[OT} Re: So today Sun announced...

Some people complained about this, but I don't want some things unanswered. So just ignore if you don't care. Endre Stølsvik wrote: | | I'm not sure how to answer this. I believe you are a little confused about | how the JCP works and what we're doing here, and people are asking for. | | Fi

Re: So today Sun announced...

Stefano Mazzocchi wrote: > Now, let's go back to let the code speak. +1 ;-) -- Etienne M. Gagnon, Ph.D.http://www.info2.uqam.ca/~egagnon/ SableVM: http://www.sablevm.org/ SableCC: http://www.sablecc.org/ s

Re: So today Sun announced...

Chris Gray wrote: > Geir, > > I'll grant you that Sun could handle the Java community much worse than they > do, but I still don't agree that having such a corporation in charge is a > Good Thing. Or maybe I'm just being old-fashioned, and we should get rid of > all those fuddy-duddy organisati

Re: So today Sun announced...

Folks, this is a -dev list. There are any number of opinion forums elsewhere where you'll get a broader interest in your point of view. Let's talk code. Tim Endre Stølsvik wrote: > | > | I'm not sure how to answer this. I believe you are a little confused about > | how the JCP works and what w

Re: So today Sun announced...

Geir, I'll grant you that Sun could handle the Java community much worse than they do, but I still don't agree that having such a corporation in charge is a Good Thing. Or maybe I'm just being old-fashioned, and we should get rid of all those fuddy-duddy organisations like IETF or W3C and repla

Re: So today Sun announced...

| | I'm not sure how to answer this. I believe you are a little confused about | how the JCP works and what we're doing here, and people are asking for. | | First, we aren't advocating changes in the way Java SE specification is | defined. So you still want the JCP? Run by Sun? Or by who? |

Re: So today Sun announced...

On Fri, 19 May 2006, Chris Gray wrote: | | > Open Source java wouldn't be the same if there wasn't some standard to | > follow and adhere to. If this "standard" is defined rather more by one | > company than the rest - what is the real problem? | | The real problem is that if that company also m

Re: So today Sun announced...

Chris Gray wrote: Open Source java wouldn't be the same if there wasn't some standard to follow and adhere to. If this "standard" is defined rather more by one company than the rest - what is the real problem? The real problem is that if that company also markets an implementation of the sta

Re: So today Sun announced...

Endre Stølsvik wrote: I personally wonder what _full_ open-sourcing of java actually would accomplish? How do you want Sun to do this? Slam a Apache-license on the code, and say "okay, folks, here it is - we're off"? Well, sure. That would be good. I believe that it could fragment into

Re: So today Sun announced...

> Open Source java wouldn't be the same if there wasn't some standard to > follow and adhere to. If this "standard" is defined rather more by one > company than the rest - what is the real problem? The real problem is that if that company also markets an implementation of the standard, there wil

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/19/06, Endre Stølsvik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: PPS: Why does Sun really bother to pour money into Java at all? The reason, I've come to understand, _was_ that they then could sell a bunch of their big-iron boxes to companies when the small intel-servers couldn't cope with a success of th

Re: So today Sun announced...

On Tue, 16 May 2006, Fernando Cassia wrote: | I give Sun credit for two things... | | 1. preventing polluting of the platform a la J++. | | "In a June 20, 1996, memo entitled "windows & internet issues" Microsoft's | then-VP Paul Maritz | explained

Re: So today Sun announced...

Thought you guys might be interested in this... http://danesecooper.blogs.com/divablog/2006/05/what_sun_doesnt.html Danese On May 18, 2006, at 12:31 PM, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: But that's not open source... Fernando Cassia wrote: On 5/17/06, Stefano Mazzocchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/18/06, Geir Magnusson Jr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: But that's not open source... Obviously not. :) FC

Re: So today Sun announced...

But that's not open source... Fernando Cassia wrote: On 5/17/06, Stefano Mazzocchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: But as I mentioned before, this is still irrelevant as far as open-java efforts because the JRE/JDK source code is not available Well, this is not entirely accurate. The source of

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/17/06, Stefano Mazzocchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: But as I mentioned before, this is still irrelevant as far as open-java efforts because the JRE/JDK source code is not available Well, this is not entirely accurate. The source of Mustang has been open for months, for others to take a

Re: So today Sun announced...

