[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-02-06 Thread Tom Boothby
> I wrote a paper with an undergraduate showing > how to call Lisp (and therefore Maxima) from Microsoft's Excel. The > range data is > transferred to and from Lisp in a standard form. Symbolic data must be > strings. We also > add to the spreadsheet, commands for lisp evaluation, and lambda > e

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-02-06 Thread Ronan Paixão
Em Sex, 2009-01-23 às 09:49 -0800, rjf escreveu: > > > On Jan 22, 6:26 pm, mhampton wrote: > ... > > A python/ > > cython/javascript spreadsheet for the Sage notebook would be great - > > unfortunately I'm not going to write one. I think it would be hard to > > do it right. > > > > -M. Hampton

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-23 Thread rjf
On Jan 22, 6:26 pm, mhampton wrote: ... > A python/ > cython/javascript spreadsheet for the Sage notebook would be great - > unfortunately I'm not going to write one.  I think it would be hard to > do it right. > > -M. Hampton I have heard that the major competition for Mathematica is not Mapl

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-23 Thread Harald Schilly
On Jan 23, 3:47 pm, Alfredo Portes wrote: > By the way you may consider using JNA to access native libraries. thx, didn't know about that! --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ To post to this group, send email to sage-devel@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send e

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-23 Thread Alfredo Portes
On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 5:37 AM, Harald Schilly wrote: > For everything else you should consider JNI (that's the mechanism to > call native C code and how all basic java language features are > implemented) By the way you may consider using JNA to access native libraries. I have used it to acce

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-23 Thread Harald Schilly
On Jan 23, 10:09 am, ahmet alper parker wrote: > Is there someone who has > experience with compiling a java code to native code on an operating > system? the standard java virtual machine by sun already compiles java bytecode to native machine code. this is called "hotspot" compiler and picks t

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-23 Thread ahmet alper parker
What about the compiled java and python benchmarks? Is there someone who has experience with compiling a java code to native code on an operating system? On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 4:26 AM, mhampton wrote: > > > On Jan 22, 4:35 pm, Robert Bradshaw > wrote: > > > I pity those who find themselves try

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-22 Thread mhampton
On Jan 22, 4:35 pm, Robert Bradshaw wrote: > I pity those who find themselves trying to do serious scientific > programming with excel :). Though there are certainly a lot of > rational arguments against it, there may be some out there that are > as enthusiastic about Excel as we are about Pyth

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-22 Thread Robert Bradshaw
On Jan 22, 2009, at 11:11 AM, rjf wrote: > On Jan 21, 10:25 pm, Robert Bradshaw > wrote: >> On Jan 21, 2009, at 3:34 PM, rjf wrote: >> >> >> >>> On Jan 21, 11:54 am, Robert Bradshaw > ... snip... >> In our case, linear >> algebra is done via NumPy, which in turn uses a BLAS (with Sage we >> sh

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-22 Thread rjf
On Jan 21, 10:25 pm, Robert Bradshaw wrote: > On Jan 21, 2009, at 3:34 PM, rjf wrote: > > > > > On Jan 21, 11:54 am, Robert Bradshaw ... snip... > In our case, linear   > algebra is done via NumPy, which in turn uses a BLAS (with Sage we   > ship ATLAS). On the other hand, if one is doing a p

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-21 Thread Robert Bradshaw
On Jan 21, 2009, at 3:34 PM, rjf wrote: > On Jan 21, 11:54 am, Robert Bradshaw > wrote: > >> >>> I am sure that some Sage people have thought about such things, but >>> probably not >>> enough. Which is why I try to poke holes in some of these comments! >> >> Sage has thought about this--we have

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-21 Thread rjf
On Jan 21, 11:54 am, Robert Bradshaw wrote: > > > I am sure that some Sage people have thought about such things, but > > probably not > > enough. Which is why I try to poke holes in some of these comments! > > Sage has thought about this--we have models for both: > > RDF -- The real double "f

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-21 Thread Robert Bradshaw
On Jan 21, 2009, at 9:19 AM, rjf wrote: > On Jan 21, 2:44 am, Harald Schilly wrote: >> On Jan 21, 6:21 am, rjf wrote: >> >>> In my experience, people doing scientific calculations for a living >>> will not tolerate a language implementation X whose programs are >>> substantially slower than equ

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-21 Thread rjf
On Jan 21, 2:44 am, Harald Schilly wrote: > On Jan 21, 6:21 am, rjf wrote: > > > In my experience, people doing scientific calculations for a living > > will not tolerate a language implementation X whose programs are > > substantially slower than equivalent ones in a language implementation >

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-21 Thread Harald Schilly
On Jan 21, 6:21 am, rjf wrote: > In my experience, people doing scientific calculations for a living > will not tolerate a language implementation X whose programs are > substantially slower than equivalent ones in a language implementation > Y. I don't know any details, but I think there are va

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-20 Thread rjf
On Jan 20, 5:15 pm, Luiz Felipe Martins wrote: > My understanding is that, since Python is based on C, it is IEEE-754 > compliant (as long as the CPU is, which I think is true for all the > modern CPUs). There are many ways of being "compliant" with IEEE-754. If Sage is supposed to get the sa

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-20 Thread Luiz Felipe Martins
My understanding is that, since Python is based on C, it is IEEE-754 compliant (as long as the CPU is, which I think is true for all the modern CPUs). Jython might be a different story. (Which, I just learned, is alive and has a new version just released.) Also, I think the Java changed its floa

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-20 Thread Harald Schilly
On Jan 21, 12:29 am, rjf wrote: > You might like to read >  How Java’s floating-point hurts everyone everywhere (1998) > by W Kahan, J D Darcy > and other papers (like Darcy MS > thesis).http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~wkahan/JAVAhurt.pdf > for arguments that suggest  Java has certain problems wit

[sage-devel] Re: python vs java for scientific computing

2009-01-20 Thread rjf
You might like to read How Java’s floating-point hurts everyone everywhere (1998) by W Kahan, J D Darcy and other papers (like Darcy MS thesis). http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~wkahan/JAVAhurt.pdf for arguments that suggest Java has certain problems with floating- point . On the other hand, it may