would have existed even if Kr
To play devil's advocate, that doesn't prove that if Kraftwerk had
never existed, Detroit techno would not have existed.
I am not interested in the debate a great deal, as the fantasy
scenario "What if xyz...?" debates don't seem productive IMO. I find
it moot. They did, and the belleville trio he
remember that argument we were all having recently about whether
techno would have happened without kraftwerk? the comment that
sparked it was "Juan and Kevin and Derrick might have had had some
difficulty without the Germans" (this was in the context of who
belongs on a techno mount rushmore alon
--Original Message-
From: Arturo Lopez [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 12:25 AM
To: 313 Mailing List
Subject: Re: (313) 313 - T
1. It's a stupid argument, I was just giving a little shout-out to ze
germans, wasn't trying to kick over a bee hive.
2. Since I orig
1. It's a stupid argument, I was just giving a little shout-out to ze
germans, wasn't trying to kick over a bee hive.
2. Since I originated this argument (on this latest occasion), my 2 cents:
It's easy to come up with a lot of techno heavyweights who were
influenced by Kraftwerk, we can all agre
oh go play in the street ;-)
MEK
"Frank Glazer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote on 05/21/2008 04:49:27 PM:
> this is perhaps the most irrelevant post made so far in this
> ultimately asinine argument.
>
> On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 5:47 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> > yeah, but how many people know w
so whats the verdict? did you guys figure it out this time?
:)
this is perhaps the most irrelevant post made so far in this
ultimately asinine argument.
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 5:47 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> yeah, but how many people know what Mojo even looks like?
> most photos I've seen his face has been in the shadows
>
> MEK
>
> "Frank Glazer" <[E
yeah, but how many people know what Mojo even looks like?
most photos I've seen his face has been in the shadows
MEK
"Frank Glazer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote on 05/21/2008 03:06:03 PM:
> on second thought, it's not that i'm against pedestals, i think it's
> pretty silly to put kraftwerk on an im
I honestly didn't know what 'techno' was until I saw 808 state on MTV™
but Afrika Bambaataa, Melle Mel, Whodini & Newcleus and the whole
'breakdancing' & electro / hiphop thing was my way into it.
Detroit didn't mean much to me until about 1989.. [yes, I discovered
Carl Craig after 808 Sta
on second thought, it's not that i'm against pedestals, i think it's
pretty silly to put kraftwerk on an imaginary mount rushmore of
detroit techno. i say put mojo up there, which, in effect, includes
kraftwerk, amongst other influences. in everything i've read on the
subject, kraftwerk has only
maybe.
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 4:00 PM, Matt Kane's Brain
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> enh. whatever. i am so tired of this argument. i don't see why
>> everybody is so passionately for putting kraftwerk on such a high
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> enh. whatever. i am so tired of this argument. i don't see why
> everybody is so passionately for putting kraftwerk on such a high
> pedestal. they're just one band.
It sounds more like you are skeptical of the utility
enh. whatever. i am so tired of this argument. i don't see why
everybody is so passionately for putting kraftwerk on such a high
pedestal. they're just one band.
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:53 PM, theREALmxyzptlk
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> like i said, nobody can deny
>>
>> their influence, b
like i said, nobody can deny
their influence, but i really believe that american disco, funk and
electro and dare i say synthpop as a conglomeration was more important
to the detroit techno sound than the individual effect of kraftwerk.
Additionally, while the mentions of funk and disco are
yeah, why not?
destroy your idols
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Matt Kane's Brain
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> yeah? and? so? so mike banks says kraftwerk is the be all and end
>> all of techno. so what? while i h
look, i have nothing but love for kraftwerk. much of their oeuvre is
quite good, and i've been a fan since, i dunno, 1985. but i just
think their importance is overrated. like i said, nobody can deny
their influence, but i really believe that american disco, funk and
electro and dare i say sy
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> yeah? and? so? so mike banks says kraftwerk is the be all and end
> all of techno. so what? while i have nothing but respect for mike,
> and wouldn't for a second doubt his knowledge nor his personal
> influence on tech
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:28 PM, kent williams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I think the implication, Frank, is that Mike Banks is in a better
> position to judge the history of techno and it's origins than you are.
yeah? and? so? so mike banks says kraftwerk is the be all and end
all of techno.
I think the implication, Frank, is that Mike Banks is in a better
position to judge the history of techno and it's origins than you are.
