Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-21 Thread Brian E Carpenter
On 2010-04-21 19:11, Philip Homburg wrote: > In your letter dated Wed, 21 Apr 2010 16:33:03 +1200 you wrote: >> By contrast, a source host >> never has this problem, because it knows by construction when a flow >> ends (chances are, flow == socket). > > I'm wondering about the 'never' part. What i

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-21 Thread Philip Homburg
In your letter dated Wed, 21 Apr 2010 16:33:03 +1200 you wrote: >By contrast, a source host >never has this problem, because it knows by construction when a flow >ends (chances are, flow == socket). I'm wondering about the 'never' part. What if an application uses sendto() to communicate over UDP

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-20 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Mark, I was hoping someone else might chime in, but since they didn't, let me extract from your messages: > So those [IPFIX] timeouts are more to do with emission of flow records, and > flow cache maintenance, rather than being a more general definition of > what a flow is Certainly. But supposi

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-18 Thread Mark Smith
Hi Brian, On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:50:28 +1200 Brian E Carpenter wrote: > Hi Mark, > > > Are you generally trying to avoid it because it would appear to be an > > implied IETF definition of a flow, rather than just the IPv6 > > definition? Or is it to avoid having to start defining the a possibly

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Hi Mark, > Are you generally trying to avoid it because it would appear to be an > implied IETF definition of a flow, rather than just the IPv6 > definition? Or is it to avoid having to start defining the a possibly > large set of flow definitions? Actually, because I have enough email to deal wi

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Mark Smith
On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 08:34:40 -0600 Shane Amante wrote: > Hi Mark, > > On Apr 15, 2010, at 04:36 MDT, Mark Smith wrote: > > Hi Brian, Shane, > > > > On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 15:52:15 +1200 > > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > > > >> > >> Regards > >> Brian Carpenter > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On 201

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Rémi Després
Le 14 avr. 2010 à 23:59, Mark Smith a écrit : > Hi Brian and Sheng, > > On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:48:25 +1200 > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> This is completely revised from the proposal we presented >> in Anaheim. This version allows locally defined use of >> the flow label in a simpl

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Shane Amante
Hi Mark, On Apr 15, 2010, at 04:36 MDT, Mark Smith wrote: > Hi Brian, Shane, > > On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 15:52:15 +1200 > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > >> >> Regards >> Brian Carpenter >> >> >> >> >> On 2010-04-15 14:10, Shane Amante wrote: >>> Brian, Mark, >>> >>> Brian: FWIW, I like the dire

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Carsten Bormann
On Apr 15, 2010, at 05:52, Brian E Carpenter wrote: >> the flow-label MUST or, at >> least, SHOULD be reset to 0 upon /leaving/ that domain, >> otherwise the next domain may (or, will?) misinterpret the >> meaning of the incoming "locally-defined" flow-label. The > > I'm personally quite attract

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Mark Smith
Hi Brian, Shane, On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 15:52:15 +1200 Brian E Carpenter wrote: > > Regards >Brian Carpenter > > > > > On 2010-04-15 14:10, Shane Amante wrote: > > Brian, Mark, > > > > Brian: FWIW, I like the direction of this version of draft > > much better than previous versions; howev

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Mark Smith
Hi Brian, On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 10:13:04 +1200 Brian E Carpenter wrote: > Hi Mark, > > On 2010-04-15 09:59, Mark Smith wrote: > > Hi Brian and Sheng, > > > > On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:48:25 +1200 > > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > > > >> Hi, > >> > > > > I suppose partly that comes down to what a

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-15 Thread Rémi Després
-Original Message- >> From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:brian.e.carpen...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2010 5:59 AM >> To: Rémi Després >> Cc: Sheng Jiang; 6man >> Subject: Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for >> draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02] >>

RE: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Sheng Jiang
heers, Sheng > -Original Message- > From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:brian.e.carpen...@gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2010 5:59 AM > To: Rémi Després > Cc: Sheng Jiang; 6man > Subject: Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for > draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Regards Brian Carpenter On 2010-04-15 14:10, Shane Amante wrote: > Brian, Mark, > > Brian: FWIW, I like the direction of this version of draft > much better than previous versions; however, I agree with > Remi that the current version is a bit confusing at the > moment and could likely be

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Shane Amante
Brian, Mark, Brian: FWIW, I like the direction of this version of draft much better than previous versions; however, I agree with Remi that the current version is a bit confusing at the moment and could likely be rewritten to be more simple and just obsolete RFC 3967. In addition, I'm still a

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Hi Mark, On 2010-04-15 09:59, Mark Smith wrote: > Hi Brian and Sheng, > > On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:48:25 +1200 > Brian E Carpenter wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> This is completely revised from the proposal we presented >> in Anaheim. This version allows locally defined use of >> the flow label in a simpl

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Mark Smith
Hi Brian and Sheng, On Wed, 14 Apr 2010 16:48:25 +1200 Brian E Carpenter wrote: > Hi, > > This is completely revised from the proposal we presented > in Anaheim. This version allows locally defined use of > the flow label in a simpler way, as the discussion suggested. > It's still quite a dense

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Rémi, Thanks for the analysis. Indeed, the conclusion may be, assuming the WG is interested at all, that a complete refresh of RFC 3697 is better than publishing a delta. I agree that it is a bit complicated to explain, although the underlying concept is quite clear: allow local use of the flow l

Re: [Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-14 Thread Rémi Després
Brian, Sheng, I carefully read the draft, and read again RFC 3697 and draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02. The draft is IMHO overly hard to understand but, unless I misunderstand its intent (which is quite possible), I appreciate what it proposes. I do support the intent, but feel uncomfortable

[Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-carpenter-6man-flow-update-02]

2010-04-13 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Hi, This is completely revised from the proposal we presented in Anaheim. This version allows locally defined use of the flow label in a simpler way, as the discussion suggested. It's still quite a dense read, but we believe that if this was adopted, it would open the way to actually using the flo