Leo Simons wrote: On Tue, May 16, 2006 at 10:46:55AM -0700, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: So, while many of us knew that Sun will OSS Java eventually, it's still good news, and it's nice to see that the Java ecosystem is moving slowly but surely to openness :) Good on them! You know, 2 years ag

Re: So today Sun announced...

On Tue, May 16, 2006 at 10:46:55AM -0700, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: > First, they announced some kind of distribution-like agreement with > Ubuntu, so that any Debian-based distro can easily install Java. About time! Goodness! > Second I'm not sure how to describe this. When Jonathan Schwart

Re: So today Sun announced...

Stefano Mazzocchi wrote: Fernando Cassia wrote: On 5/17/06, Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The JPackage folks have an interesting discussion, and I expect that the discussion (flaming?) on Debian's mailing lists will begin once the list server is back up. Waste of time... If

Re: So today Sun announced...

Fernando Cassia wrote: > On 5/17/06, Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >> > The JPackage folks have an interesting >> >> discussion, and I expect that the discussion (flaming?) on Debian's >> >> mailing lists will begin once the list server is back up. >> >> >> >> Waste of time... >>

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/17/06, Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The JPackage folks have an interesting >> discussion, and I expect that the discussion (flaming?) on Debian's >> mailing lists will begin once the list server is back up. >> >> Waste of time... If licenses are irrelevant, the Harmony pro

Re: So today Sun announced...

* Fernando Cassia: > On 5/17/06, Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >> It's still a very strange license with a lot of oddities. For >> example, it does not allow end users to use Debian's versions for >> cross-platform development. > > > Do you -or anyone else besides lawyers on cra

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/17/06, Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: It's still a very strange license with a lot of oddities. For example, it does not allow end users to use Debian's versions for cross-platform development. Do you -or anyone else besides lawyers on crack living in their private little bu

Re: So today Sun announced...

* Geir Magnusson, Jr.: > First, they announced some kind of distribution-like agreement with > Ubuntu, so that any Debian-based distro can easily install Java. It > wasn't clear if they really are going to distribute Ubuntu w/ Java or > just make it easy to install via apt. Currently, it seems t

Re: So today Sun announced...

Fernando Cassia skrev den 17-05-2006 14:35: but VisualAge is still alive - it has just been rewritten from Scheme to Java and been renamed to Eclipse (or Rational Application Developer). You may have heard of it :) While I like Netbeans, I know about Eclipse and I heard about the contribut

Re: So today Sun announced...

On 5/17/06, Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Fernando Cassia skrev den 16-05-2006 23:07: I generally agree with you that IBM have a hard time selling gold at half the price, Not only that, they dig a hole and put gold into a hole, then denying the gold ever existed. Then t

Re: So today Sun announced...

Fernando Cassia skrev den 16-05-2006 23:07: Had it been an IBM project, it would be as alive today as OpenDoc, IBM Voicetype, OS/2, Lotus Smartsuite, VisualAge for Java, VisualAge for Basic, I generally agree with you that IBM have a hard time selling gold at half the price, but VisualAge i

Re: So today Sun announced...

Dalibor Topic wrote: > On Tue, May 16, 2006 at 10:46:55AM -0700, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: >> I was at the J1 keynote this morning hoping to hear news about Sun >> open-sourcing Java. >> >> First, they announced some kind of distribution-like agreement with >> Ubuntu, so that any Debian-based dist

Re: So today Sun announced...

I give Sun credit for two things... 1. preventing polluting of the platform a la J++. "In a June 20, 1996, memo entitled "windows & internet issues" Microsoft's then-VP Paul Maritz explainedthat it was necessary for the fir

Re: So today Sun announced...

On Tue, May 16, 2006 at 10:46:55AM -0700, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: > I was at the J1 keynote this morning hoping to hear news about Sun > open-sourcing Java. > > First, they announced some kind of distribution-like agreement with > Ubuntu, so that any Debian-based distro can easily install Java.

So today Sun announced...

I was at the J1 keynote this morning hoping to hear news about Sun open-sourcing Java. First, they announced some kind of distribution-like agreement with Ubuntu, so that any Debian-based distro can easily install Java. It wasn't clear if they really are going to distribute Ubuntu w/ Java or