This seems like a pretty meaningless debate. Techno happened because
of a lot of people and influences, at a particular time and place, and
as it became a disti
look, i have nothing but love for kraftwerk. much of their oeuvre is
quite good, and i've been a fan since, i dunno, 1985. but i just
think their importance is overrated. like i said, nobody can deny
their influence, but i really believe that american disco, funk and
electro and dare i say synth
so?
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 3:14 PM, U&I Design
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Um... ok... Frank, have a sit down with Mike Banks... I can guarantee he'd
> have a totally different opinion on your comments...
>
> On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 2:05 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> That's
There's no "if". All happened the way it happened. Kraftwerk IS a
major influence on techno, what's the point of speculating about it
never existed?
Kw
On 21/05/2008, at 15:05, Frank Glazer wrote:
That's wildly arguable. Certainly nobody can deny a Kraftwerkian
influence in early techno,
I said difficulty, not impossibility :) You are right, though.
-Arturo
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Frank Glazer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> That's wildly arguable. Certainly nobody can deny a Kraftwerkian
> influence in early techno, but I really strongly believe techno would
> have happe
That's wildly arguable. Certainly nobody can deny a Kraftwerkian
influence in early techno, but I really strongly believe techno would
have happened with or without them. There were entire too many other
things going on that affected the Belleville three.
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Arturo
The original two members of Kraftwerk, Florian Schneider-Esleben and
Ralf Hütter split the last one. Juan and Kevin and Derrick might have
had had some difficulty without the Germans.
-Arturo
Eddie
Richie
Robert
Claude
Actually, I think it should be
Richie Magda Ricardo Troy
(carved into a chalk cliff face)
Oooh.
> what are the crossed out ones.
>
> On 5/21/08, Paul Kendrick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> One of my mates sent me this link, some designer has done
what are the crossed out ones.
On 5/21/08, Paul Kendrick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> One of my mates sent me this link, some designer has done this for a T
> shirt - available for "free" with a magazine that costs $40!!!
> http://www.arkitip.com/magazines/images/0046/bd_ht.jpg
>
> http://www.ar
How many spelling mistakes at the end of my last mail- ha-ha.
-Original Message-
From: Paul Kendrick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 21 May 2008 14:51
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: list 313
Subject: RE: (313) 313 - T
It says, Juan Derrick kevin across the top and Carl Jeff, Blake, mojo
nad
It says, Juan Derrick kevin across the top and Carl Jeff, Blake, mojo
nad banks o fthe side
-Original Message-
From: Nik Stoltzman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 21 May 2008 14:42
To: Paul Kendrick
Cc: list 313
Subject: Re: (313) 313 - T
Who the f*ck is Ivan?
>
> One of my
Who the f*ck is Ivan?
>
> One of my mates sent me this link, some designer has done this for a T
> shirt - available for "free" with a magazine that costs $40!!!
> http://www.arkitip.com/magazines/images/0046/bd_ht.jpg
>
> http://www.arkitip.com/magazines/issue46.php
>
> So who gets the fourth pla
While it may not be what you're looking for,
One of the artists from our site has some 313 designs through cafepress:
http://www.cafeshops.com/ph34rdetroit
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 12:02 PM
To: 313@hyperreal.
WADDUP DOE
On Friday, May 16, 2003, at 02:48 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
or make bootleg moodymann t-shirts
On Fri, 16 May 2003, Greg Earle wrote:
Naw, don't make a new design, I've got a better idea ...
Let's let Moodymann bootleg our existing 313 t-shirts!
- Greg
P.S. Fo
how about a clone army of moodymen?
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <313@hyperreal.org>
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 5:48 PM
Subject: Re: (313) 313 t-shirts?
> or make bootleg moodymann t-shirts
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 16 May 2003, Greg Earle
or make bootleg moodymann t-shirts
On Fri, 16 May 2003, Greg Earle wrote:
> Naw, don't make a new design, I've got a better idea ...
>
> Let's let Moodymann bootleg our existing 313 t-shirts!
>
>
>
> - Greg
>
> P.S. For you New York TechnoTourists: Northwest/KLM has $143.00 r/t tickets
Naw, don't make a new design, I've got a better idea ...
Let's let Moodymann bootleg our existing 313 t-shirts!
- Greg
P.S. For you New York TechnoTourists: Northwest/KLM has $143.00 r/t tickets to
Venice (no, that is not a typo) during August. (+ $72.84 taxes & fees)
- Original Message -
From: "Brendan Nelson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <313@hyperreal.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 5:01 PM
Subject: RE: (313) 313 t-shirts?
