Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-15 Thread Tom Tromey
> "Tim" == Tim Ellison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Tim> I read the description of CNI here: Tim>http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcj/index.html Tim> Is there some description of how this looks from the Java side? Are the Tim> natives declared as CNI natives somehow, or does the VM go throug

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-15 Thread Tim Ellison
Mark Wielaard wrote: > Right. It might be instructive to participate in the discussion started > this week about the newly proposed network VM interface classes > suggested by Ingo and Roman on the classpath-patches mailinglist. > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/classpath-patches > (Subject "

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-13 Thread Geir Magnusson Jr.
On Nov 12, 2005, at 10:23 AM, Mark Wielaard wrote: Hi Geir, On Sat, 2005-11-05 at 11:56 +0100, Mark Wielaard wrote: On Fri, 2005-11-04 at 11:24 -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: We have to address this. We started a while ago and it didn't go well Could you give a summary of the discussion

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-12 Thread Mark Wielaard
Hi Tim, On Wed, 2005-11-09 at 14:14 +, Tim Ellison wrote: > Mark Wielaard wrote: > > On Mon, 2005-11-07 at 17:03 -0500, Graeme Johnson wrote: > >>Split-class (ClassX & VMClassX) or customized-class solutions (Tim E's > >>Kernel classes) are different approaches to solving the same problem. >

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-12 Thread Mark Wielaard
Hi Geir, On Sat, 2005-11-05 at 11:56 +0100, Mark Wielaard wrote: > On Fri, 2005-11-04 at 11:24 -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > > We have to address this. We started a while ago and it didn't go > > well > > Could you give a summary of the discussion and why you thought it didn't > go well?

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-09 Thread Geir Magnusson Jr.
On Nov 9, 2005, at 9:14 AM, Tim Ellison wrote: Mark Wielaard wrote: That can be an issue indeed. But by marking the VMClasses package private and final (or just have list in the jit/compiler) all calls to them should be able to be optimized away if needed. Agreed. What you are pointing

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-09 Thread Tim Ellison
Mark Wielaard wrote: > Hi Graeme, > > On Mon, 2005-11-07 at 17:03 -0500, Graeme Johnson wrote: > >>Split-class (ClassX & VMClassX) or customized-class solutions (Tim E's >>Kernel classes) are different approaches to solving the same problem. > > Not completely. I think they complement each othe

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-09 Thread Mark Wielaard
Hi Graeme, On Mon, 2005-11-07 at 17:03 -0500, Graeme Johnson wrote: > Split-class (ClassX & VMClassX) or customized-class solutions (Tim E's > Kernel classes) are different approaches to solving the same problem. Not completely. I think they complement each other. The ClassX & VMClassX split des

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-08 Thread Tom Tromey
> "Graeme" == Graeme Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Graeme> Split-class (ClassX & VMClassX) or customized-class solutions (Tim E's Graeme> Kernel classes) are different approaches to solving the same problem. Graeme> Of the two approaches I believe that the customized-class solution Gr

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-07 Thread Graeme Johnson
Mark Wielaard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote on 11/05/2005 05:56:59 AM: > Hi Rodrigo, > > On Fri, 2005-11-04 at 17:53 -0200, Rodrigo Kumpera wrote: > > I see 2 options here: > > > > -Allow for some implementation stuff to package private > > -Have a org.apache.harmony, or something else, package tree

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-07 Thread Leo Simons
Darn, I wanted to add one more thing -- Dan's been doing exactly this with the bootjvm code. Subscribing to the commits list (http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html) hence is very instructive, if you're looking to get involved but don't know how yet, start reading along ;) - LSD On Mo

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-07 Thread Leo Simons
On Fri, Nov 04, 2005 at 10:50:33AM -0600, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I've been evaluating Jean-Frederic's configuration proposal and finishing up > on the core JVM code. I should have a _complete_ code base by the end of > next week. Whoah, cool! I thought we'd take years :-) As an aside (I seem

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-05 Thread Mark Wielaard
Hi Rodrigo, On Fri, 2005-11-04 at 17:53 -0200, Rodrigo Kumpera wrote: > I see 2 options here: > > -Allow for some implementation stuff to package private > -Have a org.apache.harmony, or something else, package tree where all > implementation stuff will reside. > > In the first case, only truste

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-05 Thread Mark Wielaard
Hi Geir, On Fri, 2005-11-04 at 11:24 -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > We have to address this. We started a while ago and it didn't go > well Could you give a summary of the discussion and why you thought it didn't go well? > We have people around here, lurking and active, that have done th

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Archie Cobbs
Tim Ellison wrote: Matt> Wasn't one of the issues here the theoretical "What Matt> happens when Sun defines a public VMClass class in Matt> java.lang?" There's no bad (i.e., security violating) situation that can arise from this. It is no different from Sun adding any other class that is not ye

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Tim Ellison
Rodrigo Kumpera wrote: > I cannot see how adding package private classes can possibly be > classified as 'extend the defined namespaces'. This makes perfect > sense and allow implementation classes easier access the guts of spec > classes (eg, org.apache.harmony.ClassLoaderStuff will have some hard

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Tim Ellison
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: <> > Probably the _first_ thing that will need to be tested will be the built-in > implementations > of the java.lang classes Object, Class, String, and Thread. They are partly > done, but > will need to be tested and any remaining holes filled in. (See also comments

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Tim Ellison
Tom Tromey wrote: >>"Matt" == Matt Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > >>>I don't understand this (sorry if I wasn't paying attention >>>earlier). If "extend" means defining public API's in those >>>packages, then Classpath doesn't purport to do that. The >>>java.lang.VMClass, etc. stuff

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Jean-frederic Clere
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Original Message- From: "Geir Magnusson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Nov 4, 2005 10:24 AM To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org Subject: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!") My favorite subject...

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Rodrigo Kumpera
I cannot see how adding package private classes can possibly be classified as 'extend the defined namespaces'. This makes perfect sense and allow implementation classes easier access the guts of spec classes (eg, org.apache.harmony.ClassLoaderStuff will have some hard time to mess with java.lang.Cl

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> -Original Message- > From: "Geir Magnusson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Nov 4, 2005 10:24 AM > To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org > Subject: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!") > > My favorite subject

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Tom Tromey
> "Matt" == Matt Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> I don't understand this (sorry if I wasn't paying attention >> earlier). If "extend" means defining public API's in those >> packages, then Classpath doesn't purport to do that. The >> java.lang.VMClass, etc. stuff are all internal API's

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Matt Benson
--- Archie Cobbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: [SNIP] > > 3) I'm really worried about the GNU Classpath > interface that extends > > java.lang. We do allow participants in this > community to look at the > > spec license, and we won't extend the defined > namespaces i

Re: VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Archie Cobbs
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: We have to address this. We started a while ago and it didn't go well, but we now have two VMs to work with, bootVM and jcheVM, and we need to get going here in a serious way. We're about to finish up the legal framework with the bulk contributuion rules, and as m

VM/Class Library Interface (or "Storming the Gates! Take 3!")

2005-11-04 Thread Geir Magnusson Jr.
My favorite subject... We have to address this. We started a while ago and it didn't go well, but we now have two VMs to work with, bootVM and jcheVM, and we need to get going here in a serious way. We're about to finish up the legal framework with the bulk contributuion rules, and as muc