Owner can have an agreement with one (or more) local tanker company to respond with x number of trucks to fill in 8. Heckuva lot cheaper than redundant or double sized tank.
This should qualify as a means to fill in 8. Sent from my iPhone On May 17, 2013, at 9:50 AM, "Morey, Mike" <[email protected]> wrote: > From NFPA 22 2012: > 14.4.1 A permanent pipe connected to a water supply shall be provided to fill > the tank, except as provided in 14.4.1.1. > > 14.4.1.1 Where a permanent water supply is not available to refill the tank, > an approved plan shall be permitted for manually refilling the tank. > > 14.4.1.2 During the time that the tank does not have sufficient capacity to > meet the demand of the fire protection system(s), the impairment procedures > of NFPA 25 shall be followed. > > I would suggest maybe you consider (required supply GPM for NFPA duration) - > (flow rate of filling source x 8 hr) reserve water in your pond which all but > mitigates these requirements anyways, since it sounds like expanding the pond > isn't out of the question. In which case your plan would be "if we have a > fire within 3 days of the first fire we'll hire a company to truck in water > and evacuate and impair the building per NFPA 25 until the water arrives" and > then file that plan away under "things that will probably never happen, but > just in case". > > > Mike Morey, SET, CFPS > Sprinkler Designer > BMW Constructors, Inc. > O: 317.651.0596 | C: 317.586.8111 > www.bmwc.com <http://www.bmwc.com/> > > > ________________________________ > > From: [email protected] on behalf of Brad > Casterline > Sent: Fri 5/17/2013 9:13 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time. > > > > Thanks Bruce. It is truly out in the sticks. 35 GPM well pump. The designer > is thinking if he made the pond capacity 300,000 gallons, after a 150,000 > gallon fire event the required water would be restored in no time, > literally, but it would take 3 days to re-fill the 'tank', and the book says > 8 hours max. (the tank A and tank B scenario was my idea, as a way of posing > what I was concerned about). I don't know quite what to think yet, just glad > I am not an A.H.J. :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 5:17 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time. > > Brad, > > If this tank sits in a place with municipal water, but still needs a tank, I > would say you need to design for 8-hrs. > > Start of what if's... > > ...What if water department will only allow a rate of fill that is 12-hours. > Document well (no pun), and fill tank in twelve. > > ...What if you are truly in the sticks, and you only have, and can only get, > a 20 gpm well. I think some sort of minimal tank for back up, or rent > temporary tank system during major schedule maintenance, and live within > your means. > > Of course, restrict activites during this time. > > While you tank is down is not the time for hot work to support new > equipment. > > bv > From: "Brad Casterline" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 11:42:59 AM > Subject: RE: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time. > > ok good, now then, if you are/were an A.H.J., how would you answer this > question: "How much time do we get to be able to re-fill a water storage > tank in 8 hours"? for example, 150,000 gallon capacity for demand*duration, > say tank A, from which the pump takes suction. Now we build a twin tank B, > and connect to tank A with 8" pipe with a shut-off valve normally closed. > There is an event and tank A runs dry. We open the shut-off valve and tank A > > is re-filled in about 18 minutes. The well pump then starts refilling tank > B, which will take 3 days. So the question is "how much time do we get to be > > able to re-fill the tank within in 8 hours?". > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brad Casterline [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 8:18 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time. > > asking for a co-worker: > > > > 1) Why are water storage tanks required to be re-filled in 8 hours? > > 2) Would the requirement apply to ponds (man-made with liner in this case)? > > 3) Are there any alternatives to the requirement? > > > > (the pond is large and filled by a well pump with a pumping rate that would > take more than 8 hours) > > > > many thanks, > > > > Brad Casterline, NICET IV > > Fire Protection Division > > > > FSC, Inc. > > P: 913-722-3473 > > [email protected] > > www.fsc-inc.com > > > > Engineering Solutions for the Built Environment > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