>>>I saw Tristan wearing a nice-looking 313 t-shirt over in London
On Wed, 14 May 2003 12:06:19 -0500, "John Sokolowski"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> > The '01 313 List shirts were limited to a run of about 500 each.
>Thanks to
>>your support they sold out at the Record Time tent during the fest. A
>few
>>lucky folks got some 'test' shirts
I was in Recordtime (Roseville) last Sept and they had a few of the black 313 T's w/ the record crate.
Might be worth a shot...
Cheers!
>From: "Fabrizio Nahum" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Dave Pinter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <313@hyperreal.org>
>
i'm still waiting but i cant remember who promised me one
its not like rome is exactly prime 313 territory;-)
- Original Message -
From: "Dave Pinter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <313@hyperreal.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 3:49 PM
Subject: Re: (313) 31
The '01 313 List shirts were limited to a run of about 500 each. Thanks to your
support they sold out at the Record Time tent during the fest. A few lucky
folks got some 'test' shirts printed on different color T's. Mike Himes (RT
owner) generously funded the venture and did it pretty much at co
I saw Tristan wearing a nice-looking 313 t-shirt over in London a few
months back... I asked him what the deal was with the shirt, but was too
drunk to remember the story! But that may well have been the same
thing...
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTE
wasn't there someone on this list who was getting 313 hoodies made?
I recall emailing him/her and ordering one, but never heard anything back.
In a message dated 3/6/01 12:23:59 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< I know there was a small discussion a few weeks ago about
sounds good!
__special k
> I could whip up a voting mechanism real quick. I'm new by the way.
> Hi! :)
> --
> My feet hurt... [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> WITH DESTINY!AIM:pr0j2501
> Matt Kane's Brainhttp://www.ele.uri.edu/~mkb
We've done the competition thing alreadyhalf of it anyway. There is a
website up (hopefully STILL), and designs have already been submitted.
All we have to do is either vote...or simply allow people to pick which
one they want
I could whip up a voting mechanism real quick. I'm new by th
I like the tshirt idea cuz you get em small. for small
people..like me. and when its cold just put a long
sleeve under it.
d
--- joshtwentythree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> to try and sway people :), I would most definitely
> be
> more interested in contributing to the making of
> hoodies over
to try and sway people :), I would most definitely be
more interested in contributing to the making of
hoodies over t-shirts...
josh23
--- Scotto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What ever happened to the idea of making hooded
> sweatshirts? I liked that
> one t-shirts are cool though to.
>
___
What ever happened to the idea of making hooded sweatshirts? I liked that
one t-shirts are cool though to.
> We've done the competition thing alreadyhalf of it anyway. There is a
> website up (hopefully STILL), and designs have already been submitted.
> All we have to do is either vote...or
heres the designs that never happened. i think the guy that was organizing
it didnt have the spare time to make it happen. anyhow, have a look and
maybe someone else will be inspired to tally votes and make shirt happen:
http://www.objektsynth.com/313/
-p
On Tue, 6 Mar 2001, Greg Malcolm wrote:
hey count me in to buy at least two or three...this was supposed to happen
last year too?
GM
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: [313] 313 T-Shirts
Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:46:38 -0500
I know there was a small discussion a few weeks ago about getting a 313
shirt done fo
On Tue, 6 Mar 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I know there was a small discussion a few weeks ago about getting a
> 313 shirt done for DEMF. I'd be interested in making this happen if
> there was enough support from the list to get a good order together.
> We could obviously have an open competiti
> BTW, what is the status of the shirts?
>
> anyone?
>
> greg
after the close of the submission process, i received
some late entries. tried to upload them and there were
problems ftp-ing them to the web site (premature end of file),
so i'll have to do what i usually do; keep saving the graphic
BTW, what is the status of the shirts?
anyone?
greg
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org
Subject: RE: [313] 313 t-shirt
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 18:19:17 +0200
Hmm, that adress on the site looks familiar. Wasn't that the same adress as
the DEMF? So, is th
Hmm, that adress on the site looks familiar. Wasn't that the same adress as
the DEMF? So, is this Mr. Craig's next move??
Any thoughts on this?
John
Carl's (Planet E's) office is in the Cass Corridor, around Cass St.(near the
DIA and Wayne State University-closer to farther up woodward Layf
Hmm, that adress on the site looks familiar. Wasn't that the same adress as
the DEMF? So, is this Mr. Craig's next move??
Any thoughts on this?
John
-Original Message-
From: Benjamin Cuthbert (Merch) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, July 13, 2000 3:03 PM
To: '313@hyperreal.org'
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